Good news for fabricators!
#1
Good news for fabricators!
A good friend of mine was a foreman at a CNC shop as some of you know. Well he quit and found a place to start his own business. He picked up a CNC mill, manual mill, suface grinder, and is now shopping for a CNC lathe. He is currently working at another shop and he and I are going to be working in the evenings together to get this thing off the ground.
What does this have to do with you, you might ask? Well, we can make anything you need out of just about any material you want (including plastics).
If anybody needs something, give me a shout! We should be up and running in about a week, or as soon as the 3 phase 220v run is installed.
What does this have to do with you, you might ask? Well, we can make anything you need out of just about any material you want (including plastics).
If anybody needs something, give me a shout! We should be up and running in about a week, or as soon as the 3 phase 220v run is installed.
#2
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Going on Tue to epoxy the floors and maybe get some machines in place, I'll post pics. We got at least one account for sure (25000 parts/yr) and have a couple more contracts on the table. I'm hoping to see if we can make some forged pistons for the v6 people.
Dave, where did you get those blanks?
Dave, where did you get those blanks?
#3
Supreme Member
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sayreville NJ
Posts: 2,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Good news for fabricators!
i can get them from a company we do alot of machine work for.u may be able to get forged blanks from a reg supply place as well,but im unsure on that one.
im deff interested in getting a set of billet aluminum rods machined if u guys are upto the task.but i need to check the block for clearnace since aluminum rods will have to be wider across the beam.
once i know if they will fit i can order the materials threw the shop.
im deff interested in getting a set of billet aluminum rods machined if u guys are upto the task.but i need to check the block for clearnace since aluminum rods will have to be wider across the beam.
once i know if they will fit i can order the materials threw the shop.
#4
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Oh, you ant aluminum, I was thinking of billet steel rods, and yes we are up to the task.
That discussion we had before about the sizing of the forged pistons and how they need to be smaller...
We are going to make one first and heat it to see what it does, if it expands very much, then we are going to heat them before machining . This way they will shrink down and we know they will be perfect when they are heated to temp.
That discussion we had before about the sizing of the forged pistons and how they need to be smaller...
We are going to make one first and heat it to see what it does, if it expands very much, then we are going to heat them before machining . This way they will shrink down and we know they will be perfect when they are heated to temp.
#6
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Try to. It doesn't have to be exact, since there will be some piston to wall clearance, but we are going to try and be as close as we can to perfect.
We also thought of modding some SBC pistons to work.
EDIT: It will be importent to heat them to aprox 190* (the avg interior temp of an engine).
We also thought of modding some SBC pistons to work.
EDIT: It will be importent to heat them to aprox 190* (the avg interior temp of an engine).
#7
Supreme Member
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Casselberry, FLA
Posts: 2,771
Likes: 0
Received 5 Likes
on
5 Posts
Car: 88 V6 'bird/89TBI bird/85 T/A
Engine: 2.8/TBI/TPI
Transmission: V8 T-5/700R4 x2
Axle/Gears: 3.42 open/2.73 open/ 3.27 9 bolt
Re: Good news for fabricators!
where in south FL?
This is VERY good for my central florida Firebird projects!!
This is VERY good for my central florida Firebird projects!!
Trending Topics
#9
TGO Supporter
iTrader: (12)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: AR
Posts: 6,819
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Car: 1991 Camaro RS Vert
Engine: 350 S-TPI
Transmission: T5
Axle/Gears: GU5/G80/J65
Re: Good news for fabricators!
I need something made out of brass. Quite small.
PM me when you are up and can make stuff.
PM me when you are up and can make stuff.
#11
Junior Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: West Valley City, Utah
Posts: 60
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Car: 2002 Pontiac Firebird (R.I.P 1992)
Engine: 3.8L Ram Air V6 3800 Series
Transmission: 5spd
Axle/Gears: Unsure
Re: Good news for fabricators!
If I ever need anything forged or customed I'll definately come to you. If I ever get some kind of forced induction you might be able to machine me some adaptors and what not for it =) but thats not till next spring or later.
