kevinz85

I'm starting out with a 90 350 block in good shape and ran when i pulled it.I want to make the car a 12 second car wanted everyones opinion on which parts to spend money on to get it there. ps The car is an 85 z28 with tpi.

D Stroy H8

So many combos...
heres a cheapy one:

port upper plenum
SLP runners
siamese lower plenum

hot cam 218/228
.525/.525 112LSA

1.6 full rollers

Port match heads and do a little bowl blending

1 5/8 hooker headers (you want the best header)

That should be good for high 12's all for under $1,500.00

speed88

Throw some tuning into that equation and it would be possible with a good suspension and traction. Typically if you are going to use a stock TPI setup you shouldn't go above 220 dur @ 50" with the cam. Otherwise tuning will be required in order to maximize it, and in some cases get it to run.

92 zzz28

Stroke it to 383.
Mini Ram, HSR, LT1 conversion, something to support high end
230/236 @.050 .565"lift w/ 1.6s
AFR 195s ported
11:1 CR
Hooker LTs
Lots of tuning.

Once you get it all dialed in you will have so little traction that 12s are all you'll be able to run!!!!!

D Stroy H8

I think he means keeping long tube runners... otherwise people wouldn't say TPI. When most people think of TPI they think of long tube runners... not batch firing.

That's a little over the top I think - burning a chip would help a great deal, but the car will run fine without it. You'd be sacrificing output and the ECU would be vomiting fuel at the top end but it will run. You can use an adjustable fuel pressure regulator to smear over the problem for a little while but that of course is the half-*** way to do it. Burn the chip.

kevinz85

thanks so far guys. I did want to keep it with the long tube runners and it will run off the 85 ecm

D's89IROCZ

I know a guy running that exact ! setup ....he ain't running 12's

92 zzz28

What's he running???

gen3z

91 z belonging to my freind;stock short block,1st designtfs wedge heads,1.5 cranes,slp 495/510 cam,slp 1-3/4 y-pipe,factory cats,slp cats back,slp 2400 stall,stock base,,slp runners,ported plenum,58mm tb,cut air boxes w/k&ns,pulleys,crane adj.reg,perf.resources chip...comp.ta's 245/50/16,lca's,all bushings replaced with polyeurethane1.73 60' 12.80 at 107 @houston raceway park,1996.....when the car was a virgin,pulleys ,cut air boxes it ran 13.96 @101 w/1.9 60' gotta love sea level.............:hail:

1bad91Z

iTrader: (1)

Baytown (Houston Raceway Park) is a good track. That's where I'll be running mine soon!

Shooting for low 12's - High 11's.

D Stroy H8

I hope he's running damn close to 12.9 - because there is something wrong then. It has already been done by a handful of people. Does he have tall gearing (3.08 or 2.73)? Traction issues? Altitude of raceway maybe?

poncho@home

When?????????????????

1bad91Z

iTrader: (1)

Dude, dont even start that again.

Canadians........geeze! lol

poncho@home

Its just that I am honestly curious to what your car will run. I saw your postings way back when and it convinced me to go the Vortec/TPI route.

Since then I have procurred all the parts, and started installing various components, taking it to the track each step of the way. What I have left to do in the spring(Canadian winters are long and cold) is to install my CAI, buy a 52MM TB and install my ported plenum and runners. After that I have some experimenting I want to do on the runners, but that's another story.

My point being....I was so hyped to get my car to the track to see it's actual improvements, albeit small, nonetheless it freaks the he!! out of me that you have yet to take your car to the track(after all this time).

I understand that your diffy is on it's last legs, but you don't need to launch it hard, and on street tires that's hardly possible anyways.

You mention all the street races you've had to quantify your statements of what you "expect" the car to run, well just think of the track as a few more street races.

I am not trying to be a b!tch here....I just want to know what your car runs, how your cam choice turned out, what kind of power you're making and so on....

I am constantly searching for setups and results so that I can better make my choices.

My GTA is pretty much complete(aside for the above mentioned items to complete) and whether I attain 12s or not is irrelevant, but I have started putting together the plans for a low 12/high 11 second bracket racing car that I "hopefully" plan on building next winter. I just want information!!!!!!

Oh and my track is over 1 hour away, and I sometimes go down just to try out a new tune.....make 2-3 runs and go home!!!!

