I bought this handbook a while ago when I got a wolf car cover for the Camaro. Anyone have any articles on this Camaro, I am really interesed to what all they did to it, and here are the pics.


SuperchargedRS

 

The Book:

 

I have the entire article - the caption is wrong, the car wasn't even tested at the skidpad. It was only a street car with street tires, maybe 1.05g max (if they bothered to test it).

 

That was a fast reply, lol. Could you scan the article or something. If you dont want to post it just email it to me L3323P@yahoo.com
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Thanks,
SuperchargedRS

 

Yep, article is B.S. The only way to get that car to 1.3g's is to toatlly strip it of all weight, add extensive welded fabrications, and run some very wide and sticky racing rubber- could never be accomplished on street tires. Just about any car on the road can pull a g on racing rubber, decent shocks, and apropriate alignment specs. Pull a g on street rubber and you've doing impressive. I have pulled 1.07

 

Anyone curious how to test your car? Here's an info post I made awhile back explaining how to test your upgrades-
https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...=%2Askidpad%2A

 

I'll see if I can scan it at work Mon or Tues.

 

THANKS

 

just wanted top bump this thing back up incase anyone has the article (or rather a scan or something of it).


Thanks,
SuperchargedRS

 

I have the book mentioned, and was also curious about the article. I agree that tire compund would be the deciding factor around the skidpad, but the skidpad also doesn't tell you everything. Slalom results are much more telling, because they let you know how the car transitions, and it's transition handling that makes a car fast around a track. It's easy to fool a skidpad. Drop the car real low, run very low profile sticky tires (like 4 drag radials), and have at it. This tells you nothing about how the car handles, because a car like this could do very well on a skidpad, but not even be driveable on the street.

I don't doubt that handling in excess of 1G is fairly easy to accomplish on a 3rd gen. The car's biggest limitation is the MacPherson strut front suspension. The 4th gen cars really make out in that department.

You don't have to gut the car and make it no fun to drive daily to get great handling either. Weight is a factor, but proper alignment, and careful component selection are much more important.

 

i agree 100% there...


i always felt that once the unibody has been firmed up, the 3rdgen front suspension handled MUCH better then the 4thgen setup... sure its a bastardized MacPherson strut setup with a lame PS box, but it still does quite well.....
i think if spohn does as some people have implied and make a bolt in rack and pinion k member for the car, it will be THE setup for handling... athough thats just theory right now..

i really dont see the 4thgens making out in that department other then the steering..



i agree 100% there too...

 

The design of any MacPherson strut front suspension is inherantly worse than an SLA setup like the 4th gens. The 3rd gen setup is prone to bumpsteer, whereas with a proper SLA setup there should be no bumpsteer at all. The MacPherson setup is a bit lighter though. The ideal system would be an SLA with heim joints and chromoly arms using coilovers. Don't get me wrong, the 3rd gen is a great setup stock, and the car still ranks among one of the best handling cars I've ever driven (and that includes Porsches, Corvettes, and a lot of other high end hardware).

I think the big problem with the 4th gens is that they are portly. The cars just kept getting heavier and heavier.

Plus, like anything else all factory parts are a series of compromises. NVH is a major concern, and often they carry it to the nth degree. This leads to less than ideal geometry in the suspension, as well as bushings that are quiet, but not ideal for handling. I've removed 75 pounds of sound deadening and other useless crap from a car and it made no difference in interior noise, even without the stero blaring.

 

at stock height though, theres almost no bumpsteer at all.... its not perfect, but close enough that i dont think its worth mentioning...


its once you lower the car, it fuggs with it... ive toyed with the idea of making my own "bumpsteer kit" but to be honest, its still so minimal that for my daily driver, i dont care...
perhaps after the 2nd stage of mods are finished i'll get back to the steering and get more into autoX and do it, but for now, it handles better then a new shock/spring/STB 4thgen....


and i i give up.. i know im probly going to go "duh" after you say it but... whats NVH ??

 

I accually drove the car on the cover of the performence book. I found it for sale here in Oregon several years ago. I only drove it for 3 or 4 miles, so I didnt get much of a chance to corner it. But from just driving it, it felt very tight and responsive. But it definatley was THE fastest car I have ever driven. I am doing my engine buildup very simulair (except for the superram intake,I'm going with the HSR) if my car goes half as good I'll be all

 

Noise Vibration & Harshness is NVH.

 

I'm appologizing up front guys - my post is off topic and the only reason I'm posting it rather than pm-ing it is because it sounds as if a few of you have access to the original article.

I've been blessed with my '89 IROC which wears dark red metallic paint with tan interior and gold accents in the pin striping and the 15" rims - that's right, I said 15s. So, I'm starting to think wheels like that of GTA's with gold center and silver rims might look ok - wondering if any of you who have access to that first article could get a copy to me - I'm kind of liking the look of those rims and would like to see them from another angle. My color scheme is tough when looking at better rims - all chrome just doesn't look so good and so the bottom line is I'm desperate for descent options - the rims on that alleged 1.3g machine are intriguing.......

Again, sorry - but thanks if you can help out.

 

MYBLUZ-- Where in Oregon are you from?

TKO--"I think the big problem with the 4th gens is that they are portly. The cars just kept getting heavier and heavier. "

that is an issue, the other issue with 4thgens, is that they have never raised the spring rates to the thirdgens level. i assume that was to keep the 'ride harshness' complaints down, but i would guess that a 4thgen running similar spring rates to those of the factory thirdgen performance cars, would be a great setup.

 

Well, the spring rates could be an issue, if the 4th gen cars aren't as stiff as the 3rd gen cars, or only as stiff. If they are stiffer they may not need all that spring rate.

Remember, stiffer springs don't always mean better handling. You only need enough spring rate for the tire to stay in contact with the pavement. Any more and the car is harsh, but handles worse. Any less, and it feels like a luxo-barge.

 

Looking for some ideas on spring rates

 

Funny thing, the Bilstein shocks and struts on my camaro right now came off the blue Camaro on the cover of that book. That was a test car for All Chevy Magazine. I bought the Bilsteins off one of the editors when the Magazine went under. He sold all the aftermarket parts from the car when it was all over.