Ok, you say with 4K you could make a Honda faster than a thirdgen? Ok, put 4K into the thirdgen too. Go ahead and add a supercharger or a turbo to a thirdgen and then race the Honda that has 4K into it. It won't even be close. The thirdgen has a bigger engine and if you add a turbo to a v8 , watch out! LOL. I have never seen a Turbo Honda run a 7. I have seen a turbo Foxbody run that tho.

 

The only way a turbo Honda could beat a thirdgen is with some serious boost increase and or nitrous added to the existing turbo charge. I have personally beaten some turbo Hondas. Most run in the 14's with a turbo.

 

You don't know, that is obvious. While I don't like the site, check out hybridz.org, plenty of quick N/A Nissan Straight 6s on there, many making upwards of 300 HP, which will put any S30 into the 13s.

Just because you were not able to get a 13 second time from an N/A straight 6, doesn't mean that it hasn't happened, by someone else.

If your struts bottomed out on accel, they were worn and needed replacement.

So you were flogging on a worn out S130, that would only get into the 15s. You were doing something very wrong.

I have to laugh at people that say: "I was into that before it was cool..." So? What's your point? Why did you stop? Did it become too cool, and you prefer to not be associated with the "cool kids"? I just don't understand why people say stuff like that.


You've obviously been seeing the wrong Hondas. Most turbo B18 Civics I have seen run in the 13s with a good launch, quicker with some good chassis set-up and still can be used as daily drivers.

I'm sure I could make an import equally as fast with the same money as someone else puts in their F-body. The best part is that by selecting the right import and right set-up it will also go around corners, not just be quick in a straight line. It's all about the set-up, not just number of cylinders.

 

first of all,what is an s30? the Nissan/Datsun Z motor is called an L28.

 

Six shooter do you fail to recognize that F-bodys pull a .93 on the skidpad?

 

Also, all of the 1979-89 ZX models were equipped with rear struts that did purposely bottom out. It gave the impression the car was faster.

 

For being such a "Nissan Z car nut and a member of Z car clubs" you know very little about the Z car.

The L-series came in displacements from 2L to 2.8L from the factory, that makes for L20, L24, L26 and L28 over the span of their production history. Possibly more that were special offerings or over seas.

An S30 is the chassis designation, for the 1st generation of Z car, from 1970 to 1978. The 1978 to 1983 Z car was an S130, then came along the Z31...

This is the first that I've ever heard of struts bottoming out to "give the impression of being faster." How would that even work? I don't see how a suspension that is bottoming out give the impression of the car being faster than it is?
If the struts are bottoming out, you have suspension issues that need to be addressed.
Besides that, clocks don't feel anything from a suspension that is bottomed out.

I've out cornered many of my friends in their domestics, regardless of what skid pad results published in magazines say.

 

The struts are supposed to do that. It is to give the impression that the car is pulling harder. That's how it is. The pre Zx cars (the plain Z) did not do that. The Zx's came with a McPherson strut that did that even if they were new. What were you doing in say, 1993? Did you own a Z back then? Anyway, the car scene back then was all Mustang and Camaro. The only fast imports back then were the Turbo 300zx and Supra, all of which were single factory turbo cars and they were comparable in power to a stock 305 Thirdgen. Hint: 200 hp was a big deal until just recently in time also. Then the twin turbo (un-affordable to most) came out. They were 300hp supercars.

 

My first car was a Datsun 240Z and I have also had a 280Z and then a 280ZX Turbo. Aka as the Japanese Corvette killer at the time. The Z's were pretty cars, but they all had rust issues. This was because of the lack/cheap undercoating on them, but hell, Japanese cars up through the mid 90's were always known as tin cans or rust buckets anyway. That is how it is has always been until just recently in time.

 

You're the only one to say that the struts were supposed to bottom out. I've not heard or read about this "feature" on any Z car site, brochure, or blurb. I ask you, how is a strut that is bottoming out supposed to give the impression of being "faster?" That would give me the impression that something is broken or worn out.

I didn't realize that we were discussing the tuning, or modifying abilities of people in 1993, I thought we were discussing the present. Which BTW, I was working on my first car (also an import), and learning more from my uncle and grandfather about cars, like I had been for many years prior. I also guess I live in a special area because 200 HP in 1993 was not a big deal, 500 HP was a big deal though, especially on a street car, which many people I knew back then were either at or near with their cars, which most were based on domestics or domestic drivelines.

