sparkplug619

I am currently budgeting a 350 swap and have a few simple problems making it hard to figure out which route I want to take.

Route A:

I want to start by purchasing a machined bare block from summit or PAW, purchase a rebuild kit and rotating assembly kit and have some fun.

I have space issues so I want to get rid of the 305 in my camaro before I start my build

Route B:

I Want to purchase a used 350, take it apart and get it rebuilt.


I have never had a block machined so i wouldn't know how much it would cost, I dont have that much space so taking apart a whole 350 for a rebuild would be kind of rough. This kind of leans me toward buying a bare block.

But purchasing the bare block and starting from there means I would have ALOT of parts to source out in order to complete the engine.

The reason I am having space issues is because the place where I am working on my car isn't my place and if the owner of the place get frustrated with any type of mess, it could get me evicted so I want to keep the car parts to a minimum. I want to sell my old 305 to help keep the car parts to a minimum.


If anybody has any suggestions please let me know.

Atilla the Fun

You can't build the 350 in the car. You can build it in your kitchen, then use a hand truck to roll it out once the short block is assembled enough to put it in the car. You're going to make a mess pulling the 305, no matter how careful you are.
You could have a local shop pull the 305, then tow the car to where you planned to park it during this.
Paying for a bare, machined block, plus shipping, is definitely going to cost a lot more than going to a local machine shop.
And why not just buy a crate engine? You can get a great one for $2,200. You're gonna spend more than that for the same stuff if you go with your option 1.
And what results are you hoping for, anyway? Just feel stronger, or a specific HP number, or out-accellerating your buddy's Mustang?
I remember how it felt when I wanted to build my first engine. I understand the desire. But in your situation, a crate engine is looking best.

sparkplug619

I wasnt planning on building it in the car...I thought about keeping the block at my house and leaving the 305 in the car last night and I am going to do this.

I ruled out getting a crate motor because I want to do this build on a check to check basis. 1st check = get a 350. 2nd check = machine shop work 3rd check = rebuild kit 4th check = rotating assembly kit, 5th check = small components like starter, distributor, water pump etc. I cant put together 2000-5000 for a crate motor.


I have pulled a couple engines before but never built one from the ground up so i know how messy it gets.

From what Ive read, machine work is 1000-3000, but a bare block, already machined is $400+150 shipping from PAW.

I want this car to be a semi daily driver, street car with strip potential.

I dont really know how much machine work costs, but if i can get a block and have it machined for $600 I would go for it, but why spend alot machining a block when i can get one already machined for cheaper

sparkplug619

great news. I just came across an extremely killer deal. A 1994 350 engine for $350... I really cant pass this offer up so Im picking it up tomorrow. The only problem is Ill have to find a place to store this engine until I finish swapping parts from my 305 over and get rid of whats left.

it'll come with most parts but its not 100% complete so ill be parting from my 305 and the junkyard for awhile. I'm also going to need a new ecm because I just realized the one I have isnt even for my car and it explains so many problems I'm having with my car

Atilla the Fun

Sorry, but that is NOT a good deal. You can get the same from Pick-N-Pull for a third that price. Plus at pick n pull you have the advantage of being able to swap those swirl-port heads for some 305 heads before checking out.

kd5icr

iTrader: (2)

What I am going to do is buy a rebuilt engine from a local engine builder. A complete rebuilt 350 long block pre set and spin tested for oil pressure and compression. ready to drop in will set me back just under 800 dollars. Why not go that route? Then if you feel the need you can add your own cam kit, intake or what ever else you want to ad to it.

sparkplug619

over here in san diego it cost about the same for a long block plus the labor of searching and pulling the engine at the junk yard. 350 for the complete engine seems like a good deal to me

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Having lived in San Diego (albeit several years ago now), I'd have to agree that $350 isn't too bad of a deal. But, like said, the heads are likely swirlports.

You'll have to keep it TBI to get through smog.

sparkplug619

I dont mind tbi. So if I were to start upgrading or anything, the heads would be one of the weakest components? I barely learning about gm performance.


I found out the engine is an lo5 from a suburban. I read that the lo5's are flat tappet and confirmed the heads suck

chas0218

What are the casting numbers on the yukon heads and your heads on the 305?

If the the heads on the yukon are junk then you can throw your 305 heads on for the time being. Being a yukon they will most likely be huge combustion chamber smog heads but you never know.

So checklist for you until you get too far.
1-Check all casting numbers on heads and block to see what you have
2-Do a little research on your heads and read up about gm engines.

Here is a couple links to some books:
http://www.amazon.com/Engine-Bluepri...1188598&sr=1-3
http://www.amazon.com/Small-Block-Ch...1188699&sr=1-8

The 2nd book is good for all around info on chevy systems (fuel, intake, cam, heads, ect...)

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

The only differences between the 305 (LO3) and 350 (LO5) heads are the intake valves and chambers are bigger on the LO5 heads.

