Francis T.

With only some body mods such as a custom DIY GT40 style front extrator scoop, the relocation of wing aft a few inches, new paint, and few other things to do, my 86 Turbo GT Fiero is almost done. That said, I'm kind of looking for another car to add to my stable and would like to mod a 2.8 -3.4 manual trans Firebrid or Camaro. What with our High Flow intakes and other soon-to-be built other go-fast items for the 90V I'd like to use one those cars as a project car and probably a daily driver too. It don't none that I've also always liked the way they looked. So which years with that engine are the mest to look for? Did any of the v6s come with better handling etc. I'm not knowledgeable on these cars much as you probably have already guessed.

macantley

Well seeing as im a fiero guy, im no expert, But the 90-92 models had the 3.1L v6 i believe, those had alittle more low end torque than the earlier 2.8L motors, im sure they make alot of handling packages for the camaro/firebird

if i got a camaro id get one of the RS v6's with the ground effects that make them look like an iroc.

im not sure if you can get a v6 firebird with the same ground effects or body package as the GTA but that would be nice.

or you could go with a 4th gen 93-95 with 3.4L v6 those can be had pretty cheap.

a buddy of mine has a 88 z28 with 350 TPI and i really like it, but i dont like the fact that it was VERY rare to find one with a v8 and stick shift...... and then they were 305's

anyway thats just one fiero mans opinion.

matthew

Francis T.

Hmmmmm, the RS do look nice. How about some info from you F-bod folks as to any wieght advantages between the dif years and the F-bird vers Camaro?

Dale

iTrader: (12)

85-90 2.8 135hp/160tq
91-92 3.1 140hp/180tq

replacement engine
93-95 3.4 160hp/200tq

The 85-90 is a MAF car, seems they always have trouble with the mafs. Accepts mods better.

91-92 is MAP, less electronic problems, but ecm doesnt accept mods as well. Lack of electronics to read, and not alot of people know how to edit the ecm codes.

Firebirds, more aero dynamics, cant accept the dual snorkle air intake.
Camaro. IMO, looks better. Can take dual snorkle intake.

Neither camaro or bird with a v6 got any better suspension. However, almost all v8 parts CAN go on a v6. Only thing is springs and matching the balance to your driving style, assuming you do take the car to its limits on occasion.

I do not recall anyone saying as to which car weights less. That really depends alot on options in the car.

RTFC

I have the only year 60*V6 Camaro that was somewhat a special edition and came with larger swaybars and a quick ratio steering box, but to be honest, even that was crap('87 Calif Edition RS Camaro V6- It was the first year of the RS and was limited production with a sopecial "handling package" that was to rival the IROC yet give the economy of a V6) . There in not ANY factory option 3rdgen(V8's included) that do not upgrading to make them handle a night and day difference from factory parts- even the WS6 package cars don't hold a candle to something fitted with aftermarket.

Just look for a decent shape car/chassis and go from there. Even the brakes ....well to put it bluntly....suck.

There is not one single untouched part on my car. The entire suspension and drivetrain has been completely modified. I am an authority on 3rdgen suspensions and brakes and definately have the most modified street 3rdgen on these forums, So I do speak with a load full of experience. PS I just cleaned up on 9 local V8 3rdgens at the local AutoX last weekend in this car with a measely 165fwhp.

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/518752/1

RTFC

In all respect to Jay, I have never had any problems with my MAF sensor. Matter of fact I still have the original factory MAF in the car.

And as for weights of the cars, the Firebirds are heavier than the Camaros. Especially when you speak of a ponitac like the GTA's. They can get in upwards of 3800lbs. The Camaro V6's are around 3000-3200 based on options. The Camaros have proven to be faster by the #'s throughout these boards regardless of motor size because they weight less on average.

kretos

look for an 88 and up camaro, came with dual snorkel intake, best 2.8 motor (91-92 came with 3.1) and you can get the sc with ground affects

camaro_junkie

Don't get an 86 because I believe the mains are weaker/smaller (someone can confirm this) and the gearing in the five speed sucks IMO. Plus they upgraded to the WC T5 later on too (stronger).

kretos

this is another reason i say 88 and up, 88 was the first year for the wc t-5

RTFC

'87 is the first year of the internally balanced 2.8 with the stronger jounals. But yes he may be looking for a 5 speed car.

camaro_junkie

He is indeed.