#14
Supreme Member
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sayreville NJ
Posts: 2,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Good news for fabricators!
nice place.
anyways if i send u down some aluminum stock would u be willing to machine a mock up rod so i can check it for clearances and fit.it will be just reg aluminum stock not forged billet, but it will still allow for it to be put in a motor and spun by hand to check for clearances.
btw i also have stock that u could make a mockup pistion out of for test fit purposes as well
anyways if i send u down some aluminum stock would u be willing to machine a mock up rod so i can check it for clearances and fit.it will be just reg aluminum stock not forged billet, but it will still allow for it to be put in a motor and spun by hand to check for clearances.
btw i also have stock that u could make a mockup pistion out of for test fit purposes as well
#15
Re: Good news for fabricators!
nice place.
anyways if i send u down some aluminum stock would u be willing to machine a mock up rod so i can check it for clearances and fit.it will be just reg aluminum stock not forged billet, but it will still allow for it to be put in a motor and spun by hand to check for clearances.
btw i also have stock that u could make a mockup pistion out of for test fit purposes as well
anyways if i send u down some aluminum stock would u be willing to machine a mock up rod so i can check it for clearances and fit.it will be just reg aluminum stock not forged billet, but it will still allow for it to be put in a motor and spun by hand to check for clearances.
btw i also have stock that u could make a mockup pistion out of for test fit purposes as well
We are planning on leaving the pistons oversize and we got an "oven" that's capable of 6000* to see what kind of expansion we will get Rick (in pic) says the billet shouldn't expand beyond the point of clearance problems, but I want to be absolutely sure.
Sand/media blaster and welders are also on the list.
#16
Supreme Member
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sayreville NJ
Posts: 2,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Good news for fabricators!
yes they clear but and aluminum rod must be bigger then a steel rod, if u make an exact copy of a steel rod it will be weak.i think i have a few sbc aluminum rods laying around the shop.it would be better to copy on of those witht he right pin/crank sizes then a steel rod.
btw i could send u plastic instead fo aluminum if it would be easier to machine.
what my plan is is to have u machine the mockup rod send it back to me then i can put it in my test block and mark it for clearance as needed and either send it back to u marked or machine it for clearance myself and then send it back to be remesured,
btw i could send u plastic instead fo aluminum if it would be easier to machine.
what my plan is is to have u machine the mockup rod send it back to me then i can put it in my test block and mark it for clearance as needed and either send it back to u marked or machine it for clearance myself and then send it back to be remesured,
#17
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Yeah, actually plastic would be cheaper to ship, but with the tools and machine we got metal is no problem. I keep forgeting you want aluminum rods (I've got billet steel in my head).
With lightening up the rods by going aluminum, what are you going to do for balancing?
With lightening up the rods by going aluminum, what are you going to do for balancing?
#20
Supreme Member
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sayreville NJ
Posts: 2,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Good news for fabricators!
no i dont,but our friends up in linden do,im gonna cut down the counter wieghts/knifeedge the crank myself then send it upto them for balancing
#22
Supreme Member
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sayreville NJ
Posts: 2,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Good news for fabricators!
maybe gota see.im really unsure of aluminum rods will clear a 3.1/3.4, they may only clear with a 2.8 stroke. only one way to find out though
----------
between the rods and pistons this has the making of a 3.4 destroke kit written all over it if it wont fit the larger stroke crank.
id take a lightwieght 3.0L v6 (3.4+2.8 crank = 3.0L add in an over bore and u can get upto 3.2L) vs a heavier 3.1/3.4L anyday
----------
between the rods and pistons this has the making of a 3.4 destroke kit written all over it if it wont fit the larger stroke crank.
id take a lightwieght 3.0L v6 (3.4+2.8 crank = 3.0L add in an over bore and u can get upto 3.2L) vs a heavier 3.1/3.4L anyday
Last edited by daves12secV6; 07-17-2007 at 04:44 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
#25
Junior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Miami,fl
Posts: 84
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Car: 88 prelude si/91 camaro rs
Engine: 2.0/3.1
Transmission: D2J5/700r4
Axle/Gears: 3.23
Re: Good news for fabricators!
sounds like a good fab shop is finaly opening in south florida up to the task of helping us 3rd genners
#26
Senior Member
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Posts: 1,517
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Car: 89 V6 Camaro
Engine: 2.8
Transmission: 700R4
Axle/Gears: 3.42 open diff
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Do you have any idea on prices yet. I might get my headers ceramic coated for the right price.
#30
Supreme Member
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sayreville NJ
Posts: 2,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Good news for fabricators!
thats not the problem, large journal = larger outside size of the rod.
if it would fit id just machine a spacer to put in it it so i could install a bearing and bolt it onto the crank,but it wont clear the block
if it would fit id just machine a spacer to put in it it so i could install a bearing and bolt it onto the crank,but it wont clear the block
#31
Supreme Member
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Western PA
Posts: 1,089
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Car: 91 Camaro
Engine: 3.1/3100 in progress...Turbo Soon
Transmission: 700r4
Re: Good news for fabricators!
If you are going to be able to powder coat stuff, than I might have you hold on to the pipes/headers to have them done. I was looking for a place to do them around me, but it seems I can kill 2 birds with one stone.
#32
Re: Good news for fabricators!
If you are going to be able to powder coat stuff, than I might have you hold on to the pipes/headers to have them done. I was looking for a place to do them around me, but it seems I can kill 2 birds with one stone.
