BretD 88GTA

Hmmmm, we could have a battle of the trucks/SUVs! Lon can bring his V10, Dean can bring the work truck ...and so on.

Grey Goose

The only thing I’m hiding is a few questionable DVD’s with James on them. Oh and don’t worry…you’ve got a race on your hands make no mistake about that. I’m not afraid of that big bad 2.8-liter or “sergeant slaughter” behind the wheel. At least 4 seconds? What happened to the complete and utter inhalation of my ***? The only this I’m putting between my legs is you while I’m repositioning for a heated session of reverse cowboy. I’ve been practicing for 31 years going around you only requires will.
Butterflies? No… nausea just knowing what I’m going to do to you out there even makes me sick.

BretD 88GTA

So what time is everyone planning to show up?

12secSS

We will be there early, like 7:30am or so. I think dean will be there prior to ESP running, about 9am or so.

Grey Goose

I’m thinking the earlier the better…

Guest

Got a cutout switch or cable?

BretD 88GTA

I was thinking the same – around 7:30 am.

BrandenCali

Lmfao..

Grey Goose

It sounds like breakfast is in order!

BretD 88GTA

Chorizo burritos!

Guest

Mike's secret acceleration weapon.

RWB____s

Good shoes for standing on HOT pavement

Sun Screen stronger the better

Lite colored clothing (stay cool) Mike doesn't need it, he's the ICE man

Hat (Very important)

Bring chairs, for when not on course driving/working

Shade! bring it if you have it

Lots of cold water with ice

Lots of VASOLINE for Mike and Dean to fight over. If they want to use it.;-)

Air tank/compressor for tires

Tools

Floor jack

jack stands

There "should" be food available at the event

Drivers license

helmet

Make sure car will pass a basic safety check. No leaks, battery secured, wheel bearings in good shape, NO corded tires

Check all attitudes at the gate

Everybody be prepared to be humbled by the fast guys and girls(that won't be any of us)

Please bring your since of humor

Help each other in need

Have fun, drive hard fast and clean.

Most of all be SAFE

Ron

RTFC

And most of all, Do NOT drive fast or zig zagging inside California Speedway grounds. They will kick you out for doing anything other than driving like an old lady unless its your turn out on the course. They are very strick and you don't get a second warning.

cali92RS

And the honor for most reprehensible line goes to:

smokeycamaro51

Hey i have a Camaro RS convert that ussually runs mid pack with Porsches. i want to play. I just hope you don't need a roll bar for this here gig because i haven't quite installed that yet. But my camaro can hang and i would love to see what it could do against some other american iron. Im ussually 1 second off a C5 corvette that my dad owns. And i've done the autocross thing. And i found that you get really gittery right before your run. Ussually the best thing you can do is on your first run. To blow off steam. Light them back tires up all the way down to the first corner. Then youll be nice and settled. Of course you give people a good show and something to talk about. That and some of the more upper crust club racers get all pissy and its always good to give them something to complain about, although it seems like they have plenty allready stored up. I would love to go I live right next to the track in San Berdo and if its no roll bar for converts that would be awesome. And if i don't make it out Autocrossing is fun and if you want some real fun after this autocross drive around the Orange show speedway just 30 minutes from Calif speedway on Orange show road and the 215, and run the night autocross with porsche club. Sure you would get humbled by a GT3 worth more than 6 of the cleanest 1LE camaros around.

Guest

lonsal

iTrader: (2)

No roll bar required. Also unlike the street-legal drag races, they let you drive the course top-down! I was contemplating bringing my Formula (oops, did I forget to mention I might come out to play?). Now that there will be another RS 'vert, I may have to bring the faster car.

My only concern is the "Snell 90" or better requirement for a helmet. Since when? I ran with my DOT approved one last time.

Lon

Grey Goose

When I first started road racing (on a track) it was behind the wheel of a heavily modified 1997 993 C4S. The reason I was asked to drive this vehicle was for my overall consistency which proved to be absolutely crucial in the tuning process. The vehicle in question had a Motec engine management system along with some pretty nasty mods (heads, cams, stroked, etc.). Just imagine this…you at Willow… flat out heading for turn three when you feel the car start to flatten out. All you have to do is tell the guy strapped in the passenger seat with the laptop that you need more fuel, and you’ve got it by turn four. Motec is the $hit period! I’d have put one in a third gen along time ago if it wasn’t for the caviar cost.

