LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

Hi everyone, I'm wondering where in the Valley area, or anywhere for that matter, I can get gas that's higher than 91 octane? I'm not looking for 100+ octane fuel, which is(or used to be) available at a little station in Santa Monica(which I found by accident), just some gas that my car will run better on.

My car wasn't "built" for CA emissions, but it was supposedly "converted"(*cough*scam*cough*) when I moved here many years ago. But I've never really searched for better gas before.

The rest of the country's premiums are 92, 93 and 94, and I think it sucks that CA only has 91--AND we have to pay A LOT MORE for it! This state gets you anyway it can! Oh, and by the way, it's springtime, which means it's time for the annual oil refinery fire that conveniently drives up the summer prices, lol. You think I'm kidding? It happens every year! Accident? Hmm...

Sorry for the ranting, lol. Thanks.

Tim

12secSS

Go north on the 101 freeway exit on chesebro and go over to the 76 station there. They have 100 octane 'race' fuel. I used to buy mine from them, there is also a place on mullhulland (sp?), but don't know where.

BretD 88GTA

There is also a station on the corner of DeSoto and Vanowen that sells Trick Racing Fuel. IIRC, it's around 101 or 104 octane.

LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

DeSoto and Vanowen... near House of Camaro. I guess I should've just asked Tom, lol. Cool, thanks guys.

If anyone still knows of other places, I'm up for hearing them.

Russ-So Cal

It depends on how much extra they charge you for the high octane. You can do the same thing with NOS 104 octane booster from Pep Boys. It is in the silver can with a red label and costs about $11.00. Add it to a the tank when you fill with 91 octane, and it will boost the rating to about 93 or 94. The label says it contains nitromethane. The cheap lead substitutes that sell for $5.00 or less are useless, according to dyno Don they might raise your octane by .5 at most.

BretD 88GTA

The problem with most over the counter octane boosters is that they can cause MMT fouling. This is an orange residue that likes to coat your spark plugs, cylinder heads and psitons. Just ask Kevin. He has some nice pictures from a previous motor.

I'd stay away from the bottle boosters.

Kevin91Z

iTrader: (1)

You say you're not looking for 100 octane gas, but that is all you will find in CA that is higher than 91 octane.

And yes, definitely stay away from those octane-in-a-bottle products.

LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

I've used the boosters for years, and they never hurt anything. I always worried that they'd hurt the O2 or the cat, but I was still running both originals when I passed my most recent smog test. And you don't even wanna know how many miles I had on them after 17 years, LOL!

But I've replaced both since then and made a few other improvements, and the engine is running better than it has since it was brand new and with a lot more power. So I'd like to keep it all clean and new with good gas, plain and simple, and stop wasting money on and fussing with bottles since they don't help much anyway. So I guess I'll be blending my octanes.

The 76 gas sounds great! I did some searches and found a chart for mixing their 100 octane with 92 and another chart from somewhere else that showed the rating for our engines(9 to 10:1 ratios) should be at least 95. That seems a bit extreme for everyday use, so I'm thinking closer to a blend of about 93ish, which should be about 4 to 5 gallons of 100 with our 91. And in the yellow pages, I even found a local-yocal place near me that has 100, but not sure yet who's it is yet or if it's safe.

Thanks for the responses everyone. My car and I should be happy for several more years, lol.

sqzbox

Why, would you want high octane gas for a 305?

LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

Because it runs better with it--like MOST engines would. The 305's an excellent engine. I love mine, and I've been driving this particular one for 17 years, so I can tell you that it "prefers" higher-than-91 octane. But sorry to hear you don't like yours.

sqzbox

Who said I didn't like mine? I was just asking why! (mod's, racing) ? Ca. must have some wimpy gas right? too many clean air additives huh? my car likes hi oct. too but I have my initial timing set at 6* before TDC. If I don't run 91 I get a ping and then the comp. retards my total timing.
My neighbor has an 87 TA that has a 86 305 HO that found it's way into his 87 from the fac. ???? I hear they only produced 29 ta's in 86 with the HO I checked the #'s and they are correct. How did that happen? His car wont run for s**t with anything less than 91!

LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

Oh, your earlier post sounded a bit cynical--like you might be one of those guys who'll cheat and drop in a 350 instead of working with their 305, lol. So I apologize if I sounded like a smart-@$$.

But yeah, 91 is premium here in CA. That's the best you can get from the pump. So I was trying to find better gas so I can stop wasting money on boosters, which don't help much. And thanks to the guys on this site and the yellow pages, I've found 100 octane to mix with the 91.

So your friend's car is an '87, but it's got the carbed HO engine, which supposedly didn't exist in '87? You're sure about this? He's sure? Then I have no idea how that could've happened. But if you tell that to the people on the 'History and Restoration' boards, everyone will tell you you're crazy, LOL.

