Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Hey Joe...

They are videos, here are the links...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6klErTRqHA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7-5IfDfLno

project89

iTrader: (1)

his turbo is larger then what i started with, and only marginally smaller then the 60-1.

before he goes with a larger turbo he needs to get real heade4rs on the car, he still has a ways to go before he maxes out the turbo he has now

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

It is slightly larger than what you started with, and even then it is still restricting him. The headers will only make a difference in spool time, his trap speed will not be effected by it because 15-psi is still 15-psi from the same turbo and engine combination, only his sixty foot and ET will improve with a more free flowing header setup. If that is all he is after that is fine, but he can't expect more horsepower from that same turbo though, just an improvement is spool and launch greatly benefiting his ET. His videos show close to 15-psi with that small turbo, and he's still in the thirteens because he can't launch. With the same 60-1 turbo that you had on his engine he will be laughing his way into the elevens with his setup at 15-20psi, and he has the heads, cam and injectors to easily make that happen with a bigger turbo like that. His backpressure before the turbo is killing him. It may not seem like it to him because he is still in the boat of thinking that 13's is fast, but once he tastes 11's and 12's he will immediately realize what I am sayhing. Both Joe (34Blazer) and I are also in the Grand National game, and we can tell you that it would defeat the purpose to try and squeeze more power and times from a V6 with smallish chinese turbo. It is just a waste of time to try to maximize power out of one because in the end it will still be slow from a trap speed standpoint, and accomplishes nothing...

project89

iTrader: (1)

thing ur forgeting is both my ebay turbo and the 60-s turbo had the same turbine wheel ad housing size, they both had stage 3 turbine wheels, thats why the gn housings were able to be swaped on and off both my old turbos.

with headers backpresure will go down and hp will go up, same with the turbne efficiancy with headers that will go up as well

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Thing your forgetting is how much lbs/min is being forced at 15-psi. His ebay turbo, your ebay turbo, and your 60-1 turbo does not push 92 lbs/min like the PT6765 in the video that I posted, which is why it reflects in his lower ET and trap speed at the same boost pressure level as that Turbo Duster, with both starting out with the same amount of horsepower naturally aspirated. China turbo's aren't efficient to begin with, and although he will realize more by swapping to headers, he is still leaving a lot on the table. Don't believe me? Come borrow my T66 for the day Mark, and change absolutely nothing in your tune...

project89

iTrader: (1)

im not saying a larger turbo wont make more power ,but the 57 mm unit he is running is only 3mm smaller then the 60-1

60-1 is good for about 575-600 hp max
57mm is good for about 550 hp max

thats on an ideal setup

the biggest thing holding that turbo back is the compresor housing itself since it has the small style t4 cover . swaping the compressor cover out for the larger 4 inch inlet and 2.5 inch discharge would make a difference but it would cost less just to buy an ebay gt35

btw the ebay gt35 and the garret/full race 60-1 turbo i have both spec out exactly the same, i.e same size wheels, same blade pitch etc etc they are exact coppies.
same withthe 57mm unit it an exact copy of a garret 57mm

the only difference is the garrets may have slightly tighter compressor wheel to cover tolerences which would make them very mariginally more efficient were talking like maybe 1%

gt35 would be the ideal turbo there is an ebay 66mm as well the downside is it only comes with a .48 ex housing and i belive its only a stage 1 wheel which would choke the hell out of the 3.1
but im sure the 66 compressor side could be swapped onto the current turbo

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

I really need to get my hands on a 3.1, you two got me itching to build one and slap a turbo onto it lol. There's one for sale here in New Jersey and the price seems to be decent for what it is. Freaking had to get out of the Theoretical section, I'm over there arguing with ZONE about SBC vs LSX. As soon as you mention turbo on a SBC, the LSX crowd starts saying not fair. You gotta be kidding me, anything to win an argument...

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Nice.

Yes rob, 13's do feel fast to me, but I have to admit they are slowly getting boring. Thats why I got the injectors so I could turn up the boost. And thats why I got the alky also, so I dont make the engine go boom so easily.

I haven't got to take it down the track with the combination yet. You guys know I've had my learning process issues. I have to say I'd love to see you 2 slap some V6's together. Id learn alot seeing the builld in real time.

