Kingtal0n

Yes sir, wanted to report it first hand, a little Eaton M60 Hooked to 3 car batteries and some kind of electrical driven motor...

made 22 PSI of boost on demand pushing a little 250Cubic inch V6 to 340 horsepower...

Dynamic turbo and some magazine will have a 5 page article concerning it, and i will get some more info for everyone..

Lee7

probably works, but also probably sounds like ***.

weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

FruityOne

What about when the batteries die out? Then its like running low on the bottle.

1989RS

the weight gained by the batteries and electric motor would probably match the parasitic loss gained when attaching a belt from it to your engine, or at least thats what i think

1989RS

lol, did u fall asleep on the e?

Lee7

nah, thats just me trying to impersonate what an electic motor spinning at ~60,000 rpm would sound like.

B4Ctom1

I will file this with the rear mounted turbo system.

Kingtal0n

omg the relay he was using to switch to battery power on the supercharger melted open so the supercharger got stuck ON!

It then proceeded to melt the battery terminals together (yes in a puddle of lead) and the battery EXPLODED!

there were sulfric fumes EVERYWHERE!


My friend was also in the car with the guy when this happened, he says "man that really sucks!.... BUT it was cool as all HELL!"

right before the battery exploded and the supercharger was stuck on the thing freaking pulled harder than my car on a 250 shot.

Lee7

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

Huh… well if that’s the thing that we’re talking about… looks like it moves just enough air to make 300hp drawing 1250amps (as per their numbers).

Anyone want to tell me how you wire things to carry 1250amps for 15 seconds? For that matter, you’d kill 3 car batteries wired in parallel running this for only a few seconds.

Heh…. I wonder if they actually measured the output or if they just guessed… that looks a lot like an M60 strapped to 3 starter motors, and their advertised 3x6hp (18) isn’t nearly what it would take to get 405 cfm at 5psi…. Eaton’s published charts put it at about 29hp, which would mean that for it to work they would have had to figure out how to get 161% efficiency… heh, and they seem to be claiming that their 3 motor assembly is 90% efficient in converting electric to mechanical energy…

I’m sensing some bull**** here… even if they got 100% efficient conversion from electric to mechanical power (meaning that they invented a motor that doesn’t get warm or make noise), the still only have enough power to move 310cfm at 5psi, or about 230hp.

Just think, with 2 of them, 6 batteries (plus one for the engine) and a killer charging system (I’m thinking 3 or more alternators) you could move enough air to make 400hp (at the crank)

SATURN5

But will it max out a MAF sensor..???

< best McCoy > Dammit Jim I'm a doctor not a electrician.. BW

FyreLance

That's what I'm thinking, plus you're only supposed to use it in bursts as opposed to all the time, like being on the bottle.

For the price..... why?

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

:lala:

The sad thing is... probably not.

the sadder thing is that at the 20psi that they are implying that this thing is useful for on their site it will only be moving about 75cfm worth of air with 18hp driving it, only enough air flow for about 80hp.

1989RS

looks like a pretty expensive joke to me......

1989RS

i think a nitrous kit that would offer more power would be a much wiser investment, i mean heck, you can get a very nice nitrous kit for a third of the price and be able to refill the bottle as much as you can for a year with the kind of money you would drop in that kit, c'mon,>starting at $2995? thats alot of money to blow on a power adder thats gives no better gains than nitrous and still only 75hp on a small displacement engine

B4Ctom1

and for my next trick I shall lift myself up by grabbing a hold of my shoe laces and lifting.

1989RS

lol, everythings a joke these days

Kingtal0n

OMFG guys thats the car!!!! omg he said he was advertising but i had no idea! where did you find that ?


This was just last weekend too... the battery explosion and everything... I have to run by and check it out again..

I swear works good though! I dont know about your physics Crossfire but theres more to it than what your thinking. All i have to say is... if the guy ever gets it working reliably, without turning the battery leads into puddles of lead, its going to be one hell of crazy crap.

