ChevyCamaro420

Has anybody here ever raced em? They're a nice car, and although a mitsu i'll admit i love em. The reason i ask is because there are 2 at my school, niether are VR4's though (turbo'ed), ones a base model, others an SL. What kinds of times do they run? I'm gonna gues that they're pretty quick. How would a modded 305 match up against em?

ddn69

well Im pretty sure they are AWD right? and I know the vr4s make 320 hp. So my guess is they are around a 14.x second car. I wouldnt hope too much for a 305 beating one. But if theyre not vr4s you may have a shot. Just a guess

Nate

SOLID LIFTER

VR4s can run high 13s - low 14s.
SLs can run low - mid 15s.
I've got no idea what the base models can run.

IROCaholic

The 220 hp model (I am not sure which one that is) runs like low 15's. You should be able to take one if you get headers and a cat back, and 3.73 gears. They arent slouches but they are fast either.

SOLID LIFTER

That would be the SL.

Formula4Speed

The SL is the base model 3000gt I think, unless its like an upgraded interior but it still has the 225 hp engine. My ex g/f has one its a mid 15 car, they're a lot heavier than you'd think and even the turbo models don't respond that well to mods. I think you have a good shot against them.

del91_305

The base models are jsut front wheel drive im pretty sure. I ahve raced a base model stealth before i got my rearend done and was just barely able to beat him.

Teal91rs

ok heres the low down on 3000gts hp depends on the year model
the vrs run from 310hp to 320hp the are awd the sl's are rwd and run 220hp and the base is fwd and runs i think 190hp nothing to worry about tillyou reach the vr4s they run low 14s ffrom the factory the bases run 15-16 along with the sl's
also watch out for the dodge stealths they are the same car with a different body and made by dodge just like f-bodys i would recomend http://www.daveblack.net/ a good 3000gt and stealth site

Formula4Speed

You sure its RWD, I'm 99% sure my ex's SL is FWD

thirdgen88

yeah, they're all FWD primary...

berlinetta85383

last year when I still had my street tires on and had 4 people in my car. (I still had back seats then) some guy pulled up to me in a newer red stealth, I think 94ish, and started revving at a light. I gave him a run and got worked pretty bad. He pulled about 2 lengths right outta the hole and after that I don't think he pulled anymore. later on we went from a roll and he slowly pulled about about a length on me in prob 5 secs or so. I was talking around town and found out he had a whole ton of stuff done to it turbo timer, intercooler etc.. whatever they do to make them fly. (I don't know a whole lot about turbo cars) I saw him about 6 months later and he showed me a few low 13 second timeslips, so this thing was definatley not stock. If driven properly these awd cars are pretty good from light to light.

ChevyCamaro420

Nice responses guys, thanks. According to autotrader the SL's are FWD, dont know how reliable that source is though.

I think I might throw a lil cash down and race one of em once i get my rear-end done, buy a catback/headers, and put my cam in.

91gta_tpi

I raced my buddy in his base model stealth from a stop and I beat him by about 1 to 1 1/2 cars, in my 305 tpi, bone stock.

Formula4Speed

Base model stealth only has a 166 hp compared to the base model 3000gt with 225. The stealth also had a 222 hp option and the turbo model.

junkyarddog

The base model 3000 gt is a SOHC 4 cylinder car. it's pretty weak. you shouldn't even consider it a threat.


the SL is front wheel drive. DOHC 3.0 Liter,
it will give a 305 a good run. Keep in mind, the 305 is putting it's power through the rear wheels, much better tration. The 3KGT wom't be very competitive off the line, but the SLs and GTs have active electronic suspension and good clean HP up to 7200 rpms. try racing one up to 145 though some turns, it's a different story.

VR4s aren't the fastest cars either, but good luck hanging with one with a 305.

Chances are the drivers won't even race you, theres really no point, it's more fun to do 125 through a hwy interchange, that's an adrenaline rush in itself. I like the V8 rumble myself, but there is something magical about the 'hairdryer sound' as the 3.0 winds up to 7000. There's nothing like it, yes it really does sound like a big har dryer too.