You need to get your facts straight. The 300ZX Turbo in 1993 was a twin turbo, using a VG30DETT under the hood. The 1993 Turbo Supra was also a Twin Turbo car. Not that twice the turbos means that it makes anymore power, but the design can be used to help decrease spool up time, or for packaging reasons. The Z32 has one of the most tightly fit engine compartments I've seen, and would imagine that fitting a single turbo in that engine bay would be much more difficult than it was to run twin turbo and more cold side plumbing. The 1993 300ZX was rated stock at 300 HP, so again, you need to do some more research. I'm not even sure you know what a Nissan Z car looks like at this point. LOL

It seems to me you just live in a very isolated area, that is closed off to what many people can do with their cars, especially imports, now and then.

 

When i say bottom ,i mean feels similar to bottoming out. Very close. Also i stated single turbo Zx's which is what was mainly around back then. You didn't see or hear much about the TT car's then. Also 200 hp was a big deal. My 280zx turbo put that out stock and that car flew. Was a Corvette killer when it first came out and beat the GT Mustangs up until the 96' Models came out. 200 horses was a big deal. Remember all the talk in 1995 or so when the V6 Camaro came out with 200hp? It is because of the "go slow era" that came about from around 1974-1985 or so. Only "hot cars "after that had 200hp. Mainly Mustangs,Camaros and the 3 kind of fast imports (Supra,300zx,rx7)all of which had to be a Turbo model to really compete with V8.

 

A Nissan Z car is a 240,260,280Zx and the 300Zx up to 1989. The Newer 300ZX TT is almost always referred to as the "TT".

 

A Nissan Z car is a 240,260,280Z, 280Zx and the 300Zx up to 1989. The Newer 300ZX TT is almost always referred to as the "TT". The 350Z is called a "350", simply.

 

If its clean and ffast/quick who cares if its "chevy/ford/dodge/honda/etc.." a well built car is something anyone can appreciate. I love my camaro but I sure enjoy eating up some v8's in my little ol 4banger daily driver. ('90 awd 5spd turbo talon with bolt ons and 20lb boost) just like anything else. There is ALWAYS someone faster.

those supras are damm quick too

 

Also FYI, back the in the early 90's . The 5.0 Mustang was the common "fast" car on the streets with its 215 hp v8. The 350 TPI Iroc was faster,but not as common tho

 

The information I see says 182 HP peak, that would be crank HP, for a stock 280ZXT, back in 1982, during your "go slow era." So are we talking about 1993 or 1983 now? Maybe it's 2003 or 2013?...

Do you really think that the hot imports back in the '80s and '90s had to have a turbo to make enough power to compete with the Domestic hot cars? The Japanese are, and have always been, very keen on getting efficiency from their designs. Turbocharging helps with this. Cam shafts with very little over lap and lift can be used to promote low RPM fuel efficiency and torque, while getting the air flow through the engine using the turbocharger to also make plenty of power, more power per unit of displacement, than most domestic cars, even now, since the designs have only gotten more efficient.

 

I've never heard any one refer to a 300ZX as a "TT", a "TT" would be an Audi model.

If I ever hear of a 300ZX being called by something other than it's model name is it's chassis designation, since there were two different chassis designs that bore the 300ZX name plate, those being Z31, from 1984 to 1988, and Z32 from 1989 to 2000.

BTW, my boss owns a Z31, which I've flogged on a bit and have never experienced this "feature" of a bottoming out rear strut. The car is bone stock, almost completely original, so if it had this so-called feature, it would be present in his car. I think you're just trying to pass off your slow, worn out junk as something other than it really is.

 

You name an import (4,or 6 cyl) car that could beat a domestic pony car back then that wasn't turbocharged. I doubt you will find many,if any. The old rule of thumb has always been-If it is not a V8,then its not fast. Now,that has changed. Like i said ,that changed in the mid 90's/late 90's. Yes,you are correct when you speak of Japanese cars being efficient tho. They built the engines strong and effecient,but they were never known to be fast,just reliable,and they were always known to rust out,but keep running well. So, i will admit that all that has changed in recent years. They have improved.

