Meinherr49

This is a Pic. of a Factory Stock Wonder Bar for 3RD Gen. Camaros . But this Suspension Component can Also be installed in 3RD Gen. Firebirds to . It is installed using the Front Sway Bar Mounts . The After Market Wonder Bars have a THIRD Mounting Hole to connect to the Front Chassis for a More Solid Mount .
Sice I Installed one in my 88 Formula , I have Noticed a Improvement in Handling during High Speed Turns . A Worthy Addition to anyone who wants to Upgrade their Suspensions on their F Body .

Meinherr49

Here is a PIC. of the After Market Wonder Bar . Powder Coated Red .

Meinherr49

And here is a PIC> of a Factory Stock Wonder bar . Notice the Difference ?

JamesC

iTrader: (5)

Mein,

I'm glad that you've discovered the wonderbar. Many members here run them, stock or after market. Wonderbars, SFC's, and STB's seem to be the principle components for strengthening our cars.

JamesC

Meinherr49

James , Could you possibly explain the Benefits of having a strut tower brace on a Third Gen . F Body ? Also , what is the difference between the 2 Point Brace and the 3 Point Brace ? On TPI Engines , It seems the STB is a Tight fit , and could effect the ability to Close the hood correctly , especially if the Hood Insulation is on the Car . Just wondering if it would be worth the Money and Effort in installing an STB in my Car to increase it's Performance .

Xophertony

if you noticed a difference you may want to visualy inspect the area where your steering box mounts to your frame, there may be cracking

JamesC

iTrader: (5)

The wonderbar is a preventative measure, IMO, as it protects the gear box area from developing stress cracks. Some members claim that it tightens up the front of the car--I have no opinion there as my IROC came equipped with the piece. STB's and SFC's eliminate flex in our cars' uni-body and generally strengthen its structural integrity. The two-point brace aids in side to side stability (cornering), the three-point aids in front-end flex (the more flex that's eliminated, the better the performance). The first mod I'd advise is SFC's. I believe most members would agree. You might consider a search about the hood issue. That said, whether a STB will fit YOUR car or not may come down to purchasing one and mocking it up.

JamesC

Nate86

I've also heard from other members on the forum that an STB only offers a limited amount of help on a near-stock car (suspension wise) because of the type of strut mounts that came with the cars from the factory. A more solid strut mount, such as Sphon's steel variation, should alleviate this particular problem. In any case, having an STB installed with the stock strut mounts will definately help carve corners better than not having one at all.

That said, this is all from what I have read from other members on this board. I have no personal experience with STBs but I plan on installing one on my car in the future.

Meinherr49

Thanks Nate for your Imput on this Topic . And James , ALL Pontiac 3RD Gen F Bodies with TPI have the Same Hood Clearence when it comes to Installing a STB . I also have New Hood Insulation Installed in my Formula wich makes things even Tighter Under there . I had to Position my Engine Hood Light off to the Passengers Side of the Inner Hood . When I tried to Position it in the Middle of the Hood , it Hit the TPI Plate , and I could not Close the Hood . My Point is , the STB might Force you to Adjust the Hood Height in order for you to Close the Hood Correctly . That is my main Concern when thinking of getting one for My Particular Car . Welded Sub Framed Connectors are my Next Install I think , and Maybe a Set of Custom Traction Bars . I have a Posi Rear , but on Quick takeoffs , I get that Wheel Hop we all know about . I also have the Stock Torque Arm . I was pondering Up Grading that to . Thanks Again for your response to this post . I appreciate your Advice ..........Mark

Crusin' 1980's

On the stock wonderbar, there are 3 holes on each side, but on the TDS wonderbar, there are 4 holes....what does the extra hole do?....does it require a sepcial bolt or something?

Meinherr49

That extra Hole is for Taking Advantage of a Factory Chassis Hole near the Front Sway Bar . It connects the bar to the Chassis , and Gives it more Strenght . The After Market Wonder Bars are Far Superior to the Stock OEM ones . I Noticed on mine , that I do not have to Brake that Much on Sharp High Speed Turns . The front end is boxed In , and the cars Front End does not Dip into turns like it did before I Installed it .

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

The extra hole is for 82 model cars, that have a different bolt pattern for the sway bar bushings.

The actual amount of force applied to the bar is relatively small, since it has about a 3:1 or 4:1 mechanical advantage on the bending moment that it's designed to counteract; and of course, the force is in the bar's direction of maximum strength, i.e. trying to either lengthen or shorten it. A "beefier" bar is therefore not particularly useful.

