joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

My best time was a 12.53 with a 1.75 60 foot. I know it has a little left, I am hoping for high 11's or possibly low 12's. The first run I ran with the cut out closed and 20 psi in the tires. It ran a 13.2 I then opened the 3 inch cutout and dropped the pressure to 15psi and ran a 12.75. I then Lower the pressure to 13psi and ran a 12.53 at 110. Any suggestions of indea's of how to make me run quicker without nitrous or a power adder?
My mods are in my sig

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

more converter.

car_fixer

more converter, and more gear

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

and longtubes.

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

how much does it weigh?

z28freak84

3500+ converter, 3" x-pipe kit(lose the y-pipe setup),

joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

I dont want to do long tubes because I just bought some dyno don headers with the 2.5 y pipe, and the ground clearance with long tubes is not that great, and I dont want to do dual because of the same reason. 3.90 is enough gear, If I was to go to 4.10 it would only be a difference of maybe .1 or less. And this car is street driven quite a bit also! I don't know how much it weighs, I would probably say around the 3200 pound mark. Would having the torque converter re stalled to 3500 make that much of a difference on the strip and street?

z28freak84

What are the cam specs?????

joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

Advertised Duration 287/287
Duration @.050 226/226
Gross Lift .520/.520
Lobe Seperation 112

Its the zz409 from tpis

z28freak84

just leave it alone if its just a street car then. Thats a mild cam. If u wanted to mess with it, have the heads ported, more cam, and more converter. Then you could be in the mid-low 11's easy.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

yup, ground clearance and longtubes just can't happen on these cars



want an 11 second ride? do one of two things:
-make more power
-make sacrifices

gotta pay to play

joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

There is not much more power from what I have compared to long tubes. Maybe 10 more horse and maybe .1 faster. Not worth it! And lot less headaches

DON 88T/A

What kind of tuning is done? What ecm are you using?

Your sig says 470 at the motor...did you dyno the engine/car?

470 crank is 380-390ish or so at the wheels with the 700r4(give or take)...and in a 3200lb car would be trapping a bit more than 110mph.

Looks like a strong combo...should be doing more than 12.53 @110...

I agree a little more stall/larger headers would help...i understand not liking the hassle with long tubes...I thought they were a little more than 10hp/more like 20rwhp or so....

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

it depends on the combination, but a 470hp motor would see way more power gains than just 10hp. i bet that engine was dynoed with a set of longtubes on it. not worth it? eh...maybe, maybe not...but as it sits, my motor with 73 less cubes is running .2 faster than you



seriously...i like to say that kinda stuff to get folks riled up. i'm not trying to pick a fight or anything, or get into a pissing match about how your car is a street driven car and mine is more race car than yours blah blah blah blah blah. that's NOT my point. my point is that there are things you can do to make your combo more efficient. you have WAY too much motor to be going as slow as you are. BUT, choking the motor down with a slightly looser than stock converter and restrictive exhaust will cause the problems you're facing. i understand wanting a streetable car, but when you've made a solid streeter, and it doesn't run as well as a well-built efficient drag car, don't get all bent out of shape when people tell you to do more drag oriented stuff to your car. if you don't want to make it less streetable (or whatever) than make more power.

however, when you did the tuning, where did you do it at? on the engine dyno? ok, your in the ball park then. now, go out and take it back to the track and tune again. the engine dyno is not the place for fine tuning. it's a good place to put a rough stab at it. fine tuning is done at the drag strip.

EvilCartman

iTrader: (1)

I'm running quicker too with a smaller motor

89formula350b2l

iTrader: (11)

Looks like you and I have the same times....and I have a bigger converter and longtubes....but less gears. BTw what difference did the headers make?

joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

I am going to get my converter re stalled to 3500 soon. Is 3500 going to be enough, because I only get one free stall from Vigilante. As for the exhaust I love my exhaust, and thinkin of adding another 3 inch cutout after the y and see what more I can gain on the dyno and track. The motor was engine dynod with long tubes by the way.

EvilCartman

iTrader: (1)

The looser converter will help and wont be that terrible for street driving. Think I ran a 12.22 @ 110 with a 3500 stall converter, that was through edelbrock shorties dumping at the y-pipe.

joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

what converter did you have before switching to a 3500 and how much of a difference did it make?

EvilCartman

iTrader: (1)

I started out with a 3500 stall when I dropped the 350 engine in, nothing to compare it to :/

86 IROC

iTrader: (3)

Where does your motor make peak TQ? You'll need a converter closer to that. I have a 4000+ in my 2000 and I have driven it almost 50 miles round trip to work w/o a hitch. (Most of my commute is city traffic) It's more streetable than one would think. FYI - 26" tall tires, the 4200-ish verter, and 3.73's netted me 18 MPG mixed driving. I still have cold AC and power everything - it's my definition of a "street car."

