fastlane350

I went to a few autocross events with my father this summer racing his 06 Subaru WRX sti.. and i thought it was a blast. i really want to start racing my camaro this summer in a few regional events.
I own a 1987 camaro Iroc-Z wit the 5.7 TPI package. and i was wondering if you guys could suggest a few mods that would help the car out with handeling or tire pressures or anything. Im not very familier with the classes 3rd gens run in, or what i should do to the car.
Id prefer to stay in the stock class mainly because im pretty poor, and if i stepped up to street tuned or street prepared i feel i might be out of my league..
currently im looking at -new wheels and tires for racing
-possibly a front sway bar
-but more importantly a 5 speed transmission i could
drop that would keep me stock but work with the 5.7, i really dont think the automatic would be good for this kind of racing, and im a fantastic stickshift driver..
Also any info you could give me on what classes are availible to 3rd gens and how competitive they would be(how much money id need to invest to be a seriours competitor) would really help.
any help you guys could offer would be really appriciated, thanks alot!

327???

Wheels have to be stock size, you can run an R compound tire though.

I believe that v8 3rd gens run in F stock and v6's run in G stock.

I'd go drive the car in stock form first, then see what you could change to make it fit you better.

rayar

iTrader: (1)

I run my third gen in C-prepard but it is gutted has big slicks and 450-500 horsepower.

I did get a ride in a 88 GTA at our last even and was pretty impressed. The 350 TPI has huge torque, usable torque down low where you can use it. The car was on pretty crappy street tires but the handleing was still very good. I can see why these cars are still competitive in F-stock.

In autocross you can still end up spending a lot of money, even in stock. We have a nationally competitive DS driver in our region and he has easily $3000 just in shocks(Revalved, degassed, Koni DA's). He also had lightweight wheels and keeps fresh rubber on them. Thats only the begining of what it takes to be competitive at a national level in the stock classes.

If you just wanted to have a fun stock class autocross car then I would just put on some decent shocks/struts. Koni Double adjustables are the top of the heap, In most cases the single adjustables work pretty good and Bilstein makes nice nonadjustables, KYB would only be a slight upgrade over stock. Good tires are important and you are allowed to run DOT R's in the stock classes but a good street tire can be just as much fun allthough slower. Haveing 2 set of rims/tires is a good idea so you don't wear out your daily driver tires.

As far as the automatic vs Manual debate. Keep your auto. My race car has a TH350 and it works just fine. Just pick a gear that will let you top out at around 70 MPH. You have enough torque that you shouldn't need to shift. IMHO swapping in a manual would be a lot of money spent for little if any improvement on an autocross course.

Short rundown on classes
FS: Any shocks/struts, any front swaybar, NO subframe connectors, any cat back exhaust, any DOT tire that fit on the factory sized rim(There are exceptions) Lightweight wheels same as stock size and backspacing.

ESP: No internal modifications on the engine. Any Wheel, Any DOT tire(Again exceptions) Suspension is pretty open. I believe SFC's are allowed but limited in design.

CP: Nearly unlimited engine mods, Some guys are over 600 HP. Gutted race cars on slicks, Unlimited chassis bracing. Solid rear axle but rear suspension is unlimited. Front struts can be converted to double A-arms. Replaceing the front subframe with after market will classify the car as tube framed and get a 10% weight penalty. Weight is 2400-3150lbs depending on engine size and rim size.

rayar

iTrader: (1)

I also wanted to add. I think you could put $2500- $3000 into your car and have a very fun stock class car that, depending on what caliber drivers are in your region, could be very competitive. It's hard to run with the smaller cars like Miatas but if driven well it can happen and you did it with a big heavy car, IMHO, that is an accomplishment. I think that $3000 will cover Shocks/struts(unmodified Koni DA's), new bushings, New Hoosiers and another set of used stock rims. If you want some light weight rims you could easily go over that but I don't feel they are nessecary unless you are looking for every last thousands of a second. You can save some money with Koni SA's, Bilsteins or KYB's but those Koni DA's really are the way to go. I want to get Koni DA's front struts for my car but because of my spring rates they would need to be revalved to really be of much benefit and I can't afford them right now.

slow305

iTrader: (2)

The cheapest route would be to just stay in F Stock. The 3rd gen TPI cars were still competitive in F Stock (before the Shelby GTs showed up).

Budget F-Stock build: 35 or 36 mm front sway bar, Bilsteins.
All-out F-Stock build: 35 or 36 mm front sway bar, Koni SAs, extra set of OEM wheels with Hoosiers or Kumho V710s

That doesn't include stuff like general maintenance, such as replacing worn bushings, and getting an alignment to get max camber and caster.

