89IROCZZ4

I am interested in possibly doing this to a big block camaro I may be getting. How difficult is it to install as opposed to an efi procharger? Also, how expensive? Is it any cheaper at all then an efi procharger setup?

Also, the big block has this as a rotating assembly: Probe Industries 496ci stroker kit: cast steel crank, light weight 4340 racing rods, forged domed pistons (10.2:1)


What would I need to change? Thanks for your help!

KS91Z28

It's actually pretty easy to do, and it's cheaper than an EFI steup. Give ATI a call @ (913) 338-2886 and they'll be more than happy to talk to you about it.

blown3rdgen

need to change- pistons, cam, entire fuel system (assuming n/a currently)

Matt

KS91Z28

The pistons will be fine, granted they will limit the amount of boost he'll be able to run. Anywhere from 8:1- 9.5:1 would be ideal.

As far as the cam and fuel system go, I'm not sure what you're basing your information off of. I guess I missed the part where he described his cam and fuel system.

blown3rdgen

In (....) , I put assuming naturally aspirated- which I inferred from "domed pistons 10.2 to 1". A N/A set up is NOT going to be optimal for a blow thru set-up.

IMHO- 1) If staying with those pistons (10.2 to 1) I would spray rather than s/c- otherwise I would change them. I don't feel like it is worthwhile to run low boost (4-5#) given the expense of the s/c and the rest of the set up 2) s/c cam typically needs more ex duration and lsa 3) blow thru fuel systems are expensive- need BIG pump like A1000 or equivalent, big lines, boost refenced FPR, modified carb (which you can do yourself)

Once again this is assuming you have a N/A set up. If already optimized for blow thru- please disregard, or post more exact specs on current set up

Thanks
Matt
Blow thru camaro

KS91Z28

Actually, with an intercooler, he could run 7 - 8 psi on pump gas, even more on some C16. The C5 Corvette guys do it all the time. Hell, they put 7 psi of intercooled boost to the '04 Z06 (11:1 compression) we have in the shop and made an extra 200 rwhp on pump gas.

Although I agree, 10.2:1 is not optimal for a FI application

89IROCZZ4

Here is the heads and cam ...

-Crane Solid Roller .615"/.636" 245/254 110 lobe separation, Isky roller lifters, Comp Pro Magnum Rock

-Dart Pro1 Aluminum heads 325cc

Think I would be able to run 6-8psi intercooled and pick up 200rwhp on this also? What about the crank? Would it be strong enough?

KS91Z28

The crank and rods should be good to around 900 hp at the flywheel.

The cam is a little tight for a forced induction application. The lobe seperation really needs to be between 112 - 116 degrees.

The heads would be great for forced induction.

89IROCZZ4

WOW!!!! You made my night!!!!! I was sure that crank would be only good to about 700 or so. Thanks!

89IROCZZ4

Also, if I did a cam swap to the ideal cam, do you think it'd be worth it still to go with a blower, knowing the rest of my setup?

KS91Z28

Considering you could pick up an F1C or F1R kit with intercooler, brackets, pulleys, etc. for less than $4,500, I would say yes, but you know what they say about opinions.....

89IROCZZ4

thats a good question too - what blower should I go with? Not a p1sc or anything I suppose right? I didn't realize it would be a $4500 investment. For some reason I was thinking 2000-2500.

leeperryracing

for a healthy big block, go no smaller than the D-series head units especially with those 325cc dart heads you listed.

KS91Z28

You're right, an F1C or F1R might be too big for your application. A D1SC would probably work just fine. An intercooled D1SC would probably run you around $3,500. A non-intercoooled setup would probably run you about $2,500.

leeperryracing

I think the D1-SC is as thin as the line gets between 100% streetable and kick a$$ power.

89IROCZZ4

so if i leave it as is, and get a d1sc, what hp do you think i could turn out with pump gas? what about with race gas?

man i'm excited

blown3rdgen

I would strongly encourage you to read/ research the blow thru section on www.turbomustangs.com

I agree at least a d1sc or bigger. Boost is addictive you may start low, but eventually you'll want more. All of us here have probably up the boost at least once on our set ups.

A new cam is cheap in comparison with the big picture- definitely worth it. Also verify valve springs, because boost will require slightly more seat pressure. (may not be an issue- but good to know)

If you keep that compression (10.2 to 1), and try to run 7-8psi you will be running race gas or you will have so much timing pulled out its nuts, if not-good luck- you may pop it.

I am familiar with late model cars (ltx,lsx) and the impressive gains that are possible when supercharged. I used to work for Corvette Masters and still do help on there "dyno days." They too are an ATI dealer which is where I have gotten all my kits. Late model cars can run closer to the edge due to several things. First they have direct port fuel injection. A carb will never get as exact an a/f ratio to every cylinder. Second there is there ability to dissipate heat. Aluminum heads are a good start, but not the same as an all aluminum lsx. Third is timing control. You will probably need to lock the dist or run some type of btm. Also through the use of knock sensors, etc late model cars have the ability to "save" themselves somewhat if things aren't 100% due to bad gas or running a little hot or whatever.

The carb will act as a heat sink and the wet manifol helps cool the air, so many blow thru guys do not run intercoolers. The gain is not as significant. However, the cooler the intake the better. (see race water/air intercoolers- just not practical on street car). Water/meth inj is another option to fight detonation= increased octane/cooler charge (I use this method)

Also what kind of fuel system do you have?

Not trying to start an arguement here, or write a book. Don't take my word for it or anyone elses for that matter. Keep doing research online/contact vendors/talk to people who have similar set ups. Doing it right the first time will cost a chunk of money, but be cheaper in the long run.

Matt
blow thru camaro

89IROCZZ4

Matt, thanks for the help - I actually have an LS1 T/A right now but am possibly switching to a BBC third gen. In your opinion, may it be just better for me to stick a heftier cam in there for power? How much horsepower n/a do you think I am leaving on the table with that cam?

blown3rdgen

I can't recommend a cam for you. You can always go bigger; however, that is not always better.

What is the purpose of the car? drag/street
Auto/Manual? Stall?
Gearing?
Intake set up? single/dual plane/tunnel ram?
RPM range? Shift points?

A bigger cam may make a few more horsepower up top(and sound good), but be a pig down low and possibly slower due to torque loss and power under the curve. I'd call Cammotion or comp cams.

Matt

blown3rdgen

For you the way the motor sits now- The cheapest way out would be to spray it.

I'm on my second blow thru set up and love it. I like the looks, sound, power, uniqueness, etc. I highly recommend it. However, it does cost some $$ initially to do it right.

Matt