Everybody there claims to know everything based on one simple, but silly, premise... if it truly existed, someone would've been on this site to tell about it. And if no one here knows anyone who's had such a car, it can't possibly have existed. Paaaleeeeese, lol. As if EVERYONE who ever had anything to do with anything regarding thirdgens knows about, or even cares about, this site, LOL!

I have no doubt that strange things like that can happen, either accidently or on purpose--rarely, but they probably can. And your friend's car would prove that. I also wouldn't be surprised if someone's driving around a 1986 IROC with a 350, which also supposedly never existed--even though I've found 4 sources that say it did. And there's probably ONE 'Vette out there that officially carries a "non-existent" 1983 VIN, making it one of the rarest cars in the world.

Everyone wants to believe everything is "cut-and-dried" when it comes to cars, models and years, but they just aren't. Strange things find their ways onto the streets. And if your friend's VIN is accurate, then his is ONE of a kind, not one of 29!

Russ-So Cal

My 87 TA came with the ho carb motor, but I'm not a collector, and I don't want to deal with a smog carb, so it now has a tpi 350.

LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

The L69? Hmm, then I guess a few were produced. It was awfully hard to get in '86 though, so it must've been even harder to get in '87. Either year would be pretty rare. Cool!

Kevin91Z

iTrader: (1)

Russ, I think your car has the "H" code for the regular LG4 carb. Probably like this guys 87 as well. He just thinks he has the HO engine in an 87.

sqzbox

So what your saying is, no way an 86 HO could find it's way into an 87 model built it 86? BTW it's not my car, it's my neighbor's. So I have nothing to gain by thinking I have one! I do know one thing though, his T/A leaves my 88 Form in the dust outta' sight!
I was figuring that some one either did a dam good job repacing the engine or the fac. droped a few "left overs" from 86
behind an 700-R4 and droped the HO rating for obvious reasons!

Kevin91Z

iTrader: (1)

86 HO carb is a flat tappet cam, and has perimeter bolt valve covers. 87 carb is a roller cam with center bolt valve covers. You tell me which one your friend has.

Parrydise7

iTrader: (1)

Awhile a go there was a thread about adding toluene or xylene (both of which are available at Home Depot) to raise the octane. A gallon is about $10.00, which is still cheaper than the commercially-available additives.

injdinjn

Do what the stations do, mix to get what you want.
All stations get 89 octane from mixing the 87 with the 91 at the pump.

Kevin91Z

iTrader: (1)

By the way, LAFireBoyd, why do you think you need more than 91 octane? If your car is pinging using it, have you checked your initial timing settings lately? It should be at the stock 6 degrees with the EST connector disconnected. Its possible for the distributor to wander, as well as the timing chain to stretch as our engines get older. The other possibility is you have oil and/or carbon deposits on your valves, again from the age of our engines, and that will cause pre-ignition and detonation. An application of GM's Top Engine Cleaner will solve that problem. Your last option would be a custom chip from me, in which I would redo your ignition tables in your chip so your car wont ping.

Russ-So Cal

I never drove my carb motor except from the parking space into Don's shop and back to the parking space again, but it sure didn't have any low end torque. With all of the junk on it including a mysterious blower device to blow cool air on the float bowl, I can't imagine it being a good intake system for anything!

LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

HAHA, somebody's always selling something. Maybe someday.

The car simply runs better on higher octane. It always has. I'd always used 92, 93 or 94 before I moved out to CA, and on 91 it's just never seemed as "happy," lol--especially up here in the desert(I'm actually in Lancaster).

But over the weekend I found a local "racing" auto parts store who sells BP 100 octane unleaded by the gallon for $5/gal. A mix of 3.5 to 12 is about a 93 rating, which is working very well today.

Besides, $5/bottle/tank of booster helps very little, and the NOS referred to above is $10/bottle/tank. So if I'm spending the money anyway, I'd rather pay the extra for good real gas to mix instead of booster. So I'm happy again, lol, and so's my car.

Kevin91Z

iTrader: (1)

That's even more interesting, because at higher altitudes you DONT need higher octane. What brand of gas were you using and what brand are you using now?

LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

That's the text book theory, but that's never been my actual experience. In fact, when I had my Z28 and I traveled to LA from Indiana(pleasure trip before I moved here), when I got into the higher altitudes with their lower octane gas, my Z28 was having fits!!! I was literally scared because it was running so poorly. Here I was, a teen, by himself, SOMEWHERE OUT THERE, lol, and my awesome car was dying! I had to get lots of boosters to get it running right again. And when I did, it was like flipping on a light switch.

Back then, and the first few years with the Firebird, I used Sunoco 94 and Amoco 93. I don't remember what Shell was, but I used that too. It was at least 92, but probably 93. Most premiums were, and still are, 93 back there.

My Formula has never responded that badly, not even badly at all, but it's always felt like it's lacking "guts" on 91. And whenever I've been anywhere that has higher octane gas, it "lights up" too.

Maybe it's me, lol. I walk under a street light at night, and it goes off or on, lol. And my cars have NEVER adhered to the "needing lower octane at higher elevations," umm, I'll say theory because nothing is ever constant for every condition. So maybe my body's molecular structure gives off a "bermuda triangle" effect, lol.