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

i ran a 4000 'verter by ati in a 700r4 all day everday in my car when i was daily driving it. had over two years of daily driving on it when i pulled it to go to a th350. it was a lockup style converter and teamed wtih 410's and 28" tires out back. netted me 22+hwy mileage with a 650 double pumper on top

i bet you if you dyno'd your motor with the shorties instead of longtubes, you'd see a significant drop in hp output. i understand dyno don makes a top-notch quality piece, but they're still not longtubes, and i'll put my $150 hedmans up against his anyday and i'll bet you money mine'll make more power all the way through the rpm band, not just peak numbers.

joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

its not as dramatic as you think. I do have a cut out and working on the second one right now, so hopefully that will make up a little ground. My dyno numbers are 470 horse at 5800, 435 torque at 4000. I am looking at new cams and here are two that i am interested in any thoughts.
ZZX Cam
Advertised Duration 290/290
Duration @.050 239/239
Gross Lift .558/.558
Lobe Seperation 112

ZZ9X
Advertised Duration 287/290
Duration @.050 225/240
Gross Lift .525/.558
Lobe Seperation 112

86 IROC

iTrader: (3)

I'd like to see you use the ZZ9X cam and a 4000 stall. I think moving your cut out is worthless at best, and a waste of your time & efforts. What size tire are you running on the car?

joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

I am not moving it, I am adding another one right after the y pipe, so in total I will have 2. Wont 4000 stall be to much on the roads. Will there be much difference between what I have now and the ZZ9X and how much difference would it make. If I were to go along the ZZ9X route with a 3500 stall, how much of a difference would you think that would make.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

aren't those kinda older style tpi grinds? the ramps rates seem kinda...lazy...

86 IROC

iTrader: (3)

Yep, personally I'd look into an XFI grind or one of Crane's new lobes. And no 4000 isn't too much, you'll need it to get the car moving off the line better.

2QUIK4U

iTrader: (1)

I saw you at the track. (day at the drags).
Im guessing your car is more than 3200 lbs. I think your probably around 3600 with/driver. Have you relocated the batterey to the back? That will help the weight ratio (front to back) alot. If you loosen the front sway bar, the front will come up more. I took mine off. I think it still handles better than any other car i have. My front end comes up nicely.
Why no power adder? a 150 wet shot is totally safe, and for $600 it will put you into the low 11's for sure. Im living proof. I would love to run mid 12's on motor.
Im running stock stall converter and 4:10 gears and i had 1.7's all day when i was spraying. My car was .2 sec. faster going from 3.73 to 4.10.

joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

How much does your car weigh in at. My goal is to make the car run mid 11's with motor, then go with a pro charger to dip into the tens. I am sorry, just not a big fan of the bottle. mx66nova what do you mean by lazy?

2QUIK4U

iTrader: (1)

my car weighs 3060 without driver. I have the interior out at the moment, im redoing it nicer. It will probably be around 3250 after i put it back in.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

ramp rates...the difference between the adv. duration numbers and duration numbers @ .050"

ZZ9X
Advertised Duration 287/290
Duration @.050 225/240


so, 287-225=62*
and 290-240=50*

by reducing the difference number, you increase the ramp rates (which is how fast the valve opens and closes i believe based on what i know) and it'll make more power.

see, currently i'm running the old skool comp 280H
adv. numbers: 280/280
numbers @ .050": 230/230
280-230=50*

the camshaft i'm planning to swap in the car is a comp solid cam
adv. numbers: 270/280
numbers @ .050": 240/246
270-240=30
280-246=34

see what i'm saying?

joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

I see what your saying. So you would not recommend one of these cams? The only reason I am asking about these is because I can get a really good deal on them, and would really like to go with one of them!

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

i think you should go with a more modern grind that will make more power. one of the new XFI grinds would do you more good i think.

joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

Which cam should I go with. I want a cam that will keep my compression ration down to a point where I can run pump gas safely

89gta383

iTrader: (5)

There is more in your 60ft with what you've got. I couldn't get lower than a 1.72-1.73 60 ft before I took off the front sway bar. Try shifting manually also, I pick up 2 tenths and 2mph when shifting manually vs leaving it in drive.

The more time spent at the track and tweaking things will get your et lower.

joeblue83

iTrader: (8)

I do manually shift the car. Why would taking the front sway bar lower my 60ft?

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

it allows the front suspension to articulate through it's full range of motion. thus allowing quicker take off times. it also takes ~20lbs off the front of the car, which is never a bad thing


i'm not gonna be the guy to tell you what camshaft to go with because i don't know a whole lot about the kinds of camshafts an OBD I system is gonna wanna play nice with. Orr89iroc can tell you alot more about that kinda stuff. i was simply stating that the ramp rates on those old TPiS cams are lazy, and slightly outdated now. (i mean, didn't they come out like 15+ years ago when single designs were still reining over the drag strip?)

2QUIK4U

iTrader: (1)

i took my front sway bar off completely (i broke the bolts trying to loosen it).
I couldn't tell much difference in handling. I don't like taking corners really hard anyway. If you are looking for street/drag racing and not auto-cross this would really help. You can always put it back on.
Do you have the airbox modified so you have RAM-AIR thru the foglights?
Where in the RPM's is all your power made? I think 3500 stall would hurt my L98 because all my power is below 5000rpm.
My car is also slower when i run my full cut-out exhaust. I use a baffle with a 1.5 inch hole. It gives me just enough back pressure for low end TQ..
Here is a vid of 2 of your runs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shWQUSaXvwo