#33
Supreme Member
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Central FL
Posts: 2,564
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Car: 91 Camaro
Engine: 3.1...not hardly stock
Transmission: 700r4....not stock either
Axle/Gears: 3.73
Re: Good news for fabricators!
let me know how lightening and knife-edging the crank goes... I've been told that it weakens our cranks too much. that was part of my plan, also until I was told that. I'd still prefer to do it if it does work.
#36
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Most of the income at the shop will be generating small parts, one contract for this year is for 25000 parts, another for 50000. The trick is having a guy in there making $10 or $12 per hour and just running parts after the setup is done. Rick (the machinist, I'm an aprentice), has made the molds for Motorolla phones. They start with SS and make the phone out of it, then reverse it for injection molds, it's fun stuff. The custom stuff isn't what pays the bills, but that's what I enjoy more (racking my brain, that is).
#38
Supreme Member
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Central FL
Posts: 2,564
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Car: 91 Camaro
Engine: 3.1...not hardly stock
Transmission: 700r4....not stock either
Axle/Gears: 3.73
Re: Good news for fabricators!
That's just waht I was told by a guy who owns a machine shop and supposedly has built several of these motors for racing. Hopefully its not true, though.
#39
TGO Supporter
iTrader: (12)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: AR
Posts: 6,819
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Car: 1991 Camaro RS Vert
Engine: 350 S-TPI
Transmission: T5
Axle/Gears: GU5/G80/J65
Re: Good news for fabricators!
I help my neighbor who does construction. He started calculating up the cost of his tools as we were loading them in his new trailer so they would be organized and weather protected. He quit counting after 7k... and that was just half full at the point
#40
Supreme Member
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sayreville NJ
Posts: 2,472
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Good news for fabricators!
ffb i have some ideas for pistons for ya.
first and formost is geting the pin location moved down and the ring pack further apart. then u could cut down the piston skirts since the rings will better stabilize the piston in the bore. though the real benifit will be a thicker top ringland..
the downside to this is a larger dish and a negative effect on emmisions
#41
Re: Good news for fabricators!
I'm not concerned about emmisions, FL dropped emmissions in the late 80's.
Once the program is written, changes like that will be easy to make
#42
Re: Good news for fabricators!
No major machines yet, but got a good start yesterday. The Okuma was sold before we went and paid for it, so Rick told the salesman he owed him one, wait till you see the lathe that he got instead. It cost $21k, but it has two terrets (can use two tools at a time to cut), and an auto bar feeder. This means we can put a stack of 10' bars in one end and and parts come out the other, with rough and finish cuts already done .
Rick is kissing the compressor, 85gal, 15hp. Do you think we are going to run out much?!
Whenever it's quitting time, he has a Miller permanently fixed to his hand
Rick is kissing the compressor, 85gal, 15hp. Do you think we are going to run out much?!
Whenever it's quitting time, he has a Miller permanently fixed to his hand
#43
Supreme Member
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Casselberry, FLA
Posts: 2,771
Likes: 0
Received 5 Likes
on
5 Posts
Car: 88 V6 'bird/89TBI bird/85 T/A
Engine: 2.8/TBI/TPI
Transmission: V8 T-5/700R4 x2
Axle/Gears: 3.42 open/2.73 open/ 3.27 9 bolt
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Okay,
What's the labor rate? My uncle's machine shop is in Indiana and that's too far!! I have to do some "custom" flywheel work and it's not stuff that I can just wing. I need a guy to chuck it in a lathe and do it right. So???
What's your shop rate? I'd rather support someone from this site than someone else I don't know!!
What's the labor rate? My uncle's machine shop is in Indiana and that's too far!! I have to do some "custom" flywheel work and it's not stuff that I can just wing. I need a guy to chuck it in a lathe and do it right. So???
What's your shop rate? I'd rather support someone from this site than someone else I don't know!!
#44
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Ben a while since I posted, because the electrician is taking forever and we are waiting for the CNC lathe/mill combo to be delivered from Indiana, but we should have the CNC mill, manual mill, diamond grinder, surface grinder, drill press, and air compressor up by Fri night.
KrisW, we are looking to get $45/hr plus the cost of stock, but I would be willing to trade some of my labor for worthy parts .
EDIT: That's why it's cheaper to CNC and make multiples, it cuts down labor.
KrisW, we are looking to get $45/hr plus the cost of stock, but I would be willing to trade some of my labor for worthy parts .
EDIT: That's why it's cheaper to CNC and make multiples, it cuts down labor.