 

A TT is a 300 ZX, the Audi came out later and stole the nickname. HINT: press the switch on your bosses car for the suspension setting. Set it to soft. If those are factory and not aftermarket struts,then you will see what i mean. Also, those cars from 1979-1989(the "ZX") models are really considered luxtury cars,not sports cars. A true Z fan would know that.

 

The ZX cars from 1979-1989 Turbo or non-turbo have "soft" suspension in them anyway. That is why a true sports car like a Thirdgen has very,very stiff bumpy ride. We have what us called a solid axle.

 

Six-shooter. When i had my Z from 1993-1996 it was in awesome shape. Low miles FYI. I also took great care of it and always sat for 3-5 min before shutting engine off (because it was turbo). So, worn-out junk? I think not. For as fast as that was it was in no way worn out.LOL

 

Six-shooter, set your bosses car to "soft and then drive it. Feels like the front end is comin g up, makes you get pressed back in your seat farther. There was actually an article on this in some mag too. It's a trick they came up with. Def don't try and school me on Z cars, I go way back with them.

 

Your comparing apples to oranges. of corse a 350 v8 is gonna deat up on most 1.8 liter 4bangers back then. Thats like saying to two 3rdGen guys lets ace your v6 3.1 vs my v8 5.7 (stock for stock)

whats more impressive a v8 running 12/13/14 or a v6 doing the same with a little boost.
Your ragging on 4 and v6's lets bring the TTA , GN , cyclone , typhoon into the equation. all turbo V6's.

QUICK. and DAMM FAST when modded.

 

Even compared to nowadays, my 350 tpi Thirdgen has no problem leaving a 1.8 Turbo 4 banger in the dust. A 1.8T or TT Audi should be easy for a 350 Thirdgen to take. I have done it twice myself. Anyway, yes, i would get beat by
TTA , GN , cyclone , typhoon tho. Still have no problems with v6 supercharged cars like GTP, or regals still. Beat those cars

 

Now a supercharged 305 Thirdgen would have no problem beating a TTA or GN. I know that for a fact!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3DZDLgr0YY

This one looks pretty impressive though he has no track times. I have no doubt you could build one to run 13's N/A.

 

LOL....NO. The turbo 3.8's have gone 10's, 9's, and a few have gone 8's. A supercharged 305? No way man.

 

I'll put $$ on that race.the TTA, GN, etc will whip on a sc 305. Im assuming you dot know much about the TTA , GN combos. or the 2jzgte supras for that matter.


Lets see some times here. These are car n driver test #'s Motor trend etc. So cars they actually took and tested. Take it with a grain of salt. But they are presumed to be pretty acurate.. Track / day / driver all make a diff.

1st # is 1/8th nd 2nd is 1/4 mile times

1983 Chevrolet Camaro 9.5 17.5
1983 Chevrolet Camaro Z28 H.O. 6.7 15.0
1984 Chevrolet Camaro Berlinetta 9.3 17.0
1985 Chevrolet Camaro Berlinetta 10.0 17.0
1985 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z28 7.0 15.2
1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z 6.6 14.9
1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z L98 6.8 15.3
1988 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z 7.0 15.5
1990 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z 5.8 14.4
1990 Chevrolet Camaro Z28 6.5 15.0
1992 Chevrolet Camaro Z28 6.7 15.2

1986 Dodge Daytona Turbo I 8.6 16.4
1987 Dodge Daytona Turbo II 7.6 15.8

1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD 6.8 15.1
1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD 6.7 15.2
1994 Eagle Talon TSi AWD 6.6 14.6
1995 Eagle Talon TSi 6.4 15.1
1997 Eagle Talon ESi 8.3 16.4
1993 Eagle Vision ESi 10.4 17.7
1993 Eagle Vision TSi 8.9 16.6


1987 Ford Mustang GT 6.4 14.4 (Automobile, April 87)
1988 Ford Mustang GT 6.4 15.0 (MT Jan '88)
1989 Ford Mustang GT 5.0l Manual 6.2 14.8 (MT Jan '89)
1990 Ford Mustang LX 5.0 6.4 14.9
1991 Ford Mustang GT 7.3 15.6
1992 Ford Mustang LX 5.0 6.2 14.8
1993 Ford Mustang Cobra 5.9 14.5

