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History / OriginalityGot a question about 1982-1992 Camaro or Firebird history? Have a question about original parts, options, RPO codes, when something was available, or how to document your car? Those questions, answers, and much more!
So I hate to be writing this but it appears my current Thirdgen Project needs to be rounded up and sold.
I may end up with another but for now the 24 month crystal ball shows money tightening up and I should get ahead of it.
I want to finish up the project so that it appeals to the most buyers but don't want to do a full restore. I wonder what sort of buyer this might be (retired weekend driver, restorer, younger hipster)
It's a red 1989 LB9 convertible IROC.
My plan is to sell it in the Spring where it may have the most interest.
The car has a clean title, three previous owners, and is not modified except where necessary (SFC's, STB, AFPR, Bosch D3s, tune) or fun (3:42 rear gears, door speakers and exceptional sound system (non-stock radio)
The car has 118,000 miles. Clean title but has been in some sort of a small front collision. Looking at the engine rails, the bumper mount flanges were crushed up a bit and bent back to shape. All the gaps are lined up and straight. IMHO it's impossible to tell it's been in a bender looking at it from the outside.
My main question is- what do you think matters the most to a likely buyer? What would matter to you?
Working at a car dealer that specializes in pre-owned Corvettes of all years, I can tell you that good cosmetics builds much more resale value than good mechanicals. I can't tell you how many cars I've seen that brought good money just based on how they look, yet little to nothing actually works on them.
Good paint, carpet, wheels/tires, seats, dash, etc. are the basics. When getting third gen specific, our cars seem to bring the most money when they're bone stock since the vast majority of them have been molested at this point. This means no underhood dressup garbage, a stock (appearing) stereo, and stock wheels. With your car being a Convertible, many buyers are going to be scared off by a convertible top that has tears, stains, or a window that's hard to see out of. The average person has no idea how or where to get a convertible top replaced or what it costs, particularly on a car that wasn't a factory-built convertible in the first place.
Me personally, I look for a car that has decent paint as I can't do bodywork myself or afford to pay someone else for it, and also a nice original interior, particularly the seats and door panels as it's literally impossible to find correct replacements for those. A nice dashpad is a big plus too in a Camaro, as they're nearly all cracked/trashed at this point, and quality reproduction pads are not available at any price. I also look for cars that are mostly stock under the hood -- no hacked up wiring harnesses, no carbs on cars that had factory TBI or TPI, etc. Being in GA, rust anywhere is an immediate deal breaker, since rust-free cars are easy to find here.
Post some photos up, and I can give you some more specific advice.
Paint, bodywork, and top. But honestly you're not too likely to "Add" value, at least not in the sense that you'll invest $0.75 and make $1 if/when you sell it. A good repaint will probably cost as much as the car is worth. Being in California, you're screwed. Maybe if you found a buyer in a rust state.... But really, 120k miles and visible evidence of a collision, is a tough spot to be in.
If it looks ok, I wouldn't dump anything into it. If there are obvious cosmetic issues that you can fix cheaply, fix them. Don't bother with regular maintenance items, or carpet, blah blah because you wont get that money back. Same goes for stereo, it may make the car easier to sell, but you'll end up giving away that investment to sell the car.
PDR and Detailing could help the car sell quicker, but maybe not a whole lot of ROI..
PDR might run $200-600 depending on how many dings and really good paint correction can be $1000 in these parts.. You might be able to do a single stage polish and wax for $400 or you can try yourself. You’d be surprised what a difference a swirl remover polish by hand and a polymer wax can do if you know how to polish by hand and put in the time and elbow grease.
Carpet cleaner, a bucket of water, a brush and a shop vac can get the rugs looking nice.. Use upholstery cleaner to spot clean stained seats.. sponge and towel to extract stain..
Meguiars plastX for headlights and plastic windows works great on Vert windows..
Use black shoe polish on steering wheel and shifter
Clean engine always impresses people..
