funstick

ok folks im getting ready to embark on the ultimate v6 nightmare. the v6 turbo. has anyone done it yet ?? if so got any advice tips or tricks. in case your wondering i have acess to the ecm nd its various code so there no issue with reworing the chip. i tunneda v6 single turbo for a guy in my area a close friend but i had no hand in building the motor. so any adivce tips tricks links to parts like Forged pistons etc etc etc ??

blown4now

I'm doing a complete resto on an 85 Trans Am, also going with either a 3.8L or 4.1L stage II motor, your best bet is going to be turbobuick.com check them out and they have a lot of links in the TTA section and what not. Also, the motor mounts are one of the hardest to find parts, but there is a link in there about this company making poly mounts and what not, around $250, those are what I'm going for. The 3.8L block that can be used is from LATE 85-87, and it will say 109 on the back, where a distributor for a SBC would be. If it doesn't say it, don't use it! If you are gonna build one with power, be sure to get a block girldle for it! Good luck!

Jake

joezero

Are you doing this with the 2.8/3.1L or are you gonna swap engines? Also how much boost do you plan on running and where are you gonna mount the turbos/route the exhaust?

funstick

its a proposed 3.1 build up. gonna use 1 turbo. run abotu 12 psi of boost. i was thinking forged pistons polsihed rods. the normal stuff you would do for any high perf buildup . i was just wondering if anybody had any expericne at all. i was wondering about headgaskets a big 60 v6 sore spot for sure.

TomP

Nope, the chance for "did it first!" is still out there! (Been there for 8 years, too...)

The head gaskets are a sore spot? Mine are still good! (238,000 miles) What happens to them? We have low compression to begin with, don't think a Turbo would blow the head gaskets out...

funstick

i see lots of 2.8's 3.1's with blown headgaskets. im hoping to wrap this project sometime this winter. gotta have the funds. its a truck my buddy scott has owend for a ling time. and he wants more power. we recently switch the truck from carberator to the mpfi system used in the camaros. and that was a fun adventure indeed. so the long term goal is to get about 250hp and have it reliable.

ok so this will be the first i will keep yall posted.

joezero

Well, it won't be the first time somebody's turbocharged a 2.8, but nobodies ever done it in an F-body.

fly'n_low-3.1

http://www.bryanf.com/mycars/510V6.htm

hope that gives you something to smile about as your building your motor.

-Adam

Dale

iTrader: (12)

funstick, what kinda truck is it going in. I have a s10 2.8l and i have been debating on puting mpfi on it to make people at shows go . If it was an s10, please email me as I would like some info on a few issues.

Ryan_Alswede

fly'n_low-3.1 nice find on the web, I WISH we had that much space under the hood for a setup like that.

fly'n_low-3.1

HEY listen if guys are sticking small block v8's with superchargers under the hoods of our cars why couldnt you do a twin turbo setup...JUST BECAUSE IT HASNT BEEN DONE DOESNT MEAN ITS IMPOSSIBLE



-Adam

joezero

The main hindrance really isn't space, it's routing. We have enough room in front of the engine to put in twin turbos, but it's a matter of trying to get the exhaust to and from the turbos that's the problem. There is room for a pipe right next to the power steering pump, but I don't know if I'd want to run the exhaust right next to the power steering, it might start a fire or at the least melt the resivoir. On the passenger side, you could always remove the smog pump, but then you wouldn't be able to have an emissions legal setup. I suppose you could try and run it under the suspension and all, but if you bottomed out on a speedbump or something, your custom exhaust work is toast.

I think the best way to go about it would be to make a pair of headers that rather then bending toward the back of the car, would go down straight only far enough that all three pipes can come together. Then you just have a collector and a flange. From there you could try different pipe routing possiblities while not having to change the headers each time.

Ryan_Alswede

The thing is you would need to use the TTA firebird as an example for routing stuff.