1991 GMC Syclone, 4.3l Turbo, N/A 13.06 (HT Oct 90)
1991 GMC Syclone 5.3 14.1 (M/T Sept 91)
1993 GMC Typhoon 5.3 14.1 (M/T June 93)

THE ONLY HONDS with good stock times are the newer cars

2003 Honda Accord EX V-6 Coupe 6.2 14.5
2000 Honda S2000 5.5 14.2
2003 Honda S2000 6.3 14.9 (Manual)
2004 Honda S2000 5.8 14.2 (MT Mar '04)
2006 Honda S2000 5.5 14.0 (C&D May '06)
1994 Honda Prelude VTEC 7.2 15.1
1995 Honda Prelude VTEC 6.7 15.1
1999 Honda Prelude 6.8 15.4
2000 Honda Prelude 6.8 15.4

1993 Mazda RX-7 5.5 14.0
1993 Mazda RX-7 R1 5.3 13.9
1994 Mazda RX-7 5.3 14.0
1994 Mazda RX-7 Touring 6.0 14.5 (auto)
1995 Mazda RX-7 R2 5.0 14.0
2004 Mazda RX-8 5.8 14.49 (6 speed) (MT Mar '04)
2006 Mazda MAZDASPEED 6, 5.8 14.6 (MT Feb '06)
2007 Mazdaspeed 3 5.4 14.0 (C&D May '07)
2007 Mazda Mazdaspeed6 5.4 14.0 (C&D Jan '07)

1991 Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4 5.3 13.8
1992 Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4 5.8 14.3
1993 Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4 5.3 14.0
1994 Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4 5.7 14.2
1995 Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4 5.4 13.5
1997 Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4 4.8 13.6

1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS-T 7.4 15.9
1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS-T (Auto) 7.4 15.5 (MT June, 94)
1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX 6.9 15.2
1992 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX 7.0 15.3
1992 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS Turbo 6.7 15.3 (MT Sept, 92)
1993 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX 6.8 15.2
1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS 9.0 16.6
1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX 6.4 14.9
2000 Mitsubishi Eclipse GT 7.0 15.4
2006 Mitsubishi Eclipse GT 5.8 14.4

1991 Nissan 240SX SE 7.9 16.1
1993 Nissan 240SX Convertible 9.6 17.3
1993 Nissan 240SX SE 8.4 16.3
1995 Nissan 240SX SE 8.3 16.1
1995 Nissan 240SX SE-R 8.0 15.8
1970 Datsun 240Z 8.7 17.1
1971 Datsun 240Z (Auto) 10.4 17.6
1971 Datsun 240Z N/A 17.1
1972 Datsun 240Z 9.0 16.3
1974 Datsun 260Z 9.9 16.7
1983 Datsun 280ZX 9.4 16.9
1983 Datsun 280ZX Turbo 7.3 15.7
1985 Nissan 300ZX 8.2 16.4
1985 Nissan 300ZX Turbo (auto) 7.4 15.7
1987 Nissan 300ZX 2+2 8.8 16.5
1989 Nissan 300ZX 7.1 15.5
1990 Nissan 300ZX 7.1 15.5
1990 Nissan 300ZX Turbo 6.5 15.0
1990 Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo 5.6 14.1
1991 Nissan 300ZX 2+2 7.5 15.9
1991 Nissan 300ZX Turbo (auto) 7.0 15.4
1992 Nissan 300ZX Turbo 5.7 14.2
1993 Nissan 300ZX Turbo 5.2 13.8
1994 Nissan 300ZX Turbo 6.0 14.4
1995 Nissan 300ZX Turbo 5.5 13.9

1983 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am 9.2 17.0
1984 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am HO 7.9 16.1
1987 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am GTA (auto) 7.1 15.5
1988 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am GTA 7.4 15.9
1989 Pontiac 20th Anniv. Trans Am 5.1 14.2
1991 Pontiac Firebird Formula 6.5 14.8
1991 Pontiac Trans Am Conv. 7.0 15.4

