Hello everybody. I don't know that this the correct post ,but I'm going through a major dilema. I installed a vats bypass on 89 iroc 5.7 and now it seems the starter stays engaged, even without the key in the ignition. I disconnected the postive battery, but as soon as I touch the lead to the battery the car seems to try to turn on. Someone please help!!!!

P.S. I took out the resistor and keeps on doing same thing.

Thanks in advance.

 

Your Ign switch may be faulty and the starter circuit contacts jammed on
The starter can only get power when the key is in the START position.( unless you screwed up while installing the bypass ? )

Check at the IGN switch to see if you have power full time on the thick yellow wire going to the starter; it should only be HOT when the key in start

 

Thanks vettoz. A mechanic I know told me the same thing about ignition switch. The bypass is straight forward. Is there a possibility that I somehow crossed the wires? The started without any problems and all hell broke loose on the fourth start up.
Hopefully, I can get the car running on my own.

 

Check the switch operation

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/post...71-post19.html

 

Again thanks vettoz. Hopefully a novice like myself won't screw it up.

 

Another thought
Before you start, disconnect the purple wire from the starter solenoid and connect the battery.
If it doesn't crank over then the problem is with starter wiring from the Ign as I outlined above

If it continues to crank then the solenoid plunger is jammed in the engaged position so power would flow to the starter as soon as the batt was connected
Give the starter a whack ;it that doesn't fix it you are going to have to remove the starter and check solenoid operation

 

Vettoz, I appreciate your help. It turned out to be the starter selenoid. Now back to troubleshooting cold start and idle hunt problems.

Again, thanks brother,

 

I switched out the Starter enable relay with a new one and that solved some intermittent starting problems for me that I'd been hunting down for a long time. Starts every time using a resistor bypass.
This one is directly connected through the VATS system and even though it was not throwing a VATS light it had the VATS symptoms.

http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/se...aro&vi=1035694

 

You obviously don't understand how the system operates.

https://www.thirdgen.org/vats_passkey_system

If the relay "OPERATED" by the VATS module fails, you will get a no crank situation independent of anything the VATS is doing

If you have the resistor bypass installed , there is little value in installing / replacing / wasting $$$ on a starter relay because with the bypass the relay is not performing any useful function.
Bypass it completely and call it a over;one less item to fail and spoil your day.

 

Bypass vats completely..sounds great. If I go that route, I don't have to mess around with resistors etc? Where can I get one and how much.

Thanks

 

As per the VATS link I posted , VATS has two parts.
It disables the starter through the starter enable relay and cuts off the injectors ( no fuel ).

The resistor bypass only "fools" the VATS module into "thinking " the correct key is in the Ign but by installing the resistor bypass permanently you have disabled any security features VATS gave.

Installing the resistors and deleting the enable relay gives good success for most as a VATS disable.
The VATS module itself seldom gives problems; most are key reading or starter enable relay related.

If however ,you want to remove VATS completely you must
either get VATS disabled in the tune ( chip )
or install a device
http://www.bakerelectronix.com/products_vats/

that generates the fuel enable signal required by the ECM so it will pulse the injectors
In either case the starter relay has to be deleted.

 

Maybe I should have made myself clear on the reason I installed a new starter enable relay. First it plays a major role in the VATS system and was 23 years old and when I removed it and shook it, it had a very very tiny rattle so I replaced it. It "fixed the intermittent starting problem totally. It really did not occur to me to bypass it. I have worked with relays with in my new fan circuits so I really was more comfortable just replacing it.

I very much agree with vetteoz and removing/disabling the VATS system totally is the way to go and that would include bypassing the starter relay.In the photo below the relay has been bypassed but I was under the impression these smaller low amp wires would also need to be jumped in order to complete a circuit the VATS module would need to read or at least make it to ground. I'm not trying to complicate things but would like to know.

 

The idle hunting has been repaired, the gasket was missing from the iac , duh. As for the hard starting, the iroc starts a bit better. I will have fuel pump replaced in the near future, I will keep you guys posted.

 

yhe ' low amp ' wires from the module only operate the relay ; there is no feedback to say if the relay worked or not
Joining the 2 starter wires at the relay together just make it like a old skool car without VATS

Ditto for the fuel enable signal out of the module, the module has no way of knowing if the ECM received it.

It actual works the other way around ; from the ECM ,not to it

"To signal the ECM that a correct key resistance is sensed, the VATS module uses an NPN output
transistor to pull down (ground) the 5 VDC reference voltage presented by the ECM on terminal B6.
The reference signal must be alternately grounded and allowed to be pulled up by the ECM internal
resistor 30 times per second (30 Hz) and at a 50% duty cycle.
This method was selected to prevent the simple powering or grounding of an ECM input to enable the fuel injectors."

 

Well the fuel pump and fuel filter were replaced, car started great. Man was I happy. For south Texas the weather was cool in the low 60's. No cold hard starts what so ever until the weather got warmer in the afternoon. Weather in the mornings is still kinda cool so car starts right up, but after I get off work the camaro won't start until third try ( warm weather).
What could be the problem?


Thanks in advance

 

Well I thought the stalling was weather related, its not. Sometimes the iroc starts and continues to run (cold engine). Other times starts and stalls (cold engine). I'm back to square one, she was doing great for a couple days. I need help!

 

Start a new thread .
That has nothing to do with the starter problem you had here

 

My bad, thanks for everything appreciatte.