IDOXLR8

I have a 383 superram installed in a 95 chevy truck with paxton SN2000 I was making some good HP then installed a dodge cummins intercooler and I am down at least 50 HP the air is much cooler going into the intake but is there somthing I am missing? I thought the intercooler was going to add a bunch of power
Thanks for any help

88TPI406GTA

Maybe the pressure drop into the intercooler is too great...when I owned a Turbo Talon, I had heard that...or possibly you have a leaky connection somewhere...

Have you used a leak tester to ensure that you don't have boost leaks anywhere?

I am just guessing here...but good luck...

prOject-IrOc

might wanna try posting this in the "Power Adder" forum.

Jim85IROC

iTrader: (2)

Those Cummins motors make a ton of torque, but only a couple hundred horsepower. Is it possible that the intercooler is small enough to pose an airflow restriction at your horsepower levels?

IDOXLR8

the stock cummins cooler has a big restriction at the connections but I cut that off and now it is about a 4 1/2 in hole smashed into an oval other than that it seems to be big enough to flow what I need could be wrond but I really don't think so. could the offsets cause a big enough restriction?

Formula350Scott

iTrader: (3)

Usually with an intercooler of any kind you'll run into a pressure drop. How much boost are you running? Its probably running a couple psi lower than it was with an intercooler and more piping to the intake. You might want to get another pulley to crank the boost back up if thats the problem.

biggtime

If you lost power yet have cooler IA temps the intercooler is probably to resrictive. Check boost pressure before and after the intercooler. How much boost did you have before? How much now?

Guido

Have you double checked all of your connections? Perhaps it is leaking out of one of your hose connectors.

Ed Maher

I find it interesting that he KNOWS he lost 50hp but he can't even say how much boost he is AND was running. I'm sure that's not germane. Where is Tito anyway?

IDOXLR8

I may have lost 25 or could have been 75 or even 74 I just wanted to make my best point that it was a big drop in power. today I did a quick install of a boost gauge onto my seat and found I had 4 1/2-5 psi of boost and I know with my old 350 without the cooler it made 7 psi I am not sure how much boost I lost with the 383 but I was told it is about 1 1/2 psi but correct me if that is wrong. I installed my smaller pully today and it is now running 7 psi now with only that changed it feels a bit faster at topend then without the cooler but no real gain just runs hotter when in traffic.

Ed Maher

can you post a pic of the ic?

IDOXLR8

I will try and get it to post but last time I couldent get it to work.

IDOXLR8

ok here is the pic it needs some work on the tubing but with the space I had to work with I hade to custom build all my fittings

IDOXLR8

does this do it for you ed??

rooster433

i'll bet the tubing did it to you.. replace it with something smooth and non colapseable

Spectre

The tubing looks like hell.
get an aluminum one,
custom made.

flow will be smoother by far

rooster433

http://stahlheaders.com/Frame%20Tubing.htm

buy some tubing and weld it all up together.. it wil be real nice

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

You installed an intercooler that was never designed to flow that much air, first problem. Was the engine seeing any detonation? If not then where you really expecting a gain? Even if it did flow enough it will always be a restriction. Unless your current tune needs intercooling to take advantage of the boost you already have, you will see no gain from just adding an intercooler. You might see a gain if it lets you run more boost and you actually run a smaller blower pulley so that you get more total boost. If you have any leaks or sharp bends that’s not helping issues either.

Any other pictures of the intercooler install? Do you know if you have the 28” or 34” wide radiator? I looked at that before and don’t see how there is room for a good size intercooler on them, and can’t even imagine how to run the tubing with the 34” wide radiator (will keep things cool no matter what, but man is it huge, even had issues running tranny cooler lines).

IDOXLR8

it is the 34" rad and it was a very tight fit here are a few pics

IDOXLR8

this came out right under the battery tray

IDOXLR8

pic 3

IDOXLR8

pic 4

Dan W

If all you do is bolt on an intercooler you are just adding a restriction. By itself its not adding power.

