The Greek

I have searched the posts on this subject and I definetly see the benefits on switching over to synthetics. The one thing that still remains unclear to me is do I need to flush the engine. I didn't really come across anything that stated that flushing the engine was necessary. If anything, I read that it wasn't necessay to flush the engine. The car has 70,000 miles on it and will it be beneficial to flush it or will it be a waste that could potentially hurt me.

I am at college and can't do this myself so I need to take it to a shop. Are they going to charge a bunch of money to flush out the engine? or should I just get a normal oil change and just have Mobile 1 10w30 put in and forget about the engine flush?

What about synthetic transmission and differential fluid? What exactly needs to happen when I want to switch to synthetics in those areas?

Thanks for the help
Jason

ede

no need to flush the engine when you make the switch to synthetic oil

89RsPower!

synthetics are pretty damn good at leaking past seals when you switch from regular petrolium based oils.. specially after some miles

Vader

That "damn college" will eventually provide more time AND money. Patience, Grasshopper...

As for the oil change, you'll pay dearly for synthetic at most oil change places. Get you own at your nearest Wal-Mart. They frequently have Mobil 1 in your favorite grade in five-quart jugs for as little as $15.99. That's as cheap as you'll ever find it. I usually walk out with a cartfull when they have it.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

You paint with too broad of brush.

SOME synthetics are pretty damn good at leaking past seals. The most commonly available on-the-shelf synthetic has that characteristic, in fact.

The "1st in synthetics" does not, however. So, don't go condemning the entire apple barrel.

15 years ago, petroleum-based multi-viscosity oils were pretty bad about deposits in the engine, even with regular changes. API has cracked down on that with recent requirements (higher than SF), so it isn't as much of a problem as it used to be.

However, if maintenance has been less than nominal, deposits can still be an issue. There are a couple of ways to address this:

1) The "Jiffy Flush" - basically adding a solvent to the crankcase and running the engine for a couple of minutes prior to draining. Minimal effect.

2) Some sort of "machine flush" - typically an expensive machine they're trying to justify. For trannies, somewhat effective (but there are cheaper methods). Mostly, not worth what they charge you.

3) Adding part synthetic for a few changes to clean the engine out - effective, but takes more time before the full charge synthetic is used. What you do is drain the oil, change filter, add petroleum less one quart to full, the last quart is synthetic. Next change, it's two quarts synthetic, etc., until the entire fill is synthetic. This isn't a bad way to go, but the quick-lube places may give you funny looks if you ask them to do it.

4) Real crankcase flush. Available from AMSOIL (www.amsoil.com). Add a pint to crankcase at oil change time, run at idle (do not drive the car) for 30 minutes. Drain, change filter, fill with synthetic. Quickest, most effective product I've seen. More than a simple solvent, BTW.

5) Forget it and just put in full synthetic and new filter at next oil change. Only risk is that synthetics typically are good at loosening any deposits left by the previous petroleum lubes, so your oil will get dirty quicker and may require sooner-than-normal oil/filter change.

The AMSOIL website above has a good set of instructions for do-it-yourself auto tranny flush. Typically no issue for manual tranny or diff switch-over.

rx7speed

made the motor flush before, just want to say becarefull of where you put that stuff..... big no no in the eyes or on skin

kerosene with lots of detergents makes for one burning feeling

MdFormula350

i would just switch the different oil in on the next oil change.

grumpygreaseape

yikes-preface with its only my opinion-dont ever ever "flush" the internals of an engine. let the debris sit exactly where it is. why in the world would you want to somehow work it all loose, suspend it, again, in the oil whos job is to prevent metal to metal contact, amongst a few other jobs, whiz it thru your oiling system where it did its damage once already, or by luck it did not provide any wear on any surface at all, but you want to make sure it will this time, by once again cycling it thru. im not getting it, where is the bennie there? just make the switch to synthetic and see what develops. the fact of the matter is that all synthetic oil is composed of smaller molecules, the building blocks of what makes it superior, than conventional oil. full synthetic oil will have a tendancy to leak past any type of seal or gasket that is borderline at its job holding in the conventional stuff. and if you are running any kind of variable duration lifter, crane, rhodes, etc synthetics are a nono. heres another tidbit that i have for what its worth: DELVAC 1 the only place left in the world of engine oil where you will find each and every component that is being removed from automotive grade oil in the name of emissions(cat. converter longevity)still present in the glorious quantities that was once the standard for auto grade oil. its a diesel oil and this is a no sh-tter the stuff is so bad *** that, i know you will think im lying-the stuff lives in some truckers crankcase for almost 100k miles just filter changes. for real. check it out. go to the mobil website. talk to a rep from a wholesale house-their job is to sell oil and even they will say how good the stuff is, they arent selling much oil if its never getting changed. you wont find this on pep boys shelves-oil wholesaler who sells mobil and maybe shell.

slow305

iTrader: (2)

70,000 miles? It's just a pup! Switching to synthetic shouldn't be a problem. I started running 5W30 Mobil 1 synthetic when I bought my Sentra SE-R last year before I turned it into a racecar -- 160K+ miles -- and didn't have any problems.

If you're in Richmond and looking for a car-friendly shop to do your oil change, check out Rosen Autosport. I don't know the exact address, but it's just off I95 near the baseball stadium. Don't let the r!ce on the website fool you -- they're just your average car geeks.

Edit: Forgot that the previous owner of my Formula started running Mobil 1 synthetic when he dropped in the current (70K-mile) LB9.

