last_

hey, i have the ridetech 2-1/4" drop spindles and will be dropping the rear the same .... slighter larger wheel diameter in rear for good stance. i also have the spohn k member kit which i will be shipping back in to replace with the coil over k member kit.

my question is basically, how low is to low for most everyday driving on a thirdgen... excluding the front air damn which has been deleted. i am concerned that i have been to aggressive and dfropped her to low

also, i went with the 325lb spring rate. is this a good choice for a performance oriented street cruiser?? oh yes, it will be a 6liter lq4 build to give you some idea of the weight that will be up front.

thanks in advance for your help.

//<86TA>\\

iTrader: (15)

i had the 325 lb springs on my front coil setup, it worked fine.

as for height, 2.25" of drop is IMO a horrible idea for a street driven car, unless you live somewhere that is totally flat.

Air dam is needed for airflow to the radiator when at speed. Unless you have made provisions some other way, you will have overheating issues.

drknow90rs_ss@y

iTrader: (3)

I went with a 2-inch drop (Eibach pro-kit) on my 86 IROC and think this is too low for a street driven car. I live in the phoenix area ad we have speedbumps in this town. also potholes and railroad tracks.

The bright side? The bottom of my y-pipe will never rust, due to the fact that it is continually polished by every speedbump and driveway entrance! LOL.

The lq4 is an iron headed truck block. Weighs about 35lbs less than an L98. 87lbs less if you use aluminum heads.

last_

I have the l92 heads. Fast intake. Spohn k member.

So even when running a 19 inch wheel or larger with semi low pro
to actual low pro tires the car would still sit to low?

As for the air dam I will be doing a minor redesign for more than adequate
air flow.

//<86TA>\\

iTrader: (15)

the wheel diameter has nothing to do with the ride height.

It doesnt matter how you lower the car, springs, spindles, ect. Ground clearance will still suck at 2.25" of drop, less of course you car is sitting really really high now.

last_

so let me get this right, wheel diameter has nothing to do with ride height? really?

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

Wheel diameter, no. Tire diameter? Yes.

Are your tires a bigger overall diameter than the stock tires, or are they bigger/taller?

And yes...IMHO, 2.25" is too far for a DD car, but that depends on what the driver of that car is willing to compromise to get that much drop.

You say 2.25", but that really says nothing about its ride, since we don't know where it started from. What is your ride height like:

//<86TA>\\

iTrader: (15)

well you said this

when you buy tires you dont order them as "low pro" or "semi low pro" you order them by size. So saying low pro or semi ect means nothing. What matters is the overall diameter. Sounds to me like you though the wheel size had something to do with ground clearance, reguardelss of what tire you had.

With a 19" or larger wheel, there isnt going to be much of a sidewall at all to begin with, even at a stock diameter of 25.7". If you can find a tire thats less than that, with even less side wall height, the car will still sit lower, and the body will also be lower. Also a thing to consider, with the smaller side wall, you will have a rougher ride, and run the risk of damaging/destroying the wheels if you hit a pothole, not a really issue with a show car, more of an issue with a DD

But again, like i said before, this all really depends on whereyou car is now. Also, i have never seen ridetech drop spindles, or heard of them. Do you mean springs?

Most of the time, the lowest drop people use is 2", done with innatrax springs, they are the lowest drop i know of. And most people feel the car sits way to low afterwards and the ride quality sucks. my 92 still sits are a stock ride height, and i still have to be very careful on steep driveways and curb entrances because the nose and air dam still hit the ground occasionally. Thats why i was trying to persuade you from using a 2.25 drop on a street car.

I you want to be able to sit the car on the ground, then drive it later, maybe look into an air ride set or something similar. Thats the only way you will be able run a car that low when you need it, and still keep the car practical for DD usage without destroying the front end and bottoming out on everything.

last_

sorry doing this on an iPod right now so formatting may be a bid funky.
I haven't dialed in the rim tire size yet and as far as I understand it both of those do influence ride height. As for the ridetech drop spindles I found those in the lowering 101 sticky thread. They are a great product and yes they are actually spindles and not springs. Also, drop spindles are far better than drop springs seeing as they keep the suspension in a square nuetral position.

I have also looked at the ridetech kit but due to cost I ended up going the route of a traditional suspension. If it sits to low I may end up doin the ridetech kit down the road.

I will just have to experiment on my own.

dust3r

iTrader: (1)

I've never heard of Ridetech, are you talking about Belltech? Do you have a pair of these drop spindles already? They are pretty difficult to find these days because they have been discontinued for a while. Racecraft makes drop spindles, but they aren't cheap. I have had both, and I personally think the drop is too much for a daily driver unless you remove the fender liners and roll the fender lips. Without removing the liners my tires would rub and I was smelling burnt plastic/rubber the entire drive. I am still using the Racecraft spindles along with weight jacks and 9.5" springs to raise the front up to the same height Stephen's GTA is at.