KED85

All I can offer is
GO TO CALIFORNIA TO BUY YOUR CAR!
WE GOT THEM BY THE DOZENS OUT HERE & ALL RUST FREE!!!!
AND
ya buy a junker with no engine & install your own!
That said....
I like 1985
Easiest to work on
My Firebird came with a F41/Y99 option and that's a rare combo (stylish wheels & tuned suspension according to Pontiac folks) As is RTFC Camaro with his rare combo of options
That said
Up north?
Buy anything with no rust & get to wrok
What is said about the stiffness of rebuilding the suspension is very true.
AND
IF ME
I'd seek a 93-95 3.4 w/stick
Or even better a 1995 to 2002, convert, stick & 3.8. The last ones are special!

Francis T.

Had a feeling the Pontica was haver, they near always are.
I've been told that the 90v 3.4 has larger and thus better oil passages in the crank, I'm kind of leaning toward that engine.
Can't do too new a car since I also want to use it as test bed for other 2.8 -3.4 engine goodies were thinking about making. Brakes-wise, it sounds like a Fiero. I simply put Porterfield RS4 pads, steel lines and slotted rotors on my GT and it made a big improvement. Will said mod work as well on the Camaro? One more question, what's is the most likely place to find and thus check for rust on these cars?
Been taking notes here, lots of good info. Thanks to all.

kretos

let me correct you here, the engine in the f body is a 60* v6, you can get the 3.4 from a 93-95 camaro or firebird and swap in it.

Francis T.

Yeah, I meant to say 60V. Basically I can't use a DOHC 3.4, though are good engines. Needs be the same as the Fieros except it can be the 3.4 version.
One of the reasons I left my 69 cuda was the constant rust battles. Whereas the Fieros don't have such problems, with the bodies anyway. I hope I can find a Camaro with body worth putting some effort into the engine and suspension etc. Aside from th the body, anywhere else to check for bad rust?

kretos

pull the carpet up under the front seats, check there, if a t top car, check the t top bar, pull up the carpet in the rear hatch well, floorboards underneath and wheel wells, and where the spare tire is kept, if all of those are rust free ( a bit of surface rust is easy enough to deal with) you got yourself a keeper.

the battery trays on most of these cars are trashed, even my car its rusted pretty bad, where the rest of my body is rust free.

Dale

iTrader: (12)

Sorry, just seems about 1/4 of the post on here are something MAF related. Far more then any other part IMO. Cant say I have seen more then 1-2 post saying the MAP was the issue.


Cars in my state seem to be quite rust free. Just alot owned by *******s that dont take alot of care of them. I would look out by cali, or somewhere below say the line of kansascity, stlouis, nashville line range.

But then your going to pay a few pennies to get it shipped to you.

KED85

Your neck of woods it's gonna be hard.
Make a trip to CA & just hit the wrecking yards.
We get them all day out here.
Shame for investment I'd score what I suggested. Milage, looks, value, fun factor.
Good combo to me!

camaro_junkie

I've never had a problem with my MAF sensor and I think it's original. I did have a bad connection at the MAF relay, but that's not the MAF's fault. But if you think about it, the MAP would be more robust because it is a much simpler device.

Xophertony

do yourself a favor, do not buy a t-top car unless you live somplace like so-cal where it only rains 2-3 times a year. i live in oregon (pronounced or-ih-gun not ory-gone) and i have replaiced every bit of weathersripping and my doorhinges and i still leak.

Francis T.