I say go find a nice clean road and race these clowns. I'll give you mad respect if you can overtake an SL through the turns. if these kids aren't too chicken to drive. good luck

ChevyCamaro420

The base models have the same engine as the SL, at least from '96 on anyways. Also there's no GT model either... that'de sound kinda weird anyways, 3000GT GT.

junkyarddog

yea, I was a little drunk when I wrote that...can you tell?

I'm pretty sure I meant to say VR-4 instead of....GT

I'm not sure of the '96 and up, why would they make a base model with the same engine as the SL? The SL is already N/A, they made several changes in the later years, but it doesn't seem to make sense to put a 3.0 DOHC in a car and then trim it down and call it a 'base' model...if that's what they did, then it's pretty lame!

I have a '93 SL, it's pretty funny when people think it's the base model with 160 hp and then find out the hard way... I don't race it much, but I have had run ins with mustang GTs and some F-bodys, it wasn't a shamefull event for the 3KGT especially when I'm battling with 6 cylinders non-turbo. I have only raced off the line a couple of times, I'm smart enough to know that this car doesn't have the torque or the traction to get good 1/4 times. It's much more fun racing elsewhere. I'd much rather bring it to an autocross event than dog it out on a dragstrip.

JimmyG-91Z

I've beaten an SL through a twisty road, and we weren't going at "chicken" speeds either, far from it. I'm pretty sure his car was all stock (except maybe a stereo which would just add more weight to a very heavy car), and mine had next to nothing done to it. Probably one of the funnest and most exciting races I've had. I'd say get a catback and you'll be fine, probably be able to beat them the way you are as long as they are stock.

twistydick

theyre not much to fear.a buddy o mine has an sl.one of the times that it wasnt in the shop he was talking crap about camaros trying to goad me. on our way to the club, i busted his azz...........his car didnt impress me at all, an my car is barely modded(runs 14.7s)

EDDIETA_ZZ3

they are suprisingly heavy cars. I know the stock wheels are heavy. BUT . . . the higher end model is good competition for a slightly modded L98.

However, if you brought up the Mitsu EVO. . . totally different game

EvilCartman

iTrader: (1)

Turbo timer doesn't make them any faster. When you park the car, walk off with key in hand, the engine will still run for a preset ammount of time to let the turbo cool down a bit before the engine shuts off. Just helps with the longevity of the turbo.

Sonar_un

I've races two auto 3000GT SL's in my Camaro RS. I beat both of them (we lined up on a 3 lane road, I was in the middle). So let me just say, they are DOG slow.

VR-4-Real

If it's a base and after 1996 then its a SOHC v6 with only 160 hp. No problem there. Other than that SL's and base 3000gt's have 222hp. If its an automatic you shouldn't have a problem as they are a ton slower off the line. If it's a 5-speed with a good driver the car should run mid-low 15's, but they can dip into the 14's pretty easily. All of the 3000gt's are front wheel drive except for the twin turbo models (vr-4).

Now race, get it on video, and post that ****!

BTW vr-4s can run mid 13's stock

junkyarddog

I think The Stealth/3000GT crowd has just as much fun as we do...

Like us, they're cars are supposedly slow and that leaves plenty of room for surprizes!

I'm one of both my self. I wouldn't race an F-body off the line against a 350 powered f-body with an SL. It's a bit obvious who would have that one. I would like to race JimmyG-91Z after I replace the struts and tires on the SL...That must've been a good race. And one more time as I say all the time: it's not the car...it's the driver!! So you definitly get my respect, I've always wondered if my T/A could hang a turn as well as the SL. I didn't have both cars at the same time to compare them, but I had about $1500 into the T/A's suspension that I hardly got a chance to test. There is such a variety of factors that go into a road race, but good driving is above all.

No offense to 3si drivers, but if your driving a base or SL and your lining up against RWD muscle cars to drag race.......why don't you just get a RWD muscle car? Even the VR-4s aren't designed to drag race with, but they can do a hell of a launch with a 5-speed. Personally, I think it's a well designed car, but it isn't made for the drag strip, especially stock. Anyone who drives a stock 3KGT and talks trash and then gets whipped off the line by a camaro or whatever, deserves what they get. I think a 3KGT is best for toying with import wanna-bees, since they seem to pick fights with the 3KGT on a non-stop basis, Mustang GTs and V6s second....now and then a thirdgen, but most GM drivers are pretty laid back. Alot of times I have to wait at a green light, so the nearby cop can clearly see that it was indeed the 'aluminum winged bandit' who squeeled first ,second and third with the turbo whistling out of the light.......punks.

