I have a younger friend who wants to get into thirdgens, thanks in part to my suggestions. I initally told him that he might want to get a carbureted car, since they would be easier to work on due to their having fewer electronics.

Now, I am questioning that advice. In your opinion, especially for any of you younger guys, how easy are the TPI cars to own and maintain for someone just getting into cars?

I know that TPI has the benefit of greater economy and more desirability, so if he buys a carbed car, I want to make sure there is a really good reason for it.

Thanks for your opinions so I can help my friend get a car that will suit him.

 

is he into computers ,or techy stuff like that ? It just helps to know if they like to tinker or not .

 

well, i have owned two fuel injected fbodys now.. i gotta say, they seem easy compared to a carbed car. carbs scare me. i know on my TPI or MPFI if somthing goes wrong i know i can just pull a code and replace a sensor. the rest is the same as a carbed car.

now if you are talking tuning that is different. you have to buy special gear and stuff to tune a TPI car. like a holey ECM or a pocket programmer or somthing. i have not yet dived into that. i am considering a holey commander ECM but i am not for sure yet. to tune a non CC Qjet you only need a speacial screwdriver (and know how).

one more thing to consider. any carbed thirdgen he buys is going to have a Computer Controled Carburator (CCC). a CCC is harder to tune then TPI. unlike TPI it sucks at tuning itself (TPI prety much gets ya taken care of if you are stock, so long as you take care of it.) a CCC is a daunting mess of vaccume lines. a fellow cascadecrew member and myself tinkered with one for about a week and we could not get it to run right, finnaly gave up and yanked all the CC stuff out and dropped 600$ on a non CCC and dizzy. it sucked.

hope this helps.

 

The TPI is really easy to learn on. Make sure he has a haynes manual and tell him to do all the maintance stuff that's supposed to happen every so often. While he's doing that he'll learn alot about the engine, about what goes to where and how things work and pretty soon he'll be able to adress most problems on his own from just tinkering. I started the the 2.8Lv6 and now have that and a tpi. I knew nothing about cars before I got these and now I am well on my way to being a auto tech and at the top of my class, all because of these cars. Like Xophertony said, stay away from carbs, they suck at everything, and they're ugly. TPI's have that sleek look at least. But carbs are so much hassle if you want to touch them, where as it's easy to understand air intake and timing and the MAF and all that. He'll have more fun with the tpi and he'll prolly hate thirdgens if he gets a carb. Another note, states are starting to make it harder and harder to own carbs, I live in cali (for a few more weeks before I go back to NC) and it's damned near impossible to pass smog with a carbed car, and every year they make it harder.

 

"a fellow cascadecrew member and myself tinkered with one for about a week and we could not get it to run right, finnaly gave up and yanked all the CC stuff out and dropped 600$ on a non CCC and dizzy. it sucked. "

It probably would have cost half that taking it to a shop that has the know how to do it. I see people throwing all kinds of wasted money into cars they don't understand the workings. Thousands of $$$ into wheels, tires and stereos, but choke at $90 to diagnose a problem with there car. The biggest repairs I see are having to redo improperly routed vacuum hoses, installed wrong parts, FUBAR repairs from people (and their friends who say they're mechanics) who don't know what they are doing!!!!

 

Well i've always worked on my own car since day one. My dad and relatives got me started and after that i learned everything on my own. Did my fair of mess ups and still don't know everything. Over time i have gotten to know carb and tbi motors like the back of my hand. I bought my 91 t/a in feb knowing there was something wrong cause the check engine light would come on time to time but i figured it was just a bad sensor and i would change it. Well since then i am still not fully got this missing/idling problem fixed but i have it 99% better and learned everything from the chiltons book/ searching and then just found this site a month or 2 ago and now i'm addicted to it. So i would have to say tpi is the better way to go as long as he is willing to READ a book and do a little problem solving. Once ya get your feet wet they are not as bad as everyone thinks they when purchasing your first one

I LOVE MY T/A

Later
Derrick

 

I've never worked on TPI or Carb, but I cant imagine it getting any easier than TBI. I knew so little about cars the first time I looked at my TBI I pointed to the IAC valve and said "Is that the fuel injector?". What I've learned since that point through this site, and my shop manual in the last couple months is absolutely amazing. I would recomend TBI to ANYBODY who wants to start learning to work on cars.

 

EFI systems (either TBI, MPFI, or TPI) have four moving parts for fuel control - A throttle body, a throttle position sensor, a pressure regulator, and the Idle air Control motor. Carburetors have a few more moving parts. And as Xophertony indicated, carburetors on ThirdGens and most other vehicles of this vintage are still tied to the ECM for fuel, ignition advance, and emissions management.

For someone just starting out, EFI is simpler, in my opinion. There is easily as much reference material published in various places regarding EFI systems as carburetion.

 

i say go with fuel injection, TBI or TPI,.. it doesn't really matter.
the learning curve for fuel injection is about the same as it is for a carb & your not going to see a carb on a new car.

i have worked on both & IMO, fuel injection is easier to get tuned right across the board, its just changing things on a computer. with a carb you have to get under the hood & take things apart,.. then you may have to wait for any new parts you need to come in.

 

TPI's are not hard to work on, just need to have patience and be organized. The biggest thing with TPI newbies is keeping track of intake bolts and taking the time to assemble things correctly and not forcing them. I have stripped out a few threads and needed helicoils and lost some bolts, put them in the wrong spots, etc.

I have zero formal auto training, but have changed intakes, installed headers, other parts myself and learned to to them by reading manuals, searching the internet, using sites like www.thirdgen.org or Thirdgentech.com Forums - Powered by vBulletin CamaroZ28.Com - FULL THROTTLE INTERNET , etc.

Also, never be afraid to ask for help!!

 

The battle between fuel injection, and carbs will rage on forever I personally think fuel injectio is much better especially for a street car, and easier to understand, but talk to any older person, and they will argue about it for days

 

Who are you calling "Old?" If you want to talk "old" systems, GM/Rochester has had fuel injection on small blocks since the '50s. Some "old" people have always thought it was better.