91bluebird305TBI

I have an 88 camaro with a 2.8l MFI. All i have done to it is a magnaflow muffler. It ran a 16.8 at the track the other day. I was wanting to make it a high 12 second car possible low 13s. What all can i do. Is tere a turbo or twin turbo setup for this or maybe a supercharger. ALL SUGGESTIONS WILL BE APPRECIATED. THANKS

Ovrclck350

Well, if you read the post about new owner got it tuned, that 3.1 is in the 13's. So it's doable with your 2.8. it'll just take some money.

Kyle F

There is a supercharger for a Fiero. I think it can be installed on an F-body. Im not sure though. I know this is going to be typical for a V8 guy to say, but I am anyways.
You want 12's or low 13's. Ok Im not hitting mid 13's yet with a 355. Nor are a lot of other guys with serious mods to various V8's. Now before you jump on my back I am just saying think about what you are trying to accomplish with such a small motor. You might want to consider getting a 4.3 or a 3.8 to turbo/supercharg to get into the low 13's and 12's if you want to do it with a 6. Though anything is possible if you want to put enough money in it to get there. NOS is always helpful, HEads are really important to. Good Luck its going to be a long and expensive road to do it with a 2.8.
Check my sig Im turning a 13.9 on 305 heads and a 2.77 gear. I should be a 13.5 with a good set of 350 heads and the 3.73 I want or maybe a 3.42. I haven't decided which gear yet.

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86 Trans Am 355 TPI Rebuilt 700R4 with Corvette servo, modified valve body, and a B&M Torque Converter (2000 rpm stall w/ lock up), 87 350 block bored .30 with new crank. Reworked 305 heads with 3-angle valve job. Added in the rebuild was an SLP TPI cam, BBK 58mm Throttle Body,MSD 6A, Hypertech Power Coil, 1.5 Crane roller tipped rocker arms, SLP Intake Runners and Port matching in upper intake including fully ported plenum, TPIS adjustable fuel pressure regulator @ 46psi, Hooker shorty style headers w/ Thermotech heat wrapping, Custom 3” exhaust with Flowmaster muffler and chrome quad tips, Hypertech Thermomaster Computer chip, K&N open element cone filter on modified MAF per TPIS specs, MSD Wires, removal of A/C hardware and added a 1LE firewall cover installed. Also there has been a PST front suspension kit with Hotchkis strut tower brace added. Soon to have Intrax lowering springs.
http://geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Garage/9548/kyle.html

Kills:
95 Talon TSI, 96 Probe GT, 91 T/A L98, 89 RS, 86 Mustang GT, 88 Mustang LX 5.0, 92 Thunderbird V8. couple or ricers that I think were Civics or Preludes not sure what year, 95 Celica GT-S, 94 Chevy 1/4 ton 350, one of those NASCAR F150's

The Third Gen Will Never be Forgotten

3.1 firebird

Its going to take alot of CA$H to do it. I think you probably would need around 350hp to hit high 12's, but the 2.8 bottom will only withstand around 300hp or so. You'll have to get a bowtie 60 degree V6 block(CA$H) and get forged crank,rods,pistons,stronger pushrods,(CA$H). On top of that you will need to beef up the 60degree V6 700r4. All of those mods should get you low 14's/high13's.....then you could either Juice/super/turbo your way into the 12's.

IMHO, it takes to much money to get a 2.8 in the 12's, but if you are rich ......go for it!

superz

use your brain. it will cost thousands of dollars to even run 13s. if you wanna run that fast you COULD put in a 3.8 or a 4.3, but the mods needed to put one of those into your car are the same ones needed to put in a v8. so if you want a v6 and don't have a fortune to spend, settle for 14 second times. if you want to spend your money wisely(here come the insults from the v6ers) spend it on a v8 that can actually make horsepower without expensive turbos and dangerous nitrous.(another subject up for debate) if you want a zippy street car with good mileage and reliability, stick with your v6. if you want a fast car, put in a v8.

PS: i know i'm gonna hear it from the v6 guys on this one so i'm hiding under a rock till the smoke clears. hehe)

RenoLB8

I won't even go into details, just consider your rock nuked with a 2.8/3.1/3.4 megaton bomb...