What are these kids trying to prove? I'm just limping through town on four completly fried struts and links, expired inspection sticker...trying to get to work and get parts for my other car.....don't judge a book by it's cover!

ChevyCamaro420

haha well from what im gathering, they're not a HUGE threat. I was talkin to him the other day at school and supposedly his near stock base model 3KGT can "spin the tires through 1st/2nd/3rd/4th and chirp em in 5th."

But then again, some race shop downtown also wants to sponsor him and throw turbo's/NOS/intercooler/Intake/Exhaust etc. on it and it'll be making 600 horses after that! All for free! Why are some kids the way they are? drives me crazy.



Looks like some money's gonna have to be thrown down soon... once I get my new rear-end and cam in. And of course, a video camera will be there.

twistydick: Your LG4 is barely modded and runs 14.7's? That's incredibly hard to believe, unless your one of those modest guys that has bolt-ons and by "barely modded" to u means that it just hasnt had any serious engine work. (BTW - not calling u a liar or anything like that at all, just sayin' you must have that thing in perfect tune )

junkyarddog

When I hear of 3KGTs getting 'spanked' horribly, I often wonder a few things:

1. stick or auto? if stick...can the driver drive it?

if it's auto, does the driver bother select 'PWR' and take it out of OD? big difference there, I wouldn't be surpized if a small number of people were ignorant to those settings. I've even seen posts about thirdgeners trying to race in OD....my car is auto and it won't move worth a... if it is in OD and in 'ECO' mode, I don't even use ECO anymore since it runs like garbage and doesn't seem to save much gas anyways.

2. maintenace....with a service cost of $650 to change the spark plugs, or having to do it yourself (removing the intake plenum) and $20 or whatever it is per plug....how many people really bother? When I changed the plugs in mine, it was like a night and day difference, like it was an entirely different car.

3. thier motors get all the power at high RPMs, so a paper filter pretty much sucks...a dirty filter, consider it worthless. A K&N filter is much more noticable at 7000rpm than it was in my T/A. That's the only 'mod' I've done with the 3KGT, but it made quite a difference.

I think there are a few things that can easilly be overlooked and make them seem much slower. I have went nose to nose with a couple of V8 mustangs and kept up perfectly fine, I had to let off both times so I didn't see the end result...it was interesting. I'd really like to see these races though, I can't wait!

junkyarddog

4. front and rear motor mounts......usually toasted and the stock rubber ones are made of gelatin. malfuntioning front and rear struts will affect FWD acceleration as well.

Simple things overlooked....the FWD is a whole different animal....

ChevyCamaro420

Changing the plugs doesnt require moving any accesories... and the plugs are $2 each or $4 for the platinums through top name brands... That'de be kinda surprising that they made that much difference too, it's just part of a basic tuneup.


Maybe you were running without one of your cylinders

VR-4-Real

LOL! $650 to change plugs? Where'd you get quoted for that? The first time I did it it took about an hour and a half, and now I can do it under 30 minutes. The stock plugs are 12 bucks a pop though.

How are 3000gts just good for "toying with import wannabes?" Granted since its a GT car it's not a drag car, but for less than $500 bucks you can hit 12's. When I had stock turbos I hit 13.0 on a slipping clutch with just intake/exhaust and a 15 dollar boost controller. With proper tuning these cars can be monster street cars. Can you say 11's on street tires?

Junkyarddog- Sorry but the auto is just a dog off the line. I had an auto sl and I got raped off the line by most anything. Perfect example. My buddies got a 91 firebird 305 HO and at the time I think he just had intake, headers, and flowmasters. I had intake exhaust and an underdrive pulley. Up top it was pretty much even, basically depending on who donwshifted first (autos) but off the line it was ugly.

If you guys need any info on 3000gts/stealths check out www.3si.org

junkyarddog

Yes the auto is pretty much a dog off the line, but it can be very much a dog with a couple of things overlooked. I think it would still lose to a V8, with good torque, but not spanked like it was a chrystler fifth avenue.