I’d say you could clean it up nice yourself in about 6-8 hours and maybe just do PDR on any bad dings.. but I wouldn’t spend more than $400 to get ROI
When people walk up to it and sit down in it, is there a spring poking them up their butt? do the rips in the upholstery catch on their clothes? does it smell like BO? when they close the door, is it like a refrigerator that goes kinda <<thhhhhhhoook>> or is it more like yerbasic typical Mustang that goes <<clang rattle rattle rattle fall crash echo echo rattle clink>>? does it look / feel / sound / smell / ... iunno the right word... classy? when they touch the steering wheel, is the first thing that comes to mind, I gotta wash my hands before I touch my own car and burn my clothes when I get back home?
Aesthetics is exactly the right track. People are so mechanically ignorant, you wouldn't believe. Obviously it shouldn't blow a big puff of smoke when it starts and simple stuff like that, shouldn't have visible wrecks showing, shouldn't have cord exposed on the tires; but, beyond that, the most important thing is, can THEY imagine THEMSELVES driving it. If it's some disgusting POS that some yahoo that doesn't wear shirts has been "cleaning up the engine bay" by deleting the AC and has put an exhaust that dumps in front of the rear tires so that anyone that gets in it gets back out smelling like they've been strapped under a 30-yr-old dump truck, ... you won't get top dollar for it.
A trip to the quarter car wash to clean up the engine bay (NOT involving hacking wiring out) and the undercarriage to where you can't tell it's driven on 100,000 miles of dirt roads, works WONDERS.
When getting third gen specific, our cars seem to bring the most money when they're bone stock since the vast majority of them have been molested at this point. This means no underhood dress-up garbage, a stock (appearing) stereo, and stock wheels.
A nice dashpad is a big plus too in a Camaro, as they're nearly all cracked/trashed at this point, and quality reproduction pads are not available at any price. I also look for cars that are mostly stock under the hood -- no hacked up wiring harnesses, no carbs on cars that had factory TBI or TPI, etc.
As someone who has recently bought an IROC, I can confirm the above. The number of cars that had been (poorly) modified I found shopping was substantial, the number of dirty and beaten up cars was also surprising. A/C systems hacked off, carb swaps, bolted on gauges, ratty loud exhausts etc. etc. I even found one IROC listed for $12k with the hood louvers affixed with wood screws, through the louver and the hood, "Had one blow off on me once, they're expensive!" - and that was just the tip of the iceberg with that car.
I think the key to selling a car, especially one that is to some degree a project, is a really well written ad with excellent photos. The number of ads I saw that were complete **** was unbelievable. Terrible pictures, terrible descriptions, lack of useful communication... there are cars I might have bought but the sellers were borderline rude. If you haven't read the recommendations in the classifieds section on this site for how to write a great ad check it out. You maybe already knew all that, but bad ads are so prevalent I felt it worth mentioning for all who might read this.
Best of luck selling your project, I hope your future improves enough to keep it if you choose.
Thanks again for more great info everyone. I've re-read everything three times. At least it's good to know I was on the right track buying my car- I had no intention to sell it:
"Me personally, I look for a car that has decent paint as I can't do bodywork myself or afford to pay someone else for it, and also a nice original interior, particularly the seats and door panels as it's literally impossible to find correct replacements for those. A nice dashpad is a big plus too in a Camaro, as they're nearly all cracked/trashed at this point, and quality reproduction pads are not available at any price. I also look for cars that are mostly stock under the hood -- no hacked up wiring harnesses, no carbs on cars that had factory TBI or TPI, etc. Being in GA, rust anywhere is an immediate deal breaker, since rust-free cars are easy to find here."
-navy02ws6
This is what I looked for and it took me a while but I found one three hours away and took it home. Great paint (few blems), great interior, untouched powertrain. Except it was so untouched it needed a lot of hand-on!
Anyway, I'll post up some pics after I clean it up.