Probably not very practical for large motors mind you, but just think if you strapped one to a civic motor that makes 100HP in one of those 2600 Lb cars... just imagine what they will be saying then. "im turbocharged" "oh yeah, im electric charged!"

Damon

I HAVE BUILT A REAL ELECTRIC SUPERCHARGER. It is in my basement and, yes, it really works. It really makes boost and it really moves enough air to feed a small V8 motor. Got about $10K into prototype CNC pieces to put it all together. Mine uses a T-73 turbo compressor, not a roots blower.

I'll distill down several years of expereince into a few simple observations:

1. Believe what 83 Crossfire says. His comments about the ****load of electricity it take to compress enough air to make any kind of meaningful boost on a real engine are spot-on. You can't imagine the kinda juice it takes, even if you assume 100% efficiency in everything electrical and mechanical. We're talking MASSIVE Amps, even running at 36 volts (which my system does, also). I'm talking about a 15-25 second burn-time before the batteries are flat as a board. Forget constant use. Think "nirous bottle tyhat never runs dry."

2. A roots blower? And how does the engine keep running once the batteries go flat? I don't really care. It could probably be done, but think about the plumbing nightmare and one-way valves to have an occasional-use roots blower. A centrifugal (turbo) is a much better way to go since it can still have air drawn past the compressor even if it's not turning wihtout any one-way valves or special plumbing. That's just nuts.

3. How does the system recharge? There is NO WAY you can store enough electrical energy in the car. You'd need TONS (literally) of batteries). NO ALTERNATOR will keep up with the demand. You need a system that can discharge rapidly at high voltage when the blower is in use and then recharge SLOWLY off your car's electrical system at 12V. That's at least half the magic of a real, usable street electrical supercharger. My prototype has such a system (helps to have a brother who is an electrical engineer). Without something like this the party's over pretty damned quick.

Long story short- the technology has been there for some time. Decades, really. But making it USABLE in the real world is questionable. Main problem: batteries are too damned big and heavy and don't store enough energy.

Kingtal0n

<b>Long story short- the technology has been there for some time. Decades, really. But making it USABLE in the real world is questionable. Main problem: batteries are too damned big and heavy and don't store enough energy.</b>


and when they explode it really makes a mess! man a sound like no other... i swear i thought i was dead. i thought i was a goner. what a noise!

614Streets

When is someone going to take a turbocharger and turn it into a turbine engine feedeings its gases into another turbocharger to feed the engine. Better than electric motors to drive that set up would be a auxillary gasoline engine lol!

1989RS

one question......why? why when it is no better than anything else?i mean it is possible, obviously, but im sure it is also possible to get a 3 cylinder geo engine to 500 hp, but why would you want to?

askulte

Heck, if the guy wants to try it out, and play with it, why not? Folks usually learn best from their mistakes. Granted, as 83 Crossfire pointed out, there are some laws of physics that need to be kept in mind, but without people trying "new" things, there won't be any progress made. Rather than batteries, if he used some other lightweight & power/capacity dense storage medium (some huge capacitors?), it might work out well for a drag race 4 cylinder. After each run, swap in a fully charged set, and go play with your 75 extra hp.

I'm sure lots of you were into RC cars. It sucked having the batteries die right as you were having fun. Same thing here :P Would it be usefull for V8's? Probably not. It's tough finding the 50+ hp's worth of energy to drive blowers & turbos, to get a free ride. What the dude is doing is trying to change forms of energy. It's never 100% efficient, and pretty damn impossible to beat N20 as an energy storage medium. Hmmm... I could start working on the fusion cell to create some heat, and drive a turbo from that, and...

Andris

Grumpy

So that $19 electric blower I just bought may not work too well?.

Looked like it would bolt right up to the MAF sensor.

askulte

Grumpy - It'll work great to boost the output on the 21cc engine on the leaf blower, though!

A.

Dan W

I thought about this a while back, considered using rc car type nickle cadium batteries... you could run a bunch in series to kick the voltage up to keep the current down. They are fairly light weight and they can discharge pretty quickly without damage... they maintain their near peak voltage for a while also.

