TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
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Car: 89 ws6
Engine: 355 afr195, hsr,gmpp cam, hs rr,
Transmission: t-5
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Batman,
I think giving detailed tips of what problems you ran into along the way can greatly help future third gen owners trying to look for feedback from someone who didn't build the thing lol. My harness should be ariving soon and I hope to do the same thing and try to explain what problems I may have. I will try to take some pictures as well along the way. mine is going into an 89' formula so there are a few differences in the harnesses.
I think giving detailed tips of what problems you ran into along the way can greatly help future third gen owners trying to look for feedback from someone who didn't build the thing lol. My harness should be ariving soon and I hope to do the same thing and try to explain what problems I may have. I will try to take some pictures as well along the way. mine is going into an 89' formula so there are a few differences in the harnesses.
Last edited by shocker89bird; 06-19-2007 at 01:18 PM.
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Car: 87 GTA, 88 GTA, 92 TA, 72 RS SS
Engine: 350, 350, 305, 396
Transmission: T56, 700r4, 700r4, T56
Axle/Gears: 3.42, 3.23, 3.23, 3.73
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
I got my ODB II TPI harness from Mike at EFI connection today and man its one nice looking piece. here are some pics of the harness and car.
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
If anyone decides they want 4L60E or 4L80E control in the harness, this can also be done (even if not used immediately). shocker89bird's harness has 4L60E wiring, but for now he's got a manual transmission. Adding 4L60E control to a harness after it is built is going to be a lot of work. If you think there's the possibility of using a 4L60E/4L80E in the future, tucking the connector aside is easy.
For those making their own harness, I recommend including 4L60E control for the possibility of future use.
This is what Matt did with his 89 Formula (see several pages ago in this thread). He swapped rather quickly from the 700R4 to the 4L60E after he did this 0411 conversion.
The 4L60E and 4L80E are pinned differently, so keep that in mind. Plan on one or the other, but not both.
Cars originally equipped with an automatic transmission have the park/neutral indicator switch and brake switch. Installing a 4L60E is as simple as plugging it in. Cars with original manual transmissions may require additional work for the brake switch and park/neutral indicator signals. Now I'm speaking of wiring simplicity. There are a few ways to tackle the VSS. Fortunately the 0411 PCM allows for VSS correction through EFILive or your preferred tuning software.
VSS correction - I wish that was available for my S10 with the 730 electronics. Try getting a 40 pulse per driveshaft revolution signal (VSS in Typhoon transfer case) to work with the TPI ECM. My speedometer was all over the place. I'm really looking forward to getting the 0411 PCM into my S10.
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I noticed the 2000 f-body in your profile. You can simply swap out the 99-00 PCM for the 01-02 PCM (12200411). I did this with my 2000 Firehawk. The harness is pinned the same. Just be sure you put your car's VIN in the newer PCM. If you don't, the air bag light will come on. There are no significant benefits on a stock car, but if you decide to use an EFILive custom operating system, it will be a good idea. A crankshaft relearn will probably be necessary.
For those making their own harness, I recommend including 4L60E control for the possibility of future use.
This is what Matt did with his 89 Formula (see several pages ago in this thread). He swapped rather quickly from the 700R4 to the 4L60E after he did this 0411 conversion.
The 4L60E and 4L80E are pinned differently, so keep that in mind. Plan on one or the other, but not both.
Cars originally equipped with an automatic transmission have the park/neutral indicator switch and brake switch. Installing a 4L60E is as simple as plugging it in. Cars with original manual transmissions may require additional work for the brake switch and park/neutral indicator signals. Now I'm speaking of wiring simplicity. There are a few ways to tackle the VSS. Fortunately the 0411 PCM allows for VSS correction through EFILive or your preferred tuning software.
VSS correction - I wish that was available for my S10 with the 730 electronics. Try getting a 40 pulse per driveshaft revolution signal (VSS in Typhoon transfer case) to work with the TPI ECM. My speedometer was all over the place. I'm really looking forward to getting the 0411 PCM into my S10.
----------
I noticed the 2000 f-body in your profile. You can simply swap out the 99-00 PCM for the 01-02 PCM (12200411). I did this with my 2000 Firehawk. The harness is pinned the same. Just be sure you put your car's VIN in the newer PCM. If you don't, the air bag light will come on. There are no significant benefits on a stock car, but if you decide to use an EFILive custom operating system, it will be a good idea. A crankshaft relearn will probably be necessary.
