transamice

I have a stock 87 TPI auto with rmt 24lbs inj afpr walbro pump at 4psi boost.
Im having some trouble getting my rmt setup to run %100.
When I gradually roll into boost it doesnt supply the fuel proper but in WOT it performs better but gets too much fuel.
I installed a wb02 sensor and get readings of 11 in boost but if I keep in boost for 2 secs it drops to 10.
What can I use to perfect this setup, the NA part runs fine just in boost Im having the issues.
I thought the stock setup could handle upto 8 psi, Im sure I read that somewhere online.
Any help is appreciated.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

More information is needed. You said your running a stock L98 with 24-lb injectors, so right there your running 2% more fuel over stock because L98's came with 22-lb injectors. Are your running LT1 injectors? Did you get a chip burned to compensate for the extra fuel? You mentioned your running an afpr, but where is your base fuel pressure set? I'm not too sure about stock ECM's being able to correct for 8-psi of boost, because normally they can only correct for up to 6%, which is why we choose our injectors based on our setup, and adjust pulse width to get it as close to 0% O2 correction as possible....

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

Perfecting it isn't going to happen. Not with the FMU anyway.
It sounds like you have too much fuel pressure vs boost with that FMU. Reduce the spring so that it does less fuel PSI vs. intake PSI. I would say tune it with the chip but you can't because the ECM knows nothing about boost and nothing about fuel pressure (FMU raising it).
If all you want is 4 PSI of boost I would just remove the FMU and install an AFPR and set it at 53 PSI and tune the chip PE Mode. Make sure you have a fuel pump in decent shape (new GM or Walbro). What software do you use to tune?

transamice

Im not using an FMU, running just stock setup with LT1 24lbs injectors and 1:1 afr pump is new, as for prom Im using a stock performance prom from GM that was made for 87 3rd gens I forget the bin code.
What do you mean PE mode on the chip?

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

He is referring to wide open throttle mode (alpha-n). MAF input is ignored, and the ECM uses the RPM and throttle position to create this airflow value, based on a preconfigured lookup table from the factory. This needs to be adjusted after you determine your air fuel ratio, otherwise you may run too lean or too rich because there is no O2 correction in this particular mode, unless it is programmed to have correction like in some of the turbo tweak chips. In part throttle your ECM is having trouble because it is still in closed loop, and the MAF can't compensate. If you want it to be perfect, install 30-lb injectors because that will at least cover you up to 15-psi in case you want a little more down the road, burn a new chip for the injectors, as well as your new MAF scalers so it can provide adequate fueling under boost at part throttle, then tune your PE....

transamice

Im lost with the ecm stuff, can a prom be flashed to handle this setup or would I need a whole new engine/ fuel management system?
The 24 lbs handle it no problem, reason I went this way is I read an article that explained roughly what was done with a 91 Camaro with a supercharger.
http://carcraft.automotive.com/9336/854/index.html
Then again thats map but still gave me the idea for the setup.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

My bad on the FMU. Street Lethal said what needs to be done. All GM proms were performance tunes. Why would GM make proms that don't perform? As to a "special" GM performance tune..........there isn't one. Maybe you put a Vette bin in there which is sometimes called a performance tune. Which if you did then you have way too much timing advance even for 4 PSI.

You put a turbo/SC on it without knowing how to tune? Gotta love low boost turbos and EFI.

Every time I read one of those magazines articles I just shake my head and say that is why I stopped buying them.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

"Using the fuel-pressure and horsepower equations, we know that the 24-lb/hr injectors will safely feed 450 hp that will get us into the low 12s. Or we could build a monster 420-inch mouse and get 37-lb/hr injectors for $80 more and feed 737 hp at 100 psi. Elevens here we come! CC"

I guess they build in fairy tale land. Where does one get a pump that can put out 100 PSI at that flow rate. How ridiculous. This is the kind of info that makes for bad builds. Just buy the right injectors and get it over with. Way cheaper than some expensive magical pump. That entire article is full of bad advice.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Without tuning capability, an FMU like one in a procharger kit is your best bet. They have bolt on blower packages for 6-10 psi that are suppose to run on stock motors well.

Still need to pull some timing at WOT in boost, and still need to adjust air fuel by tuning the fuel pressures. Its not the best way to do things but in your case, may be the best option. You have the wideband, now just need a fuel pressure gauge taped to your window so you can read whats going on during a run and adjust from there.