Double adjustable Konis are, IMO, a waste on a stock-class F Body. My girlfriend has an LT1 4th gen with SA Konis and an LT1 4th gen with DA Konis, and there really isn't much of a difference between them. My old LS1 4th gen had Koni SAs. Also, my friends Mike Johnson and Sam Strano have won national championships in a 4th gens with Koni SAs (Mike in F-Stock Sam twice in ESP). If it's good enough for them ...

As far as auto vs. manual, don't worry about it if you keep your car stock. Just put it in 2nd gear and go.

Pat

rayar

iTrader: (1)

Even though the SA's are fine I personally like being able to set compression and rebound seperatly. If I remember right there isen't a huge price difference between the SA's and DA's so why not go with ones that are more adjustable. Personally, I just don't like both compression and rebound adjusting with the same ****.

slow305

iTrader: (2)

Pretty sure the Koni SAs only adjust rebound.

Also, Koni doesn't make "off the shelf" double-adjustable for the thirdgens (but you could run 4th gen DA rears), although I'm sure Koni-North America or somebody else could do something custom. As for the difference in price, you might be thinking of the difference between the Koni red "Specials" and Koni yellow "Sports."

Pat

rayar

iTrader: (1)

Pat, you just might be right. If memory serves me correctly Koni used to have DA option on the yellows for the third gen in the catalouge but I cant seem to find it anymore. I also had a chance to purchase a set of used DA's from a CPer that decided to part out his 3rd gen to build a 4th gen so I am pretty sure they at least used to be an off the shelf item. Either Koni has discontinued them or my memory is screwed up. Chances are its my memory since it was 4-5 years ago when I was building my car. I am going to keep looking for the DA option just so I know I am not losing my mind.

slow305

iTrader: (2)

It would be interesting to know if Koni did make double adjustables. And if they did, why they don't any more.

Pat

racing geek

iTrader: (5)

Your car can be placed into F-Stock, STU, SP, or SM.

If you can, try and find out if any of the "Pro" autocross drivers have driven a car like yours, and if so, see if you can get them to ride along with you and provide advice. If you and the Pro are comfortable with it, see if you can get him/her to drive your car so you can get a better idea of where the limits of your vehicle are at.

I used to race my dad's 4-door Dodge Dakota Sport in H-Stock, and then I bought my IROC-Z which I currently run in STX. I had (and still do) an extra set of wheels but decided to use the money that would have been spent on DOT-R tires to put towards shocks and other refurbishments. I am currently running on my DD tires in STX (due to my little 305), and I too have an auto which I leave it in 2nd gear. If I ever get around to installing the Spohn SFC I have in my sig, I will be bumped into either SP or SM... can't remember which.

Before you go nuts with parts get some seat time in your Camaro. I have 2 years of autocrossing experiance, and I could definatly use more seat time. Most of the first year was in my dad's truck (I acutally beat some corvettes on PAX!) and the rest of that year and this previous year was in my Camaro.

PS - If you need a 36mm front bar I have one for sale... It is already painted and looking nice. All you would need is the bushings and time to install it.

rayar

iTrader: (1)

Ok, I admit defeat. I searched all night for some Koni DA front struts and the only thing I found was some Ground Control modified ones. Still not badly priced at $125 to do the conversion but I swear I saw a DA option in the Koni catalog when I was building my car.

Midniteson2

I have a set of double adjustable koni's. i bought them off a guy who was parting out his 85 Z28 a couple years ago. they may not still sell them but they did at one time.

rayar

iTrader: (1)

I was pretty sure that I had seen them in the Koni catalog. I have also seen quite a few used ones available when I was looking for them a few year ago on places like EBAY and different message boards.

I suppose that they could have all been converted to DA by a company like GC but I used to run across them on a regular basis, just never had the funds to purchase them at the time.

Camaroz1985

iTrader: (2)

Like everyone said get some seat time in your car first. Then worry about upgrading. Get a bigger front bar, and some good shocks all around. Even stock replacement shocks and struts would be an improvement if yours are older and worn. Koni would be the obvious choice, I have used the Tokico Illumina also with pretty good success.

If it is in your budget, get some lighter wheels (maybe some GTA wheels) and slicks if you really want to be competitive in stock class, otherwise get some good street tires and you should be fine. Also might want to look at some upgraded brake pads such as Hawk HPS or HP+.

As for switching the transmission, I don't think you can "legally" do that in stock class because there wasn't a 5 speed option for the 5.7 IROCs iirc.

First and foremost though is seat time. All the other mods are pointless if you aren't comfortable with your car at the limit. Have an instructor who drives a similar car ride along with you or even drive your car to tell you what you can do better, and so you can see what your car is really capabale.

Above all have fun. That's why we do this isn't it?

What region are you running in?