I am also thinking I will find a dealer to work with and take it down there see what they say. I welcome any recommendations in the LA area.
Craigslist or EBay could work well if you have a good ad. I don’t think it would be worth consigning it at a dealer and giving up a percentage.
People looking for these cars are scouring the internet.. there’s no a lot of good verts for sale out there..
Good luck!
Agree! There are not a lot of clean verts out there. I drove 850 miles to buy mine, then drove it home. I used Auto Trader, Cars.com and Ebay to find candidates. I found the classifieds on this site to be disappointing. I got very few responses when I reached out to people to inquire about their listings.
Damn....sorry to hear you have to sell the vert Tootie. I followed what you have done to the car and it seems it has been a labor of love for this ride. You have also helped me personally with some of my issues and for that I thank you.
I think I would stay away from the dealer and sell it on your own. I am sure the dealer % would be quite high. Alot of cars are purchased off Craigslist, that's where i found mine. I think Auto Trader is a good one also. Not to sure on Ebay and you will pay a commission on there when sold. I feel there are plenty of people out there looking for these cars. A clean, well running car should sell itself if the price is right. Especially a vert in SoCal!
GLWS and I hope you stay on this board even after you sell the IROC!
A nice dashpad is a big plus too in a Camaro, as they're nearly all cracked/trashed at this point, and quality reproduction pads are not available at any price.
Not true. I just received my OER dash pad from Year one and the quality is every bit as good as the original. The only thing I could find that could be knock-able was that the texture on the dash pad seemed more prominent on this reproduction than the original. Year One is listing it for $619 but during their Black Friday sale it was $400.
My plan is to sell it in the Spring where it may have the most interest.
The car has a clean title, three previous owners, and is not modified except where necessary (SFC's, STB, AFPR, Bosch D3s, tune) or fun (3:42 rear gears, door speakers and exceptional sound system (non-stock radio)
The car has 118,000 miles. Clean title but has been in some sort of a small front collision. Looking at the engine rails, the bumper mount flanges were crushed up a bit and bent back to shape. All the gaps are lined up and straight. IMHO it's impossible to tell it's been in a bender looking at it from the outside.
If you are in California I wouldn't wait until Spring, you guys can drive convertibles year round. Look up craigslist ads for your state to see what they are being advertised for and then add $500. Put it in regular car shows with the for sale sign on it too--Maybe you could get 1/2 the price cash and a future project car?
I don't think it will add to the asking price. I think it will add to the appeal but it's only a $100 bolt on item so I just don't see the buyer willing to pay an increase in asking price just because of the STB. The items you listed it's fair to ask an extra $500 since I've heard of guys paying shops $500 to install the SFCs alone.
I don’t think any aftermarket parts can get you more money. You could use is as a reason for not coming down on price if someone try’s to haggle you though..
"Springtime" is relative. There are a lot of car buyers here in January when Barrett-Jackson is going on. That is my springtime if I were selling a car of interest. Not sure what to tell you about L.A.
Except that it is a much bigger market with a lot more money than any of the "You gotta smog? Bummer, dude." areas. The bummer is your CA-legal car is sellable and registerable to buyers anywhere in N. America; hacked cars are not. So your market is bigger. But, still market to areas with money. Yay area, Maricopa Cty, othe CA counties, Vegas. Plenty of people are comfortable with buying a car in CA. I did, in the 90s.
A list of maintenance and detail, along with detailed pictures will help. It is a challenge for attention spans these days to list out everything, but the more someone is spending, the more they care that you did wheel bearings and seal 01/01/2017 with semi-synthetic wheel bearing grease, for example. Especially if they're driving from L.A. to home a long distance in the springtime.
11-30-2017, 08:48 AM
If you haven't read the recommendations in the classifieds section on this site for how to write a great ad check it out. You maybe already knew all that, but bad ads are so prevalent I felt it worth mentioning for all who might read this.
