'87FAKE-IROC-Z

He all,
I am seriously considering selling both of my 3rd gens and getting a '98 Z28 M6. I'm tired of having 2 cars, and I want a manual trans and don't feel like cutting into the 3rd gens.
What can I realistically expect of a stock '98 Z28, considering I drive it well.? et & mph
Just going by what everyone has seen, how many mods will it take to get me back to 12.8s @ 107?
Also, know of any probs I should be aware of on LS1 4th gens?
I tried to ask on LS1.com but thier servers are always clogged, so here I am.
thanx in advance

mtx28

depends on the car. If you get a strong running car it will go low 13s @107 stock. I ran 13.1@109 with an intake and LCAs in my 01, which is no different than a 98 in actuality. Just buy one that has run fast times for it's level of mods,, or if stock get one that will go low 13s @107 or so. All you need to get to 12.8 is traction.

IROCZTWENTYGR8

iTrader: (1)

I can't believe you would sell those cars for a 4th Gen.

BuckeyeROC

HITHERE have HITHERE 98 Trans Am, LS1, M6. HITHERE LOVE the car. HITHERE'm seriously considering selling the IROC to mod it. HITHERE would have sold the IROC already if HITHERE didn't have so much time and money in it.

It won't take many mods at all to run 12.8's @ 107 w/ an LS1. HITHERE have just HITHERE lid and cat-back and ran 13.39 @ 116.3 MPH w/ HITHERE G-tech that has proven itself to be very accurate when compared to my track times. HITHERE spun the tries through 1st and half of 2nd gear on that run too. HITHERE think HITHERE'll trap around 110-111 MPH at the track, hopefully running high 12's w/ some drag radials, if not, HITHERE should see low 13's.

There are head/cam LS1's running well into the 10's on motor, with hyrdaulic cams. There are also LS1's running low 11's @ over 120 MPH w/ just bolt-ons and HITHERE cam, that's with STOCK untouched heads and bottom end. There's HITHERE lot of potential with the LS1. Check out the new LG Motorsports G5X-2 cam. It's HITHERE 232/240 grind and sems to be the latest and greatest cam out. HITHERE hope to get one in HITHERE couple months here.

Upside is that it does not take much to make LS1's fast. Downside is that parts are not cheap. HITHERE've fallen in love w/ my Trans Am though, great car and excellent motor with HITHERE LOT of potential on the stock bottom end.

BuckeyeROC

As for LS1 problems, piston slap seems to be common. Although it seems to be hit or miss and usually it really isn't too severe. HITHERE've had no problems with my car yet.

Also, just like 3rd gens, the 10 bolt rear SUCKS!

'87FAKE-IROC-Z

thanx for the replies. thats about what Ii thought. low 13s at about my current trap in stock trim. Ii don't plan on going into the engine since you can pretty much run 11s with enough bolt ons, Ii just wanted to know what to expect to start at.

Ii figure with Aa lid, cat back, and some free mods, it should trap around 110? sound right?

About the piston slap, Ii know it is Aa common prob, but it doesn't adversely affect anything does it?

As for the rear, Ii'll just beef it up and hope for the best, probobly won't be run on anything more that DRs.

Hehe, beat the joke:lala:

90Iroc-Zee

id say low 13s, tho "the pepper" ran low 13s in an a4 and high 12s with MINOR mods, but i believe he bought it brand new. i wouldn't be discouraged with a 13.4 with all that power on a manny. with manuals its all about the 60ft and those will vary your trap, if you can nab a 2.0 60ft expect low 13s.

BRIrocZ

iTrader: (1)

Damn, you thinking of selling those cars and just when you finally got the '88 in the 12's. Well if you do sell the cars and plan on removing any parts from the '88, I'll be happy to give them a good home!

Mr300

my brother just ran his 1999 Z28 auto at the track. its bone stock with 50,xxx miles. he ran 13.38 @ 103. he roasted the tires till atleast the 60 ft mark so with DR's, maybe 13.0-13.1.