But right now, I've got it running even better than when it was new--and A LOT more powerfully. So I just wanna make sure it stays that way. I've had this car for 17 years and ###### miles, lol, and I'll have it forever. Believe me, this car and I have a psychic connection, lol. I know this car, how it feels, how it responds, and what it needs--if it needs anything. And when I took it out today with the higher octane, it ran awesomely!

But I don't drive it all the time, so it's not like I'll go bankrupt buying 3 gallons of 100 octane once in awhile. BUT... since it IS running so well, I AM driving it more again, lol. But that'll probably slow down soon.

As far as how clean the engine is, you'd be surprised. Again, it's a testimonial to the opposite... I've never run synthetics, but it doesn't burn oil, there's no puff of smoke, and the oil on the dipstick is so clean that you wonder if there's even oil on the dipstick--and that oil has 2,000 miles on it. And even though I didn't tell you how many miles it has, counting the number of ###### is somewhat of a clue--but even more, lol.

I've tried synthetic, but I couldn't convince myself to leave it in for 7-10,000 miles. And to change that every 3,000 miles would be a waste of money. So I've always stayed with my Valvoline Racing 20W-50. But since Valvoline MaxLife 20W-50 has been around, it's kept the engine in excellent shape. There WAS a puff of smoke before MaxLife, but there's not anymore!

The only thing this car needed was better gas. I've tossed around the idea of a custom chip, but I probably won't yet. The only mod I haven't installed yet is an AFPR. I've got one, but I've never installed it. I never "mess" with things, unlike SO MANY people on these boards, which is probably why my car's always run as well as it has without many problems, and probably why so many people here HAVE so many problems with their cars.

The problems and amount of problems people have has astounded me in the few months I've been on these boards. I've concluded that people just think they're more "technically knowledgeable" than they really are. They run for the guages and meters and screw with sensors and adjustments BEFORE they even try to reason and eliminate possible problems. I just wanna scream sometimes, lol.

And as I was saying about my car, it's running so well right now, that I'm gonna let it be for awhile. But we can talk about a chip sometime, that would be cool.

Cosmetically, it needs new black paint(at least the hood for sure), my driver's seat needs recovering(for which I have original fabric), and my t-top headliner is falling down, lol(for which I also have fabric). The rest of the interior is almost "showroom."

Ok, that's enough, lol. Have a nice night Kevin.

Tim

LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

I just realized I didn't answer one of your questions Kevin. But don't worry, this won't be a loooong one again, lol. Sorry about that one above.

The gas I've mostly used out here, and you'll slap me and say that's been my problem, lol, has been Arco.

But over the last few years, I've discovered that Techron Complete fuel system cleaner works very well, so I've been using a lot of Chevron lately.

And we just got a nice new Shell up here in the last couple of years too, so I've been going to it a lot more. And with Shell's new "mileage" formula, I figure I'll take any extra mpg I can get out of the Firebird, lol.

I have noticed a more positive difference with Chevron and Shell. I've always had good results with Texaco too, but they're very hard to find, and they can be pretty expensive too.

Ok, I'm done, lol.

BretD 88GTA

P?zti]Originally posted by LAFireboyd [/i]
And we just got a nice new Shell up here in the last couple of years too, so I've been going to it a lot more. And with Shell's new "mileage" formula, I figure I'll take any extra mpg I can get out of the Firebird, lol.[/QUOTE]

Funny you mention that. I just recently switched form Union 76 to Shell and have noticed my car is getting better mileage.

I also see you run Valvoline MaxLife. I'm consdiering that for my next oil change. I've been running Mobil 1 for quite some time, but with 165k now on the clock AND the sterotypical blue smoke at start-up I'm thinking the MaxLife might be worth a try.

The synthetic may be a bit too slipery for my engine at this stage.

LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

Others have posted that they've had good results with MaxLife too. But it'll take a few changes before you see any difference. My puffs went away very gradually. I'd completely forgotten about it before one day suddenly realizing that I hadn't seen any puffs in a long time! So it really helped.

Actually, I never noticed it happening because I wasn't looking for it to happen. I didn't switch to it for that. I switched to it because I know and trust Valvoline, and I figured it would keep my aging engine from getting much worse. I'd never even considered that it would actually make my engine better. So one day, I'm like, there's no more smoke! When did that happen, lol?

sqzbox

Some one called me on that HO in a 87 bird! Turns out it's not!
After a second look at it, it's got the center bolts on the valve covers. I think the guy was trying to BS me into buying it!
Whoever it was, thanks for the tip! SQZBOX

LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

What did the guy say when you discovered it's not an HO? Did he still try to insist it is?

I was in a junkyard today, and I found a 1984 Z28 with the remains of a carbed V8 engine, and it had the 5.0 Liter HO sticker on its rear bumber cover. I got pretty excited for a few minutes, lol. But then I checked the serial number, and it had H for its engine code.