Dave, I still want headers, Real ones...not logs, this fall. They cost $$ and you see all the $ I've been putting in the car recently. So its tight here, but you must make me some of them this fall. I want to tear down the engine and see what going on in there why Its too cold outside to drive.

Rob, Dave, get on building up a V6 soon. You know there fun engines with boost and theres no better look on a guys face when he sees a normal stockish V6 keeping up with him or beating him.

project89

iTrader: (1)

lol im working on my v6 build.

i do have another v6 build thats almost complete

remote mount gt35 on a 3.5L v6 but the engine is of the dodge variety not the 60* gm motor the turbo system is complete but i cant install it permanantly on the car till i change the timing chain. the timing chain is about 15k overdue for replacement and i an hear the chain slap already. im afriad the added tq and power from the turbo will snap that chain

whenever ur ready man just let me know and ill get that set of headers done

project89

iTrader: (1)

looks like ill be changing cams again

this is the cam im thinking about buying , its a lil uncoventional but its smaller then my current cam and designed to have that nice idle witghout driveability issues


what ya guys think ?

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Hmm, a turbo 3.5 Dodge Intrepid. Interesting.

project89

iTrader: (1)

the one i have is the older engine it dosent have cop setup, and btw plumbing the charge pipe to twin throttle bodies was not fun.

thinking about disabling the first set of intake runners, manifold has a vacum operated valves to change runner lenght and plenum size with vacum.

not looking forward to the timing chain replacement though the front of that motor is so close to the radiator

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

At first I questioned why you went rear mount, then when I seen you had the Intrepid I remembered how tight those engine bays are. You going MSII with the Dodge...?

project89

iTrader: (1)

there was room to do a front mount but it would have required building all new headers for the car, and not something i wanted to do on it, and even then the charge piping would have been even more of a nightmare

ms 2 extra running the factory coilpacks, though nextime im at the junkyard they have ton of the 3.5's there i may grab the cop setup off one and switch to that.

the setup my motor has is junk cause the spark plug wires run under the intake and they always start arcing out there

TwinTurboROC

Since when? Honestly I think twins are easier to do than a single.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Are you kidding? You can either get your hands on any shorty header that is already done, either that or simply run the stock exhaust manifold. Then you can cut and modify the stock y-pipe, make a single turbo header, and plumb the y-pipe right into it. That is way more simple than making two turbo headers, two down pipes, two wastegate dumps, and two charge pipes. Here is my turbo header just before I welded the T4 flange onto it and ground down the welds (please note that I am saving pics of my completed setup for my new thread)...

project89

iTrader: (1)

i think both are about the same as far as how hard it is to do.
twins maybe a lil bit easier though since with twins a basic log manifold can support a ton of power a pair of log manifolds will do 1000 hp with twins

with a single turbo header design will have to be better planed out

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

I just had to...

project89

iTrader: (1)

lmao


one of my local car clubs here is doing a mountian run here in a few weeks i may throw the turbo onto the dodge just for that and take it back off after till i can get the timing chain replaced

id really like to take the iroc but the car is a lil to twitchy for a nice mountian run yet. boost is to much of a light switch for me to be comfortable going up that twisty road

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Be sure and have plenty-o-beers next to ya while you do it...

project89

iTrader: (1)

quick update , i had installed a 4l80 with a manual valve body and second gear started slipping. so today i took the car over to my friends farm and got the car on the lift and droped the 4l80 and started reinstalling a stock 700r4 until i get the 4l80 looked at.

had to run home to take my gf to work then im going back to work on the car. ill get some pictures up later tongiht when i get back.

34blazer

4L80, nice

project89

iTrader: (1)

yup full manual and transbrake, need to buy a good converter for it though

i did manage to get the car back together tonight unfortunatly the is dead for the time being

i got everything all buttoned up last thing to do was put the stock shifter and cable back in, do that and stick my friend up in the car so i can hook the shift cable to the trans move the detent on the trans into 1st and have him put the shifter in first and slightly snug the bolt

have him move the shifter one gear at a time once he hits od the linkages stops moving, put a lil presure on the bracket with my hand and it jumps into nuetral, then he is able to go to reverse and park

slightly readjust the cable and it snapped when he goes back to first gear and starts moving up threw the gears



so now i need to come up with a stock shifter cable asap

ill get some pics up later, its midnight and im just now eating for the first time today lol , actually i should say im still cooking diner

project89

iTrader: (1)

ive been up since 4am working ont he car today with a friend swaping cams again, the summit 224/224 was just to sleeperish for me. when the car is sitting there idling i want it noticable. so i stuck back in the old cam
the new old cam may be a lil much but it sounds good

excuse the shitty sound quality i took this with my cell phone. not to mention the damn echo in the shop