Last edited by S10Wildside; 06-21-2007 at 06:14 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
#454
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Engine: 355
Transmission: 700R4
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Re: 4L60 I'm gathering the parts for this conversion on the 88 GTA and the trans I got has a 2 piece bell housing and a connector at the shift lever. Will this trans work? I'm assuming the conn is for start and back-up?? Before I freshen it up, thought I'd better ask. Thanx, Dave
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Re: 4L60 I'm gathering the parts for this conversion on the 88 GTA and the trans I got has a 2 piece bell housing and a connector at the shift lever. Will this trans work? I'm assuming the conn is for start and back-up?? Before I freshen it up, thought I'd better ask. Thanx, Dave
The guesswork on the park/neutral indicator signal (early in this thread) would have been avoided if the switch on the side of the transmission were used.
Last edited by S10Wildside; 06-21-2007 at 08:36 AM.
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Car: 89 ws6
Engine: 355 afr195, hsr,gmpp cam, hs rr,
Transmission: t-5
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Ran into my first hicup yesterday before i even got the harness. Can't find my ignition key after much searching. Now I am going to replace the igniton lock and tighten the tilt steering nuts while i am at it. Other than the I am getting my old harness ready to be removed. I did take a before pircture but this will look almost identical to the finish product. It also helps that I have done two harnesses on this car and know what wires need to stay.
FYI jsut take your tiem guys if you have not done this before. Not the worst thing ever but time consuming. If you have any questions feel free to email me I can rememebr many of the wiring colors off of the top of my head, also you can talk to Mike he has been extremly helpful so far. He really seems to know his stuff. Sorry to volunteer your help liek that Mike i know you are very busy.
FYI jsut take your tiem guys if you have not done this before. Not the worst thing ever but time consuming. If you have any questions feel free to email me I can rememebr many of the wiring colors off of the top of my head, also you can talk to Mike he has been extremly helpful so far. He really seems to know his stuff. Sorry to volunteer your help liek that Mike i know you are very busy.
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Engine: 355
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Re: 4L60E Thanks for the response, Mike. I glad I posted and the salvage yard assured me--------- well, you know. Back it goes. Thanks again, I will pick the right one and order my harness from you. Dave
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Car: 87 GTA, 88 GTA, 92 TA, 72 RS SS
Engine: 350, 350, 305, 396
Transmission: T56, 700r4, 700r4, T56
Axle/Gears: 3.42, 3.23, 3.23, 3.73
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
I noticed the 2000 f-body in your profile. You can simply swap out the 99-00 PCM for the 01-02 PCM (12200411). I did this with my 2000 Firehawk. The harness is pinned the same. Just be sure you put your car's VIN in the newer PCM. If you don't, the air bag light will come on. There are no significant benefits on a stock car, but if you decide to use an EFILive custom operating system, it will be a good idea. A crankshaft relearn will probably be necessary.[/QUOTE]
That’s good to hear that it doesn't have to be repined. I am installing nitrous so it looks like I will be making another 411 swap in the 2000 TA.
Mike, I have a MAF off of a 95 LT1 camaro do you know what the difference between it and the LS1 MAF? I have not compared part numbers yet but physically they look the same.
That’s good to hear that it doesn't have to be repined. I am installing nitrous so it looks like I will be making another 411 swap in the 2000 TA.
Mike, I have a MAF off of a 95 LT1 camaro do you know what the difference between it and the LS1 MAF? I have not compared part numbers yet but physically they look the same.
Last edited by battman; 06-21-2007 at 03:02 PM.
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
At one time I compared part numbers for the LT1 and LS1 MAF. They were different numbers. I'm not sure what is different about the sensors.
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Car: 77 El Camino
Engine: 355 Converting to TPI
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Evening,
I just got back into town from a workshop. Real quickon a couple of items.
First, I found some tubing I might be able to use. Its flexible stainless steel used as gas lines with installing stoves and the likes.
Secondly, Looking at the parts list, I noticed two different sets of years. Is that manditory?
Bill
I just got back into town from a workshop. Real quickon a couple of items.
First, I found some tubing I might be able to use. Its flexible stainless steel used as gas lines with installing stoves and the likes.