I was in the Porsche performance business for many years. I’ve had the opportunity to pilot literally hundreds of suspension/engine combinations both on and off the track. Over the years I have found that the majority Porsche owners lack the testicular fortitude to push their vehicles to the limit. Now this is speaking late model of course. If you looking to test your skill look for a guy with a 914-6 or 911 with fender flairs bolted to the quarter panels. Its not that I think your RS isn’t running mid pack with Porsche, it’s the caliber of driver your up against that I’m questioning.

Here is a perfect example… I’m flat out coming down the back strait (86 Z28) when I’ve got three 996 Twin T’s running me down. We’re running the track counter clockwise setting up for the sunset corner; we are four wide the last 300’ before the turn and guess who explodes out of the corner first. A guy driving a $1,500 car is going to have a much different perspective/attitude that a guy driving an $80-$100,000 car. If I trade a little paint going into a turn its par for the course, let a first car Porsche owner trade a little paint and he’s on a stretcher headed for the hospital.

Now you put the driver of a $1,500 car behind the wheel of an $80-$100,000 super car and you’ve got a lethal combination.
The GT3 is a superb vehicle, but I’m afraid I prefer the GT2…the boost keeps you busy.

RTFC

Heaviely modified 993 my foot. That thing is so 4x'ed it looks like its going to roll. Who's the clown giving the hang loose with his arm 2 ft out the window- officials love rookies like that.

I would eat that little black 993 for lunch. Heck, I have proof of eating a full race version 930 TT. That 993 street car would be gobbled up. There is a GT2 in the back of that pack also. Its Dallas Raines best friend (the white car). I just drove this car by Don's shop yesterday- it is streetable- barely. This was a private event at Calif Speedway front stright sequence on bottom of link page.
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/518752/4

Anytime you want to play with the bigboys Mikey, I got that covered also after I school you in the wifes car.

KiLLJ0Y

iTrader: (1)

yeah why does that black porsche look so high off the ground?

Guest

I see we're posting still photos of moving objects as evidence of speed again.

Grey Goose

Dude you may be able to read but you certainly cant comprehend. That is NOT a 993 in the photo, it’s a 2004 GT2. The reason I posted it in the first place is because the guy said that we would all be humbled buy a GT3 in which I responded no that I prefer the feel of a GT2. That is I in the photo taking the owner around the track showing him what his car can do. If you were familiar with some of the road courses (other than California Speedway) that surround these cities that we live in you would know that this photo was taken right at turn five on the big track at Willow. Turn 5 is down hill with a 90* left hand turn at the bottom. So based on the information I just gave you, and you being the “all around bad ***” that you are, what would happen? That’s right…the car would go light, which is exactly what you are seeing in the image. I’m surprised a suspension guru like you cant see something so obvious. Open track on slicks? You’ll get your teeth kicked in little man. Chasing cones in a parking lot is your specialty remember, putting a 4000lb car into a sweeper at a buck+ is mine. Lets get past this weekend before you start talking smack guy…



For clarification this is the 993 in question.

12secSS

In Mike's defense about that GT2 being "lifted" ... that is true! When I first saw that picture, that is the conclusion I came to. The car is light due to that portion of Willows Spring, clearly visible in the picture.

Mike, maybe we can do a club thing at Willow with some of these guys. I would love to run up there.

drop-top IROC

Man, this is getting good... I may just have to cxl my Sunday plans and take a trip out to the track!

james_85Z28

more flames for the fire.....

RTFC

I am assuming Kenneth D Marks is RaiderKen- I have a fan club, would ya looky there. Just remember guys, I didn't start this smack talk challange that will end up embarassing Mike, He did. I am going for fun, but I will be there ready as I am for any other driving event I do. I am glad to see its about time this group of guys gets together for a non-drag racing event even if it isn't a so called group event. I like to have fun and its better sharing with others of the same interest and enthusiasm. I just didn't know one of you was related to Mohammod Ali.