There is a company that sells big MAF sensor kits to handle the fueling for these MAF cars. Mainly targeted at the Vettes. Forget the name but they do alot of blower builds and do chips modified for the large MAF that will handle the high flow from the boost.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

Most tuners will say that when under boost the AFR should be 12:1 or less (many prefer 11:1). For an N/A engine it should be around 13:1 AFR for best power (not cruise).

With that, using a MAF and turbo (not supercharger) how can the MAF and ECM determine when the air is just N/A (13:1 AFR) or pressurised (11:1 AFR)? With a SC the "tuner" can program the TPS tables so that as TPS goes up the table richens the AFR because with the SC the boost is linear. Ain't gonna happen with the turbo, stuff goes lean or is too rich when the tune is done this way. The problem the "tuners" run into is that turbo boost is non-linear and the MAF can't see boost. The MAF can be crutched with an SC to run decent, but not with a turbo. With the turbo you either have to tune it to floor it and deal with the way rich when not floored.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

I never used it nor have I seen anyone using those kits, but it was my understanding the larger MAF made it possible to read much higher than the factory 255 grams second so it could cover the larger amounts of air flow from the turbo. In that sense it would beable to handle boost since the air flow changes with the pressure but ecm is not boost referenced so the timing tables would not beable to function like they should. Need an aftermarket ignition to pull a deg per psi or something to that effect.

Thats just some theory I was thinking but I dont know for sure. They advertise it as supercharged bin, so you are probably right. Assuming linear boost curve, it added the fuel based on rpm rise and possibly PE mode adders.
http://www.blowerworks.net/

they have some interesting products. If you could add some additional injectors and one of their turbo fuel controllers, you can tune the extra fuel for boost just fine, but dont know where you would put in the extra injectors. It would be cheaper to run 91-92 ecm and code $59 like i did. I did that swap for about 180 bucks which included ECM with 350 TPI memcal for SD, and MSD 3-bar map.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

Sure, the MAF sees more air but still doesn't know boost. You said you want to pull timing during boost.........well you want a richer AFR in boost too. Sure the MSD box can pull boost, but my point is it can't change the AFR. That is, the MAF is only doing one AFR. With MAP you do two WOT AFRS (one for boost and one when not in boost). Yes, SC is possible with MAF because boost is a function of TPS. Not so with turbo. It is a function of load............which is MAP. They can get away with a SC MAF bin, but with turbo it gets ugly and all you can do is the way rich bin. Guys with MAF and turbo run rich and always wack the throttle to put it in PE mode because just cruising with less than 80% TPS and boost will hole a piston with MAF (no PE mode).

Yes, $59 is the way to go. The problem is that GM discontinued the 350ci PROM and now it is expensive. The truck ECM is a nice alternative, but needs boost code.

tequilaboy

For a turbo application with a high flow capable MAF as described above, I'd be inclined to adjust the PE target AFR as a function of load rather than rpm as is normally done in the 165 bins.

This could be easily accomplished by inputting the LV8 signal into the normal (PE vs rpm) 2d lk up table in place of the rpm signal.

Since load roughly represents torque, it can serve as an indicator of boost if properly scaled.

With standard scaling, LV8 can be approximated by:
airflow * 4800 rpm / actual rpm

If you cut the normal LV8 scaling in half, 128 would represent full NA load. Values above 128 could be considered boosted.

Then simply ramp the Target AFR from 13.0 to 11.0 for example, as a function of LV8.

A load dependent AFR target could then accomodate both the boosted and NA regions of operation with a variable target AFR.

The only trick is coming up with the scaling to determine how much flow for a given rpm is considered boosted and how much to enrich the target AFR for said load.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

So even with a higher capacity grams/sec MAF, the boosted charge would not effect the MAF reading? I would think the more air going past from the denser charge it would make it move higher in the MAF tables so you could program the MAF tables to input a certain fuel value. Same as tuning 165 right now, change MAF values to add or subtract fuel, if only you could log MAF voltage as well as g/s. I think there was a way to do that but as it stands now, you cant.. Because n/a it wont hit the MAF limit lets say 512 g/s but under boost it certainly can. I'd be curious to try it, and with stock motor with 8 psi, a LS1 MAF conversion should beable to handle the air flow required.