Personally, since it's RIGHT ON THE NOSE OF THE CAR, about a foot or more in front of the ball joints, I'd like the lightest thing out there that will get the job done. IMO the stock one is entirely adequate.

The primary thing that it does, is to keep the 2 "ends" of the unibody frame stable with respect to each other. That is, it keeps the whole steering paralellogram (frame, center link, idler arm, Pitman arm) a true parallelogram, instead of being warped into a trapezoid by the forces applied during operation, which bend the unibody "frame" to a different dimension while those other things stay the same. In other words, it keeps the front wheels both pointed together in the proper direction at all times, instead of kind of waving around in the breeze out there. Without it, they invariably either toe way in or way out, and scrub off speed, in turns. I think, looking at tires and how they wear, that they mostly toe in. But I could be wrong about that.

STBs are known to be problematic in these cars, and very specific to the exact motor and intake and hood combo they're installed with as well as the production tolerances of your particular chassis. The TPI Camaros have the most clearance, in general; the carbed Firebirds have the least. But every car is a little bit different.

I doubt that "new" hood insulation will create too very much tighter tolerance than "used" hood insulation. That stuff is less than a quarter inch thick, fully compressed.

Wheel hop = you need LCA relocating brackets. A more solid torque arm will not fix that by itself.

Meinherr49

Thank You for that Lesson on the F Body Suspension Characteristics sofakingdom . LCA Relocating Brackets , And a Upgraded Torque Arm ? Hmmmm..




P.S. and maybe a Pair of These if I Win my Big Super Bowl Bet ? LoL I WISH !

91'ss'

just wondering...why did oyu put an IROC sway bar ont he front of your Formula? the formula i bought for parts (mainly the WS6 suspension to put under my RS) had a 36 mm swaybar vs the IROC 34 mm... anyways, i noticed on my RS after installing a factory wonderbar, that not only was there slightly less body roll, but it also seemed to have a quicker steering response. my dad and i figure that it's because the wonderbar keeps both sides of the fram from twisting as much when turning, so all the steering linkages and stuff don't flex and bend as much resulting in quicker-responding steering.

lonsal

iTrader: (2)

Actually, Meinherr49 had it right. The extra hole takes advantage of existing bolts in the frame. The different bolt pattern of the 1982 model year is solved by the long angled slot. That slot will accept the tab of the 1983-92 bushing retainer brackets and also accomodates the straight pattern of the early 1982 model year bushing retainer brackets.

Agreed. I went slightly beefier on the center bar (1.00" OD x .120" wall vs .75" of stock) when I redesigned the bar. As mentioned in the product description, my aftermarket brace weighs 3.7 lbs. For comparison GM's wonderbar weighs 3 lbs. The reason why other manufacturers of the brace use 1.25" OD x .120" wall DOM isn't so much for added strength as it is for economic reasons. It is less expensive to purchase and stock one size of tubing. In many cases other manufacturers use the same tubing for other products, such as an aftermarket torque arm.

Lon

DiabloWS6

iTrader: (8)

im gona get a wonder bar for my 86 WS6 trans-am and i would like to see if any one knew what was the RPO on the wonder bar

DJP87Z28

No RPO as far as I know, it was just a engineering change adding that stamped metal support on IROC models. The hype and name came later when some people thought it was a handling item on IROC's.

DiabloWS6

iTrader: (8)

oh alright....so now its gona make my WS6 handle even better thanks IROC-Z

Pablo

iTrader: (1)

So much BS concerning this wonder bar. If you want to make your car handle get tires, shocks, springs, and bushings and a proper alignment. Tubular this and that has its place but these parts are VASTLY overrated here on TGO. I see people with this stuff rolling on monroe shocks, stock springs, and uniroyal tires. I don't care if you have a space frame chassis, without proper shocks, springs, and tires, the car is going to handle like poo.
There's not one tubular aftermarket part on my car (for now) and I would gladly put it up against any of the best handling cars on TGO. Chassis rigidity is important, but it's benefits are extremely overrated here.

//<86TA>\\

iTrader: (15)

^i agree completely with this.

Now the wonderbar, steering brace, ect, does have a legitimate purpose and helps a real issue with frame stress at the steering box when using larger front tires. I have one on both my cars, just for that reason.