Secondly, Looking at the parts list, I noticed two different sets of years. Is that manditory?
Bill
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Car: 87 GTA, 88 GTA, 92 TA, 72 RS SS
Engine: 350, 350, 305, 396
Transmission: T56, 700r4, 700r4, T56
Axle/Gears: 3.42, 3.23, 3.23, 3.73
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
I am taking off work early today to go the junk yard and get the rest of the vortec parts I need and start working on it tomorrow mourning. I was going to try and do it tonight but I think I'm going to make some passes at the track in my 2000 ta tonight.
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Car: 89 ws6
Engine: 355 afr195, hsr,gmpp cam, hs rr,
Transmission: t-5
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Sounds good battman. Should be a nice swap when you are done. I was able to find my parts all in the same place. Usually I would think the coil and igniton module come together. I was unable to get a timing cover with bolts so try to make sure you find yours with bolts as to save time trying to match them up.
#466
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Also, be aware that I'm the only one who had a problem with the front timing cover leaking (driver side)...and I'm also the only one who did not use silicone sealer in addition to the seal built into the cover. Use a sealer.
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Last edited by S10Wildside; 06-22-2007 at 11:48 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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Car: 89 ws6
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
A new cover (with bolts) is about $50.00 from http://www.partsamerica.com. Not all that unreasonable.
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Car: 1992 25th Anniversary Z28
Engine: 6.3L - 383
Transmission: 700R4; Vig 3200
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Another step closer! I met up with Mr. Lextech (Thanks again buddy!) earlier this week for a little 411 ECU 101. Jeff is one awesome guy...extremely gracious taking the time to help me out with the ECU's. Lemme tell ya his turbo truck is amazing...the welding and fabrication work he did looked absolutely perfect...he is a very detail oriented guy and it shows.
Now I just need to get my balancer machined down a bit and install it all and order the Harness from Mike when I get my paycheck this week
Jeff reiterated the same experiences as others whom have completed the 411 project...just upgrading his stock '98 ECU with stock tune to the 411 ECU with the stock tune was a night and day difference! Can't wait to order that harness and get the car running!
Now I just need to get my balancer machined down a bit and install it all and order the Harness from Mike when I get my paycheck this week
Jeff reiterated the same experiences as others whom have completed the 411 project...just upgrading his stock '98 ECU with stock tune to the 411 ECU with the stock tune was a night and day difference! Can't wait to order that harness and get the car running!
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Car: '86 IROC-Z/'94 Z28
Engine: 350 LT1/382 LT1
Transmission: 4L60-E/T-56
Axle/Gears: 3.45/3.42 (soon 4.10)
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Whew! LOTS of info!
Looks like this has solutions to problems I was looking at too. First, I have an '86 with an LT1 with a TPI intake (accel base) and I really dont like the conversion harness. Where did you locate connectors to make it plug into the chassis harness?
How does the PCM signal work with the factory tach? Does it work ok or no? I'm assuming since it's running a dizzy and one coil and not multiple coils, that the signal is fine. And the other gages?
I'm half tempted right now to just build a harness if I can locate the connectors. Using an OBDII harness is such a PITA on an '86...
On camaroZ28.com, they were saying the Vortec distributor uses a cam sensor that is the same frequency as the LT1. So I'm assuming the Vortec distributor could also be used on LT1's to replace the optispark, while I build a new harness for my '94? That way I could run the '94 with EFI, and everything else will work as it's designed to. And I can do this on my '86 for simplicity...because my adapter harness SUCKS and there are no good wiring schematics for the car I can easily find! I want to ditch the generic adapter harness.
Looks like this has solutions to problems I was looking at too. First, I have an '86 with an LT1 with a TPI intake (accel base) and I really dont like the conversion harness. Where did you locate connectors to make it plug into the chassis harness?
How does the PCM signal work with the factory tach? Does it work ok or no? I'm assuming since it's running a dizzy and one coil and not multiple coils, that the signal is fine. And the other gages?
I'm half tempted right now to just build a harness if I can locate the connectors. Using an OBDII harness is such a PITA on an '86...