LS1 cars spray dry shots of nitrous before MAF so it can read that extra air flow. I would have thought a turbo would do the same thing. I think ford guys blow thru the MAF as well but i've seen superchargers do that, not sure i've seen turbos do that since i dont follow fords

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

I was told the 305 TPI SD bins would work too, just need to use 305 knock sensor but it wouldnt be accurate since the bore/harmonics are off. Doesnt really matter because I use a 350 bin on a 400 small block which has different bores/stroke and havent had a problem. Seems to pull timing at only 35 deg for cruise so it may be overly sensitive.

tequilaboy

Orr, yes the high capacity MAF (with appropriate tuning) will still measure and report the airflow, and the ecm can provide the fueling for a given target AFR and flow rate.

The issue being discussed here is how to handle the target AFR for a turbo, since the desired target AFR may depend upon whether the turbo is spooled or not, albeit for a short time.

Lets say you want to target 11.0 in boost to keep the exhaust temps under control, this might be a little rich off boost at WOT at the same rpm if you were to use a normal rpm dependent target AFR. Not terribly rich, but perhaps richer than optimal.

A load dependent target AFR would be one method to fine tune the target as a function of load (or boost) to optimize both the boosted and off boost states, and everywhere in between.

The MAF will still measure all of the flow, but it may be desirable to have a more flexible target than what works for NA or centrifugal superchargers.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Agreed. Calculating airflow by multiplying the current MAF Table value by the current MAF Table Scaler. The scaled LV8 value would have a determined reference value which could then be filtered by the program to track load changes at a slower rate than the one used to calculate the current LV8, a la the '7148. It's all in the scaling...

bl85c

iTrader: (2)

The problem with rescaling the LV8 like that is the formula is intended to express volumetric efficiency up to 100%. Matter of fact, LV8 is identical to ve, I set up a formula in tunerpro for ve and the LV8 was almoast identical in the logs. You end up limited to the last row of the main spark table in boost when LV8 pegs. I haven't tried rescaling it like that and watching what it does when my motor comes into boost, but I don't think it will work like that. AFR won't be a problem until you max the maf at 255 g/sec, THEN it becomes 'alpha-n' because you're trying to tune with the power enrich tables. And when the maf is maxed LV8 goes out the window. And since running a maf in boost will skew the readings LV8 gets even less reliable...

But I am working on a solution to all this, something along the lines of BAUJP, but for maf '165 cars. 3 bar map input replacing LV8, extended a couple tables, nitrous control, support for larger mafs, launch retard and the list goes on. I have about 40% of what I set out to do done & functioning. Once I get the beta done I'd like you to rework it for v8 cars tequilaboy.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

The idea behind what I was saying would be to eliminate the affect of short duration change. That program has an LV8 factor table which is read using the LV8 delta above the minimum as the index, with the output from the table representing a percentage of the normal injector pulse width, which is then multiplied by the output from another table controlled by coolant temperature. The result is doubled, then used as a multiplier for the otherwise normally calculated injector pulse width.

bl85c

iTrader: (2)

Yeah, but it seems complicated for a simple calculation like that. It is, after all, an approximation and only as good as the input. It may be a feasible workaround that lets you skip using a map but I can't see it as reliable. What kind of lag are we looking at when all this recalcing is done on a calculation that already has a visible delay? I mean you don't even see an LV8 change until the airflow change is picked up by the maf...

transamice

Can someone explain what code $59 is?
PE mode and LV8?
Sorry, Im learning.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Code 59 came from a group of guys modifying the cyclone and typhoon GM computer code to suport a 3 bar map sensor and bunch of other cool things. You would need to convert over to 90-92 ECM and add a MAP sensor, here is the website http://code59.org/

Probably little over your head at the moment but something to look into in the future.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

what is your exact setup? whats the specs of the turbo and how does it spool? The right turbo will spool pretty quick so you can jump to the higher end of the MAF/LV8 tables. I know my turbo setup goes to max boost pretty quickly and holds there so I'm either out of boost or WOT in heavy booost.

I think it will depend on where the turbo spools and with that information you can dial in the MAF tables to fuel the situation at hand. With 4-8 psi I dont think it will need to be much richer than 11.5-12.0 to 1 which is simple PE adders to get there if the MAF itself cant handle it. I think it can be done on MAF but i'd be curious to see how it would work on a 512 g/s cap instead of stock 255. I had a 383 that would cap the 255 g/s at 4500 rpm on motor and i'm tuning a L98 setup now that caps that at near 4800 rpm range. A turbo car would need alot more but I'm wondering if a modified LS1 type 512 g/s MAF can handle most of the fueling if its reading the boosted charge.

