Kingtal0n

OK I put the new stator in and now im having serious issues.

Issue #1: boost valve, the last thing to go in is VERY hard to put in. I have to hammer it down onto the spring, then when i put the snap ring in place i can twirl the snap ring around because the boost valve is NOT pushing back up. its like its stuck in place, ive removed it 3 times by prying up on the valve itself, and it pops out, but when i go to put it back in its very tight.

Issue #2: Pump Vanes / rotor... I put in the rotor, with the dowel and the spring to hold it in place. the book says to install a "teflon bushing" on the other side of the rotor, I have this teflon piece but theres also this black rubber piece with it. what the heck is that?

I assume the rubber piece goes behind the green teflon piece to hold it against the pump. if thats correct then...

I cant get the Vanes to sit flat, or to all go in. the vanes seem to sit on top of that "Steel ring" that goes under the rotor, and i cant get more than 4-5 vanes in place because on the other side of the rotor there is no room for the vanes.

Issue #3: I have leftover valves. uh oh.. where do THESE go? pic.

Kingtal0n

See the little green and black thingys? Did i put those in the right place, correctly? I think thats the "teflon bushing" the book refers to.

Kingtal0n

See how none of the rotors sit flat? and the ones on the bottom wont even fit!!!!

Kingtal0n

and another thing, the old accumulator has 2 pistons, and a spring, and 2 long round shafts in it.

the way the shift kit instructions tell me, is remove the bottom piston, and use a spring "cup" instead. Then put the top piston in place, followed by another spring. Right? well what about the 2nd shaft? get rid of it with the old piston too? I also saw another set of instructions telling me to turn the top piston upside down. Im guessing i DONT do that....

Kingtal0n

Ok I think i figured out the vanes.. they were going in the wrong way. So i put the rest of the vanes in, right side up, then put the other steel ring in place, and everything sits flat now.


Im STILL worried about the green / black thing though. did i do that right?

Kingtal0n

Heres what i put into the acumulator. Note the missing piston on the bottom, and the missing shaft after the 2nd piston. this is how the book says to do it????

Kingtal0n

I went back outside to re-check the boost valve one more time, and this time i cant even get it out! its really stuck in there...


If i pry up on the valve it springs back down in place just like any other valve, but i cant get the stupid thing out anymore. will it be OK in there? im going to mess with it some more.

Kingtal0n

ok everything went together nicelly the 154,304th time around. Im just trying to get the pump into the tranny now, its being a little pain in the ****...


tell me, just how far should the reverse input drum be below the pump gasket surface when its in all the way? mine is about 1/8" below, if that. Just want to be sure its all lined up before i shove this pump in...

thirdgen88

1/8" sounds about right... Did you use a pump alignment tool when you reassembled the pump?? If you didn't, you will not be able to get the pump to go in correctly.. You don't really need the special pump alignment tool, you can get a couple BIG hose clamps, hook them together, then place it around where the pump halves mate, tighten the hose clamp down, then torque the pump bolts... Then loosen the hose clamp and install your seals and don't forget the thrust washer on the bottom of the pump (you'll have to retain that little bugger with lots of petroleum jelly so it won't fall off when you set the pump in)...

Also, the middle valve pictured is the TV valve!

PLANT PROTECTION

iTrader: (6)

The other two valves are the 3-2 control valves. The left one is the stock one, the right one is the bigger of the two in the transgo kit. By looking at your stock valve, you installed the correct one.

Kingtal0n

Well I installed the transmission but have no reverse and no engine breaking leading me to beleive a sprag is installed wrong or not engaging properly. im going to scout the valve body out tommarow for little stupid things that could be the problem, but if i find none im going to pull it back out and dig in.

Kingtal0n

I posted this elsewhere but if you didnt see it I beleive the problem is the reverse/roller clutch. I dont think i seated the snap ring into the groove properly, and when i hit reverse for the first time I beleive the low/reverse clutches came on and pushed the roller clutch up into the sunshell, causing it to lock the output shaft with pressure from the clutches, which explains why it felt like i still have the parking break on when in reverse. that also explains the no-engine breaking. without low-reverse operating properly, you cant have engine breaking.

go figure. its coming out tonight...

in another positive note, the thing drives great in OD and D... its going to be a monster when its back together.