-Reno

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'88 Firebird LB8
"Cerberus"
"You think you're weak and maybe I'm the cure, but I've got 6 pistons in my engine, and I got one for ya...it's a long shot"
http://www.angelfire.com/il/Firebird28/index.html

85f-bird

o.k., i'll just go on what the others have already stated and maybe build on it. the big question can a 2.8L block put a car into the 13's or 12's, yeah, i'd say so. Now, you'd be better off using a fiero as your test car, or say a caviler, and not a heavy f-body. In all truth, if your car turned a 16.8 in the 1/4, that's pretty good, being that 2.8L's are genuinely 17 second cars, and your's is 13 years old too. so good job just on that. Now there isn't a turbo for the 2.8L that i know of, even though there are some universal turbo kits, and some other things, you might want to check some earlier posts, i remember reading one about that same thing last week. Graeme (sp.) had a supercharged 2.8L for a while so you might want to ask him about it, but also i remember him saying it cost him like 3k to do. All in all, it'll cost you big bux to get a 2.8L camaro or bird into the 13's, the 14's are even hard, but slightly more attainable, so if you've got a deep pocket, i'd say go for it, but if you're easily frustrated, let it go, and aim for say, 15 flat. 3.1firebird had a nice ammount of mods, and turned a best of a 15.9 i think, itwas probably a 16.0 uncorrected, but i could be wrong. So anyway, good luck, and godspeed.

superz

boy... i'm dissapointed, i thought someone was gonna come on here and rape me for what i said earlier. i guess someone finally saw the light and realized that most of us v8 guys aren't a$$holes after all.

HIX5000

I wouldn't go that far j/k

TechSmurf

I'm only not ripping you a new one because I might be joining your ranks, superz =P

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'86 Camaro SC, black /w silver racing stripes
2.8l MPFI/700r4 /w special 2nd gear delete option
In search of new v8 engine & transmission, now contemplating t5 swap to get me out of this mess.
MSD coil, Accel 8mm wires, SplitFire plugs, Gabriel hijackers

Graeme'sFirebird

Yep...email me privately. My friend is building a 300 hp 350 tq 3.4 n/a so it can be done and will be done. Lemme know. That about 14 secs there, squirt it and WHAM low 13's high 12's. It can be done.

Monkie

Just get one big ****ing shot of NOS ! !

3.1 firebird

hey you know what my 6 banger needs?
WE all realise its alot easier to go faster with more cubes. I was just saying if the dude was rich and wanted to get a 2.8 in the 12's for the hell of it, why not do it?

25th anniversarry RS

superz.. you didnt get raped because you are pretty logical.

There are quite a few mods for 2.8-3.1 engines that i have seen, like aluminum heads, different intakes, throttle bodys.. i wouldnt go with nitrus though, if you want to keep your car , or engine for that matter, nitrus is not the way to go. Check into some nice heads and remember the chip too, be careful to keep it smog legal if you are going to drive it every day.

CaliCamaroRS

hey graeme, how did you get the 350 TQ figure??? you realize V6's have the shortest crankshaft of all engines. i'm not saying it can't be done....i just think 350 is a little high.



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Dan
1990 3.1L RS
80 Series Flowmaster
It's fast(er than a 3 cyl metro)

TomP

SuperZ, do you think we V6 owners will ONLY own/want V6's? If you searched archives, I never concern myself with supercharging or turboing or twin-turboing a 2.8/3.1/3.4- it's not worth the cash. A v8 swap can be done for less money. Plus, the v8 guys have a hard time getting into the 12's! How in heck would we get a V6 there?


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-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
---Think your car could be pic of the week? Visit http://www.f-body.net for details!

turbo497

if I undestood your question it would be no! I don't think you can get a 2.8 to run 12 second quarters. would like to be proven wrong but don't think we will see any scans posted to this thread showing 12 second time slips from a 2.8 block non turbo, non blown, non cranked, non bored out, in a firebird

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3.8 turbo 20th anniversary transam #497 first owed by Clifford Williams, Bass player from rock band AC/DC

superz

TomP i totally agree with ya man. but there are some pretty hardcore v6 guys i expected to hear from when i said that making a 2.8 run 12s was a joke. (without spending a million bucks.) in my opinion, you should choose a motor that will satisfy your need for speed most effeciently. like i said, if you want ***** out fast, in most cases get a v8. and if you want an economical yet sporty car, a v6 is great. however, making a v6 run like a v8 can be done, it just isn't practical. and getting a v8 to get mileage like a v6 is a waste of time too. in a nutshell, EVERY MOTOR HAS ITS PLACE. 'nuff said.