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

I need to get mine back together, nice dave. Its getting sicker every time..sweet.

project89

iTrader: (1)

this cam will make less power but with an idle like that who cares

the cam really has to much overlap for the turbos but i couldnt stand the stockish idle of the summit cam

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Sounds pretty rough, you have no tunes saved...?

project89

iTrader: (1)

my laptop died and i didnt bring the charger with me, i was able to go back and flash and old tune and its better now.

timming witht hat cam needs to be around 34* at idle witht hat cam, i only had 24* when i shot that video. i took a new one ill post it in a lil while

project89

iTrader: (1)

hey rob by any chance to u happen to have a factory shifter cable laying around? mine broke and none of the junkyards in my area have any auto 3rdgens in them

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

I gotta check, got so much stuff lying around still...

project89

iTrader: (1)

please do , cars ready to rock but i cant get a shifter cable locally, napa can order me one but they want 50 bucks screw that

project89

iTrader: (1)

got the laptop out and bumped idle timing back to 30* it idles better now , have to change my iac settings though as this cam drives it a lil crazy trying to hold a steady idle.

right now its setup to hold a 850rpm idle , im going to change it so its only active on cold starts once the motor reaches 140* ill have the iac fully close and ill set idle speed witht he adjusting screw on the tb

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Sounds much better, don't be surprised if the fast idle screw on the throttle body is capped off on the other side. Got home really late last night and didn't get a chance to get in the garage and look around for the cable, gonna try and do that sometime today...

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Pretty sure I have the shift cable from the '84 TA from awhile back, but not 100% positive. Gonna take a peek now. You should toss that disgusting steering wheel from the car, and buy my old one while your at it...

100_0547.jpg?t=1327176215

project89

iTrader: (1)

thanks rob but i already have an nice condition iroc wheel to put back on the car, but i did just replace the colum in the silverado, and i have the original wheel off that which i think i may put oin the iroc since i liek that steering wheel better.

either way though that crappy small grant wheel is comming out of the iroc

project89

iTrader: (1)

****ing autozone , th eone in cedar said they had the shifter cable so i drive down there yesterday to pick it up get there and they dont have.
so i end up driving to richfield to pick it up
240 miles just to save 25 bucks on a shifter cable
should have just ordered it from napa and paid 2x as much

wouldnt have been as bad if they would have told me from the tsart they didnt have it cause i go down there to do my grocery shopping anyways but atleats if i knew before hand i could have just done it in richfield and picked the cable up there and saved 120 miles

but anyways going over to my friends farm to install the cable tonight and see what i can do to quiet the ex down a lil bit , and then the car is finally done with the exception of putting the 4l80 back in once i get it rebuilt

ZZ3Astro

Not to steal this thread but... how much for that Iroc wheel? :-)

project89

iTrader: (1)

well my megasquirt is dead i knew from day 1 that somethign wasnt right with it
tonight i was having a very hard time getting the engine to idle and or rev up so im idling the car back to its parking spot and all the sudden it runs perfect. so i let it run and rev the motor a few times and its still perfect. then out of nowhere it goes back to not idling and dieing if i touch the throttle.
if the cpu itself is bad im going to buy an ms1 cpu and use that. if the board is shot and not repairable i dont know what im going to do

project89

iTrader: (1)

idling the car to its parking space for the time being

noboostnogo

iTrader: (4)