On camaroZ28.com, they were saying the Vortec distributor uses a cam sensor that is the same frequency as the LT1. So I'm assuming the Vortec distributor could also be used on LT1's to replace the optispark, while I build a new harness for my '94? That way I could run the '94 with EFI, and everything else will work as it's designed to. And I can do this on my '86 for simplicity...because my adapter harness SUCKS and there are no good wiring schematics for the car I can easily find! I want to ditch the generic adapter harness.
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
How does the PCM signal work with the factory tach? Does it work ok or no? I'm assuming since it's running a dizzy and one coil and not multiple coils, that the signal is fine. And the other gages?
Last edited by S10Wildside; 06-24-2007 at 07:53 PM.
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Car: 1991 Camaro RS Vert
Engine: 350 S-TPI
Transmission: T5
Axle/Gears: GU5/G80/J65
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Wildside, few more questions if you dont mind.
1. On your site, I dont see anywhere where you offer to edit the bin files on the ECM for turning fuctions off/on. Do you offer this? If so, how much.
2. I was told the express doesnt have electric fans so the wiring will not be in the factory harness for this. Everyone says it will run the fans and I belive it will. Could you post what pin #'s need to be hooked up for this function to work?
I have almost all my parts collected, still a few short. ECM and harness should be in this week to look over and see what I need to order to make the factory van harness work. WOOT.
1. On your site, I dont see anywhere where you offer to edit the bin files on the ECM for turning fuctions off/on. Do you offer this? If so, how much.
2. I was told the express doesnt have electric fans so the wiring will not be in the factory harness for this. Everyone says it will run the fans and I belive it will. Could you post what pin #'s need to be hooked up for this function to work?
I have almost all my parts collected, still a few short. ECM and harness should be in this week to look over and see what I need to order to make the factory van harness work. WOOT.
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
2. I was told the express doesnt have electric fans so the wiring will not be in the factory harness for this. Everyone says it will run the fans and I belive it will. Could you post what pin #'s need to be hooked up for this function to work?
Fan 1 "Low Speed" - Blue Connector Cavity 42
Fan 2 "High Speed" - Red Connector Cavity 33
If you're not using LS1 fans, ignore the high and low speed notes. Just count on the PCM grounding these circuits to turn on fan relays.
If you need terminals for the LS1 PCM, EFI Connection has them at http://www.eficonnection.com/eficonnection/100w.aspx
Or, you can reuse some of the wires you pull out of the used harness.
#473
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Car: '86 IROC-Z/'94 Z28
Engine: 350 LT1/382 LT1
Transmission: 4L60-E/T-56
Axle/Gears: 3.45/3.42 (soon 4.10)
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
OK, sounds like it makes sense.
The connectors I would need are the C100, c105, c210, c220 and c230 with corresponding wiring. The fourthgen has the relays and such in the chassis half of the harness, which these connect to for fuel, A/C, fans, and stuff like that. I have a set of the connectors from my last swap if you need them, since I know this isnt a common request. I just want to make the harness a plug in. The connectors I am referring to for the fourthgen can be seen here:
http://shbox.com/1/harness_connector_faces.htm
I'd want one for a 1994.
On the bright side, I looked on my data disc for schematics for my Camaro and was happy to see that I have ALL the GM SPO information for 2001 Chevy Express Vans. I have the PCM pinout diagrams and other information if you would like to post them, but someone will have to host the pics.
So let me see if I got this straight. This is such a long thread the info is kinda spread all over. Use a PCM and knock sensors from a 2001 Express Van with an 5.7 L31, and Vortec C/K distributor, crank sensor, timing cover, damper, and ignition module and coil. Toss in the remaining sensors required to complete an EFI setup: coolant temp, oil pressure, etc from the vehicle application and make a wiring harness using diagrams from the Express Van, using the vehicle's diagrams as a reference as to how to tie it all into the chassis. Then reflash the PCM and you're on your way. MAF can be the stock unit or a Z06 85MM MAF with the appropriate table changes. Am I correct? Did I leave anything out?
Out of curiosity, what ga wire is in the harness, 22? And with one car, there is no VATS to worry about so how would you wire in the harness? Still using the relay? That way on my 4thgen application, I can wire it in the same way, since I want to retain VATS, which is my next question...will this PCM still keep VATS functional on cars originally equipped, if the owner wanted it?
I'm the guy who emailed you earlier, btw Send me an email if you would like those schematics, with any requests if you have any. I have schematics for the C/K Vortec trucks too.