Monkie

superz Im taking it my name is in mind. The reason I didn't talk **** to you is because of how you put it. making a 2.8 run 12s was a joke. I would love to talk trash because you said that but you followed up with something that made it not so insulting (without spending a million bucks.) So see man, were not always *** holes that try to start things its just when you put our engines down and say it cant happen. I mean hell this guy might have money comming out of his *** and is going to twin turbo the car. That would get it well into the 12s if he could get traction. And it DOES take an artist to make a V6 run that. Just think...at a car show what would get the most attention? A twin turbo 2.8L Camaro or a IROC-Z? You know the ol 6 would be the star!

Graeme'sFirebird

Nevermind!

[This message has been edited by Graeme'sFirebird (edited March 06, 2001).]

TechSmurf

Uhm.. Graeme? You know how quick you seem to be modifying that little Z of yours? (judging by how frequently quickly your sig is growing anyway).. yer starting to scare me here..

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'86 Camaro SC, black /w silver racing stripes
2.8l MPFI/700r4 /w special 2nd gear delete option
In search of new v8 engine & transmission, now contemplating t5 swap to get me out of this mess.
MSD coil, Accel 8mm wires, SplitFire plugs, Gabriel hijackers

94Camaro

Actually, some of you are sort of right.

my motor wont be doing 350tq. and the more accurate figure is 295hp. and thats just estimated. im not sure what the torque will be in the end, it all depends on what the motor puts out. you can estimate hp, but its harder to estimate torque.

i mean i can say, yes, my car will have 295 hp (estimated) and that it might produce all that HP @ 5000 RPM.

but then, taking this formula (reverse of finding hp) TQ = HP * 5252 / RPM (or TQ = 295*5252 / 5000) leaves me with TQ = 309 lb. ft.

however, thats not the max torque rating, we can take that number down (just for what if's sake)

say 230hp @ 3600 RPM. then you are talking about TQ = 230 * 5252 / 3600 = 335.5 lb. ft.

so you see, it all comes down to really seeing what the car can put out on the dyno. im not gonna claim my engine has some ludicrous number like 350. AND (read this) i dont know if it will have 335TQ either.

however, if i do reach that nice number, i will have to get my T-5 Reinforced, as the transmission i DONT think is rated that high.

anyway, peace out, catch you all later, and monkie, stop being a dumbass and stop trying to start flame wars.

-out

-R

edit: No. NRT (no longer in business, changed name to Nu-Tek Motorsports) - does not have an engine that can do 275 HP. even with OBDII installed. i do have a friend that is doing 178 RWHP off of a NRT motor. and if it wasnt for his OBDII, he would have 195. the trick is all in how you build it, but i ain't sayin


[This message has been edited by 94Camaro (edited March 06, 2001).]

Red91Bird

I was the one that built the high 13 second firebird with a 3.1L block and NOS. It took about 4K in cash and about 4 months. Even at that i didn't complete it as i got to feedup with waiting on special order parts and getting laughed off the phone. HOWEVER the guy (neighbor) that bought it completed it and broke into the 13's. I have read about 2.8 liter engines that can turn 12's, there twin turbo'd. I have seen 270HP N/A 2.8 liter engines in fiero's --- they're NOT streetable! --- period. There a guy here locally that runs a 3.1L turbo engine in his Z24 www.turboz24.com He can SMOKE all but the most stout V8's --- daily! and if he can't keep up to a 12 second runner he takes his boost from 9psi to 15psi and out runs em... He also has spent 1000's into the car. BTW... his cam is running .600+ lift (thats for you tomp -- grin) Isold my V6 car and got a V8, now with the 3K i personally spent to get my old car into the 13's PLUS the grand the new owner spent i could get my 74 T/A with a 403 well into the 11's on NOS... i am posting what i bought to get the 91 firebird into the 13's. Its not a complete list as the new owner got some stuff too but forget the aluminum block... theres cheaper ways to go to make power...