PLANT PROTECTION

iTrader: (6)

Just curious, how simple is the fix? Having to re-rebuild would suck.

Kingtal0n

To fix it i need to pull the transmission, then I have to

Pull the Tranny Pan, Remove converter selenoid, pump filter,
then Remove Front pump,
Then the 2-4 Band (possible to do with Valvebody installed but time consuming to put back in)
THen take out the reverse input drum with the Input Drum,

then the small snap ring holding the first planet gear things in place, take out everything down to the sunshell,

Under the sunshell is the reverse roller clutch, I just have to seat it down and properly install the Retainer Ring into the groove..

Then just put everything back together. 10-12 hours including trans-removal and install.

Kingtal0n

Well I did all of the above...

but now i STILL have no engine breaking in 1st, and my shifts are very late (4000 RPMS+) and hard, even under very light throttle. adusting the TV cable doesnt seem to make a difference in shift timing or firmness.

but reverse works... woodeedoo.

thirdgen88

How is the garage shift?? (from park to reverse or park to drive) Does it engage extremely harshly?? I'm suspecting overly high tv line pressure...

Kingtal0n

Its not STOCK smooth but its still pretty smooth. it engages quickly and quietly, i have no bang or headsnap.

Now if im in reverse and the car is rolling back some when i put it into drive from reverse i get a snap into drive that almost chirps the tires...

now the transgo kit comes with a weird TV valve setup. it has 2 springs on the valve, then a weird long shim thing INSIDE the outer spring, then ANOTHER washer shim before it sits up inside the outer piece (before roll pin) I know i did it like the instructions but im wondering if maybe it wasnt for this year tranny or something. I didnt see that sleeve thing in there like in the instructions... Maybe i could re-use my stock TV valve and remove the shims from the situation and see what happens?

Would a high line pressure stop engine breaking in manual 1st?

thirdgen88

Well, high tv pressure definately should not stop engine braking.. I think the overrun clutches are responsible for that.. and high tv pressure would hold them better than normal levels...

I would reevaluate the throttle valve system first... Make sure its working right, and go from there.. (man that line pressure gauge sure would be handy

Oh and the tv sleeve should be the piece thats held in by the roll pin (the deal that the plunger slides back and forth in)...

Kingtal0n

Ok heres the deal so far:

I replaced the governor with a new one (just in case) still have all problems.

I then removed the valve body, and checked all the valves for free-motion. they all worked fine. i pushed the plunger in the TV valve system and watched the valve move as it should; fully depressed plunger = fully depressed valve.

Then i was looking through the instructions and realized that i drilled a hole wrong in the valve body. Instead of drilling the hole through the partition from the manual linkage into the bathtub, i drilled straight through the bathtub (towards the pan) through the valvebody completelly!

So i re-drilled the hole correctly and blocked off the old one.
What would that hole cause being there?

Situation:
Very late shifts, 1-2 occurs @ 4500RPMS under very light throttle, 3-4 @ about 85MPH.
<b>
--When downshifting from 4-3 manually, the transmission binds up and almost locks the tires up. it feels like someone slammed on the brakes. I smelt burned tranny fluid and saw white smoke pour out the back for a bit afterwards... </b>
The only thing occuring during a 4-3 downshift is the #4 servo piston disengages, and the over-run clutches come on the sprag.
the sprag is in right or i wouldnt have engine breaking in 3 or 2 right? and the band is working because it comes on and off in 2nd. it comes on in 4th also just fine and normal, except really late of course. whats the deal?

I think i found out why theres no engine breaking in manual 1 though, Dana pointed out that when the low-reverse clutches came on and the roller clutch smacked the sunshell the piston moved farther up than it should have so when it came back down the seal ripped on it. so now when in manual 1 i lose engine breaking because the fluid just spills out the seal down there.

So now im just worried about the super high shift points and of course the downshift bind. I have engine breaking in manual 3 and manual 2, so i suppose that means the sprag is in correctly.

thirdgen88

Drilling through the valve body can't be good.. I'm not sure what that passage even does (I don't have any of my books here)... Perhaps that is dumping governor pressure back in to the pan so it never exceeds tv pressure (to shift)?? Couldn't be good whatever it is...

