maroon88iroc

iTrader: (7)

ok so my 86 305 tpi automatic camaro is not running. i know it is a fuel issue. i have no fuel coming out of the shrader valve with the car not running. i have 45 psi at the filter with the car not running also. with the car running i have fuel pressure at the shrader and 38 psi at the fuel filter. the car was not running previously i got it home and got it to run, i didnt even do anything to it,i just cranked up after i tested the pressure at the filter and it ran just fine, i drove it around the block and it drove fine for about five minutes then it shut off and i parked it on the side of the road where it is now. i have pressure out of the return line, i also have pressure in the main line. i have unhooked the fuel lines coming into the engine bay and i have pressure there i used a noid light tester to check the injectors and they are all functioning. i am thinking it might be the fuel pressure regulator does anyone have any suggestions?

maroon88iroc

iTrader: (7)

bump... anyone?

Viprklr

iTrader: (5)

Have you hooked up your fuel pressure tester to the schraeder, prime/run, shut the car off, then watched what the fuel pressure does?

It should hold with a slow drop.

pandin

When you say you have pressure in the return line, is that with a gauge? 20 psi won't run tpi. Return line should be open to the tank, low or no pressure.

From fuel pump, filter, to injectors including pressure side of reg should all be the 40#. Pinch down on return hose and pressure should increase any where before the pinch. A dead headed pump (full tight pinch) will read up to 100#. Becareful old rubber lines don't like 100#.

One guy here at TGO, got an inline pump, series it in the fuel pressure line, because of a dead pump. Installed and hot wired under the hood to save on tow bill. Pulled fuel through dead pump. Use this at your own risk. Temporary at best.

Viprklr

iTrader: (5)

On a side note.....the stock regulator diaphragm doesn't like anything over 65psi. This is per the Service manual.

sprslo92

i would do what viprklr said i would check the regulator. if thats not the problem get a screwdriver and put it against the injectors and listen while some one is cranking. if they are working you should hear a ticking noise through the handle (injector pulse).

maroon88iroc

iTrader: (7)

all the injectors were tested with a noid light... they all work, i am guessing it is a dead pump. what would be a good external pump like you are talking about pandin. i would like to try that and if it fixes my problem then change the pump out.
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zero fuel coming out of the shrader with the pump primed... but it was just like this before also but then it ran for like ten minutes straight no problem...

pandin

search on "Fuel Pump - Not That Bad!" use the quotes.

It is a step by step, How to, by the guy (camaronewbie) that just did it.

Well 10 11 2005 But he posted right after it was done.

Viprklr

iTrader: (5)

You have said that you have 45psi at the filter and 38 at the schraeder.
That alone says the pump is working although I think the pump supply pressure is supposed to be higher.
Hook up the fuel pressure tester to the regulator, prime the car, shut the car off, and watch the pressure drop on the tester. Don't waste money on a pump that you may not need.

maroon88iroc

iTrader: (7)

no i have not checked pressure at the shrader. the car ran for like ten minutes the other day and i hit the shrader with my finger and i had plenty of pressure but i did not check it with the gauge... i had 38 psi of fuel pressure at the filter with the car running and with it not running and primed i had 48 psi of pressure. with the car not running i have ZERO fuel coming out of the shrader, and i cant get the car to fire.. i just rechecked pressure at the filter and i have 48 psi there and still nothing at the shrader.

it doesnt make sense to me someone help me out.

maroon88iroc

iTrader: (7)

well i think i have decided again it isnt the pump, but i ordered the external one from oreilly and i am gonna try it out tomorrow here is what i have going on tonight.

fuel pressure at the filter is 48 psi everytime i prime the car. still ZERO pressure at the shrader. i have used the noid light on every injector and it is flashing on every injector, and on the rear passenger injector the connector doesnt want to seat on the injector, when i put it on it wont snap down like the others. and i can pull the connector back off without taking the clip off. i think this lack of connection is causing a problem. also on that same injector the wires going to it are not in good shape it looks like a rat was chewing at them. but the noid light flashed when i put it on that connector...

the car cranked and ran fine again tonight for a short period of time. when i took off the injector connector to the injector over cylinder #4 to test with the noid light, the car cranked up with the connector disconnected and ran fine i pushed in the shrader and it had plenty of pressure i put my pressure gauge on it and it didnt read but it had plenty of pressure, i think the pressure tester didnt push in the shrader or something. so i dont know the exact psi it had but it had alot of pressure b/c when i pushed it with my finger it shot out pretty hard. i shut the car off plugged the connector back in and tried to crank it again and it wouldnt crank.

from my understanding the way this system works is that the regulator is the very last thing on the whole fuel system circuit. so that means pressure would go from the tank, through the filter into the engine bay, to the injectors, then to the shrader, and then to the regulator. am i correct on this?

i think it is a problem with the injector or the connection to it. is there anyway i can ohm that injector out to test the injector out itself

pandin

You are right about the guage not opening the S-valve. You are not getting a true reading.

Go to a parts store and look in the AC section, the S-valves are the same as the freon ones. Remove the internal valve with a tire valve remover. Sometimes real skinny needle nose plyers will fit, to remove.

