evilemokid94

iTrader: (6)

Anyone know if its possible to take the engine out of an 07 impala and put it in my 86?, the engine in the 07 is a 3.9 v6 front wheel drive that i would want to convert to rear wheel but is it possible? sorry its a 3900

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

Yes, it's possible, it will take quite a bit of work.

Take a look at purple92z (IIRC that's his username) thread on his 3500 swap, pretty similar.

Thirdgen89GTA

iTrader: (5)

Yeah, the 3.9L is just bored/stroked 3500 engine. However, the 3900 uses VVT and variable intake geometry, so its PCM might be more fun. The 3.9L is supported by HP tuners though.

The 3.9L moves my 3400lb G6 GTP pretty good though. About as fast as a stock L98. I don't know how well it would do in a thirdgen, but the swap should make the thirdgen pretty light.

Its not monster torque, but it does have 240lb/ft @ 2800rpm, and its peak hp is 240hp @ 6000rpm so the power curve is pretty broad. Don't expect tire roasting torque, but it should move fairly well.

Personally, I'd go find a VQ35 motor out of a wrecked infiinity or a 3.6L out of a new Zeta platform car. The DOHC v6's have much better headflow and more power potential.

overide

So is the 3900 a 60*... would the heads bolt on the 3.4 like the 3500 heads? Obviously there would be an intake swap as well

Thirdgen89GTA

iTrader: (5)

No idea. Depends on which engine you are talking about. The 3.9L found in G6's and Malibu's are based on the High Value line. However in most cases were replaced by the DOCH High feature V6 in 2007. Some models still used the old 3500 and 3900 engines with their cam in block design.

2007+ G6 GTP's used the 3.6L DOHC making 251hp.

Project 3.4 Camaro

Its doable, I can never remember the boardmember's name, but just search for the 3500 swap thread, should be pretty much the same stuff required, but you will def need the pcm with the engine.

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

The 3900 is not just a bored 3500, it almost a whole new layout. The cylinder positions have been moved slightly along with may other block changes for the VVT and DOD.

No, the heads will not just bolt onto a 3.4 block, due to the shift in cyliner placement.

overide

Ok... that makes sence. About like the 3500 fwd heads not working on the RWD 2.8 and 3.1 blocks.

Project 3.4 Camaro

Not really...there is a different reason for not being able to bolt 3500 heads to a 2.8 or 3.1, in that case the reason is that the difference in bore is too large, you can however bolt them to a 3.4 rwd, since it has a large enough bore.

evilemokid94

iTrader: (6)

here are the engine specs.

jensen73110

iTrader: (4)

^Hmmm... I thought the 3.9 was just an updated 3800. That would explain the large size and poopy output. The Camaro and Mustang v6s are smaller, but offer 70 more hp....

evilemokid94

iTrader: (6)

its a 3880

jensen73110

iTrader: (4)

Yup, I was wrong. Again.

Project 3.4 Camaro

They're new engines...and ford and gm seem to have finally started caring about the performance of their base model v6 performance cars, still though I've been trying to wrap my head around how they squeezed out 300 hp from a daily driveable 3.6l v6...I mean how much power can vvt and DI really account for? Just seems surprising they managed to get that much without headers(i think..) and a lopey cam...my best guess is pretty well designed heads...

evilemokid94

iTrader: (6)

yeah thats true. my 07 impala can lay about 60 feet of rubber from about 20. that little v6 is a monster for speed and the car can handle it with no problem thats whats amazing.

DeathStarr89

iTrader: (1)

It's possible, not much harder than my swap.

You could run it on OBD1 with an external crankshaft trigger, then use any aftermarket cam for a 3x00 as long as you get bearing spacers and new cam bearings put in. Block the VVT, degree in the cam and forget about it. Swap to the Gen4 3500 upper (non variable length) to solve that problem.