DBLTKE

iTrader: (1)

IMO there is no such thing as too low. My camaro has about 2.25" to the y-pipe and I don't have any problems whatsoever driving around. No rubbing and no scraping. You just have to change your driving style. Hell, my DD is a '92 GTI and measures about 1.25" off the pavement to the oil pan and a little higher than that to the front lip.

carkook

My car is lowered almost 3" all the way around, I daily drive the thing. The air dam scrapes going down the road constantly, but who cares, as long as the lip isnt scraping. My front is just about touching the bump stomps and the rear is about 1/4" away from the bump stomp.

Iroc-Z28Man

Like DBLTKE says just have to alteryear driving style. I've had some low DDs and its really down to driving carefully and avoid pot holes and speed bump and poorly maintained roads. IDK what your local roads are like but for the most part i can drive my cars anywhere as long as i am aware of any possible obstacles.

Super low cars are awesome, i say go as low as you can. these cars look sweet slammed. Good luck!

carkook

The lower these cars are, it seems like the better they grip AND the better they look. Drop Spindles are the best way to go, but my car still handles great even if my front/rear control arms are at horrable angles. Still no bump steer.

last_

Thanks for the positive feedback and help full insight. should actually be able to start work on the car soon versus just buying parts for it so maybe i will be able to post some pics soon.

87350IROC

iTrader: (2)

Are you kidding me? That car must ride and handle like crap.

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

This is my 87 w/ sportlines and not even all the weight on it (missing body panels, hood, rear glass etc...) my 82 trans am is even lower and it's almost riding on the bump stops.





I wouldn't go lower than this

My 88 has the same springs and it scrapes on every speed bumps, even with the cat cons and the SFCs

last_

do you have any pics farther off... that show the stance of the car? also, approx how much of a drop is yours?

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

carkook

Well with 850lb/in spring rate in the front and 275lb/in in rear its very stiff. This is with the LT1 so the front end is already a bit lighter. Not only that but the LT1 sits much lower. And riding on zr1 wheels with 265 wide in the front and 285 in the rear. It does ride like crap, but I can assure you it will out handle a stock iroc by FAR.

87350IROC

iTrader: (2)

Try finding yourself some more suspension travel. I think you will find it will ride and handle better. I have been down this road before.

Riding on the bumps stops is not good for handling. The suspension needs to absorb road irregularities to effectively keep pressure on the tires.

There are ways to lower these cars and still retain some suspension travel. Here is my ride height. I have 1.5" travel on each corner and could get about 0.5" more without to much trouble.

carkook

Ive rolled the body in the rear and plan on trimming the bump stomps. You might be against this, but even the stance of your car is just way too high IMO. Its just the style around here. It grips amazingly, it is too the point where I have to run above 1/2 tank of gas or the pump stops picking up fuel during hard cornering.

jwdomino

iTrader: (12)

I scrape on everything, my oil pan is now getting a skid plate. my spohn x-member for my t56 swap scrapes, my exhaust damn near scrapes and my front air damn always does
I measured my air dam and its just under 3" off the ground (I think the cross member sits a bit lower)
Its not a daily driver by any means and I avoid parking lots.

I love the stance and the only way it'll go higher is if the larger wheels I put on next year do it

last_

[/quote]

This is almost perfect stance.

fast377

iTrader: (4)

On your 82, what is the height from the ground to the bottom of the k-member?

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

Don't know and can't measure because I took out everything apart from the engine itself (which will be pulled also), it's sitting quite high now.

87350IROC

iTrader: (2)

For reference here is what my car looked like sitting on all four bump stops. Front airdam is about 1" off the ground. Front fender is at 24" rear is 25".

I really liked this look but it would be totally undriveable. The height I'm at now allows me to drive without constantly worrying about road imperfections. For me thats a worthwhile tradeoff.

carkook

Thats where my car sits now, I have to compliment how clean your camaro is. Mine is pretty much immaculant as well, but I dont have a nice camera.

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

That's damn perfect right there. I'm cutting the springs on my trans am some more, will cut half of the bumpstops off too... I love that stance. Screw it if it scrapes!

last_

This stance is outright sexy... very cool looking. Anyway to redo, err... re-engineer the bumpstops or make it so there was basically enough suspension travel so that the way you have it set up in these pics would be practical and would not hurt performance?

last_

did you drop it that far with springs alone or with spindles? i should be able to get close to that with spindles and or springs... at least i would think but one of you is probly about to crush my dreams yet again with some technical jargon.....