You can look for some 083 casting L98 heads, but unless you plan on giving the 350 a lot more spunk (cam, intake, TBI, etc.), the stock LO5 heads will be fine.

sparkplug619

I decided to hold out on an engine for now so i can try to locate something better. If I get this engine ill be on too tight of a budget between paychecks.

Pick your part here in san diego has 50% off once every month or so. Im going to work on fixing/upgrading my suspension since it has the most problems and later on find a 350

sparkplug619

ok, I was just offered 200 and a complete 350 with new heads for my complete 305. The engine has a compression problem on the passenger side though. I figured the 200 he is giving me could pay for the parts to solve the problem.. I have to talk with him more to see exactly what the problem is. He told me when they put the new heads on it, they had too much compression for the valvetrain or something like that.


yay or nay?

kd5icr

iTrader: (2)

Be careful. The engine that came in the car I got had the same problem, only on numer 1. It turned out it was a busted piston. Due to detonation. It 305 heads on a 350 engine. While you can get away with this on a rebuild I found out by the head casting numbers that they were 58 cc heads add that to a 30 over bore and we are talking some high cylynder pressures, 180 psi. that came out to almost 11 to 1 CR on low grade pump gas. So you had better look it over BIG TIME I didnt and now I have to stab another engine in it. Learn from my mistake, PLEASE.

Atilla the Fun

180 is fine on mid grade unleaded. Premium is good for 200 psi cranking compression.

sparkplug619

Well we agreed on trading tbi for carb since I have to smog and his car doesnt, so I'll tell him to let me pull the carb off and take a look before I make my decision.

The guy didnt know english but the guys son and my neighbor were translating for me. I think the guy was saying it was making a ticking noise.


As a matter of fact while I was writing this post, I just called my neighbor and the guy was telling him the engine has bad compression because of a rod, which was also making the noise. When the guys son was translating, he was telling me that there is only a problem with a valve.

In a nutshell, The guy's son was lying to me to try to get me to buy his engine. The guy said the engine had rod knock but the son translated to me that it only had a valve problem.

Now I'm still going to check out the engine because sometimes my neighbor likes to twist words and add on to the truth to make things worse then they are.

I know the difference between rod knock, spun bearings, but never heard the sound of bad valves

sparkplug619

I found a set of vortecs that come with valves and rockers but needs lifters. If the valvetrain IS the damaged area, would the vortec valves and rockers and a set of new lifters contribute to solving the problem?

the heads are only 100 bucks

sparkplug619

even better. if the engine has a valvetrain problem like he claims, ill wait on the heads and order this http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-K12-238-2/.

Ill be fixing the valvetrain issue AND upgrading at the same time.

Im pretty sure the engine is non roller so this kit should be compatible.

If anyone has a better idea please let me know

sparkplug619

If I were to buy a 350 from a suburban with the lame swirlies, would a set of vortec's be direct bolt on heads?

I found another guy with a 350 tbi from a 93 suburban. Im pretty sure they have the swirl ports so I also found a guy selling his 350 vortecs. I'm going to try to talk the guy down to 150-200 and pick up the vortecs for another 100.

Atilla the Fun

That's a good plan. You can just bolt the Vortecs in place of the swirlies.

sparkplug619

your great atilla, if you look through this thread you'll notice you answered every single one of my noobish questions

sparkplug619

ok so I talked the guy from 300 to 190, I just kept feeding him all the info about the heads and he finally broke at 190.

I have to hope the other guy still has the vortec heads by saturday because I I dont have anymore money.

Grumbles

You need to be careful. You are talking about investing in a motor that has a known problem. If he has a bent rod or cracked piston that can set you back hundreds getting a new set, press-fitting the rods and bore/honing the block.

Do NOT hurry into this. Take it from someone who has, you will be *** deep in debt in no time if you don't take it slow and cautious. The likelihood of it being your cam and lifters is almost none. You may have a collapsed lifter but if he's telling you it has a knocking rod that has absolutely NOTHING to do with the valve train, and your lifters/cam will NOT effect compression.

If you buy the Vortec heads, you will need a new manifold as well, the best carbed version will run you about 250, the cheapest about 140.

Just be careful b ud, I'd hate to hear about you gettin' screwed and it sounds like the guy you're talking to is really shady.

Atilla the Fun

I'd've started with the heads, they're harder to come by, fewer were produced, and they're in high demand because they are so good.

sparkplug619

I understand what you mean. I wasnt going to jump right into that motor, I already explained that there might have been something shady going on. I changed my mind on buying that motor. If you read down a little you can see that I am talking about buying a different engine from a 93 suburban.

Grumbles

If your 305 runs I'd also start with the heads as atilla suggests. Gives you time to do some port & polish and also get them machined to your preference.

But 190 for a motor isn't too shabby a deal.

EDIT: If the Vortec heads are only 100 bucks you need to ****** those up fast!

sparkplug619

well $100 is good but it may need a rebuild. In the posting the guy said the motor blew up but the heads are still in good condition.

Then he claims "all parts are in usable condition except for the lifters." I would jump on the heads first but I already sold my 305 and Im in a bigger hurry getting my car running again then getting my car upgraded so I jumped on the engine first.