Why go back tow ms1? Jw specially since u talked me into ms2 v3 with msextra lol

project89

iTrader: (1)

cause a replacement ms1 cpu is only 19$ replacement ms 2 cpu is 110$


its just a money issue right now is all, its going to start snowing here soon and i need to save up for 4 new tires for the silverado 2500 and they aint cheap

project89

iTrader: (1)

ok some updates for some odd reason my ms2 is back to working perfectly and has been for the past 3 days so looks liek all is good

heres an update i copy and pasted from my local forums

we may be getting a x275 dr class at our local track so the car may get setup to run that class

drove the car again today without issues , so im really stumped on why it acted up. i know it wasnt the hot cam i had installed, since it did it with the much milder cam as well

the car is parked for the next 2 weeks since my friend is leaving for training for work for 2 weeks in vegas, when he gets back we are going to start stripping the car down for paint, the car is finally going to get the 2 tone blue/silver metalic paint job that i said it was getting on like page 2.



if the x275 things happens he has a brand new unmachined gm performance parts 4 bolt block that he will sell me which i will buy for x275 if it happens

the plan will to build a 434ci shortblock with 9.5-1 cr toped with afr 227's single plane and fuel injection

and yes i will deffinatly be switching back to ms1

project89

iTrader: (1)

ms1 cpu got here today , i unsoldered my stepper iac mods and had to redo my ignition control mods since the ms1 wont do stepper iac , and has a diff ignition system layout.

but the unit is ready to go

i am setup now with dual table use so i now have 2x 12x12 tables for fuel and ignition versus my 16x16 tables in ms2 so i have alot more tunning reslution now.

i have the tables setup to switch based on map sensor values my first table covers idle to around 12 psi , then it kicks over to my second table which is 13psi to 22 psi so i have lots of tunning points in high boost

unfortunatly my car is locked in my friends barn and he is in vegas till friday so when he gets back friday im going to get the ecm back in the car and hopefuly get to drive it around and get some videosdepending if i get to it before it gets dark.
dam headlight switch is not working so the car dont have headlights right now hopefully its just some bad wiring that the previous owner did that i can fix easily as ill be able to fix that on the spot, not so much if i need a new light switch


when the car does come apart for the good build i am going to replace the wiring in the entire car while im at it since the po really screwed it up

77nomad

iTrader: (1)

Don't you hate that? My 86 Pick up could dim the headlight with the ****. I cut a plug out of one in the JY. Wired it color too color and never had an issue. Never did understand why they hacked the original.

project89

iTrader: (1)

let me give u an idea what i started with lol


its hard to make out but the previous owner used bolt cutters or snips and just hacked the original harness in half to get rid of it

and yes the return line back to the tank is hooked to the main vacum port on the carb

all the crap that was left to rip out

that wasnt even the bad part they hacked up the wiring under the dash as well, fuel pump was wired directly to the key with no fuse.alt wire directly to fuse block. the radio harness was cut in half then not vene taped or capped off and left just hanging in the dash.

that actually started a small fire in the car the wiring was so bad and is still bad enough i dont leave the car sitting with the battery connected.

im hoping to get the last bit sorted this weekend before the snow comes so i can focus on getting the car painted

project89

iTrader: (1)

dam only pic i have of the inside here u can see some of whats hanging from undfer the colum and were the radio used to be, dont mind the wires hanging out the side behind my aluminum panel they were for my ign and fuel pump switch aloong with my wideband harness

project89

iTrader: (1)

well unfortunatly it was sleeting and snowing all day friday, and overnight we got 6+ inches of snow.so maybe next weekend something will happen

77nomad

iTrader: (1)

Nice panel. I just picked up AEM's new failsafe Wideband. It freaking cool. The output can trip a zillion different things incase it runs outside the parameters you set. It runs lean, the output can pull the ground on my MSD and shut it down. Or trip a boost controller to dump the PSI. . The way I plan on using it is with a MS3 and having it switch to a different fuel table and pull 2* of timing across the board if it goes lean. Or it could simply turn on a light on the dash. But it turns red anyhow when it goes into failsafe.

project89

iTrader: (1)

thanks lol mad eit out of the back half of the stock ecm case, no sence in wasting a good piece of aluminum lol.

ms3 has a built in afr saftey feature that u can use as well, the thing about those systems is at wot the wideband is lagging behind in its readings so by the time the system does anything it will prolly be to late

77nomad

iTrader: (1)

Really! I guess thats why I'm here. I am lacking in both boost and efi. I am gonna whip up a engine test stand soon to put my 383 on and fire up. If I can get it to idle with the Commander 950 I'll be happy. Plus I just wanna hear it run again. The MS3 is probably going to be after Christmas.