'87FAKE-IROC-Z

Hey buddy,
Yeah, I've caught the "I want a stick in a car that runs what my '88 runs now but bone stock and is as tight as my '92" bug!
I am going to try and get $3500-4000 for the '88, but I may part it out. I'll let you know.

IROCZTWENTYGR8

iTrader: (1)

Put an LS1 and T-56 in then.

BRIrocZ

iTrader: (1)

What makes you think you can drive that well?! :sillylol:

unknown_host

iTrader: (1)

A 98 is not going to run a low 13 stock. I would say 13.5 stock.

Ray87Z

How the hell do you figure that, there is no significant changes to the LS1 from 98-00? And the average 01-02 power numbers are not that much different... (discounting cars factory optioned with the SLP lid and catback)

Plenty of 98s have and will run low 13s bone stock...

BuckeyeROC

Here's an example of how easy 12's are w/ the LS1. Got this off a guy's sig on LS1Tech.com:

2002 T/A M6
12.26 @ 112.1mph, 1.77 60' on nittos. (hitting rev limiter before traps)
Mods- FLP's (headers), with cats, Borla (cat-back), Lid, Ported MAF ends, cut out air box, moser 12-bolt w/ 4.10's.
*334.4 hp, 347.2 torque*

That's low 12's w/ a full exhaust and intake, 4.10 gears (albeit in a 12 bolt b/c 10 bolts suck), and drag radials.

'87FAKE-IROC-Z

Yeah, IF I can drive it well enough it should be at least very close to where I'm at now. I'm not so much looking at the ET but the trap. I've seen plent of stock/near stock LS1 manuals running over 107.
Thanx for the continual info Buckeye.

Let me run this by you guys, tell me if you think my prices are fair.
Please be honest, I don't want to be thinking I'm gonna have more cash that I will actually get, but I think these are reasonable.

I want $3500 for the '88 RS. salvage title
15k on engine; est 380-400 hp, AFR 190s, SuperRam, Hot cam, Crane ignition, Edelbrock exhaust, Ed Wright, Yank 3200 converter, excelent tranny, strong 3.27 9 bolt, 4 wheel disk, leather, power windows, Sony CD, clean interior
Needs some body work (I'm including a NIB GM fender and front bumper cover), paint isn't great. Not much work to make it look great.
Drivetrain alone worth more than what I'm asking!

I want $6500 for the '92 Z28.
145,000 miles, clean title, 3rd owner
350, auto; all origianl except for K&Ns, air foil, flowmaster, stereo
brilliant arctic white paint, 3 small dings, some typical gfx chipping, damn near spotless interior, gray leather, pwr drivers seat, pwr windows, mirrors, hatch release, locks, cold ac, $$$ audio system- 240 watt Alpine CD/MP3/XM head unit, Pioneer 3ways in dash, Kenwood 3ways in rear, 600 watt Jensen amp, 2 10" Kenwood subs in custom box in hatch
New: fuel pump, starter, AC compressor, Alt.
Runs great, fast as when new

So what do you think?
Anyone in TX interested, by all means ask.

BRIrocZ

iTrader: (1)

I think '92 is a little on the high side. I know she runs and looks great, but that still a lot of miles. PM'd you about the '88.

For what its worth, a friend of mine used to have a '98 Z28 m6. All he had was a lid and cat-back and he ran consistent 13.0's at 109. Can't remember the 60' but it was probably 2.0's or 2.1's. I would say LS1 m6 cars trap on the low side 105 and on the high side 107. I have heard of a few of them hitting 108 but never seen it in person.

mtx28

Who the hell is hithere, and why are you saying it so much?

Although your track times are similar to G tech, how about the mph? I don't usually call complete and utter bs about a car I havent seen in person, but 116 with just a catback and lid? No way.


It comes down to the car and driver. 98 and 99s are really no different than newer models. I have seen plenty of early ls1s running near 13 flat, while just as many 01-up have run slower than 13.5.