I think for most peoples purposes a bolt-on electric supercharger setup would be a great way to go. It could easily be remote mounted and the only engine compartment modifications would be some air inlet plumbing and a high output alternator.

Recharge times would be on the order of several minutes for a few seconds of discharge. It would be fine for the dragstrip but not exactly approprate for a road course.

This is not the Tornedo, This is a viable reality.

askulte

I don't think NiCad's would be happy discharging in 15 seconds. They get hot enough discharging in 4 minutes! For a V8, assume 50 hp to drive something (rough estimate). Keep it powered for 13 seconds. 50 HP is 37,000 Watts. Power = Current * Voltage.
Take a higher voltage DC setup for the sake of keeping current down. Wire some cells in series to step up voltage, say to 250V.
That gives you 150 amperes, which is manageable. Now, can you take a DC motor & battery pack from an electric vehicle to drive the blower? Sure, but now you've just added 500 lbs and 100 hp... Hardly a huge help.

A.

MdFormula350

I am going to mount a generator in my rear hatch and run a ceiling fan in my intake 3 speeds baby.

who wants to lose in speed 1, hmm maybe a corvette.

speed 2 is barely street legal, hmm 10 second monter

speed 3 is can go back in the future :hail: warp speed captain.

1989RS

heres my idea.... a rocket powered turbo....take a turbo, modify it to fit a large solid fuel rocket engine from model rockets, and use the thrust from that to spool the turbo,lol usable only once, then you gotta change engines,(rocket) prolly good for 7sec. bursts, but no parasitic loss, and prolly instantaneous spooling. somebody try that one, it would be kinda cool:lala: :lala:

askulte

Race cars have been using injectors mounted in the exhaust forever to help spool turbos faster. Nothing new there... If you search the net for home built jet turbines, folks are making them out of old turbos and mounting them to go karts. It's almost rocket powered

Dan W

Yeah, the power requirements are high. Nicads (if my math is correct I'm doing this in my head) can discharge at about 35 - 40 amps... thats discharging over 4 minutes which can probably be shortened and maybe pump the amp value up a bit. So anyway, to get the current down to that number the Voltage would have to be pretty high... on the order of about 900 - 1000 Volts on the upper end of the scale... Thats to drive 50 hp... which unless I'm mistaken is what it takes to drive a supercharger on a 800hp car.

Lets say instead it only takes 25 hp to drive enough air for 400 hp... a bit more on par if I recall correctly with what someone with a stock short block would want to run... and lets assume that we can get those nicads to discharge at a rate to fully discharge in 2 minutes instead of 4 and now we are talking about someting more like 225 - 250 volts and 75-80 amps.

Hmm, come to think of it, regular lead-acid batteries can discharge at that rate. Put a couple of them in the trunk with a transformer to step the voltage up and you could be in business.

Anyway, In my mind I don't think the battery issue is that big of a deal. The big problem is getting an electric motor that can put out 20-40 kw w/o burning itself up.... something that doesnt weigh 400 lbs would be nice too. Anyone have any Ideas here?

Dewey316

i worked for a company here in portland that build industrial magnetizers for companys such as lucent. very high end stuff. the owner/engineer of the system was expeirmenting with some niodamian (spelling) brushless electic motors, very small scale, high-output stuff. we are talking stuff the size of a quarter, puting out upwards of 3/4 HP. but considering these are brushless, i don't forsee burning out being an issue. the issue would be 1) making one functional on a large scale 2) actualy producing it, and the magnetic fields required to support the kind of power needed. it has been several years since i worked there, and i was never smart enough to understand it all, but IIRC they were VERY effecient (98% or something like that).

B4Ctom1

any new info on this "three mile island mobile"?

New_to_GM

It would be pretty lite and fairly quick

B4Ctom1

Heck yeah take it easy on those fast 3 cylinders

http://www.flash.net/~lorint/lorin/manual/