xunedeinx

Baught a 1991 firebird V8 305 yesterday, for a dance and a song basically. Half of my paycheck, guy said he sold it because he had way too many problems with it, i payed 100 dollers for the whole thing, and it has brand new flowmaster exaust, tires, suspension, and everything is in amazing shape.

well, almost.


For one, car is a b**ch in a half to start, its very tempermental to start. He said that 2 cylanders are dead, though i havent found any reasons to say that, when it runs its well balanced and sounds like a nice full v8, not a v8 trying to be a v8. and, both pipes, which are ssplit between the 8 cylinders have equal pressure comming out of them, unless one cylander is out on both sides, and somehow the engine isnt rocking like crazy because the dizzy sequance dont allow proper balancing from what ive saw in my haynes manual.

ok, next problem, cooling fans dont come on, though ive read they dont come on till around 220-250 deg, and i cant get the car above 220deg, which leads to next problem.

Car will randomly stop running when it gets to around 220 degrees. sometimes itll be a tad over, or a tad below. if the cylanders were bad, it shouldnt shut the car off if it ran cold. its easier to run warm then cold. No check engine light, no codes thrown out by the ECU(or whatever gm calles them). Jus flashes code 12, so, it isnt anything in the electronic system.(also should mean coolent temp sensor should be good, right??)

and, car wont start untilit cools down to halfway between 220 and cold.


Ive done all engine checks, theres no air bubbles out of the collent(meaning crack block superheating the coolent, overheating the engine. engine dosnt even have a chance to over heat) oil is fine and decent looking, though needs a chance. no blowby out of the crankcase that has the oil cap on it, also meanin that IF 2 cylenders are dead on opposite sides of the engine and somehow balance out, that the compression SHOULD be ok, which would probably narrow down the bad cylanders to vlaves, or sparkplug, or maybe clogged injectors. ALSO, there is no blowback in the intake, which would mean the valves arent seated right, so, not sure if it rules that out, just some more info.

Havent had the chance to pull the plugs to check for fouled plugs, will do tomorrow. also, plan on renting a compression reader from autozone to test that. Pressure should be around 130ish, right?

so, a big long explaination of whats going on.

I probably will become a perm membor of this board. also a member of redpepperracing.com, but my 86 hatch is on its way out, running on 2 out of 4 cyls, and it ISNT balanced. that was my beast car.


Id appreaceate any help i can get, thanks.

++-copied this from the other forum where i posted, maybe more responses here-++

Vader

Get a new set of spark plugs in preparation for your diagnosis. Just plain old AC J-nose resistor plus, or Champions. Don't fall victim to the designer spark plugs, like the Bosch, Hilfiger, or Accel. Don't waste your time with Autolite (Fram) plugs.

Remove the plugs and inspect the electrodes and insulators - both inside and out. A cracked or contaminated external insulator can be a problem. Look for internal insulator damage, wide electrode gap, and electrode wear or damage. Pay close attention to which plugs came from which cylinder.

A compression test is good, but don't get hung up on the numbers. The important thing is that all the numbers are within a 10% tolerance. Actual cranking compression pressure can vary widely, depending on cranking speed, camshaft profile, engine temperature, and other variables. Make sure you have a fully charged battery before testing, and block the throttle to a wide open position. Remove all the plugs, connect your tester, crank the engine several cycles, then record the results. Move to the next cylinder.

A cylinder leakage tester would be better, but requires an air compressor..

Once you get compression test results and note spark plug condition, install the new plugs (correctly gapped) and test the resistance of the plug wires before reconnecting them. You might also want to remove the distributor cap, inspect its condition, and do the same for the rotor. Once the rotor is off, take a close look at the pickup coil and reluctor.

xunedeinx

ok, did a compression test, was basically perfect, every cylander between 160 and 175. thats not the problem. reconnected the sparks after checking the gap and wires, looks fine there. their decently new bocsh's, so i dont think they need to be replaced right now.

Ok, so i took off the dizzy cap, it looks like its in bad condition to me, though idk if thats how they all look.

under the cap where the electrode things are, it has a lot of metal-shaving-like buildup. the rod and gears under the rotor are majorly rusty and look really bad to me, though idk if that would be the problem.

should i just play it safe and get a new cap/rotor/guts?

wat next, im fairly green to this.

llvll4l2c91350

yea i would go ahead and get new cap/rotor/wires. always start with the basics before u take on the more involved stuff. ive never seen a pick up assembly that isnt rusted on these cars. i wouldnt worry about it.

xunedeinx

got pics for u





one is the pickup assembaly, one is the cap and rotor. it is worse then that pics, whiped it off.

88TAJeff

See those nice rusty bolts holding down that ignition control module? might want to take them out and clean them off, I think they provide ground for the ICM. I've had plenty of module probs.
Welcome to the boards, BTW.

llvll4l2c91350

cap and rotor dont look that bad in the pics. maybe it just needs a lil cleaning? how are the wires

the pickup is pretty rusted but from what i remember, mine was lookin pretty close to that too the last time i had my cap off.

also wouldnt be a bad idea to have a spare ignition module in the car in case the one in the dizzy goes bad. ive been stranded twice b/c of it. luckily first time i was close to an auto zone. second time i had the spare module and swapped 'em and was able to get home.

xunedeinx

ignition modual, whats that??

thank you for the welcome.

Found a problem, dont kno if its THE problem, but its one.