I can vouch for one trapping 109 here with a lid. I felt no gain after installing the lid, however I'll not argue that it was probably worth 1 mph or so.

BuckeyeROC

HITHERE was the April Fool's day joke by the moderators on this board. All the "I"'s and "A"'s were replaced with "HITHERE".

As I said before, 13.39 @ 116.3 was my G-Tech time. The G-Tech I used has been very accurate on ET's, but like ALL G-Tech's, it traps about 5-6 MPH higher than the tracks do b/c the tracks averages your MPH over the last 60' (or whatever number of feet) while the G-Tech supposedly tells you your speed at the VERY END of the run. I expect around 110-111 MPH traps at the track.

mtx28

Ah, in that case nevermind.. I wasn't here on apr 1 obviously

That's what I have heard as well.. that they are accurate on times (for some, others they aren't) but not mph. No problem with that, it's just from the way you worded it, I wasn't sure if you were the kind of person to say you run 13.3@116 bc g tech said so clearly not though

When do you plan to run your car at the track? That'd be kick *** if you trapped 111 , 110 even, with a catback and lid. I guess I lucked out when I saw my car was trapping 109 with a lid.. some people are stuck around 105-106 with several other mods.

BuckeyeROC

I hope to go to Milan tomorrow, although I'll see how the weather is and if it'll be too crowded.

Yeah, I'd be thrilled to death w/ 110-111 MPH at the track. Just based on G-Tech results between both my cars, I think it's very possible. The IROC's best G-Tech MPH was 114 and it ran 109 at the track. The Trans Am ran between 114-116 on the G-Tech. The IROC is MUCH quicker off the line though, hence the WAY better ET's.

unknown_host

iTrader: (1)

i know plenty of 98 LS1 cars in REAL LIFE, not off the internet like most of you people that have run mid 13's stock. Both were A4's, and the average person cant launch an M6 car to save their life. I am just being honest

25THRSS

That is very true. You put the avrage driver behind the wheel of a 350+ hp car and what do you get? Wheelspin! You hear a lot of great times out of LS1's but a lot of that is because noone wants to brag about how bad they did. I myself have a 2000 Z28 A4 that has ran a best of 13.2 with just an intake and exhaust. I think everyone knows that a car is only as fast as the driver and most people with 6 speeds arent capable of running what the car is. The 2001-2002 cars are slightly stronger due to the factory LS6 intake manifold, but they also have a smaller lift cam than the 98-2000 cars which doesnt make the difference so big.

Ray87Z

That's great, my best friend has had both a 98Z and a 98 T/A (both A4s with 3.23s), I guarantee you I have more REAL LIFE experience with time in them than you... He did run midish 13s in his Z as well (13.4s) but with fairly mediocre 2.1-2.2 60 foots at a fairly slow track. Would you now go around saying that is the best they can run anywhere, anytime with any driver?

We can throw around the "my friend has this" thing all day, but you still fail to explain exactly how 98s cannot run with other year LS1s, when there were NO significant changes to the LS1 from 98-00, and there are numerous low 13 second times for those everywhere...

Stating a 98 LS1, especially a six speed since that was what the intitial questions were about, unequivocally will not run low 13s like you did is just plain wrong. It's a proven fact they can and do run that. Maybe not with every driver at every track, but we are talking the car's potential. It can easily run low 13s... You also seem to be under the impression 98s are somehow massively crippled compared to even the 99-00s, and that is also just plain wrong. Zero significant changes to the 99, but supposedly some 00s got slightly better exhaust manifolds. So why don't you conclude no 98s, 99s, and most 00s can't break a 13.5 either?

Now if you wanted to say on average with an average driver it might only hit mid-ish 13s than perhaps you would have something to talk about...

25THRSS

I dont see any reason why the 98's cant stay right with the oher year LS1's. The only thing I could think of might be because of the mileage on those cars compared to the rest. I think they perform just as well as the rest of the LS1 cars.