Lets say you add 10# of boost and you put an intercooler on it. Your boost now is cooler but you only have about 8# of boost. Since there are losses through the intercooler you have less air mass actually making it into the motor now than before you added the intercooler.

So whats the point of adding one? To make more power you have to get that lost boost back. With a turbo this is accomplished through the waste gate but you have to do a pully change. So crank it up, to make something like 12# before the intercooler and 10# after. Now you are looking at 150-200 degrees cooler at the intake with 10# and you will make more power because of a denser intake charge (more air mass making it to the motor).

Since combustion temps are directly related to intake air temps you can now also run a more agressive tune if your engine wants it. Ie: if you had to back your timing off to 25 degrees total before the intercooler, you can now run something closer the the 36 degrees that will make the most power with your ride.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

IDOXLR8, thanks for the pics… very enlightening.

I’m not sure what it is, but my truck doesn’t appear to have as much room in that area. I’ll have to take a better look at it. I do have 4wd and just about every heavy duty package available on mine, so I’ve got an oil cooler and tranny cooler that you don’t have, but I swear that there is something more to it. I know my AC lines go through the holes in the core support on the passenger side behind the headlight, and there is no room for them to run on the inside of that flat panel, right next to the radiator. I’m wondering if you might have the smaller radiator (though mine looks the same if you added the 2 coolers).

Creepy how the Cummins intercooler is the same size as that opening… from the pics I take it that you left the AC condenser in front of the IC and just extended the brackets to move the radiator back? I’ll have to have a look at that also, I seem to remember that either the front axle or the skid plate supports or something is in the way of doing that on my truck.

Interesting…

B4Ctom1

Hey a combo of the Stahl header stuff and some rubber bends from these guys could make it into a cooler, smoother, leak free transition. I believe the 4" to 3" ones are the ones used for the throttle body to 3" pipe adaptation.

https://web9.tdl.com/jags/Parts_AirClean_Ducting.html

IDOXLR8

83 Crossfire TA
this Rad is the biggist one GM used in these trucks this one if for the 454 I had to press the sides in 1/4" on each side and give the intercooler a slight bend (you can see if you look closly at the pics) to get the Rad to fit between I have a trans cooler but it is in front of the condenser. I can send you more pics if you would like I don't mind helping but keep in mind I have not been able to get this setup working well yet but I think it is other issues.


B4Ctom1

the problem I have with using that type of tubing is the clearence I have is not enough to have 3" round pipe fit between the engine acc. and Rad. so I used 3 1/2 od tubing and smashed it so the inside is 1 1/2" I am thinking (allthough the piping is not the smoothest and needs improvement) I am not getting enough fuel to handle any more power even without the IC I can't get it to run any richer at WOT the most I can get is .78 on my otc scanner where my brother has a stock Lt1 in his truck that runs at .92 at WOT
this is what I have on my fuel delivery
walbro in tank pump
30# accel injectors
AFPR set at 49 with vacume unhooked
12/1 FMU (I think, the diaphragm is as large as it can be)
and with about 5 Lbs of boost my fuel presure goes to 56-60 PSI

rooster433

Low O2 readings can mean misfires.. It isn't misfiring is it?

rooster433

Heres how i make a large to small adatper

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

Well, like I implied, it looks to be the same design radiator as I’ve got minus the extra coolers, it just seems to take up less space… I’ll take a better look under my hood tomorrow. FWIW, my truck doesn’t have a 454, it’s a 350 TBI but it came with a “supercool” option code that gave it the bigger radiator, all the coolers, a different fan…

As far as more pics are concerned, I’ll take anything I can get. I’m not too worried about it working right now or not, I’m more interested in seeing what you came up with in setting the truck up. I’ll PM you with my email address (actually, I just sent you email to your yahoo address)

IDOXLR8

it dosen't backfire at WOT but will if I hit the throttle 3 or 4 times and at light acceleration when the knock sensor reads around 15 20 knock counts