D's89IROCZ

High 13's .....not tooo sure of the short time ....but I don't remeber it being a sugnifant thing that contributed to this time .... I am at a loss for the stall and gearing too .....
I'll ask him ...and PM ya


this is at a track in Southern Ontario .... so altitude aint a biggy

kevinz85

So I a question and 3 answers and an argument. thanks guys

Ions91Z28

Slight larger cam, ported base, ported plenum, 1 5/8" headers and a 125 shot. You should be covered.

gen3z

i am with 1badz,not because i lived in h-town,(humble)for starters i know these cars very well i ran lo 13s with an 88z 5.7,3.27s,hooker hedders,cut air boxes and a 5spd.(i can drive a stick)i was so close to 12s with a stock motor with mods like 1bad has no doubt at all it will run 12 teens,one problem though this is his ONLY transportation so why should he break it to prove to anyone he has a hard runnin z,so he can walk to work the next day dont think so!!!!!!!i have an extra 92 disk 3.42 rear i would loan him if was still there....1bad dont sweat the crap,in good time you will safely be able to represent your combo........you could always launch softly about 10' then pop off a lo 13@116mph

1bad91Z

iTrader: (1)

lol, yea.

Eventhough the Z is not my daily, I still dont want to drive 2.5 hours to the track just to break a rear end or run some crappy time at a high MPH.

I want to go there, launch at 3,000 r's on slicks and run a high 11 !! And without breaking anything!


I will be dynoing the car soon though. As soon as I transition to my new job, I'll have free time and money to dyno it !

That will have to be good enough till I'm ready to take it to the track.

gen3z

ok guys,now you have it,again! in time,for the right time..

poncho@home

eh? Explain...

No matter what you do there is no guarantee of this. Touch wood not to jinx yourself.

Waiting for the perfect conditions, either mechanical or otherwise, you might end up waiting all your life.

I am not trying to flame here, just pointing out that you've been posting 11 sec guestimates from your car for the last 2 years.

I understand life and racing is expensive, but in all honesty after spending the money for your buildup, what would another $100 to be do a dyno session? or go to the track even. You could have dynoed your car a long time ago without fear of your diffey.

If you don't want to run or dyno your car, that's your decision, but stop continually preaching as gospel what you think your car will run, because its of no use to anyone, especially some noobie that is trying to learn.

The internet is filled with useless information, lets not add to it with unfounded hypothesises.

I honestly hope your car puts down good numbers, and great times because I too think the Vortec/TPI combo is a great combo, but until then for all I know your car runs 12.9s....

When do you estimate on getting onto the dyno? 1 week, month, year....?

1bad91Z

iTrader: (1)

Dude............

Did you even read my last post?

I'm currently trasitioning to a new job that will allow me to have the free time and money to dyno my car.

This will take place in February and if ya dont relax, maybe I'll e-mail everyone the results except you!

Just chill man. Or, give me $75 bucks and convince my current boss to let me off so I can dyno my car.

If not, then your just gonna have to wait like I have to.

Dont you think I want to know the dyno results too?
Well, I do and probably more than anyone here!

Patience, kemo-sabi

camarojoe

I don't know about 12 sec setups, but mines an easy one to get mid-11's with if it's tuned and can hook up up great.

camarojoe

Oh yeah to get mid-11's you need to have a set of heads that flow about like mine. Here's how they should look.

1bad91Z

iTrader: (1)

My vortec's flow 278 @.500

1990irocz28

What about this?
-Accel Superram
-Accel afpr
-24lb ford fuel inj
-200cc/64cc Aluminum Pro Topline cylinder heads, 2.08int, 1.56exh
-Slp 495/502,,,218/224 cam
-383 L98
-9.5:1 compression
-1 3/4 Slp headers
-3 inch tube cold air intake w/ 7x3 k&n filter
-MSD everything
-Magnaflow cat back
-3.23 gears
-Hotchkiss LCA's and Panhard
-Edelbrock torque arm
Or wut about all of the above plus a 50shot of NOS??
wut do u guys think?

BadSS

Who ported those and how much did he charge? I'd like to talk to that guy if he can get as much out of a set of Vortec heads as a set of CNC competition ported 210 AFR heads.

1bad91Z

iTrader: (1)

My heads were used (they came from a circle track dirt car). I had them cleaned / spec'd and flow benched before I put them on my 355. I got a deal on them. I paid $400.00 bucks for them. The shop said if they were to dupicate them, it would cost about 800 - 1,000 worth of work / parts to make another set like them, plus the original cost of the bare castings.

You would be able to get ALOT more out of a set of AFR 210's all ported out.

With the vortec's, you're starting out with a 180cc runner.

I've seen a set of ported 210's flow ~320 cfm on the intake side!

8Mike9

Someone mentioned it above, but the Accel SuperRam, LPE 219 cam and AFR195's is a proven 12sec 350 combination...infact some are knocking on 11's...those with the same SR/LPE219/AFR combo and a 383 are well into the 11's.

camarojoe

1bad, your heads flow great, but mine still have them beat, barely, except I doubt you can get the exhaust close to that of an AFR head. I'm just trying to give you some crap, man but here are my flow #'s. The heads ported and flowed by the guy who sold me the car.

camarojoe

Here's the intake #'s.

BadSS

You have to be buds with these guys to get a deal like that,,, so you coming off the shop name and number or what?

speed88

How about some more combo's....