The connectors I would need are the C100, c105, c210, c220 and c230 with corresponding wiring. The fourthgen has the relays and such in the chassis half of the harness, which these connect to for fuel, A/C, fans, and stuff like that. I have a set of the connectors from my last swap if you need them, since I know this isnt a common request. I just want to make the harness a plug in. The connectors I am referring to for the fourthgen can be seen here:
http://shbox.com/1/harness_connector_faces.htm
I'd want one for a 1994.
On the bright side, I looked on my data disc for schematics for my Camaro and was happy to see that I have ALL the GM SPO information for 2001 Chevy Express Vans. I have the PCM pinout diagrams and other information if you would like to post them, but someone will have to host the pics.
So let me see if I got this straight. This is such a long thread the info is kinda spread all over. Use a PCM and knock sensors from a 2001 Express Van with an 5.7 L31, and Vortec C/K distributor, crank sensor, timing cover, damper, and ignition module and coil. Toss in the remaining sensors required to complete an EFI setup: coolant temp, oil pressure, etc from the vehicle application and make a wiring harness using diagrams from the Express Van, using the vehicle's diagrams as a reference as to how to tie it all into the chassis. Then reflash the PCM and you're on your way. MAF can be the stock unit or a Z06 85MM MAF with the appropriate table changes. Am I correct? Did I leave anything out?
Out of curiosity, what ga wire is in the harness, 22? And with one car, there is no VATS to worry about so how would you wire in the harness? Still using the relay? That way on my 4thgen application, I can wire it in the same way, since I want to retain VATS, which is my next question...will this PCM still keep VATS functional on cars originally equipped, if the owner wanted it?
I'm the guy who emailed you earlier, btw Send me an email if you would like those schematics, with any requests if you have any. I have schematics for the C/K Vortec trucks too.
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Car: 1991 Camaro RS Vert
Engine: 350 S-TPI
Transmission: T5
Axle/Gears: GU5/G80/J65
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Thats all I want, is some constants so I dont get SES light for stuff thats not there. Let me review what I plan on doing this week and what all it will do and I'll email you about it, and a few other things I plan to order.
I will have 2 fans, I could set this up as fan1 at x temp, and then fan 2 at x temp I am guessing? Thanks for the pin info.
Sure!
Fan 1 "Low Speed" - Blue Connector Cavity 42
Fan 2 "High Speed" - Red Connector Cavity 33
Fan 1 "Low Speed" - Blue Connector Cavity 42
Fan 2 "High Speed" - Red Connector Cavity 33
#475
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
So let me see if I got this straight. This is such a long thread the info is kinda spread all over. Use a PCM and knock sensors from a 2001 Express Van with an 5.7 L31, and Vortec C/K distributor, crank sensor, timing cover, damper, and ignition module and coil. Toss in the remaining sensors required to complete an EFI setup: coolant temp, oil pressure, etc from the vehicle application and make a wiring harness using diagrams from the Express Van, using the vehicle's diagrams as a reference as to how to tie it all into the chassis. Then reflash the PCM and you're on your way. MAF can be the stock unit or a Z06 85MM MAF with the appropriate table changes. Am I correct? Did I leave anything out?
Out of curiosity, what ga wire is in the harness, 22?
And with one car, there is no VATS to worry about so how would you wire in the harness? Still using the relay? That way on my 4thgen application, I can wire it in the same way, since I want to retain VATS, which is my next question...will this PCM still keep VATS functional on cars originally equipped, if the owner wanted it?
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Car: '86 IROC-Z/'94 Z28
Engine: 350 LT1/382 LT1
Transmission: 4L60-E/T-56
Axle/Gears: 3.45/3.42 (soon 4.10)
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Well, we can try. I sent you an email. Simply put, I would like to keep A/C and VATS functionality so making the harness a replacement type instead of a standalone would be ideal. I'm imagining it like taking one of your harnesses, and between the relay and fuse center, splicing in a set of weatherpacks. The only catch is, you wouldnt start off with the half that has the fuses and relays...you would be able to see that in the schematics though.
I guess we could try to see if the VATS and such would work, since the key is the resistor and the ignition switch is the sensor, it's the VATS module that stores that proper resistance value and reports it to the PCM. My understanding is the module sends a signal to the PCM telling it it's good to start or not based on if it sees the appropriate resistance value from the key, and with VATS bypassed, the PCM reads good all the time. I'd be willing to try, dont see why it wouldnt work...
