Evanslooten

The problem - My engine will turn over but wont start.

It was completely out of the blue. I went through the drive through, and stopped my vehicle while I was waiting. My food came, started up fine. No noises or abnormalities.

So then I stopped at the bank next, idling for a bit - again no abnormalities - eventually stopping my car again. This time when I go to start, it briefly starts and then sputters, stalling out. This happens sometimes after it's been sitting and it's cold out, but never when it's warmed up.

So then I crank it a few times, pumping on the gas when I hear it catch. Sputters, stalls. Eventually, it just cranks - no spark.

I'm going to replace a section of the lines that are rusty towards the front of the vehicle, but I don't see any fluid spots under the front.

I'm assuming this is a fuel delivery issue? Please don't let it be a fuel pump...

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

Instead of jumping headlong into "maybe it's this maybe it's that", calm down and use logic and reason.

Yes it does sound more fuel related from what you've said but that's not exactly "data".

What's the fuel pressure?

Evanslooten

I'm not sure, I don't have a fuel pressure gauge. When I took the large line off, I got a face full of fuel that was definitely under pressure.

Didn't get any squirts when I cranked with the line to the engine disconnected, prior to removing the rusted section; still don't after replacing the rusted sections. I disconnected the top line by the engine, nothing coming out. No fluid on the ground where the new section joins.

bop11

No squirts because you have (or had) an electric fuel pump. The ECM turns on the fuel pump relay for a few seconds when you turn the key on to pressurize the system. When the engine starts, the ECM gets ignition pulses and turns on the relay. If the relay is bad, cranking the engine will build oil pressure. When the oil pressure gets high enough, a oil pressure switch bypasses the relay to turn on the fuel pump. Sounds like your pump has "bit the dust".

Evanslooten

Thanks for the information! It's crazy how it wasn't showing any signs something was wrong, then dies moments later.

I really hope it's not the pump, from what I've read replacing the pump is a major project! Is there a way I can verify for sure it's the fuel pump? Do I need to get a pressure gauge to do so?

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

Get a fuel pressure gauge.

Sitting there whining about "major project" isn't getting your car any closer to running.

Yes you need to get a fuel pressure gauge.

Get a fuel pressure gauge.

Now that you've done that BEFORE your next post, wherein you'll have the to the question: what's the fuel pressure?

bop11

His pressure is getting it moved from in front of the bank before it gets stolen. Although, in front of a bank might be providential, if it is the pump its gong to cost $200 or more.

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

All this about "bank" and "stolen" and "major project" and all the rest of that P&M'ing doesn't matter. The broken parts in the car don't care.

From his description though, sounds like it's gonna turn out to be the pump. Not much to do in that case but replace it. Nothing anybody can post on here is gonna miraculously un-wear-out the one he has now. The sooner he gets started on it, the sooner he'll be driving again.

If that means having the car towed to somewhere he can work on it, then ... it means having the car towed. Sucks maybe, but best to meet the reality head-on.

stephenscamaro

True words of wisdom +1

Evanslooten

It's already been towed someplace! Looks like I'm ahead of the game.

I received my gauge today, I'm getting nothing, big fat 0 at the rail.

I thought maybe the sections I replaced might have been bad to start with, however I was able to get it to fire up once; I had not tightened the compression fittings enough and it was leaking fuel like crazy. That should mean fuel can pass through the lines? I shut it down and tightened them up, however it went back to the same symptoms.

The line seems to pressurize consistently from my tests at the fitting. Additionally I believe I can hear the fuel pump when the engine is cranking, a kind of buzzing whirring sound. It's pretty audible from the drivers seat.

I'm wondering why would I be getting 0 pounds at the rails if the lines are pressurized? I thought maybe it could be the flexible tubing was clogged or bad, but since it started once I should have good flow throughout right?

stephenscamaro

A weak pump can still move volume, just not at a high enough pressure.

Think about a water hose. Turn it on full blast, stick you finger over the end and within a few seconds, the pressure moves your thumb off the hose.

If the pump that pushes the water is weak, then you could put your thumb over the end of the hose and nothing will come out~ move your thumb and water will continue to flow!


Same principle. Anyways, start diagnosing!

Evanslooten

Is there something that acts like the thumb in the line, before the engine? I assumed it was open, and that if it built up any pressure at least some fuel would get to the engine. Is that incorrect?


I'm not sure what the next step is, I don't understand how the line can have pressure but the fuel rail cannot. I assume that even if it isn't enough pressure for the vehicle to operate, it should read more than zero.

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

I'm gonna go out on a limb here......Don't roll your eyes when you read this.........but when you turn the key to the on, not the crank position.....do you hear the FP buzz for 2 seconds? If so, is the FP Gauge reading anything? And the second question.....is there fuel in the tank? Just asking, I've seen worse.

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

make sure the schrader fitting is tightened real good on the fitting of the fuel rail.

stephenscamaro

The fuel pressure regulator~

Evanslooten

Fuel gauge reads three quarter tank, and that sounds right. I had filled up a day or two before it died. I also had fuel coming out of the fittings when I checked.

I can't hear any buzzing when I turn the key to on, only when I crank it. I tried pumping the gas pedal and the buzzing increased.

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

If you push the schrader valve in, does fuel come out it? If your pump is pumping, and is good, SOMETHING is blocking the fuel rail. Or your Fuel Pressure gauge is not on all the way. The blockage would be AFTER the places where you replaced the lines

Evanslooten

I see! How common is it for one to go bad? Is there a way I can test the pressure before the regulator, a special fitting or something? I know my fuel pump is developing some pressure, but I can't get a reading of how much to determine if it's bad.

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

Pull the hose off of it at the plenum, If fuel is in it, the diaphram is bad, which is putting fuel into the plenum, and into your cylinders, causing the flood mode.
PS: you have to pull the plenum to get to the regulator