You may have fitment issues getting the RWD timing cover onto the 3900, i don't think that's been researched yet. A V6 700R4 or a T5 will bolt to it no problem. You'll probably have to build headers, i don't think the FWD manifolds point in the right direction for you to use them like the gen3 3500 does.


the 3900's heads in stock form out-flow my ported 3500 heads, they'll easily support 350+ N/A HP with the right cam, headers and good tuning.

FireInMe17

I've always thought about this engine as something that would be interesting in our cars. If they can get 312HP out of a N/A 3.6 in the new Camaro, what can a 3.9 do? I'm sure you would have the best idea Purple82TA having a 3500.

Thirdgen89GTA

iTrader: (5)

I'd be curious to know exactly what the 3900 heads flow. I have a G6 GTP with the 3.9L.

As for removing VVT and the variable intake? I wouldn't, its leaving so much on the table. My 3.9L makes 240lb/ft @ 2800rpm, and 240hp @ 6000rpm. Its a VERY big power curve. Very smooth motor too, I can be at 3000rpm floor it, and it'll pull to red line easy. Easy to rev this motor too, can't count the # of times I bounced it off the rev limiter when learning to drive it.

EDIT: NM, found flow numbers. Are these typical? If so, damn I want to cam my 3.9L lol! There's a ton left on the table!
http://images.fieroforum.com/2010/3900Flow.jpg

In any case thats a apples to oranges comparison between the 3.6L and the 3.9L. The 3.6L is a 24v DOHC motor, it has 4v per cylinder. 4v heads usually out flow 2v heads, specially at low lift.

DeathStarr89

iTrader: (1)

http://60degreev6.com/forum/showthre...ight=3900+flow

firstfirebird

iTrader: (3)

LOL! Swaps have already been done, twin turbo in a Fiero even. Just as purple82 said, lock the cam timing in place, use the upper from a VVT3500, motor mounts, and get a DIS signal to an OBD1 ECM.

The DOHC 3.6DI has a new bellhousing pattern, so unless you take the entire drivetrain and electronics, not going to be an easy task.

EDIT: I think I know someone who got over 300bhp from a 3500, hmmm, who was that again? :P

jensen73110

iTrader: (4)

^Of course swaps have been done, but that wasn't the OP's question....

Project 3.4 Camaro

imo I wouldnt disable the vvt..its one of the advantages that engine has to offer.

firstfirebird

iTrader: (3)

Sorry, he asked if it was possible.

Controlling it is a different story. To use a newer PCM is more than just engine management anymore.

Thirdgen89GTA

iTrader: (5)

Yeah but it provides a good boost in performance.

I have a 2006 G6 GTP with the 3.9L v6. And performance wise it just about trumps an L98 in every area except for launch, part of that is that its FWD. But once you get past the launch it HAULS for a 3400lb car.

Not only that, but it easily cruises from 40mph to 80mph in 6th gear no problems. Sure, it doesn't accelerate fast in 6th, but it has no problems. And MOST of that is due to the cam phasing and variable intake.

240lb/ft @ 2800rpm, and 240hp @ 6000rpm. This engine LOVES to rev, it hits the red line fast but is still amazingly smooth and quiet, nor does it have to be shifted like you hate it. It will be perfectly happy to stay in the lower revs.

Trekking around Road America I used 2nd in about 2 corners, but the rest of them it was 3rd, 4th, and 5th in the straights.

DeathStarr89

iTrader: (1)

I hear his crazy *** is talking about bumping up the SCR to 14:1 and running Methanol next year. He's estimating around 400 HP after some other small changes.


That dude needs serious help.

firstfirebird

iTrader: (3)

Yup. He has a different approach to things, that's for sure. We PM back and forth now and again, he was the one who convinced me to go with the 11.5:1 and boost on my motor, but sold it before I got it running (car was shipped to us for the install) - still going to be boosted, but with 9.1:1 CR instead, just got it stripped down to the block for the 3400 pistons and different cam to go in.

DeathStarr89

iTrader: (1)

I just hope he makes it to the 60v6 meet next year.