Worst case scenario is I wouldnt be able to use the LT1 VATS module. In that case, a swap to the appropriate LS1 F body VATS module and matching key would fix that problem, but I'd be on my own at that point, or I could just reflash the PCM with a bypass
Oh yeah and what application are you guys reporting to the people reflashing your PCM's? Are you having the PCM think it's a really hopped up Express van? How are the PCM's at accepting non-stock VIN numbers?
I guess we could try to see if the VATS and such would work, since the key is the resistor and the ignition switch is the sensor, it's the VATS module that stores that proper resistance value and reports it to the PCM. My understanding is the module sends a signal to the PCM telling it it's good to start or not based on if it sees the appropriate resistance value from the key, and with VATS bypassed, the PCM reads good all the time. I'd be willing to try, dont see why it wouldnt work...
Worst case scenario is I wouldnt be able to use the LT1 VATS module. In that case, a swap to the appropriate LS1 F body VATS module and matching key would fix that problem, but I'd be on my own at that point, or I could just reflash the PCM with a bypass
Oh yeah and what application are you guys reporting to the people reflashing your PCM's? Are you having the PCM think it's a really hopped up Express van? How are the PCM's at accepting non-stock VIN numbers?
Last edited by dhirocz; 06-26-2007 at 06:47 AM.
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Regarding VATS in the LT1 car, it comes down to this. There are three options to the tuner: turn it off, use the "f-body" signal, or use the "Corvette" signal. If the LT1 car signal is incorrect for the 0411 PCM, reflash the PCM to use the other style VATS. If that doesn't work, get the VATS components from an LS1 car. For the sake of speculation, I think it will work as-is, but I can't speak from experience.
I have received errors using Tunercat when attempting to enter an invalid VIN. I don't know what criteria must be met to make a VIN valid to the tuning software. I've not yet changed a VIN with EFILive...because Tunercat OBDII has no licensing.
The PCM doesn't contain vehicle meta data (meaning description of data), but the tuning software does its own lookup using the stored VIN. You can think of these OBDII conversions as being an Express Van PCM, but really it's the scan tool's interpretation of the stored VIN. Fortunately the Express Van was the only gen 1 SBC to get an operating system and calibration with the 0411. I really hope GM uses the gen 1 SBC again with one of the newer E38 or E40 ECMs. For simplicity, I would just keep the Express Van VIN and tell your local auto parts store, shop, or dealership that your 3rd gen f-body is really a 2001 Express Van.
Justin shared this experience with me after the recent Power Tour. The PCM threw a code, he explained to the auto parts store that they had to scan the PCM as a 2001 Express Van, found a cylinder 3 misfire code, traced it down to quickly see a loose spark plug, tightened it, cleared the code, and resumed the Power Tour. Now try quickly tracking down this problem with the original TPI electronics.
I have received errors using Tunercat when attempting to enter an invalid VIN. I don't know what criteria must be met to make a VIN valid to the tuning software. I've not yet changed a VIN with EFILive...because Tunercat OBDII has no licensing.
Are you having the PCM think it's a really hopped up Express van?
Justin shared this experience with me after the recent Power Tour. The PCM threw a code, he explained to the auto parts store that they had to scan the PCM as a 2001 Express Van, found a cylinder 3 misfire code, traced it down to quickly see a loose spark plug, tightened it, cleared the code, and resumed the Power Tour. Now try quickly tracking down this problem with the original TPI electronics.
Last edited by S10Wildside; 06-26-2007 at 11:38 AM.
#479
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Car: Formula
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Mike, Erin and I just purchased a boat with a 90 350 Mag. Thinking of going EFI on it with some sort of TPI. Would it be hard to make up a 411 harness for Marine use. I would imagine a few things wouldnt be needed. Is this even doable without 02's? since the manifods are a wet design.
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Car: 1987 Chevrolet Camaro Z28 IROCZ
Engine: L98 350, mini ramed and camed
Transmission: T56 6 speed manual
Axle/Gears: 10 bolt 3:73 limited slip
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
I can't wait ether. Cause you know your going to help me with mine in the IROC and RS. So Mike, I'll be calling you one day for a harness setup for a t56 to put in the IROC. And one setup for a 4l60e to put in the 89 RS when I go TPI. This sounds like the best thing for EFI in these cars since they did stand alone system's! Adam :-)
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
My harness should be here any day now since it was shipped Monday.
