lakeffect2

I was advised to post up here at Thirdgen to get some programming help for my situation, a big cam in a 350tpi swap from 350tbi. details: 1993 Caprice Wagon, 4L65 with 2200 stall 5.7L 1992 Speed density system with "730ECM", AFR 195 heads, Comp Cams XFI 230/236@0.050 with 32 lb/hr Accel injectors. 1.6 roller rockers SLP runners.


So the cam is huge, and with 32lb/hr injectors I'm getting nothing but fuel fouled plugs. (yes I know I should cut back on the cam duration and injectors ) Although the chip was custom programmed by a common vendor,(unnamed intentionally) it seems obvious he didn't come anywhere near close to getting right after two burns. After cleaning the plugs from each fouling, the motor usually will die in less than one minute, degrading as each plug fouls again.

This cam/injector combo was headed to a 406 but that has been sidetracked for another year at least, and I stuffed into into the 350 for now (yes, it was stupid. and overkill) I'd hope to learn some thing from the 350 project to apply to the 400.... other that "this isn't working" So I was hoping that SOMEBODY here must have found success chip burn with a similar combination, and has had a good ".bin file" that proved useful. If I knew who the programmer/burner was, it would be easier to get a handle on the monster I've created. It would help me get it fired up and non-fouling. But what burner might that be? I'd even considered "the Prominator" route but still need a .bin file that close enough just to get running.


So far, I have been frustrated with a 5100 lb paperweight inthe driveway for over a year now. I would be most appreciative as to posting up sources for SUCCESSFUL similar burns. You may post up here or directly to my Email at lakeffect@gmail.com Thanks Guys, Your insight and advice pro or con will be greatly apprciated. Dave Buchholz, Rochester NY

michal_larson

man dude, don't cut back on the camshaft. who told you to run 32 lbs injectors? #24's at the most. those high lbs injectors will degrade your plugs at idle cause....i dunno, its a fact. the cam you chose is close to what i may get in the future. i am currently running a larger cam than that with no idle problems, if you get a programmer that will help you tremendously or you might try setting your minimum idle air just under your hot idle (10 steps on the IAC). that camshaft NEEDS IDLE TIMING. mine idles perfect at 28-30 degrees and NO fouling. rawk on dude!
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dude, you may try the ZZ4 bin stock, and just add to the idle timing so that it idles at around 28 degrees, the vette bin IS agressive and will work well with your combination.

lakeffect2

So if I suck up the damage to my ego (and wallet) and swap out the 32 pounders for 24's or 26's, then I should have a better shot at making the 230/236 work? Any more feedback?

The 32 pounders came from calculating what I'd need to get 500 hp for when I was going to rebuild the 400. Bought the parts earlybut didn't start the rebuild on the 400 and chucked them into the 350. Not the greatest idea, which is why I'm here for help to cut my loses.

michal_larson

actually look at that zz4 bin before you do anything. can you edit a bin file and burn it to a chip?
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if you can, you can set the injector size with winbin or tunerpro, just put 32 where the 24 is

it apears that the zz4 idles at 20 degrees

michal_larson

what bin file are you using now? can you post it?

michal_larson

man what happened? ya left. i was on a roll.

lakeffect2

Still here... other tasks at hand.

I don't have a way currently to read what I got until my daughter, who I thought loved me, but apparently not enough, allows me to hook up her laptop with Tunerpro RT on it to upload it.

That's part of why I need to contact a programmer/burner with known success with a similar burn. I'll spend the money to save the time and hasssle. If it's improper to name or suggest a specific person/firm here on the forum, I'll take a direct Email at: lakeffect@gmail.com to allow the info to be passed on. Thanks again, Dave Buchholz

lakeffect2

I just realized that you already a ZZ4 bin in your ealier post. (it pays to read the fine print) I also dug around on the Tunerpro site and found one there as well.

Oddly,when I looked at the Tunerpro version of spark advance and VE tables and graphs, I couldn't figure out why there were so many irratic spikes found in them. It didn'tseem right. I looked at the one you posted and notice the smoothness to both tables and correspoding graphs.

MAN, what a difference.


So in theory, IIIIFFFF I bought a prominator and pin adapter for the "730ECM" that I' using, I could load this up into the Prominator and see what happens.

Is this the burn you are running now?

And if so, is it on 24 Lb/'hr injectors?

Where in Tunerpro RT is the Injector size keyed in? Which constant, flag or table? I didn't find it.

michal_larson

id say that bin would be close the way it is, as for injector size, tunerpro has a setting for fuel injector size, so just change your setting to 32 and it should run like the 24's would. the setting there is "Injector Flow Rate (lbs/hr) and the stock bin is set for 24.13 lbs/hr. actually i am not because im runing a 1227747 ecu wich is really crappy lol. you should try MY xdf file it has that setting for fuel injectors, and yes, if you get a chip burner and you can change the parameters, the 32 lbs injectors would work in just about any engine combo. personally i like the Pocket Programmer 2, i dunno, its simple and easy to use, not sure about any others though.listen, 30zz4 bin you can try and will get you started, just compare it to the stock 730zz4 bin and see what ive done the 30zz4 is already for the 32 lbs injectors, definitly help the plug fouling. you may wannaadjust your throttle blades open a little more.

lakeffect2

Michal< ireceived your PM. Thanks.

I was playing with the original ZZ4 file you sent and worked on the fuel and spark curves to smooth them out more. It would be interesting for you to upload it to see if you can tell the differnce. I simply was going under the working assumption that engine management prefers smooth curves rather than sharp lines. Per your instruction, I found the injector size table in TunerproRT and changed to to 30.06 lb/hr for you.

I'm trying to attach it but I'm new to this particular forum's quirks. I keep getting an "invaild file" popup. Maybe I can send it directly via PM. Apparently I'm unfamiliar with transforming it into a ZIP file for transmission.

lakeffect2

Michal. I can't seem to private mail you from this forum. Contact me direct at: lakeffect@gmail.com. Thank you for your support. Got your email of 0//511/06. Can' t respond back other than here.


Three things.

One had a snall set back. Fire under hood resulting from ACCEL fuel pressure guage leaking around the 90* bend. Blew fuel and ignited. Luckily damage limited to Silicone vacuum lines and convoluted tubing protecting the harness. GOT REAL LUCKY.

Secondly, niether of the two original memcal chips from TBIchips were close enough to get me going without instant plug fouling. WAY too Rich. I have Alvin at PCMforless burning a new chip. No offense to TBIchips , but two chips later, I can't even get it started without fouling out. Alvin seems to think after 3000 chips xperiance, that he can get darn close the first time out. I tend to beleive him. IF NOT, then there's the following.....


Thirdly, I've been consulting with MR.Bill and now have a prominator ordered as of the past few days. (hope to be included on the group purchase just announced today.. how 'bout it Bill?) and Mangus has been coahing me with the TunerproRT set up, to correlate with MR Bill's hardware. Between the three .bin files, yours, my "smoothed" mods to yours, and Alvin's burn I should get SOMETHING close enough to get started. I'll still have five open slots to play with after to hone in on things afterward.

Sorry to have to resort to using this forum to respond to you. Can't seem to figure out howe to attach a .bin file here either. (newbie... whadya expect!)