Anyways, Sent the wife an hour and a half ago to drop by and pick me up some return hose for the powersteering pump. (I have a spare unit off the 60K mile 3.4 I picked up that I am swapping in. Its dry and clean off that motor and should be fine. Mine had a hard aprox 160K on it.) Wife loves to shop and no doubt her and the daugther are out buying crap and keeping me waiting. So I figured I'd jump on here and continue the circus.

Mikey, Your gonna loose........

Gotta get back to winding my rubberband. Now am I suppose to use the yellow rubberband, or was it the red one?

RTFC

And to add to Ron's prep list on tips for everyone,

Make sure to lower your tire pressure so you get real good traction through the starting timer.

And ArmorAll your sidewall so they look nice and pretty all the way over the edge tread. There's alot of nice looking cars out there and you want to be sharp looking also.

Bring you AAA card in case you have no tread left from over driving your car.

injdinjn

It would appear that there is a lesson to be learned here.


Don't go fishing with Mikey, when he baits his hook he catches the big fish.

Even a fish wouldn't get in trouble if it would keep it's mouth closed.

cali92RS

Anyways...Its not that I dont think Mike is a supremely qualified driver. Its just that he has only been autocrossing 1 other time.
Also, your car, with its V6 and every single trick piece of suspension, is porbably more setup for auto-crossing than his.

Dyno Don

iTrader: (7)

Very wise words

RWB____s

Well, Car setup for autocross 3rd gens like we all have are not "that" different than track setups. Alignment specs, tire pressures, shock settings "usually" are all you have to concern yourself with because of the difference in tire temps generated during track sessions.
Brakes have gotten to the point that good aftermarket pads
and High temp fluid will work fine in a autocross and track sessions. If you go full time track racing then I would go with the biggest brakes that the rules allow.
As for driving ability, a autocross racer that moves up to track
racing usually has a easier time adjusting to driving on a race track and being competitive.
While a track racer that goes autocrossing will have a harder time adjusting to the more precision driving lines needed to be competitive on a autocross course.

RTFC

I don't stand there with a stupid hook, I go into their home aggressively You see, I know when Mikey has his hook set on the anchor.

RTFC

Ya, but its the wifes car. Its not setup for my personal weekend toy- its coming with how she drives it daily.

If you all someday want to see my real car in action, I CONSITENTLY ran in the top 10 times of the day in a car that had no powersteering and beam of 77" on the rear tire width. Very often I was top 2 beating even the open wheel cars all but Guy Ankeny- all depends on the track layout. Want to play for real someday? try out running my V6 first.

Some people need to learn not to prejudge someone they not know- wise words also

Grey Goose

Dean, what are you going to do when you lose?

james_85Z28

C'mon Mike.....it's just his wife's car. Who's wife doesn't need a carbon fiber driveshaft, 800 lb front springs, no rubber in the suspension (AT ALL!), brakes that are unbalanced and lock up, an exhaust that it horrendously loud, and is constently being tinkered with by her husband to the effect of it being down for days or weeks at a time.

Ha!

Like I said it will be a fair race and the loser will have nothing to blame but their driving. The cars have comparable quality components and both have been given enough otice to where even Dean had changed his whole exhaust system in order to find more power. But both can be easily beat in the straight line by any a Geo Metro.

RWB____s

Mike

The serious question for you is what are you going to do if "YOU"
get beat? It works both ways

KiLLJ0Y

iTrader: (1)

he see's the light and buys a V8

BrandenCali

I still suggest a better track.. For these 2 well experienced drivers..

lonsal

iTrader: (2)

Brake fluid flushed, fluids topped off, custom chip & vacuum adjustable TBI installed. Car packed. See y'all there.

Lon

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Hmmmmm. Thought we might have seen some results posted by now.

lonsal

iTrader: (2)

I'll let everyone else post their own results.

Run #1: 74.842
Run #2: 70.056
Run #3: 69.846

No spins, no cones down.