Toying with imports...lol...I'm just being sarcastic. It's just that I get much more attention as far as as challenges and stuff. Just petty stuff like revs and things....the other day, some jkaz in an old rusty cutlass cerieera barked his wheels and took off hard after sitting next to me at a light. I was sitting there minding my own business too! I never got any thing like that in the T/A, so it was a little ugly, it looked tough and definitly sounded healthy....I always wanted some kind of beef like that! DOGBALLS (my t/a's nickname) was built for battle, I could drive that car as hard as I wanted too and it wouldn't break a sweat, make a little contact....no big deal, the paint was last on the list...jk

So, now that these punks actually try something when I'm in a different car....I get to show them that those wings really don't do anything for performance. I get to do that with the corolla too. One time I got a '98 cavalier (big body kit, huge wing, tip, stickers) off the line and tore by him in 2nd....with an 85hp 1.6 corolla....no need to lie about that. Another one of those dorks who thought I was reving to instigate a race....no, just trying to rev it up a little so it won't sputter and stall.

30 min for the plugs? you're pretty slick I took my time doing mine, it was after some dummy posted something about breaking a washer and getting it stuck inside a cylinder in the 3si boards....I thought it seemed dumb, but I spent a good 2 hours just fartin' around....the whole time wondering "can that really happen?" The $650 is the 'dealers cost' and some shops charge $20 for those plugs, I got mine for like $14.xx each. I'm doing the valve seals next...heads on, that will be a good time! I have the Mitsubishi factory service volumes for these cars...I'm not bringing it to some meat-head mechanic for anything...I see the shoty rushed work those guys do to other peoples' cars! No thanks!

VR-4REAL, do you ever sense a strong anti-japanese sentiment while cruizing in your car? I do now and then, and I think that is where some of the dumber people come from. It's those people that actually believe American cars are still 'American made' and hate something Japanese just because they made a cool car. Some people act like I'm driving around with a large red sun flag hanging from my car......but upsetting people is fun sometimes.


with that I will conclude my postings with a little 3KGT vs chevy 350 kill story. I like chevy's just as much as everyone here and I think some will see the humor in it. Might as well while we are talking about these cars.

It's 19:45 (7:45pm) Haloween night 2001, I'm driving home from duty in my newly accquired 3KGT. I have my window cracked for some fresh air and I'm staying under 60 in the RH lane. To my left, I hear the familliar rumble of a Chevy 5.7 Liter, and Flowmaster dual exuasts..........Ahhh still heart broken over my T/A, recently departed. I look over to see what it could be, but it's not an F-body....it's something bigger, meaner!

As I turn around to see what was coming, the 700R4 drops a gear and lets that motor open up full throttle...........This monster is rumbling by, WOT absolutly growling in all it's might. To make it obvious to what the sudden passing was about, the drivers girlfriend has her window down waving 'good bye' to me....as if to say "you can't keep up with this powerful machine!" I was bewildered, confused........shocked......was jerry springer shooting in Norfolk?
The reason I ask is because this woman was waving with all her confidence out of the passengers window of a late model Full Sized Chevy Z74 pick-up truck!!

I couldn't believe my eyes.....but it was there! still flying by me WOT displaying 'good ol dixie' in the rear window....I thought of letting it go, but I didn't want to risk picking up airborne chew spit.....I checked my gas, 1/8th tank....good to go, checked for cops....put the pedal down, it picked up no problem. I wanted more though, so I got a little more into it.....ahh screw it...put it right to the floor demanding the lowest downshift possible, vvvvrooooooooom like a gaint hair dryer! Next thing I know I'm winding right at 7k, it drops a little, but still stays put close enough to 7, still pulling good, by now this truck is very far behind me....he didn't even seem to try to keep up even though he was...it was like I was passing this thing on the side of the road.

I was a little disapointed in him. Then I noticed I was going almost 140, and decide that was enough of that........I slowed to 60, 50 then 40.... for almost two miles, trying to let this shmuck catch up...I wanted to point and laugh....but he also slowed and took the first exit he could behind me. I didn't get to laugh at him and his girl, but it was a lot of fun....I seriously had no idea what the car was capable of, I had assumed that it was butt slow just from driving around town. The switch for power or economy mode was switched to econ too, maybee this disables at WOT? For me it was more for laughs than to say 'wow, that was so fast!' however, I did wonder how much faster it would've went top speed...it didn't even feel unstable or weak at 140, I think it would've kept going easilly. I kind of wished that was a 350 camaro instead of hillbilly Z74, it might have been a good race.