Turbo spooled would and should have higher air flow going thru the MAF so it should read higher g/s so the MAF would handle the flow. IF it maxed, PE mode would have to take over.

If the turbo aint spooled you shouldnt have high air flow thru the MAF. When its spooled more flow is moving thru the MAF so it should beable to compensate Air flow will change whether your in boost or not..

For 4 psi I'd tune 12.5 to 1 still. For 8, i'd go 11.5-12.0 on a good combustion chamber. That should be MAF range if calibrated for higher g/s values.

I never tried it but I'd be very curious how it all works with a high flow MAF setup.

tequilaboy

To add some perspective, my present tune with the Blowerworks MAF will provide normal fuel control for up to 765 gm/sec airflow using 63# injectors. The normal 255 gm/sec range has been extended by a factor of 3.

The MAF handles all the airflow, PE mode is only used to provide the desired target AFR, not to compensate for MAF limitations.

The LV8 calculation has been rescaled to provide standard load values despite the increased MAF range to maintain normal tuning of any LV8 dependencies such as AE, spark, etc.

With a centrifugal supercharger, I'm not too concerned with using the LV8 as a boost indicator, but I like this idea for a turbo. Since centrifugal boost is predictable, I just enrichen my AFR target progressively with rpm from an NA like setting at 2,000 rpm to an 11.5-ish target at 6,000 rpm. A flat 11.5 AFR target in PE mode would work well also.

A turbo on the other hand could be anywhere from 0-20+ psi at WOT and 3,000 rpm, so a variable AFR target would be very nice thing to have. The good news is, it can be easily done if there is a real need.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

One of the easiest ways to move from the '85 - '89 MAF TPI ECM to run boost is to use an EBL Flash ECM. All that is required to the car is to move 4 wires in the ECM harness connectors (7 wires for an '85), plumb in a 2-bar MAP sensor (or 3-bar), and use the MAF wires to wire the MAP to the ECM. The MAF may stay in place but will no longer be used.

Plug in the EBL Flash ECM and turn the key. It is that simple. Plus you get boost fuel multiplier tables and boost spark retard tables. Along with being able to flash in a new calibration in seconds. No chip swapping.

I know that some folks in this thread won't like to read what I just typed, but it is the truth.

The '7165 ECM has issues with data logging, has no inkling of boost control. And the MAF sensors are unreliable and expensive to replace.

Going speed density with an EBL Flash is a viable and decent solution to the problem of boost on the early TPI systems.

RBob.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

Some guys understand the problem. Some don't. Here is an example for turbo apps. exaggerated.

Cruising down the high at 4000 rpm, no boost, light load, TPS less than 60% (no PE mode, closed loop feedback) => engine consumes 500 cfm
Pulling a long hill at 2500 rpm, 15 PSI boost, TPS less than 60% => engine consumes 500 cfm

With MAP the ECM drops out of closed loop and does the rich AFR for the 15 PSI.
MAF is blind to the fact that the engine is under boost and does the closed loop feedback and holes a piston. It just knows that it needs enough fuel for 500 cfm.....oooppps.

Yes, MAF can be made to work. I am not saying it can't. Just saying it is FAR from optimal with turbo. And for inexperience (and some experienced tuners) a way to destroy a good engine in a hurry.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

It sounds easy.

Probably directed at me. I have to say this to me is the first time I agree that the EBL is a good solution vs cost and effort

I thought about modifying the 7165 code but stopped because of the datalogging problems it has. It used to really annoy me. Never mind it having fits during a boost run. I have a bunch of them sitting in a box now and that is where they will stay. Never did like the only 16K of space either.

Yes, an easy solution but the most costly. I think the cheapest but most difficult is the 730 ECM with $59 code and a V6 PROM.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

I see where that could pose a problem if you do run into a situation in boost at a lower rpm that equals the same air flow at a higher rpm but less load situation. makes sense, the maf is just tuning for 14.5-14.7 or so. I guess since LV8 is high and if you set the TPS settings correct you can get into PE mode at those low rpms but its not worth the effect I suppose.