Lon

irocdan

good job lon,one day i'll join you on the track i'm sure i'll have a blast too

RTFC

So is everyone now going to accept the validity of the video that was posted of me running on the bumper of the GT40 around a 60mph sweeper at Calif Speedway and we were BOTH pushing the cars hard through that sweeper like the video shows?
He obviously left me down the straightaways, I have no contest there with 165hp.

Gotta now at least give this little car a little credit- I do not BS

Also have to give me credit that I was not talking smack (well not entirely), I mostly just giving an accurate prediction. I stated above that if Mike had "only" about the same power I did that I would get him by about a least 4 seconds.......I got him by 3.928 seconds. I was very close on my prediction.

12secSS

Branden

What better track do you suggest? AutoX is where skill is really needed to be victorious, all other 'tracks' can be victorious with more HP, with less skill.

BrandenCali

Anything with curve that is permanent is what I was thinking of.. Not that the cone thing does not work.. But a track with more angles..

RTFC

Autox is the most precise and and demanding type of racing there is next to rally car racing. Make a mistake in a rally car and you either kill 10 stupid spectators or you kill yourself and your navigator when you slide off a mountainside cliff.

AutoX its you and the car vs the time. You are contantly working the wheel and the pedals, or should be unless you lack power or do not have the car on edge. Roadracing faster and thus more dangerous because of traffic, yet you do have time to relax in between corners and can make up for mistakes in laps to come.

Autocross you only get three unpreaacticed runs to go as fast as you can and thats it. Mistakes count and count hard. It is very demanding and is the very bst venue to show a driver's skill level.

The most fustrating part of autox is you have to realize early on that it does not matter what the small skinnier cars are running. You have to compare yourself and car to others your same width. The trasitioning and tightness of corners demands that the wider and heavier cars always be subject to a higher scrub angle on the tires to run the same transitions as a car narrower. Hence why most of the smaller car were consistantly running about 3-5 seconds faster times than we.

-------------------
Let me try and explain this better. Take the center line of a third gen and then measure its distance to the outer left and right sides of the car- we are about 37" (the car fender, not the tire width- its the fender that will hit the cone). Now take a Mazda Miata that is more like 32".
On a slalom from left to right to left gates say staggered 10ft to the left and right, the center line of our car has to travel not only the center line lateral distance of 16' 4" (missing the cones by 1" on the apropriate sideof the car) compared to the Miata doing only 15' 6". BUT we also have to maintain that lateral distance in a forward motion for a longer bodied car and also do all this with much heavier polar weight. The larger car HAS TO turn the front wheels sharper in the same corners as the smaller cars.

On a road corse this is not the general case and a larger car can setup for a corner about as easy as a small car on a 50ft wide course. the only time you have this trouble is in a chicane. Autox in essence is all chicanes all the time. Much more gruling and mistake potential. You also heat the tires up much faster in autox.

BretD 88GTA

The thing is, with a track it typically comes down to horsepower. The faster car has an advantage.

Auto-X is the big equalizer. Horsepower is not a big factor. A small 4 cylinder in the hands of a good driver can walk all over a big V8.

RTFC

Here's a chart I made showing two cars running through 3 gates of cones. Green is our larger 3rdgens, the blue is a small car like an EVO. You can see how we need to clear the gat in more of a forward direction, then turn a sharper angle to the next gate where we need to then enter a a sooner vertical angle do to us again being longer arching the cone.

12secSS

What do you mean by "more angles"? I am not picking on you in any way and I know you are big on top speed, but have you actually experienced anything besides WOT on the freeways? I am no where near an expert at all of the performance driving sports that I have done (AutoX, Road Racing, Canyon Carving, Off-Road, Drag Racing and street racing). AutoX is THE most difficult task for a driver, and this is the proper venue to test driver skil against another driver's skill. Not evertything is about holding the pedal to the floor and hanging on you know. JFYI. You should come out with us next time Branden, I am sure one of us will be willing to give you a ride or you can have an instructor show you what it is like.

injdinjn

Tell me about it.

I need rims tires and diff springs.