87350IROC

iTrader: (2)

Here is the biggest problem with being that low. My garage has the generic 1" lip that most do. Just rolling the car back into the garage, the airdam hit that lip. I saw that and determined there is no way I can drive the car that low without doing constant damage. If you go this low be ready to replace the airdam on a regular basis, armor the oil and trans pan, dent up the exhaust, scrap up the k-member.

Honestly if you want it that low, I'd just run it on the bump stops and give up all driveability. Otherwise normal suspension compression is going to be putting drivetrain components on tarmac on a regular basis.

The best solution would be air ride. After seeing my car that low, I kinda wished I went with air ride too. But my car sees track time and I didn't want to give up handling just for looks.

Thanks, carkook, photography is a hobby of mine.

87350IROC

iTrader: (2)

Mine is on springs alone. Stock spindles. These cars have long enough control arms that the angle really isn't that bad. If anything it helps camber gain in the corners.

Dartht33bagger

I honestly don't even think it looks that good that low. It just looks like any other honda on the road...I personally like the stock ride height and at least you don't scrape on every little bump.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

That Camaro looks like my old 89 GTA parts car. It had NO front springs in it, when I got it. It had no engine/tranny/interior, or the extra weight mights compressed the bumpstop a little more & it sat a little bit lower.

Guest

Your in trouble with A-arm angle with the weight of a V8 car. You will need much heavier spring rates to control the front RC from diving in the dirt as well as your a-arm angle is already invrted and articulating in a curve loss with body roll and bump absorbtion. Laterally weighting the outside front tires with large springs (locking up the RC from dropping and preventing as much camber curve loss) wil overload the front tires in ratio to the rears and throw off chassis weight distribution.

You are MUCH better suited to go to drop spindles on a heavier nosed V8 thridgen.

Mine sat at about the same stance. Gives a much wider look tot he cars, but you will be hitting the inner fender plactic liners with tire travel at this height with your V8 unless you go very stiff (by very stiff I am talking in the range of 1000 lb+ coil rates)

My stance is 24 3/4" front lip/ 25 7/8" rear lip- this is a lightweight nosed V6 with very stiff springs and slightly inverted A-arms at static ride height (I did this car prior to availiabilty of current drop spindles- bell tech spindles were long discontinued so I had no choice at the time.) I choose to invert the A-arms at the cost to get lower chassis height ONLY because I had a light motor. I would not do this to a V8 car without drop spindles. You are getting a camber gain alright.. a positive camber gain in the wrong direction.

87350IROC

iTrader: (2)

Not that it really matters. As my car is much higher in its driving configuration anyways. And anyone running that low probably doesn't care about handling anyways. Your car sits a full 3/4" higher in the front and 7/8" in the rear than my car in that picture.

I'm not understanding what you are saying about camber gain. Methinks the suspension on the outside tire compresses in a turn. As the suspension compresses, the tire gains negative camber. No?

Pillsbry10

iTrader: (1)

man thats funny i was just thinking about that color scheme today and poof there it is on a post ha ha ha ha

what made me think of it was an 82ish brown one out in a corn field, not sure why that made me think of it though

ive got 3 inches before my air damn hits and 5 inches tops before crossmember hits, i love the stance on my maro but the air damn does catch a lot of potholes...you learn to drive around them though. they look way better lowered

Guest

Not when the A-arm starts in an inverted stagnant position. CHeck out my "Ultimate Handling" post on where it talks about use of srop spindles for optimum camber gain with lowest possible chassis height (or center of gravity). I have detailed pictures on there showing articulation angles.

The starting point or stagnant suspension height of the balljint imaginary center pivot should be at a starting point of about 1" lower than the front A-arm mount bolt center height. THis is optimum A-arm articulation angle for best handling results and control of RC migration. Drop spindles will get the car's cg (center of gravity) 2" lower in the front without dropping the front RC so low you need massive spring rates to control the lateral leverage increase. THis also allows for about 1-1/2" normal suspesion compression while retaining a increasing a-arm lateral length through travel which in turn increases negative camber in travel to a point where it reaches lateral parallel- then it will start to decrease with invertion.

Guest

Hey, its nostalgic That was factory/dealer paint. It was a showroom car the first year the RS came outr and was a California Only series that year in red, black or white only. The dealer custom painted it and place this car in its showroom.

Pillsbry10

iTrader: (1)

yeah i remember the story, im an OG on here remember ha ha

do you still have it?

Guest

I remeber you well form the V6 forum. OG? Original ganster I'm assuming you mean

Nope, I think the ex wife is burried in it.

Pillsbry10

iTrader: (1)

you are correct

yeah wasnt sure if that was the one the ex got...back to topic i suppose