Tuned Port

Its my friends car, its the older turbo II style Rx7. It is in pretty poor condition, and i believe its all stock. But i was just wondering what these cars ran? I know I would get killed if it was a turbo. Its also an automatic, my friend told me that it would do mid to high 16's? I've ran a best of 16.3 at the track in my brothers camaro(still looking for a nice affordable corvette), on a hot sunny saturday. I have raced the camaro enough where I am used to it, i can launch getting no wheel spin ( 2.2 60fts ) and shifted the auto tranny perfectly. So do you think I could take this Rx7 down?

tpivette89

ill answer your question, since i was told the results of the race. yes you will beat that POS, and you will do it in your 110k mile Bonneville by 3-4 lengths. and to think that choade thought he could beat my Z! typical *****

Tuned Port

Yeah, I was surprised to beat him by so much. He had cold air induction, a valve breather, and straight pipes. He had one other person in the car, but I don't think that would really even help him a lot. Well that just adds to one more to the bonneville's kill list, I'd never thought I would even win a race in that car.

rx7speed

if it was a TurboII you would get raped

but they do not make a turbo with an auto unless yo are talking a thirdgen

as for a stock second gen RX-7 they should still be able to pull on you if they are in decent shape


but you put an auto behind it and well.... you might as well give him a few cars head start


the rotary is not the best car to put an auto behind and also the mazda automatic tranny SUX gnats ***

Matt86t/a

When i ran my 16.45 at E-town, I ran against a late 80's or early 90's Turbo II RX-7. It ran a 14.3!! I took him hardcore off the line, but when I bogged he caught up and passed me just before the 60 ft. I think he was like 2.56 and i was 2.63. As soon as it spooled it was gone. Never got to talk to him though. It was my third run, and I was like, "wow, i'm finally gonna win one of these races-never mind."

~Matt

Marc 85Z28

iTrader: (3)

Stop calling it a turbo II!!! Unless it's got the turbo, it ain't a turbo II. The Z should walk all over that rotary. Even a manual trans rotary would barely keep up. Rotaries are nice motors only with a turbo, and cannot perform without.

ChillPhatCat

You clearly have no idea what a rotary can do... the 13B will put out 250 Hp N/A and the 2.0L version can do 350... 2.6L can do 500 all N/A!

Don't even joke about the ratary being crap w/o a turbo... they respond to mods probably the best of any engine design.

tpivette89

not the one my brother raced

rx7speed

a rotary can be the ****


I have seen and raced a N/A first gen that had only 1.1L in the motor

he beat my *** BAD

he claimed something like 280hp I think

doesn't shock me either since I looked under the hood and he had the port job to run it

and again this is NO TURBO

hell mine if it is running right can pulled high 14's with a good launch and LOTS of luck and this is minor bolt ons that I am doing it with

Marc 85Z28

iTrader: (3)

What's the fastest NA rotary - what - a low 14 second high 13 second car? Come on! Yeah they make great power for such a little motor - but they are still just that A LITTLE MOTOR!
If you want to go fast with a rotary you need a turbo - nitrous don't work. Every fast rotary is a turbo.

ChillPhatCat - I'm a technician at a Mazda dealer and have helped build a few performance RX-7's (85 GSL-SE, 88 NA, and a 93TT), so I know rotaries. We even experimented with a NA 2.0 3 rotor and the car ran 14.3 in a 94 RX-7, however, with the single tubo setup it was another story. No good ET due to severe traction problems, but it ran 12.9@122MPH. Like I said, they ain't **** without a turbo.

ChillPhatCat

Dude... you asked for this so I'm gonna have to post it... here is the Mazda 787B Lemans car from 1991, it had a the 26B 4 rotor engine, 3 spark plugs per chamber... 700 Hp N/A Now how about you tell me that rotaries are crap w/o turbo now? The Link has the specs.

http://www.2751engineering.com/787.html

BTW they banned rotaries after this car won.

ChillPhatCat

Ok, I paraded around long enough.

Marc 85Z28

iTrader: (3)

We were talking about street cars...

That's like comparing a new Z28 to a Top Fuel Dragster. Yeah, they both have V8's

How about posting a link of the fastest 2 rotor non-turbo RX-7 you can find so I can have a good laugh.

ChillPhatCat

I'd say you got smacked pretty good there... if you want to **** and moan about it I will further my search later... Now you cannot tell me this is like comparing top fuel to an LS1... The top fuel dragster uses NITROMETHANE! Yes... that is a type of alcohol and it produces a lot more power... you're talking the difference between 325 Hp and 6000 Hp

My comparison would be closer to the difference between an 5.0L LG4 Thirdgen and the ligenfelter 9.XL Ligenfelter Viper (750+ Hp)
My comparison is simply the difference between one engine that is half the displacement and half the number of rotors... similar to the difference between a 2.5L I4 and a 5.0L V8.

Where do you draw the line between street cars and race cars?