I am hoping this is a 12 sec combo,

TPiS Miniram
AFR 195's CNC Ported
BBK 52mm tb
LT4 Hotcam
GMPP 1.6 rockers
Edelbrock Jet Hot Coated headers
Flowmaster 3" cat-back
TCI 3000 stall
Full suspension
Nitto 555R's

zerotosixtyV8

I've got heads like that but they are iron and have bigger runners

fun Pain

my set up does just fine, always in 12s but not consistant worth a dam#.... and it has taken about 40 some runs to master the launch with a stock 1400 stall.....

BadSS

Hello,,, 1bad91Z,, you still in this thread? I'd really like to talk to these guys about a set of Vortecs that can 278 cfm @ .500 lift. I'd PM you, but I'm sure others would like to know about these guys also.

1bad91Z

iTrader: (1)

I dont know who actually ported my heads. They were trade in's at the machine shop that machined my short block (Sun Racing). The heads came from a circle track car from what I was told. I purchased them from the late owner, Joe sometime in 2002. Sorry I dont remember the peak exhaust flow number, I only remember the peak intake numbers.

R.I.P Joe

camarojoe

1bad, do you know what size your intake runners are? They have to be at least as big as 210cc to get those kind of flow #'s. I think my 210's are at least 220cc now and they would have flowed about 315cfm at .700" lift, but my cam is at .598" lift so it doesn't really matter.

I'd really like to ride in your car to see how a set of killer heads feels with a kick-*** tpi setup. Your intake runners must be ported great and flow well, since your car seems to run so well.

1bad91Z

iTrader: (1)

Your more than welcome to come down to Houston and take a ride in the Z.

I've driven and riden in a few mini-ram and stealth-ram cars that are faster than my camaro, but, my camaro is the fastest naturally aspirated LTR TPI car that I've ever driven or riden in. My motor makes a ton of torque. It would make a GREAT truck motor (pull some tree stumps out of the ground with this one!)

I dont know the exact cc of the intake runners. But this may give you an idea:

If you look at a set of stock vortec heads with a gm plastic vortec intake gasket set on them, you'll notice that there is plenty of material that can be removed from the head in order to port-match the heads to the intake gasket. My heads are port-matched to the exact size of the intake gasket.

Major intake / exhaust throat work

Then they have 5 angled under cut stainless valves 1.94's / and upped the ex. valve size to 1.56

massive bowl job

milled to 62cc's (for more compression)

spring pockets enlarged for comp dual springs (upto .600 lift)

There's more that was done, I just cant remember. Pretty much everything you can do to a race head has been done.

gmgod

Did you ever dyno the car 1bad91Z?

poncho@home

yeah did u? what about the track ever go? It's been a couple of years now...and I can't imagine the excuse you can possibly come up with.

gmgod

Anyone else running 12's with TPI? Or mabee getting 300 wheel horsepower?

GTA matt

iTrader: (1)

I expect to be running some 12.80's or so this year. Last year on street tires with 3.23's and stock torque converter ran 13.35. Added 3.73's, drag radials, adjustable torque arm, lca's, 52mm tb, and accel 300+ ignition this winter. Will keep you posted on times coming March 6th. I've talked to several companies about torque converters and will be ordering one shortly. From what i've seen they usually knock up to a half second off the E.T., so we may be seeing a stock intake runner, lower intake, stock untouched heads and cam car run some 12.30's. BTW the car still has full interior, and power everything including seats. Weighs 3700 with me in it. I will keep everyone posted with updates.

gmgod

Man those are some nice times, stock base, runners, heads and cam to boot. I'm gonna be gunning for a 12.99 with a fresh 350, zz4 cam, afr 180's, stock ported tpi, T5 and 3.42's if the heads get here this season.

FactoryFreak

iTrader: (2)

Sorry but i don't think its gonna knock half a second off your time since your already probably breaking into the 12's. Maybe .2-.3 though

GTA matt

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, that's what i'm worried about. Mid 12's still ain't too shabby with a stock TPI though.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

some i seen lately used a tpi and HSR....its a recent thread, dyno results

aftermarket base like accel/TPIS
runners fully ported SLP or big tubes TPIS/AS&M

ZZ9 cam shaft, with 1.6 rockers

trickflow heads/afr heads or something that can flow well

tunning and suspension, should make 300rwhp and go high 12's at 107ish


another one, using HSR
LPE 211/219 cam
good set of heads
tuning, and have a 300rwhp car

i would like to see a HSR with the LPE 219 cam....should also run very well!


heres teh one i am thinking of......

383 about 10 to 1 compression
new Comp XFI 218/224 cam
superram base/BIG tube AS&M runners or maybe the siamesed ones
port matched plenum/etc......
trick flow 195 cc heads... CNC'd option suppose to flow 260 on intake side as advertised lol

tuning to make it go and it should be deep 12's