SOLID LIFTER

LOL!

VR-4-Real

Good luck with the valve stem seals! lol WHy are you replacing them? Is your car smoking pretty badly? I'd check into a kranvent. I think it's actually krankvent.com or something like that. They actually create a vacuum in your cranklcase, which pretty much eliminates blow by around the seals. It doesnt fix the problem technically, but since I put mine in I've had no smoke, and the problem shouldn't get any worse.

I get plenty of association with other 1.6L hondas and acuras (which can also be pretty damn quick if you know what you're doing). Works for me though. After the race it just proves how ignorant some people are. For example about a year ago this kid was talking **** about his Camaro. I think it was an iroc, but anyways it was an auto 350. He asked what I had and I just told him a v6. He then asked if it was a stick and I said yeah. I asked about his engine and he says,"350 baby!" like he's some sort of ***. Anyways I'm pretty sure he just had exhaust. We lined up, and I launched at only like 3.5K and put an instant couple of buslengths on him by 70 mph lol. He called me an ******* for "spraying" and took off

BTW the power button shifts the car at about 6.9K instead of like 6.4 in eco, regardless of throttle position. Plus it shifts firmer

junkyarddog

put the bong down 420, we're not talking about SBCs....

It's a 3.0, cramped into a front wheel drive vehicle, the 3 in the front head are easy to get to, the 3 in the rear are tucked underneath the intake plenum. The intake, throttle body and all the hoses and wires have to be unhooked...not impossible, just a little extra work. I wish those plugs were only $4, that would be nice. As for missing a cylinder, I think it was more like a 1/6 of each cylinder

junkyarddog

I would love a VR-4 if I could afford one...I'd keep my SL decal and slap in to the rear bumper!

Your right, now that I think of it, it wound as high as I would let it, but shifted a little early. Later on when I was wondering why, I looked down and saw which position the switch was in. That made me laugh even more. I liked the way it shifted thoguh, very precise, right on time. I can drive standard just as well, but I had no complaints with the electronicly controled shifting.

The valve seals will be fun! I have the compressed air to hold the valves up, according to my corrola haynes manual...you can use nylon rope to 'fill' the cylinder if you don't have air....that seems a little wierd, but at least the valves can't possibly fall in. That is my biggest fear, a little carbon or something on the rim of the valve, and 'plink' I have to undo the head and get that thing....That's more than I want to do. Yes, my car has hellafied blue smoke....I sit at a light and nothing but cloud on my way out. It loses lots of oil too, 24 bad seals don't help. It has all the symtoms of bad seals, hopefully it's mainly the seals nothing mechanical. My T/As first engine was tosted...bad rings, everything....I took much better care of the second engine and this car I have now.

Thanks for that link! A quick fix is a fix, I'll still do the seals too. I'm also switching to Synthetic fluids, I run Mobile One in my other car and it's been very good to me.

BTW, mechanics charge $1500 to do the seals!....not in thrdgens 420!

ChevyCamaro420

Haha ohhh ok, it all seems to make sense now

do you guys (junkyarddog/VR-4real) have any times for ur 3KGT's?

VR-4-Real

When I just had an intake I ran a 13.7, but I couldn't launch to save my life (it's actually harder than you'd think with awd) Last summer in about 100 degree heat, AND a slipping clutch I ran a 13.0 @ 107. I was definately capable of probably a 12.8 or so. This summer will be a different story :rockon:

kairles

iTrader: (2)

my buddy has a 91(I think) stealth rt/tt he ran a 14.0 all day but we went to put a boost controller on and check to see if it was really boosting 14 psi as his gauge read and it was only boosting 5psi he turn it up to 10psi and I swear it was a second faster that thing was a rocket out of the hole very fun car to drive

junkyarddog

I never timed mine. Like VR-4REAL says, it's not to hard to take an SL (stock) off the line, especially automatics. So if that's what your are going to do, then don't worry about it.

If it's the VR-4, you better hope the turbo is malfunctioning or something.....

If it's not either of those two...leave the Camaro at home, borrow the family sedan or minivan and have at it!

ChevyCamaro420

good idea, maybe i should give the 528i a shot at it