Tested the coil, the right side plug in isn't working. the left is ok though. going to pick a new one up tomorrow at AZ for 30 bucks.

think the bolts will be a prob? its nothing to take em out and clean them, 15 min. ill see if the coil does the trick. if it works, wont worry bout it, if it dosnt, then, dont kno, will post more about it.


once i get the car running, need a new windsheild, its cracked, wont pass inspection. then, off to emissions.

then, thinking of putting 2 Y valves, one for each side of the exaust. going to be able to pull a handle, or if i got the money, push a switch, and itll switch it to straight pipes out both sides. Thinkin of puttin it right behind the front wheels.
Going to put the valves before the cat, also.

xunedeinx

ok,so compression is good, dizzy cap is good and so is rotor.
Changed the coil, dosnt even try to run. tryed a new ICU, also isnt the problem, from what i can see, there should be any thing worng..

help me please, anyone?
im running out of tests

88TAJeff

Are you getting any spark?

xunedeinx

yea, ignition is fine, compression is fine, spark plugs are fine, and injectors are fine. dont kno wat else to do, sence i allready did all the tests i know how to do.

bringing it to my mechanic later.

gettin ready to pay the labor charges out of my ***...

Cam91z

iTrader: (1)

It wont start since you changed the wires and cap? Check the firing order.

xunedeinx

i did, and had a friend and father recheck it, its right.

just cranks like it would if it was out of gas. mayb fuel pump, whatever, its at the shop as of tomorrow morning.

Vader

Have you tried to administer fuel manually to see if it fires?

xunedeinx

dont know how i would do that. shop has it now. Ill post when i have it back.

i hope to become a frequent member here though. nice site you have here.

xunedeinx

Ok, mechanic called today...

Said im getting spark, fuel pressure is good, dizzy is working properly, and right now he dont kno, he just did a quick look-over for me today as a favor he owed me. tomorrow hes going into it, and im going to be paying normal price.

any idea on what it is?

it isnt..
fuel pump
dizzy, icm, sparks, compression, spark wires
o2 sensors.

help please!!! i dont want to have to pay with my left arm and my right nut!!!

HalfInchWrench

You got spark.
You got fuel pressure.
You have compression.

Computer! Hook up a scan tool and see if it is giving normal feedback. Make sure injectors are fireing.

xunedeinx

maybe, ill see what my mechanic comes up with. he has the car right now. he can do in 10 min what i can do in an hour.

going to give him a chance, he got 30+ years experiance and he has the tools and man power.

i dont, lol.

-crosses fingers-

xunedeinx

my mechanic found the problem.

2 injectors are shorted out, 2 are cracked, and one seems like its on its way to shorting out.

said its a fairly uncommen problem, and he never saw it before.

what you think bout that? i plan on replacing all 8 of them, at 150 a pop, hes getting me them for 90 a peice, and hes waizing the labor charges because he tested a lot of **** that didnt work, and hes been in the family for over 30 years.

think this info is accurate? it makes sence.

HalfInchWrench

He is probally right about the injectors but the price is way off. Sombody rough was in there before and beat things up. Kinda like a bull in a china shop. Someone mad or just careless. Who knows. Hopefully you don't find things like that in other areas of the car.

You can get a whole set of 8 from summit.com for $230. The ford yes ford SVT injectors are fine and a real good price as far as injectors go.

88TAJeff

I second the ford injectors. Sometimes you can get lucky and get some ' take out' injectors for an unreal price. Got mine for like 50.00 !

xunedeinx

ugh, too late now. he allready has them in, whatever.

He got them straight and brand new from the dealer, so at least i know there going to work and are good quality i guess. whatever.

everyone pays out of their *** at least once before they learn.

MBH

I have an 1982 berlinetta, my egr blowback valve (I hope I have the right term) is cracked. Where can I get another one? My mechanic checked with chevy and they didn't have one. Does anybody have any ideas, I would really appreciate it.

-srs-

Wow. Necropost AND a thread jack...nice.

MBH

I am sorry, I don't understand. What do you mean? Is that the name of the part? If I went to my mechanic and took a picture of the part, would that be helpful?

irock88

What SRS is referring to is the thread your on that you have replied to is dated 2005.
And that you have started your own thread under someone elses(thread jack)
I can understand where your coming from thinking that this heading `lots of problems with new car`is a general topic on this board.
You can start your own thread for your specific topic.
By the way Necropost isnt the name of a part. Lol

MBH

thank you for the advice - I couldn't figure out how to start my own thread, maybe I am computer challenged. How do I start a thread? I really appreciate any help that you can give me.

irock88

go to the third generation f-body message board(main section)look for tech-general engine section open that up and on the top left of that section you will see `new thread`click that and away you go posting and starting your own thread.

MBH

thank you very much, I appreciate the help

irock88

If Chevy dosent have them you should be able to obtain one from an aftermarket company.
Depending which area you`re from you should be able to do an online internet search for `82 camaro egr valve` where upon you`ll have different options of suppliers to choose from along with pictures for the specified valve

MBH

thank you for the info. I am going to the mechanic's today to get a picture because it isn't the egr valve but something that attaches to it, not sure of the terminology. It has about 4 long tubes that come out and connectg to something. I will try to post the picture when i get it.

cuisinartvette

Hopefully the new injectors do the job . If not check the injector drivers to make sure they are getting a signal to fire (open and close)