TomP

Ah, just move the power steering over. Or convert to a manual steering box from an early S10 Blazer, and dump the power steering altogether. Like Adam said, it's not impossible, just nobody can follow through with doing it.

Ryan_Alswede

If I wasn't in college and had a welder I'd do it. I'd just take a look at the TTA as a guide.

joezero

I'd thought about trying that. Or removing the A/C and smog pump. Then mounting the alternator where the smog pump was. Then you could run the exhaust up over top of the accessory belt. But again it wouldn't be smog legal. Or remove the A/C and make a bracket for the power steering so you could mount it where the A/C was. But I still think that you're not going to be able to get around removing the smog pump.

Ryan_Alswede

Well if have you noticed that the TTA is only 8.0 to 1 compression ratio, thats how they made that sucker last with the turbo. So our engines should be ok with 8.5 to 1.

joezero

It depends on how much boost you're planning to run. At like 5-6 psi, you should be fine at the stock compression. If you're thinking like 15-20 pounds of boost, you may run into a bit of trouble. Just my $.02

redraif

Joe talked to this guy yesterday. See I love the looks of my 6 and if It was possible to get some deceny HP numbers...

Well he said it was done by a very well know turbo guy in these parts. Turbo Tom. Joe had a Regal T-type, so he has heard of this guy... Well he built teh car for some rich guy who kept breaking things. Finally the rich guy parked it and this guy got it. He fixed it up, but said he would not recomend it. He told joe not to bother that for the gain is was not worth the $ or time and headache. Everything is custom. The electronics alone were around $2000 I believe. He told Joe to not turbo my car but do the V-8 swap. He said the speed and Numbers were never there. He was not happy enough with teh results to justify the time and expence. And that car was light. He told Joe to swap a turbo 3.8 instead if I was set on a 6.

Not to slam the idea, but I wanted to share what I had just learned...

funstick

hmmm i doubt the turbo v6 2.8 isnt worth it.look at the 2.2 chryslers running 12's in 4,000lb minivans.from reading the bit on the turbo 510 i think the engine management system was really holding the car back. also he might have been running the stock 2.8 heads.

the plan to date for the turbo build up in the s-10 is to use the gm performance parts 2.8 heads. speed pro pistons. and just good fastners everywhere. gonna run a mild cam for sure. as for the efi system being hold bck im sure it was. running alpha n mode is great when your tunning every day for the weather. but it had to really suck without a tps sensor to tell the ecm its accelerating and such.
ive already seen a single turbo camaro making good hp.

and if the guy who asked about the mpfi swap want to talk email me.

djfreggens@aol.com

SC2camaro

hey guys

i am fimialir with the GN 3.8 liter turbo's they make great power. but one thing is what i want to know is how are you going to keep the crank in the block ( the 2.8) cause i have had dealings with them the cranks are brittle with no counter weights. you must not plan on making abunch of boost. But as far as the ecm system just use a GM # 1227747 computer and used in the syclones/typhoons but you could use the stock ecm since it is a mass air ecm so it don't use map/bar sensors just will have to get bigger injectors and change the chip and timing. BUT I THINK THE REAL PROBLEM WILL BE KEEP THE CRANK IN THE BLOCK OR KEEPING IT FROM BREAKING INTO. SINCE IT'S NOT A WELL BALANCED MOTOR. i have seen blazers with broke cranks in a 4WD na from the stresses of the load just think about with a turbo making torque. please keep in touch for i am intrested in how it works cause my roomate wants to turbo his 86 SC 2.8L

but like the guy sid ealier in the post the buick 3.8- 4.1 are great to turbo, also on the TTA they used the FWD heads to get the headers to clear with the AC air box. the GN heads and headers will fit if you used a no ac air box. then other related itmes like computer and harness for the SFI turbo 3.8L since it's a DIS motor

Ryan_Alswede

THE 3.1L motors and 3.4L v6 60 degree motors have balanced cranks. I don't think you would want to do it to a 2.8L.

funstick

yeah ive got a borken blazer 2.8crank in the shed. as said before the 3.1 has been chosen becuase of the better crank. i would build a 3.4 but getting one is exspnsive and i already have sevral 3.1 2.8 blocks.this build up is going to take some time. as for the ecm tunning im not worried. i have the software to edit the ecm so its not a big worry. the code already has resolution for the airlfow im gonna be pushing into it.