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Car: 1989 Iroc-Z
Engine: 350ci SBC
Transmission: 700R4
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
What is the reasoning behind why the 411 will not control the TCC on the 700R4? I know the new PCM use a PWM solenoid to gently bring in the TCC on the new cars. Is the PCM still providing this signal when its hooked up without an electronic transmission control. It is my understanding that the PCM needs only a VSS, 4th gear, brake, and MAP signal to lock the TCC. It should already be recieving all these signals. If it is then why couldn't we use a PWM to DC voltage converter to control a 12V relay to provide the signal to lock the TCC on the 700R4 when the PCM commands?
#484
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
What is the reasoning behind why the 411 will not control the TCC on the 700R4? I know the new PCM use a PWM solenoid to gently bring in the TCC on the new cars. Is the PCM still providing this signal when its hooked up without an electronic transmission control. It is my understanding that the PCM needs only a VSS, 4th gear, brake, and MAP signal to lock the TCC. It should already be recieving all these signals. If it is then why couldn't we use a PWM to DC voltage converter to control a 12V relay to provide the signal to lock the TCC on the 700R4 when the PCM commands?
#485
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
This should provide (more) clarity to the conversion. Below is a stock 1991 Trans Am engine harness (350 TPI with 700R4).
Left to Right..
- Bulkhead Connector, Fuel Pump Relay, Fan Relays
- O2 Sensor and Coolant Temp Sender for Gauges
- Oil Pressure Switch (difficult to see in pic)
- Bank 1 Injectors and Alternator
- Bank 2 Injectors, TPS, IAC, CTS, MAP, Air Pump, EGR, Knock Sensor, A/C Compressor, Starter
- Coil (Gray Connector)
- A/C Connector (Black Connector near trunk of harness)
- A/C Low Pressure Switch, Electric Fan Connectors, Fan Grounds, Charcoal Canister Purge
- ECM Connectors and I/P Connector (connector C207)
Left to Right..
- Bulkhead Connector, Fuel Pump Relay, Fan Relays
- O2 Sensor and Coolant Temp Sender for Gauges
- Oil Pressure Switch (difficult to see in pic)
- Bank 1 Injectors and Alternator
- Bank 2 Injectors, TPS, IAC, CTS, MAP, Air Pump, EGR, Knock Sensor, A/C Compressor, Starter
- Coil (Gray Connector)
- A/C Connector (Black Connector near trunk of harness)
- A/C Low Pressure Switch, Electric Fan Connectors, Fan Grounds, Charcoal Canister Purge
- ECM Connectors and I/P Connector (connector C207)
#486
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
A few hours later...
The fuel injection harness is removed. I made good use of the following terminal removal tools:
Left to Right..
- Bulkhead Connector, Fan Relays
- Misc Wires: Power to Fuel Pump, Tach, Oil Pressure Gauge, Brake Switch for Torque Converter Power, Ignition Power for Coil (not needed)
- Coolant Temp Sender for Gauges
- Alternator
- A/C Compressor, Starter
- A/C On Input Wire (Dark Green wire facing bottom)
- A/C Connector (Black Connector near trunk of harness)
- A/C Low Pressure Switch, Electric Fan Connectors, Fan Grounds, Charcoal Canister Purge (Part of Fuel Injection Harness, but left in place for length reference)
The fuel injection harness is removed. I made good use of the following terminal removal tools:
Left to Right..
- Bulkhead Connector, Fan Relays
- Misc Wires: Power to Fuel Pump, Tach, Oil Pressure Gauge, Brake Switch for Torque Converter Power, Ignition Power for Coil (not needed)
- Coolant Temp Sender for Gauges
- Alternator
- A/C Compressor, Starter
- A/C On Input Wire (Dark Green wire facing bottom)
- A/C Connector (Black Connector near trunk of harness)
- A/C Low Pressure Switch, Electric Fan Connectors, Fan Grounds, Charcoal Canister Purge (Part of Fuel Injection Harness, but left in place for length reference)
#487
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
So what's next? The 0411 fuel injection harness must be mated with the remaining engine harness. In the same way the TPI harness was separated from the engine harness, the engine harness must be combined with the 0411 fuel injection harness.