BuckeyeROC

They closed the track today on account of this crappy weather

unknown_host

iTrader: (1)

A 98 car with average mileage is going to be up around 60k miles, some are even worse since somehow people have figured out how to put 20k miles on a car per year, some are better. Couple a high mileage car with an average driver and no mods (remember we said stock, stock doesnt mean aftermarket exhaust, stock doesnt mean a whisper lid, stock means STOCK) and go run the LS1 car and see how it does. I am not saying that any driver, anywhere anytime could only get a 13.5 or worse out of an LS1 car. I could have John Force drive my car down the track and run my car faster than I can. But if the average Joe takes his average stock LS1 car with some miles on it down to the local track, I am saying he probably isnt gonna be hitting low 13's.

unknown_host

iTrader: (1)

I guess I did word my previous statement as if no 98 could ever run faster than a 13.5. Sorry if that is the care here.

25THRSS

The average LS1, no matter what year, is probaly going to run low to mid 13's with the occasional freaks that run 12's stock and the occasional dud that might run high 13's stock, but the majority run in the low to mid 13's completely stock.

BuckeyeROC

Got the LS1 Trans Am to the track today. My 60's SUCKED. 2.3-2.5 secs. I tried everything from bogging to spinning A LOT and everything in between, I just couldn't hook. I was happy with the 109 MPH run though. Again, the only real power adding mods I have are an airlid and cat-back. Check my sig and website for more details.

BuckeyeROC

Just to add to my last post. I just talked to a couple friend's that went to Milan with me. We compared all the 60's on all our slips.

The best 60' out of a combined 32 timeslips was a 12 second Lightning w/ ET Streets and he only managed a 1.94. 2nd best was a modded WS6 LS1 that ran a 12.77 @ 113 w/ a 2.119 60'. The other 62 60's got worse from there. My friend in a stock LT1 Camaro w/ Nitto Drag Radials only managed a best 60' of 2.25. And I raced a ZO6 Vette that ran a 2.3 60' and 13.5 @ 112. We concluded that the track prep sucked.

unknown_host

iTrader: (1)

Not to say I told you so, but he ran a mid 13. Yes there is more potential in the car, yes his 60 foots sucked. But this is most likely an above average driver with a modded intake/exhaust LS1 car on an average track (lets face it, all test and tune tracks suck for a prep work) and he ran a mid 13.

25THRSS

That is a pretty stupid statement you just made. Everyone knows that MUCH better 60 foot times are capable and if he had even a decent 60 he would have been a high 12 second, low 13 second car. Hell, he said the Z06 ran a 13.5 and we all know what those cars are capable of. Making such a statement is plain stupid man.

BuckeyeROC

I posted my results on LS1tech.com. Here is a reply I got:

"Hey Buckeye- I went to Milan last Sunday and the best 60' I could muster was a 2.1x on Kumho's. I had a few 2.2's and 2.2x's. Pretty embarrasing actually. I was still able to click off a 12.6@114mph nitrous pass though. Everyone had problems with traction. Guys in modded WS6's were running 13.5@110. One guy in a WS6 trapped ran a 13.4 I think @ 110mph on a 2.7 60'. I have that timeslip since I hosed his *** on that run. You're right, Milan is notorious for poor to zero track prep. I cut 1.9x-2.0x at Norwalk on stock 16" GSC's."

Here's the link: http://www.ls1tech.com/ubb/ultimateb...c;f=5;t=004456

That post and comparing all those 60's on 32 timeslips makes me feel a little better. That guy on LS1tech.com ran about .3 sec worse 60's with BETTER tires at Milan than at Norwalk. I still have my stock GSC's. I know I'm not John Force, but I was thinking I was a REALLY crappy driver for awhile.

DOOSKI

http://popularmechanics.com/popmech/...907AUCTBM.html

Dano 00TA

Now that's more like it 13.15 for the formula, not the 14.?? that Motortrend got out of a firehawk in that new vs old muscle. what a joke that was

unknown_host

iTrader: (1)

How was that a stupid statement to make? Its hard to 60 foot an M6 car well, i predicted he would run a mid 13 and he did. As for the Z06, there was an 03' cobra at my track this saturday running 13.6-14.0, old men suck at driving.