GilmourD

I'm going to be doing the same switch soon. What I was wondering, how long is synthetic (Mobil 1) supposed to last between changes? I hear varying reports from regular changes to change it once a year. Can somebody clear up the for me?

Danno

Basically there are 2 categories of driving manufacturers and oil companies along with API recognize. Most all driving today is considered to be what is referred to as "severe service". That is stop and go type as opposed to "normal" which probably only happens out in the plains. That places the "dino" oil at 3k miles, synthetic at roughly 7k. Some companies place a time interval also on oil changes. Usually it's 6 months. The idea behind that is to help prevent acidic buildup in the engine and pan. It's really a matter of opinion but I generally follow the recommendations of the oil company. My Z gets about 2-3k/yr and I change it once at inspection. Amsoil claims 25k or 1 yr for passenger cars. As far as leaking the switch to any synthetic poses the possibility of weeping from the seals. Dino or parrafin based oil because it is more likely to produce sludge will plug up leaks. As the detergent/dispersant in the synthetic washes away residue it is not uncommon for the various seals to ooze for a period of time. However as the parrafin is washed away the swell agent in the syn will start to act upon the seals and usually after the second or third change the problem goes away. Obviously large leaks need to be fixed. Mobil1 is my choice and I have had good results with it. Amsoil, as 5.7 so religiously points out is also a fine oil but my feeling is that it is too pricey. You do reach a point of diminishing return. Regular service with Mobil1 should prove every bit as good anything else out there. It is also the factory fill for the vettes as well as many other manufacturers. Thats good enough for me.

tjnapster

I switched to Syn. and my bird eats now eats more oil

Vader

Hey, Grump! Where you been hiding?

Yes, Delvac is STILL available. My supplier has it both in regular old mineral oil and in a synthetic Delvac (about $19 for a gallon bottle). It is very good engine lubrication. And, yes, some truckers use it religiously and a LOT of farmers drop it into their "cheap" implements. You know, those nearly $quarter-million turbodiesel 9700 combines and such - not in anything "good". (Damn, a new threshing cylinder and feedhouse conveyor costs more than my friggin' ThirdGen did new.) Mobil will probably make Delvac until there are no more trucks left in the world.

grumpygreaseape

hi vader, im not certain. i remember something about large breasts and staying up too late all the time. i dunno its all been a blur. i think im ok now though. whatup with you?

Vader

Well, certainly nothing nearly that interesting...

grumpygreaseape

hey vader-one more thing too, i adopted me another wiemaraner dog. she is from a wiemie rescue place and she is a good dog. im being a bad dog and straying off topic. here: DELVAC 1 :lala:

zroc

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Vader
[B]Hey, Grump! Where you been hiding?

I was wondering the same... glad to hear about the new pup... shoot me an e-mail some time...

anyway... happy holidays to yall...

back to topic...

doing a flush whether it be machine or chemical is iffy... roll the dice...

I have found leaks with synthetics before... LOL...

good note on the bleed lifters...

the difference in the vicosities was mentioned before... about the addatives to lengthen the strands of the molocules... something like that... it was a good read...

the range of temp I live in varies a lot... I still run 10w30 year round but use a block heater when the temp get very low...

why is it Amsoil doesn't like to compare thier stuff with mobil one??? never have seen a test between the two... testimonys from the amsoil dudes always make me wonder...

amsoil is not a readily available product either... you gotta have contacts and all... the revenue for development must suck...

zroc

Raiden

If you make the change, make sure you have no leaks! It is very common to leak when making the change from regular oil to syn.

Amsiol is the best but someitimes hard to get.

grumpygreaseape

not to start it up but amsoil is far from the best. its good but...there isnt a better oil out there than that old(new) delvac 1 just take a gander over at the mobil site gotta say this i know. it still is laden with the all the anti wear goodies that are being systematically removed from the automotive grade stuff due to ever increasing epa rules concerning not only the actual tailpipe emissions but now with obd 2 the actual longevity of all components that make up a vehicles emissions control system and in this case its the cats, and being able to be sure that the actually very fragile conversion that goes on in a properly functioning cat can be maintained at a level approaching 100% for 100k miles. think about that. like 97% operating efficiency must be maintained for that long. and what they are designing into the software to vary the levels of several gasses mainly o2 content contained within the exhaust gas stream prior to the cats is an amazing thing. what those up and downstream o2 sensors have to continually prove out to the ecm is also a test that is run on them nearly every start up where the ecm's strategy is to provide a fuel mix that needs to translate thru the pair of o2 sensors to just what the ecm is programmed to accept as a prove out of functionality. or it will pending code you. and thats a fact. ill bet you wont find a drop of amsoil in one of the mega buck giant lawnmower farm implements- nice word-implements out there in vaders north fourty.

Vader

Grump,

Good to hear you found another friend. I'll tell my buddy - he thinks every dog should adopt a human.

Blk71Z

yeah if we (my family are part owners of a trucking company here in salt lake) had to change the oil in our deisels every 3,000 miles we would be screwed. we can do taht in a week. most our drivers drive 17 hours a day at 75 mph (you do the math) that Delvac is the only stuff we use (kenworth t-800's w/ detroit 540's) and we havent ever had a problem before.

Raiden

I've never heard of Delvac? Where can i find it??

grumpygreaseape

in the harleys that the california highway patrol busts ba((s on. :nono: a wholesale petroleum distributor, mobil and or shell would have to be on their line card though. pretty sure that mobil bought shell, not the other way around. :nono: :rockon: :nono:

zroc

correct me if I'm wrong... I think it was; exxon bought mobil... then they bought shell... also think they bought penz/quaker... somthing like that...

zroc