The wires near the bulkhead connector need spliced into the 0411 fuel injection harness:
- fuel pump
- tach
- oil pressure
- brake switch (if using 4L60E)
- the A/C ON input wire needs to be spliced into the existing A/C compressor clutch wiring
This information in the past few posts is just a general guide. There are no short cuts and you must get familiar with your engine harness. This will take hours or maybe a few days depending on your familiarity with the engine harness.
All new 3rd gen 0411 engine harnesses EFI Connection has been building include new electric fan wiring and relay connectors. The harness pictured is going to be mated to a new custom LS1 harness with LS2 intake components and electronic throttle control. This conversion is a little more involved than the 0411 harness, but is much like the 0411 conversion.
The wires near the bulkhead connector need spliced into the 0411 fuel injection harness:
- fuel pump
- tach
- oil pressure
- brake switch (if using 4L60E)
- the A/C ON input wire needs to be spliced into the existing A/C compressor clutch wiring
This information in the past few posts is just a general guide. There are no short cuts and you must get familiar with your engine harness. This will take hours or maybe a few days depending on your familiarity with the engine harness.
All new 3rd gen 0411 engine harnesses EFI Connection has been building include new electric fan wiring and relay connectors. The harness pictured is going to be mated to a new custom LS1 harness with LS2 intake components and electronic throttle control. This conversion is a little more involved than the 0411 harness, but is much like the 0411 conversion.
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Mike,
Any luck finding out about splicing into the vehicle speed sensor?
Any luck finding out about splicing into the vehicle speed sensor?
#490
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Car: 89 ws6
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
#492
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
answered some of my own questions...
yup...barely clears the back of the intake. Thankfully you don't adjust the distributor too much.
going to just stick with the inside install
shouldn't be too hard, just need the module from the truck and associated wiring...might have it already
easy as cake...new style uses power and is grounded by ECM
hope these pics help...
Todd
3 - cruise control. Could diagnose my non functional factory cruise but I'd prefer to update to the later model type since I don't feel like having all the vacuum crap for the stock cruise. The truck style I think is controlled by the ECM? Might have been Body Controlled in 99 but I'd expect that in the 411 ECM, its integrated.
hope these pics help...
Todd
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Car: 1992 25th Anniversary Z28
Engine: 6.3L - 383
Transmission: 700R4; Vig 3200
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Did you test fit your fuel rails on the HSR with the dist? Try them out you may run into a problem.
What's the detail on the truck charcoal canister? Different hookup?
What's the detail on the truck charcoal canister? Different hookup?
#494
Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
The charcoal canister is an electric pulse width valve instead of the factory type that has a vacuum pot and on/off type switch. I just wanted to limit the number of vacuum lines running everywhere. You always seem to end up chasing your tail looking for vacuum leaks
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Car: 1989 Iroc-Z
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Sorry weeoh5 you will definately run into problems with the fuel rails as they run directly into the path of the plug wires on the cap. There is no way you can get the plg wires on there with the longer fpr rail installed. Even with 90 degree fitting on the back, 2 short rails, and a remote AFPR there is interference...... trust me..I have it mocked up now without any fittings on the fuel rails and it fits like a s s.....
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Car: 89 ws6
Engine: 355 afr195, hsr,gmpp cam, hs rr,
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Ok so has anyone sucessfully run the stealth ram with the 411 ecm?
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Yes, I have. But that's on a 99 Vortec as a starting point. Works great.
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
I have with a Ramjet intake on a 98 Vortec truck. Since the port spacing is the same, I would think it should work fine. I did have to shorten the rear of the rails as much as possible. I welded on a 90 degree -6 fitting to the rear of the rails to help make it as compact as possible.
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Car: 89 ws6
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
Ok thanks guys I may have to hit up Behind Bars to get the fuel rail modified.
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Re: TPI OBDII - Thoughts/Opinions
On my Ramjet, I did something like Lextech did. I shortened rails at back.
I have pics, but they will not download for some reason.
I'll try to show later, or go to this link and look at message 29
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...ion-gen-i.html
I have pics, but they will not download for some reason.
I'll try to show later, or go to this link and look at message 29
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...ion-gen-i.html
Last edited by scuzz; 07-19-2007 at 01:50 PM.