For his setup with low low boost, you may beable to get away with using MAF based setup but I definately agree its not optimal at all. Just throwing out ideas on if this can work to keep this simple as possible for the OP.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

You got it. With my setup that will cruise up a hill at 10+ PSI around 2500 RPM and 25% TPS using a MAF setup tweaked/hacked for boost would be a problem and/or not close to optimal. Suppose I tune it to hit PE MODE here to not hole a piston. Now when I am cruising I will hit PE MODE very often wasting gas which is the exact opposite of why I went with a turbo. Too not make HP and suck up gas when cruising.

Yes, it can easily work with his 4 PSI.
He is just running into the problem of the stock tune in PE MODE being too rich. GM made the open loop PE very rich. Even though he stacked on 4 PSI which should lean it out a little.......at the same time he installed slightly larger injectors so it is a wash and therefore still very rich.
He could tune it out by reducing the target AFR table.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

I wanted to post this for someone, as although I've been discussing adapting the MAF Translator to work in conjunction with the '7165 for my turbo application with Bob Bailey, he just read through this thread and had this to add, and I really appreciate him giving his time....;

"LV8 is better than MAP for controlling spark and fuel, as it represents the air that actually made it into the cylinder. Its true 'load'. The issue when converting to a boosted application is to keep it from maxing too early. Since it is derived from MAF, the MAF measurement limit is the true issue. Once the MAF maxes, then LV8 will undercalculate as RPM rises....

The BlowerWorks L98 MAF gizmo is just a Ford MAF in an aluminum tube. A cheap MAF upgrade for you guys would be a Lightning or Cobra MAF. You just need to find one with enough range. Most of the Ford MAF curves are posted on the internet.

So, what you want is a MAF that doesn't hit its limit until you are at full boost and 75% of your redline. Then scale LV8 accordingly so that your spark table can adjust for load properly. Then set your PE thresholds to work from TPS or LV8.

Beyond that, you could play with PE AFR/LV8 so that you are only moderately rich at lower boost...."

bl85c

iTrader: (2)

I see the logic. But it's still an aproximation that's only as good as the info that's plugged in and it still has no direct way of knowing if it's in boost. Adding a map to make it a map/maf system like modern systems looks like a better solution to me. Even if the maf is pegged you still have a map to change wot fuel. You can change the wot table to fuel vs map, or do a 3d table for map vs rpm ect. and add a map qualifier for pe, which I've already done on mine or even add a small ve table to control fuel. Fixing the datalogging is something I'm looking into also, but it's pretty far down the list. I am, however, inclined to believe that it may be more of a tunerpro problem because my scanner at work will hook up, log and continue to log without a hiccup. EBL is also a good solution, but some may want to skip spending the $ on an ecm & map if they can keep the '165 and just add a map via the egr wiring.

bl85c

iTrader: (2)

We've really gone off topic here with programming stuff that's way over the op's head and I want to apologize for pirating your thread to discuss this.

Do you have a datalog you can share with us or do you just tune with a guage?

transamice

I dont have any datalogging, I have a wideO2 sensor with the datalogging but not the wire or device to read from.
Just using live readings from the gauge for now.
Correct me if Im wrong but I think I need a reader to access the data.
Whats the EBL, is there something I can read about it and how do I connect a MAP sensor to the egr wiring?
For now I reconnected the FMU 6:1 and its better but not a final solution.
I was running into problems like hesitations without the FMU like a missfire when I gradually went into boost.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

For more info on the EBL see the link in my sig. You can connect the output of the WB to the EBL so that the reported AFR is included in the data stream. The data logging software and cable is included with the system.

Usually use the MAF sensor wires to connect to the MAP sensor. Just need a MAP sensor connector pigtail and splice the three wires to it.

Because of the high speed data logging and plethora of data from it, it is easy to see what is going on with the engine.

RBob.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

The FMU helped? You said you were already on the rich side?

From the sounds of it with your experience the EBL would fit you well.

bl85c

iTrader: (2)

Connecting a map through the egr wiring is part of an upcoming version of 6E that I'm working on. It's still in beta though so don't concern yourself with it yet. You need to familiarize yourself with tuning in the meantime, you can't put a turbo on and expect the ecm to run it properly with a few auxillary changes like an fmu. Start With small things like the power enrichment enable constants, then move onto improving the power enrich tables & accel enrich and just continue to experiment & learn. Go slow and learn what each change does.