#45
Supreme Member
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Casselberry, FLA
Posts: 2,771
Likes: 0
Received 5 Likes
on
5 Posts
Car: 88 V6 'bird/89TBI bird/85 T/A
Engine: 2.8/TBI/TPI
Transmission: V8 T-5/700R4 x2
Axle/Gears: 3.42 open/2.73 open/ 3.27 9 bolt
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Do you have the ability to make a new flywheel for me or do you need an existing one to modify.
Either way, I will still have it balanced to match my rotating assembly after modification. Just trying to figure out what I need to start with.
McLeod will build a flywheel to my specs for 500 bucks and I still have to pay shipping to and from them for my pieces!
Throw me a "rough" quote...
I give you an auto trans flexplate and you build me a replacement steel flywheel. Obviously, I need the same crank bolt pattern and O.D. as my auto piece and my starter ring gear fitted to my new flywheel.
That's what I'm doing...
Either way, I will still have it balanced to match my rotating assembly after modification. Just trying to figure out what I need to start with.
McLeod will build a flywheel to my specs for 500 bucks and I still have to pay shipping to and from them for my pieces!
Throw me a "rough" quote...
I give you an auto trans flexplate and you build me a replacement steel flywheel. Obviously, I need the same crank bolt pattern and O.D. as my auto piece and my starter ring gear fitted to my new flywheel.
That's what I'm doing...
#47
Supreme Member
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Casselberry, FLA
Posts: 2,771
Likes: 0
Received 5 Likes
on
5 Posts
Car: 88 V6 'bird/89TBI bird/85 T/A
Engine: 2.8/TBI/TPI
Transmission: V8 T-5/700R4 x2
Axle/Gears: 3.42 open/2.73 open/ 3.27 9 bolt
Re: Good news for fabricators!
When will that be? If you said already, I missed it.
Let me know when you are ready, I'm in no great hurry. I can drop it off whenever...
Let me give you an idea of where I am going...
I am going to use an older (pre 1991) front wheel drive Buick V6 to replace my 2.8. To my knowledge, there is no flywheel made for them. My manual says that the bolt pattern is different than the rear wheel drive engines and the newer engines use an 8 bolt flange (fourth gens use this one) while mine has the standard six. I need to run a small flywheel so that it will fit inside the 60 degree V6 bellhousing for my T5. I will need the flywheel to be the same diameter as my auto flexplate and the same thickness/clutch bolt pattern as the 2.8 V6. I may have you bore out my pilot bearing hole in the crank while I'm at it as well.
Does this sound do-able?
Let me know when you are ready, I'm in no great hurry. I can drop it off whenever...
Let me give you an idea of where I am going...
I am going to use an older (pre 1991) front wheel drive Buick V6 to replace my 2.8. To my knowledge, there is no flywheel made for them. My manual says that the bolt pattern is different than the rear wheel drive engines and the newer engines use an 8 bolt flange (fourth gens use this one) while mine has the standard six. I need to run a small flywheel so that it will fit inside the 60 degree V6 bellhousing for my T5. I will need the flywheel to be the same diameter as my auto flexplate and the same thickness/clutch bolt pattern as the 2.8 V6. I may have you bore out my pilot bearing hole in the crank while I'm at it as well.
Does this sound do-able?
#48
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Bellingham, WA
Posts: 692
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Car: 1989 RS
Engine: 3.1L + .060" overbore
Transmission: 700R4
Axle/Gears: 4.11, Auburn LSD
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Sounds like you want to make your own rods and pistons? Why would you make your own rods? Small journal sbc rods fit the V6 with little modification and will be stronger than anything you could make. Not to mention that a shorter rod will increase sidewall pressure. Your own pistons would be neat, but I'd watch for irregularities when the piston is heated. I've seen oval pistons cuase the expansion rates cross wristpin are higher than trans. I'm not trying to beat you guys up, I'm just looking out and asking questions.
#49
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Sounds like you want to make your own rods and pistons? Why would you make your own rods? Small journal sbc rods fit the V6 with little modification and will be stronger than anything you could make. Not to mention that a shorter rod will increase sidewall pressure. Your own pistons would be neat, but I'd watch for irregularities when the piston is heated. I've seen oval pistons cuase the expansion rates cross wristpin are higher than trans. I'm not trying to beat you guys up, I'm just looking out and asking questions.
#50
Re: Good news for fabricators!
Here's what we got today, the neighbor is downsizing, and said to pay him on consignment...
Machines got feed electric and are running finally, the ones that the salesman has actually gotten there so far anyways
Lines run from the compressor
The "mini me" isn't staying, but it's running also..
Here's Rick's son showing him who's boss...
Machines got feed electric and are running finally, the ones that the salesman has actually gotten there so far anyways
Lines run from the compressor
The "mini me" isn't staying, but it's running also..
Here's Rick's son showing him who's boss...