TomP

The 2.8 was internally balanced (big center counterweight, meant for DIS application in a FWD Gen II 2.8) starting in '87. The DIS marks are still cut into the crank, but we have no use for them...

joezero

So are you saying then that the 2.8s from 87-90 had balanced cranks? Or are that at risk too?

funstick

tomp i will be brigning the s10 that will be turboed to the meet on staurday. youve got to drive this thing. its got a stock 2.8 that makes 4.3's cower. lol its not that fast but its close. are you bringing yr car ?

redraif

The crank was his weak point according to the guy who did the turbo 2.8L. He had to have so much custom stuff done, he said it was not worth it anymore.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

That car was a high dollar effort, using the best parts available. When someone spends that kind of money, and tells you it was a wasted effort, I'd listen...if you're deadset on a turbo V6, use a decent starting point like a 3.8 Buick motor, or even a 4.3 Chevy.
I'm sorry, the 2.8 did what is was designed to do fairly well, but why reinvent the wheel...use a proven motor that will GUARANTEE the ability to make serious HP, reliably...its not too hard to get 700hp out of a streetable GN motor, and it owuld probably be cheaper, too.

Ryan_Alswede

Isn't that the truth, if your willing to put money behind a project you can build any thing YOU WANT!!

TomP

Hehe, hell yeah I'm bringing my car... gotta get down there somehow! Don't expect an award winning show car though!

stuart69427

especially if you haven't replaced the quarter panel yet just pokin fun tom

SSC

Is the turbo idea still going around????????

Ive got myself a carbed 2.8 and two turbos dont tell me I'm going to beat the V6 owners to it? Although Im just going to flip the pass side manifold around and slide the single turbo on just to test. I'm 90% sure the exh flange for one of the turbos even bolts to the damn 2.8 s10 manifold. I just need to dig the engine out of the pile.

funstick

dont worry the s10 its no show winner its ugly as hell. but it is really kewl. its not turboed yet but i have had to do a great deal of prom tunning to make the carb cam work with the mpfi injection. its not realy a fast truck but it makes mondo TQ. and as for those who say turbing a 2.8 isnt worth it so what. im not building a race car. we are simply looking for a realy easy to build high fuel economy v6 with about 250hp. im sure the 2.8 can deliver that. and btw the build up will be a 3.1.

Dale

iTrader: (12)

funstick, mines a showtruck, and I have been debating on dropping the 3.1mpfi top on it. What all did you have to do to make just the mpfi part work on it. Got pics of it?? I would really like to do this, but I have come accross a few in doing it.

heres a link to my webpage, and it has a link to email me.

http://downndirty10.tripod.com/

SC2camaro

=you can have CUBIC INCHES

or you can have CUBIC MONEY to make power

why not use something that will work and live like a GN 3.8L
or a syclone 4.3L turbo engine it's nnothing but a vortec engine with a nice induction system

funstick

yet again this is not a max effort engine. we are shooting for 250hp. this is a modest goal. i dont want to hear about why i should not turbo the 60v6. i dont rememeber asking you for your disertation on why i shouldnt so please dont give it. if you have nothing constructive to add then dont add anything and keep yr print to yrself.

as for the guy asking about the mpfi swap. well it depends on if you are gonna just use the 2.8 3.1 indutction form the camaro ??? what kind of setup do you have now ? this swap is not hard but tunning the eprom to get it to run right is a bit of a chaleneg.

SC2camaro

hey funstick

sorry dude didn't mean to step on any toes.

send pics when it's done as for i'm curious to see how it turns out