My Fiero has a pop up roof nut not the T top. I'm not a big fan of T tops anyway and won't be looking for one. On most cars, thay be more trouble than they're worth and proably add a few pounds too. Thanks for the warning though. Here's a question that might get a response; I'm aboyut to do a GT40 type extractor scoop on the front of my GT, is there roon for such a thing on the Camaro?

Dale

iTrader: (12)

I beilive ugh, who is that in hawaii did that? Has the white rs that he drifts??

His extractor was right behind the radiator. I think if you try to do one above the engine, you might be quite limited for space.

redraif

Revlimit has the hood...only one I've seen. I have always liked it in a strange sort of way. (Got a spare hood for my indy Fiero to make it one of these hoods!)

If you want to stick with what engine is in the car... the 2.8s from 87 on had massive imporovements made over the earlier 2.8s. Mine was a 2.8... The 3.1 cars have a better engine and are speed density. Have not messed with them to know what is easier to mod and work with... the MAFS like my 2.8, or the Speed density 3.1s... Fiero 2.8s are Speed density, right, so i think that would be more what you are used to... So I would let this determine what year to get...

Though I say definately do the swap to the 3.4 block swap... well worth it! The TQ gains are great! You've seen the same in the Fieros on the boards I'm sure! I would say you are better to get a car that looks good...body and interior! As far as how it runs...thats a bonus if you can get it, but I would do the 3.4 swap and not worry about how it runs when you get it. Most are 150,000 plus and are going to need a total rebuild soon anyway! With a decent 3.4 block, your intake, the old engines top end & computer you will be in good shape. Again speed density or MAFS preferance to determine if you want 3.1 or 2.8 to start with!

I have also heard Camaros are lighter.

Like anything with 20 year old technology... upgrades will do nothing but help and are a must! But at least the options of finding a decent workable v-6 are better since most were not beat to death. V-8 sways and supension are a good junkyard upgrade. Factory brakes for me with slotted and drilled rotors have been fine for daily driving. Added stainless lines.

Some basic suspension upgrades, new LCAs, panhard, added subframe connectors, Eibach prokit, wonder bar, strut tower brace, v-8 sways, and polyurathane bushing all around! Now I'm looking to go more RTFC's route...more bigger and better suspension upgrades. Tons of options to really make these cars handle!

Usually rust crops up in the floor boards... pull back carpet as was mentioned above. Found alot on my 82 that way. Get the car on a lift if you can... or at least jack it up! Someone had taken the 82 off the road aparently and dented the floor. That was were the rust started. Everything was an easy fix though! Battery trays are always bad.

Look at the bottom of fenders & doors. Though they are replaceable... the stuff to really watch out for is in the rear quarters. That you would have more of an issue with fixing (unibody). Check rear quarter hatch where the weather strip mounts. I had some there. Check wheelwells very well. I would look for bondo in the rear quarters too. Joe got a TA that had horrible quarters. Thought it was some bad paint and it turned out to be a bondo sculpture. He had to cut quarters of a junkyard car to replace his!

If the paint is original & delaminating you will need to strip it all the way down to metal and reprime. Some were bad about the paint going bad. Once the white starts to form the protective clear coat is breached. This is the only barrier from water. Moisture will then soak in these areas as it would on primer. You then run the risk of rust forming under the paint in exposed ares. You must then remove all the bad paint and go to the metal and reprime with a metal eching primer first to prevent further problems. So if you are not into a strip and repaint...look for decent paint!

If there is fresh paint...watch for any excessive sanding lines popping out. Might be a sign of bondo! Alot of backyard repairs have been done to these cars! Heck you may take a magnet to search out thick paint or bondo! Though a mill gauge would be ideal! I want to get one for this reason!

And though there are alot of used interior replacements avail... if you can start with something decent do that! Black interior is hard to find, esp in good condition. Goes for top $. Seats are typically torn on either the outer side bolsters or outer most side of the bottom cushion. Though there are alot of aftermarket venders of good quality seat cover replacements, so don't stress about that!