1986 Toyota MR2 8.4 16.5
1988 Toyota MR2 Supercharged 6.5 15.0
1989 Toyota MR2 Supercharged 7.8 15.8
1990 Toyota MR2 Turbo 6.2 14.7
1991 Toyota MR2 8.5 16.3
1993 Toyota MR2 Turbo 6.1 14.7
1994 Toyota MR2 6.2 14.8
1995 Toyota MR2 Turbo 6.2 14.8

1983 Toyota Supra 8.9 16.8
1984 Toyota Supra 8.7 16.8
1986 Toyota Supra 7.0 15.4
1988 Toyota Supra 7.9 16.0
1989 Toyota Supra Turbo 6.6 15.2
1991 Toyota Supra Turbo 7.1 15.6
1993 Toyota Supra Turbo 4.6 13.1 (C&D Mar '93)
1994 Toyota Supra 6.9 15.2
1994 Toyota Supra Turbo 5.3 13.7
1995 Toyota Supra Turbo 5.1 13.5
1997 Toyota Supra Turbo 5.1 13.6


JUST SOME FOOD FOR THOUGHT. A LOT of those I listed are in the running ball park with v8 camaro/firebirds/etc..


again comparing a supercharged v8 even 305 vs a stock tta ? gn etc . not even based race.? Ok up the boost on that v6 and its gonna knock the socks off of that SC 305.

YES if you toss the same mods at a V8 it should always beat the 4/6.

Lets do it this way. Take someones average budget and allow $5- 10k to MOD your car(out of the 90's erra your talking about) as you wish. Then have a 3way duel off.
Dyno day , track day , and cruise... mmm Kinda like HOT ROD DRAG WEEK on a budget

I'll show you A LOT of turbo 4 and 6 bangers who will eat some v8's alive.
Im not sticking up for all imports. As Im a die hard camaro guy thru and thru. but Ive also build a quick daily driver turbo 4. that shocks alot of 350 cars including ls1's etc..

I'll give respect to all makes,etc that are not "RICED OUT" and quick. Even the riced out ones I dont rag on to bad. Its what the owner like. Everyone has diff. taste.

 

That is absolute BS. My brother had a 91 Formula then supercharged it. It was a c5 killer man, no joke. He raced a 1989 TTA and the trans am lost. Do you have any idea how fast a supercharger would make a thirdgen? I mean my car is a bolt on 350 TPI and I am whipping up on 2000 and up GTP ,Regals,Porsche Boxster, Infinity G37S and 350Z's. So imagine what a supercharger could do.

 

Here we go again. Up the boost on anything and it adds tons more power of course. Stock GN or TTA vs 305 supercharged. THe 305 would eat it. That is what I'm saying.

 

Buick GN are not impressive factory. They run in the 14s, The GNX may run in the 12's tho stock

 

I am also still running on stock block,heads,cam, and intake!

 

Look at my Sig. I know all to well what a BUILT 3rdGen can do. I know what a turbo charged 3rdgen will do. I know what a modded stock 305 tpi will do. I know what a 355 HSR combo will do. Ive prob. built more combos in the 20yrs of playing with 3rdgens (yes Im an old timer when it come to playing with cars.) then you can think of. From twin turbo , single turbo , supercharged, no2 infested, N/A , etc....

Since this is the THEORETICAL board. what bolt ons do you have that your WHIPPING up on those listed cars? if you have ALL BOLT ons (no heads/cam) id say your in the 13's. (im not talking SOTP feel /times etc)

 

Yes I know the adjustable suspension is OEM, so, what's your point? Even on the "soft" setting it never felt like it was bottoming out, so yes, your junk was worn out then.

I'm still waiting for an explanation on how a bottoming out suspension "feels faster."

You obviously know very little about Datsun/Nissan Z cars, when you don't even know what an "S30" is, or that there was more than just the L28 in the L-series engine line. There was also a 4 cyl version of that same engine, the the 6 cylinder was adapted from. So I'll school you, until you admit that you know very little about them.

If you want to get picky about semantics, the Z31 and later are considered "Luxury Sports cars."

You are missing my point about the Japanese using turbos on their smaller displacement engines and getting more power than the USDM counterpart. The Japanese prefer smaller displacement engines for their efficiency, then use the turbo which is only needed at high rates of acceleration, for the power.

The more you post, the more obvious it gets that you really know very little about the Nissan Z car line.

 

Well hell if were gonna play the THE GN has to stay stock but we can add a superchager to the v8. How is that fair.