David

MrZ28

I found a 87IROC-Z28 for 4000 at a used car dealership. I used to have a 3.1 and would tell everybody how i was going to drop a 350 and all this other crap into it. Trust me it is a lot easier to just go out and find another car with what you want and buy it. That is what i done. It works and i plan on doing lots of things to it. Imagine my L98 supercharged vs a 3.1 supercharged. Imagine a 502 supercharged vs my L98 supercharged....muchahahahahahahahaha

FORD Rustangs -R- Us

Yes, but keep in mind that some of us may have the money and hook ups to afford a real nice, very good condition V8 to mod up and make into 12s and beat of rustangs and ****..but after the mods how can a 16-17 year old afford insurrance?! for some people its just more sensible to buy the V6 for insurance, drop in a SH!Tload of cash making it fast (not saying 12s, we all know thats near impossible with technology 13 years old and such a small engine) and get the better fuel economy....

i know **** about engines and such cause im just 16 getting a career in comps not automotives so ill just let someone prove me wrong and continue my reading and learning from these posts
PE@CE

-92camaroRSV6

Graeme'sFirebird

hey man..
im 16 too...but ive been working with cars since i was 7... and other stuff. its not hard to learn. pay attention to everything here and u should learn pretty fast.

FORD Rustangs -R- Us

ya i am, i read just about everypost hehe after i get home i got liek 2 hours before everyone gets off from sports, so i just read the new posts...

i cant wait till i get my f-body in may

wow theres gonna be a lot of modding the first month hehe

KED85

Is there a centrifical supercharger available for these 2.8/3.1/3.4 engines? How about modifying the unit used on the early-mid 90's Grand Prixs? Or was that used on the 3.8 block,if it was in that car, too?
The Fiero one used a K & F unit, I believe, same one/design for the carb Jeeps/S-10 Blazers.

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Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA

FORD Rustangs -R- Us

i know this isnt really a camaro question, but my dad got my mom our 3rd "new" blazer (1/2 year old used) because my mom has had every sports car put out on the market. i asked her if shes gonna buy another sports car when we leave but she said she liked this blazer so i figured something was up.. either a 2nd gen camaro..or 98 blazer.. hmmmm

so i popped the hood and just to my suspition (i always thought the Vortec ones were supercharged) i thought i saw a supercharger. i dont know what they look like exactly but i swear it didnt look like a normal engine..and it does have some NICE Horses on it even with the weight.. does a 98 LT fully loaded have a Vortec super in it?

CaliCamaroRS

sorry dude, i've never heard of a new blazer with a supercharger. only the old Typhoon's had a supercharged 4.3L.

EDIT: 300 posts...woohoo!!!

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Dan
1990 3.1L RS
80 Series Flowmaster
It's fast(er than a 3 cyl metro)

[This message has been edited by CaliCamaroRS (edited March 09, 2001).]

FORD Rustangs -R- Us

bah...maybe carbed? i dunno...dont know much about engines..ill grab my dads digi soon and take some pics and u guys can tell me what the deal is..cause its pretty ****ing fast for an SUV and ive tried LOTS of cars since my dads a used car lot manager

(If you need a car always check winkelly.com first :P) jk

RenoLB8

IS there a supercharger? No. IS some of the supercharger technology getting to the point where it would be damn easy to fab one in? YES.

I was just talking to some folks the other day about this. I personally consider the 350 to be a "Lego" engine. Whatever can be done, has been done, and you just do what everybody else has to get a helluva motor.

But look at things we've accomplished around here... When 3.1 Firebird got headers to fit, we were all floored, Red91 talks about a neighbor getting into the 13's, it's awesome! A 350 in the 13's? Dime a dozen.

Sorry, philisophical digression there. As for the superchargers, check out powerdyne or the new ATI P-15. They'd make about 6 lbs of boost for us (rated 4.5 on LT1's), and since they are standalone units (no oil lines needed), they'd be VERY easy to fit under our hood. Ditch your AC, suddenly you have a massive hole of space on the driver's side of your belt system, and more then enough holes into the block to mount the blower. Custom brackets, or an adapter of sorts to make it fit the AC brackets (wish I'd kept mine). Will it work? Ask me another year or two.

-Reno

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'88 Firebird LB8
"Cerberus"
"You think you're weak and maybe I'm the cure, but I've got 6 pistons in my engine, and I got one for ya...it's a long shot"
http://www.angelfire.com/il/Firebird28/index.html