Considering you've limited an easier to serch category of Le-mans cars... it'll take more time to get non-race car evidence... I can post the blurb about their 10A powered 24 hour racer from 1969.... 187Hp out of a 1.0L N/A rotary... not bad.

link: http://www.scuderiaciriani.com/rx7/history.html

Under the heading Mazda Cosmo & R100:
"As for performance, Mazda raced its R100 with blind ambition. Mazda was, after all, very proud of its new rotary engine, and in July 1969 the factory entered two R100s in the famous SPA-Francorchamps 24-hour, a production-type race where many of the world's manufacturers entered to compare product against opposition product. The SPA R100s ran with their Cosmo type all-aluminum 10A engines. By this stage Mazda's 10A peripheral ported engines were capable of 200+hp, but the SPA engines were held to 187hp for endurance reasons. Still the small R100s put in a big performance to finish a very respectable 5th and 6th overall behind factory 911s Porsches. For the 1970 SPA an R100 again came 5th outright."

gmgod

I wonder what it would cost to build a 400 horse rotary N/A mazda engine?

Chronos_Titan

Trying to get a whole lot of horsepower 13b rotor is not the easiest. You are not going to be able to get 800 hp like the turbo cars. Howerever like rx7speed says 280 is do able.
As for nitrous didnt you watch the fast and the furious??! A nitrous rotary won the very first race.
:hail: FF

gmgod

I have no intention to build one,just was wondering how deep of pockets one would need.

ChillPhatCat

$15-$20k ought to get you a nice race prepped 13G 2.0L engine... that is a pretty easy 400 Hp.

Marc 85Z28

iTrader: (3)

Chronos_Titan - it's not a good idea to use that movie as a technical reference MMMMkay? Nitrous in turbo apps is mainly used to spool the turbo faster, not for power gain. A 100 shot is usually worth about 40HP on a rotary - if that.


ChillPhatCat - I still stick by my opinion. I doubt even the new 250HP NA RX-9 will impress me. They will be out soon, so I'll try to grab one for a PDI. It's probably just another low 15 second turd. 9000RPM and no torque until 7000, yup, CRAP!

rx7speed

a 100 shot only being worth 40hp?
how would that be so?
I can see maybe 90 hp or so on a 100 shot but not 40.
though would I trust a wankel with nitrous? not at all

and as for the rx-8 I think they have the car around mid to low 14's not a low 15 second car. also are they not doing quite a few things to the motor if they haven't done so already that will give it more low end torque. I think I remember reading something in C&D where from the first time the drove it vs. this last time the car has a lot more low end to it then before
I admit I might be wrong on that but still the car is not that bad though I do hate the way it looks

Marc 85Z28

iTrader: (3)

Yeah, only 40HP. That was both on the 88 and the 85 I've worked on. The 88 is a 13B with a custom intake, and the 85 was a 13B, but we put on a carb kit, header, no cat and 2.5" exhaust with custom ported exhaust ports. After the carb kit and other mods the nitrous shot was still only worth an additional 45HP. Both are wet systems. It is possible we had them tuned wrong, but one being carbed and another FI - who knows? Besides, rotaries are unreliable as it is. Last thing they need is more stress on the apex seals. So we sold the system.

They guy with the 85 GSL-SE is so disappointed with his car's performance - 14.5 with the NOS, that he is currently looking into a SBC swap.

ChillPhatCat

I could see from the second you shot my first post down you were too stubborn to argue with. Where did NOS come into the equation? Who cares how it handles N20... I think you're still reeling back from the loss. The engine in the 787B may not be in a street car, but it is completely feasible. The same engine proved itself on several 24 hour races which are a lot more demanding than the typical driving any street car will see. 4800 miles I'd say in a 24 hour race is probably equal to 40k+ in typical abuse. The Hp comes from the high revving nature of the engines.

I thought about looking for a non race prepped example, but you wouldn't listen to what I had to say so I figured, forget you I don't need to waste my time. My example suffices. I have seen many conversions of second and 3rd gen Rx7's undergo the 13G transplant and I don't recall one of them making less than 350 Hp N/A.

The Rx8 is gonna be a hot car with simple mods I'm sure. Mazda is pretty smart, and being teamed up with Ford which supplies A LOT of aftermarket parts for it's cars will just add to the list of Rx8's that whip your ***.

'Nuf said.

panther

Not to be a bad guy, but my third car was a 1993 RX-7 TT. It was funny how many younger kids would want to race. I remember once some jackass in a Fiero thought he could hold his own. hehehe. After the shift into second it was over. Those cars are VERY quick. My second car was a 1991 RX-7 N/A and with a full exhaust & CAI, felt alot quicker than my first car, which was a 1984 Z-28 HO.

Once again, I'm not intending to make anyone mad. I'm on this boards because I'm looking to get into another third gen soon. It's hard to duplicate the V8 sound from a rotary.

rx7speed

and that is why my car is now at 173k miles and STILL kicking strong

and why we have a guy who runs low 14's with about 170k on his motor
or another guy who had his car hitting mid 13's with about 150k
all of them stock motors

the last two are turbo for that matter

or wait that's right forgot about the other guy in his first gen pulling about 260k miles with no motor work done to the car at all....


mmm... unreliable huh?
if anything it is how you tune it
and if you think a rotary is unreliable how much does that say for your tuning skills

and if I look at things the way you do I would have to say chevy motors suck *** and are even worse then a rotary cause the the one in my camaro started to die at about 50k miles
or my dads truck b/c it died at about 70k