Thats just like you say HERE WE GO. ADD a supercharger to that V8 of corse its gonna beat my STOCK turbo v6. Your beating yourself up here with the

Im slowed to boost my V8 with 2more cylinders so I can beat your boosted v6 with 2 less cylinders. Typical internet bench racer.

V8 vs Boosted v6 = even fair race.
Boosted V8 vs Cranked up Boosted i4 or V6 = fair race.

 

Who the hell calls it a Z31 or a Z32? Yes those struts are meant to make the car dip down in the back. Obviously you never owned a ZX style car.Again, because you seem to keep sticking to what you believe.. I'll say it again. A vehicle that dips down in the back upon acceleration WILL FEEL FASTER . GET IT? I should send you the article also that states it.

 

Funny how V8 F-body guy is bragging about beating up on V6 FWD family cars. LOL

I have to wonder if the drivers of the other cars were even racing.

Kinda reminds of when I had my turbo 3.2L Jimmy. I pulled up to a stop light, where a Beretta with a bunch of lighting and stick-on mods was in the next lane. It went green and I pulled away calmly since I was just heading back to a buddies place with him in the passenger seat. Meanwhile the guy in the Beretta is flogging on his car, revving it out, make a real ruckus, while my buddy and I were both looking out the passenger window trying to figure out what the hell was going on. I didn't even give it 30% throttle and the Beretta never pulled past me. If it wasn't such a hot spot for cops I would have put the hammer down to show him just what my truck could do (It was also a 13 second truck, with poor "tuning"), at the speed limit he pulled in front of me. I found out months later, the driver of the car was bragging how he beat "The turbo Jimmy." :facepalm:

 

Yes I'm in the 13's with mine.

 

Pretty much every Z car owner I know calls them by their chassis designation when referring to different 300ZXs, due to their being the two chassis that bore that name.

Now the story changes....

It's gone from "the rear suspension bottoming out that feels faster", to "a suspension that dips feels faster." :facepalm:

You can't even stick to your own story. You really should quit now.

 

Exactly, everyone has a fast car on the internet. lol

 

Bingo...

ok so ninetyone your in the 13's with BOLT ONS.
DONT UP THE BOOST on a TTA or GN , etc. lets call it even and just do BOLT ONS also.
Im sorry but no way your WHIPPING up on all of them.

 

These were all real races.So are you calling me a liar or assuming i am not being truthful because we are on the internet?

 

What has changed about my story? Those are your words in attempt to TRY and prove me wrong.

 

Secondly ,I WAS A Z ENTHUSIAST and none of us referred to the cars by a chassis name.

 

So from browseing this thread I've learned a few things:

1) If it doesn't have a v8 and say Camaro/Iroc-Z/Chevy/Built in the USA ect. then the car is junk and worthless in upgrading.
2) If my car has 4 cylinders and not American made its a POS
3) If my built up import can beat your American muscle its still a POS
4) If my suspension bottoms out or dips in the rear I will feel like I'm going fast and therfore have a super powerful car
5) I should only own a V8 muscle car because they are supieror to all
6) The other guy on the forum has a faster car than me because he will never meet me in person therfore he can boast how fast his car really isn't
7) I'm an idiot for having intrest in both tuners and muscle cars (owning a 91 Talon TSI and 87 Iroc-Z)
8) If a car has a 5" muffler, rims, body kit, wing, and stickers its a rice POS even if it can beat you V8 (what about the drifter scene, they all have that)
9) Your camaro is superior to everything else on the road
10) Your camaro is superior to everything else on the road

Does this pretty much sum things up??

 

Here is a quote from car and driver and i also sent you the link. LOL

" As with the old Z, the rear squats on acceleration. There is also a minor amount of self-steering over bumps and during hard braking. In general, the ride quality is plush and underdamped, more along the lines of a luxury car than a sporting machine.Continued...

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...changes_page_2

 

Dont chime in just cause you wanna feel like you are a part of. You are looking for a feeling of comrodery . Haha

 

Why do they call you shorty anyway shortyskater?

 

Afew things Ive learned about shortyskater: don't even get me started.LOL

 

Shorty's is/was a skateboard company. Skater because I skateboard. Put two together and you get the name.