Do you have a flash programmer or something like an ostrich to tune with?

transamice

As for my tuning I just have stock setup with an FMU back on, its all I have to work with at the moment till I decide what route to go with.
I like the sound of the EBL ECM, would probably be the solution.
Like I mentioned the car runs fine just need to perfect my afr in boost and keep easy on the boost, only 4 psi for now.
The FMU smooths the transition into boost, this isnt a daily driver I am patient and sure it will come together soon enough.
Does the EBL have torque converter control?

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Yes, there is full control of the TCC lockup. Low/high gear tables with lockup/unlock via TPS% versus MPH, re-lock delays, forced lockup MPH, and so on. All user programmable.

RBob.

tequilaboy

As a follow up to the earlier discussion, for a test, I expanded the LV8 scaling to accomodate 150% load (0-384 range) and also set the PE AFR target to use of LV8 instead of rpm.

It is working fine. LV8 is going above 255 by 3,000 rpm with approx. 2 psi boost. LV8 continues to climb into the mid 300s as boost and rpm increase. Target AFR above 360 load was set to 11.8.

In today's 90 F ambient air, the MAF flow peaked at 400 gm/sec at 6,000 rpm with 330 indicated for load and 106 F for air charge temperature at 9 psi after intercooling. At 330 load, target AFR was running at 11.85.

Load based AFR appears to work very well and would be well suited for a turbo application for the reasons already discussed.

I also made a WOT pull in 4th gear from about 1,000 rpm to 2,600 rpm or so, roughly 0-1 psi. LV8 hovered around 200 for the entire range of rpm with an AFR target at a conservative 12.51.

bl85c

iTrader: (2)

Oh sure, it works when you cheat! Jk. Cool, firstfirebird will be happy to hear that. He's looking for a way to get his maf BMW stuff to 'understand' boost. Are you still using a hitachi maf, just in a bigger tube?

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

It sounds right to me. That is exactly how MAP is tuned and like you said earlier using LV8 with the MAF is the way to go for tuning boost.

I forget is the LV8 a 8-bit or 16-bit number? Since it is 0-384 then it must be 16-bit and the table range only allows for up to 384, correct?

tequilaboy

LV8 is an 8 bit value, I rescaled it internally to represent 150% of the normal range and also adjusted the displayed value to read from 0 to 384 for display purposes. Load dependent factors were also adjusted for the new scale.

As an added bonus, I now have 3 spark columns to play with in the boosted LV8 range now, as compared to only one column previously for LV8 above 208.

bl85c

iTrader: (2)

LV8 is like airflow for sd though. I preffer maf because it uses a sensor to directly infer airflow, instead of calcualting it from other stuff. A map gives you actual pressure, instead of a calculation. Simple, direct and immediate. AE tuning is better with map as well. When I was using LV8 nomatter what I did to the AE tables I just couldn't get that initial lean blip to go away. With map I can see the pressure change ahead of the change in airflow and head the lean blip off. Could that initial lean blip cause problems? Probably not, but someone using heavy power adders might find out and end up with what's in my sig. Maybe a combo of map for transient stuff and LV8 for steady state would be best.

And my spark table has 8 columns under boost so .

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

I can't say which sensor system is better for boost, but I will say that either one with the proper code will work well. This is the first time I have heard of someone modifying the MAF code to make it work properly using LV8. When done this way I think it is a wash using properly coded MAP code for boost. It is good to hear that the 165 ECM still has a good life with non-linear boost.

As for the 165 ECM ALDL lockup: I often thought it was a TunerPro and other free software problem not syncing with the ALDL and just jamming a request at it. It didn't go over real big...........but neither did my explanation of memory leaks in the software causing other apps to crash. I was told my computer must have "ghosts" in it. A software term for I can't figure out where my bugs are. After that I stopped reporting problems/bugs.

I had to make changes in the MAP code to go into PE MODE using MAP and TPS, not just TPS as was originally programmed. A few other little changes here and there. It sounds like using LV8 to do the same would get the 165 ECM there.

I often questioned why GM used TPS so heavily instead of a combination of LV8 or MAP for the respective ECM. I am starting to dive into the 4LX0E transmission code to get it to work better with turbocharged boost. Again GM used the TPS heavily when MAP/LV8 should have been involved (in my opinion anyway).