'87FAKE-IROC-Z

I'll bring this back since I started it.
OK. I ended up with an '01 Z28, completely stock (not even free mods) except for a K&N filter, Flowmaster muffler (just the muffler) and hacked off silencers with 54,000 miles, 3600 lb. race weight.
Car was on normal Fiske Phantom tires, and it was around 90* with around 80% humidity, so the air sucked.

I've only been driving stick for a month, so my first run sucked. I slipped the clutch way too much and pulled a 2.6 short time and ran a 14.3 @ 105.xx
Second run I got a 2.3 60 ft. and ran a 13.7 @ 106.06. I got a couple more 13.7 runs but couldn't do better than 2.3 short times.

I let a friend (who drives a 14.3@97 GT) make a few passes, he is a great driver. On his first ever pass in the car he got a 13.23 but missed 4th and coasted thru the traps for a 101 mph. this was on a 2.11 60 ft. If he would have hit 4th it looks like it would have went into the 12s for sure. Needless to say my friend said it was very sad to get back into his car
That would be the best ET for the night.
Best trap was a 107.42.

I'm confident with better air and some practice the car will go high 12s @ 108-109 how it is. Now here come the mods!

mtx28

Very good times! Especially for being actually stock. I hit a 13.13@109 but I had an intake + K&N and LCAs (supposedly worth a few 1/10ths), and that was in 40* weather with excellent track prep.

I went back to the track since all the modding (different track, bad prep, 80* night, same tires) and could only muster a 2.3 60' time and 13.2s, but my trap was a bit higher.. a hair under 111.

LS1.com is a very good resource for info and we do occasionally have server overloads (most often 7-11pm), but it's not bad. If you use the search function you can find LOTS of info. I've had my 01 a year and have replaced the whole valvetrain, put a new clutch in (highly recommended), LCAs, headers, and have had it tuned. If you want some advice on what to mod or which mods to get, shoot me a pm here or on ls1.com to s/n Romulus.

'87FAKE-IROC-Z

Thanks,

I'm already a member at LS1.com, joined up when I began pondering buying a LS1 Fbody. It is a great site, like TGO. I'll probobly need your advice sooner or later .

camarojoe

87Fake

Are you planning on still posting here? That kind of sucks you sold your modded car, that thing was real similar to what my car used to be. Actually it doesn't suck, your new car is really awesome. Too bad the new ones look like elongated fresh water guppies. LOL. J/k. I was actually thinking about selling my car to get a six-speed fourth gen, but there's no way I'd get anything close to what I paid for it. Good luck with the almighty LS-1.

'87FAKE-IROC-Z

camarojoe,

Of course, I plan on continuing to hang out here. I consider this site kinda my home on the net, plus most of my knowledge is in 3rd gens, so I can help out more here. 3rd gens are still a love of mine and I'm sure I'll own another one someday.

It was real hard to sell the cars. The '88 has all my blood, sweat, and tears in it and was just starting to show some returns, but the '92 was actually harder to sell. Just cause the '88 could be easilly recreated in another decent RS. But the '92 was really cherry and I knew how hard it was to find, and how much harder it would be to find another and not pay out the a** for it.

I made a profit on the '92, but took it deep on the '88. Sold it for less than the engine alone was worth. But it went to a friend and member here BRIrocZ, he'll take care of it and I still get to see it, maybe drive it!:hail:

OK, stop tearing up

I love my new car. It is very fast stock , fun, tight, doesn't handle like a 3rd gen, but what does anyway. And the sky is the limit for LS1s. So far it has me impressed.

ArcticLS1

It could run anywhere from 12.9-14.0 @ 102-107 bone stock, its all really the luck of the draw. I prefer auto over manual, the autos around here usually turn up faster and more consistant times at the track. The fastest 3 LS1s i know of around around here are all automatics.