Bled off gas pressure, key off. Remove s-valve internals and install guage. retest. After you are done replace old S-valve with new one.

The pressure from tank (pump) to filter to fuel rail (S-valve and injectors) to reguator should all be the same.

Put your finger over the end of a garden hose. The pressure will be the same from the Tap to your finger, even if hose is 25' long.

Idle, with vacuum line attached, at regulator, 39 psi or so. At wot or with vacuum line removed should be 45.3 psi or so. Any pressure over about 25-30 psi should work up to about 55 psi (depends on injectors).

18 ohms or so. All injectors should be close. Usally a bad one will be like 10 ohms.

Spraying gas on a hot engine or smokers can make pretty fires.

maroon88iroc

iTrader: (7)

i am going to try that in the morning. so i went ahead and pulled the fuel rail and all the injectors, to replace with a good working set when pulled from my iroc. so while i had it apart i went ahead and cleaned up a little and painted some stuff.

i hate it but i didnt take a before picture.. how stupid of me and i couldnt find one on the computer lame but oh well here are the pics.

here is the tear down to the valve covers...



donor tpi setup came off my iroc b4 i carbed it.



finished product, i painted the valve covers and the runners grey, i wanted more of a graphite color but this looks good, it is more of a blueish grey which i dont like but oh well it looks pretty good all together and definitely 100x better than before. all i have to do in the morning is hook up the fuel lines and put the alternator on, i put everything together and bolted the alternator back on and was like eh i might as well paint it too so it is off and i painted it black. i would have painted the throttle body but i didnt really wanna disconnect the tv cable from the throttle body since i am pretty sure that is what killed the 700r4 in my iroc, the cable not being adjusted correctly. but then i put it all together and realized that the cable was supposed to go inside the runner instead of on the outside so i had to take it off anyway, i saw that and was like just shoot me lol. but it turned out good ill let yall be the judge.

Viprklr

iTrader: (5)

Disconnecting the TV cable from the TB wouldn't have hurt anything. It just clips to the TB. The adjusment part is located at the bracket mounted to the plenum.

maroon88iroc

iTrader: (7)

the problem is not the fuel pump. i swapped the rail and injectors over and i have PLENTY of pressure at the shrader 48psi to be exact. every time i prime it it is right there at atleast 45. ok now i am having another problem. the car wont stay running at all. it is like sputtering when i hold the gas open on it. i noticed that i forgot to hook up the senser under the plenum after i tried to crank it. i hooked that sensor up and it is still doing the same thing. so i disconnected the battery to reset the computer. crank it up and it runs just fine for like twenty seconds, then the belt startes squeeling really loud and the car sputters and shuts off. trying to recrank it the car wont crank and is just sputtering like it is trying to fire but wont... any ideas?

pandin

Unhook the squealing belt and try a start and short run (just a few min). sounds like something else, water pump, alt, (mechanical, bad bearing, ect)

maroon88iroc

iTrader: (7)

i did that last night same results just no squealing belt. i am thinking it is loosing spart i am gonna replace the coil and ignition control module today.

pandin

Since you had all the FI stuff off, take a real close look at what you just had undone. Recheck connectors and look for a vacuum leak (slipped gasket, broken plastic line, or even a loose bolt or two). AMHIK BTDT

maroon88iroc

iTrader: (7)

I forgot to hook up the connector under the plenum so I lookedover everything and it all looked good everything is hooked up

BAD88IROC

I know you said you checked everything but check the coolant temp sensor on the front of the lower intake manifold. Its kinda hidden so look carefully. It sounds like that is unhooked and the computer defalts to like -40 Deg F. That causes the computer to richen the engine so much that it floods it kinda like an old carbed engine . That sensor has the same type connector as your fuel injectors have. Just a thought. let us know what u find.

pandin

One TGO member had a weird problem, after doing what you did, after long hours and many different suggestions at 4:00 am he unhooked and reconnected all of the FI connections. Poof all weirdness left, car ran fine.
Something just was not making good connection. So maybe if you unplug and replug anything close to where you were working, maybe it will help. Thats all I can think of.

Jay

iTrader: (2)

Just to add... checking with a noid light verifies that the injector is getting a pulse from the ECM. It does not necessarily indicate the injector is working, mechanically it could be stuck.

maroon88iroc

iTrader: (7)

well i found out what the problem was... the rotor button was burnt up, it had about a nickel sized hole in it... i got the fuel problem fixed and the car would fire, it just would run like crap i didnt even think to check that because the car was firing. someone told me it could be the ignition control module so i pulled the cap and wala there is the problem. put a new rotor and cap on and cranked the car i had to keep it at like 3500 to burn the plugs clean then it ran pretty good. i checked codes via a paperclip and got a code 42 which was oxygen sensor lean i think. but the light hasnt came back on yet. been driving the car all week and its running great.

pandin

This is the hardest thing to do, is to look where you know the problem isn't.

Glad you got it.

maroon88iroc

iTrader: (7)

definitely is bro. but i fixed the fuel problem so i know that was fixed its just something else happened and i just went digging around and noticed it and i am so glad i did.