PLANT PROTECTION

iTrader: (6)

I nearly drilled straight through the bathtub too, transgo directions just suck. Lucky for me ZaphodB has the video on his site and I saw how to do it correctly. Good luck with the trans!

Kingtal0n

It LOOKS like originally, the fluid came through the spacer plate and pushed against the valve (thus the spring faces the roll pin) which actuated the 3-2 valve, whatever it did.

Trans-go has you block off the hole in the plate where the fluid used to go, then drill a hole in the partition of the manual valve INTO the bathtub, from there the fluid travels to the other hole you drill INTO the valve area (where the spring used to be) to actuate the valve in the opposite direction.

Drilling a hole in the bathtub, i would seriouselly DOUBT has anything to do with the late shifts simply because i never drilled the hole through the partition which to ME would simply mean the valve never got fluid because there was no where for fluid to come from, therefor how could it leak fluid from the governor if there was no place for fluid to come from? I had my 3-2 downshift, however, what did the old valve used to do? and what is the purpose of the new valve? maybe its the reason for my 4-3 bindup downshift?

I removed the TV valve again and found a big piece of lint in there, although i didnt see the valve sticking because of it. I took a picture of the TV valve fully compressed (plunger) just in case one of you notice anything odd.

Kingtal0n

OK I put the valvebody back in and drove it...
heres what going on now:

My shifts are now ON TIME 1-2-3 perfect no problems. Reverse is good too.

But now, I no longer can find 4th gear. I took it up to 55+MPH and no Fourth gear. Sigh* I HAD fourth before i re-did the valve body though!

Another weird thing:
I was driving in 3rd with it locked up. Suddenly, it unlocked in 3rd. I have a manual switch for lockup, so that was very odd. now, I have no more lockup in 3rd gear. but i DO have lockup in 2nd gear. weird huh?
So no fourth, and no lockup in 3rd. everything else seems peachy so far..

Kingtal0n

UPDATE:

Finnaly got it working the way its supposed to!

Problem with 4th and lockup was the 4th gear piston seal (Under the servo cover) was blown clean out. thing almost blew out of the tranny case! Man i guess not having that hole in the valve body drilled right caused a crapload of troubles. Sheesh.

Well its fixed now, i put a good 100 miles on it for some fun and even driving it hard and pushing the converter into the 3500-4000 stall range doesnt seem to be really hurting my fuel economy as bad as i thought it would. In fact I went 78~miles on about 4 gallons of gas... 55 of which were highway thought (4th lockup helps) so im averaging 20-22 MPG right now, which is what I was averaging before the converter...

Now to do the gears... and get some video! its pretty impressive how much faster this thing got.

thirdgen88

Glad to hear!! Its a good feeling when you finally get something like that working perfectly (almost leaves you wondering what you missed )... Right on!

RBob

iTrader: (1)

My understanding of these changes, new (3-2) valve, drill holes, plug holes in spacer plate, is how TransGo enables 1st gear to be manually held. A stock 700R4 will upshift to 2nd even if held in manual 1st. (please note that only some of all the changes are for this purpose).

TransGo hijacks the 3-2 valve and converts it to a 1-2 manual upshift valve. Originally this 3-2 valve was just a setup for the actual downshift. Once converted it is now possible to hold manual 1st.

RBob.

Kingtal0n

Rbob That sounds interesting, but what im curious about is how the heck that one hole caused so many problems? its obvious to me that somehow that hole in the partition has something to do with pressure releif from the 4th servo piston during a 4-3 downshift... SOMEHOW related, simply because when i downshifted the forward sprag came on (like its supposed to) but the band did NOT disengage! the fluid apparently had no where to go, so it bound against the sprag, and blew the piston seal so the fluid could escape (lost 4th gear of course)

It also has something to do with governor pressure, since with that hole in the wrong spot i had very late hard shifts (4000 rpm range) where now they are normal without that hole.

Oh ya AND it has something to do with lockup.. with that hole there I would lose lockup after trying to go into 4th gear. now it works normal...