87TPI350KID

How does everyone 'feather the gas off the line?'

When I race, I usually just do what I call jumping the gas. the light is green, i hit the gas to about 3/4 throttle real quick let off a sec, then punch it. It seems to work well for a solid 14.5 run. My 60 ft times are about 2.25~ give/take .05.

Anyway to launch a little harder before I get the stall? Plus how do you 'Lauch' with a stall?

Rogue86

Get some sticky tires, put one foot on the brake, one on the gas, stall to desired stall speed, on the last yellow, let off brake and mash gas.

Usually works for me.

vernw

iTrader: (2)

And if you have a fairly stout motor don't forget the broom and dust pan to be able to pick up all the pieces from your former factory 10 bolt rear end.....

87TPI350KID

I will be sure to do that since Im running a 9 bolt Borg Warner..

MrDude_1

its diffrent for every car.. mostly you need to learn where your car likes to launch from


for my auto cars: i stall it up to around 3k with my foot on the brake and gas....

if it spins... i fix the suspension so it doesnt.



if you get the chassis down, there shouldnt be too much to the technique... just launch hard at the ideal RPM for that motor... if you cant put down max power off the line, then you need more traction from the chassis.

that concept applies right up until you start hitting low 1.5 60's

Rogue86

I've seen 10 bolt survive into the 11 second range. I've got in the neighborhood of 450 8.4 second 1/8 mile passes on my 10 bolt with low 1.8 and a few 1.7 second 60's.

Also saw his car was fairly stock... shouldn't have to worry about breaking the rear end.

IHI

iTrader: (1)

Save alot of time and energy by just investing in some stickey tires, and i hope you at least have a posi unit of some kind, otherwise your fighting an uphill battle.

One thing I get a kick out of is reading about these guys that did this or that, etc...and went to the track to try and tune their combination, get fast passes, etc...and the whole time they complain about not hooking up, spinning, chirping gears, etc...there is no way your doing yourself anygood but not making an attempt to first stick to the track...these stock suspensions will hold alot of power for the "average" guy before any bolt on's are deemed necessary-it mostly in the tires!!

Used slicks are everywhere at your local drag strip, just ask around to guys that are out there frequently and I'm sure they have some they'd sell dirt cheap...I got's 4 pair in my basement going out on our night of fire for $50/set that have ALOT of rubber left. then get some junk steel rims and your set. $50-75 dpending on tires/condition, probably get rims for free of $10 and maybe 30minutes outta your day to get them mounted for guranteed hook!!!

84firebird383

I'm going to knock on wood here.My 26 spline 10 bolt so far has held up to low to mid 11 second runs on 1.7 60' times with a set of free very used slicks on a completely stock suspension.

IHI

iTrader: (1)

that must be a mile per houring son of a gun running low to mid 11's with only a 1.7? 60'...wow!!!

MrDude_1

thats great advice.

i just ASSumed they already had ETstreets....

84firebird383

Not anymore. It used to really put you back in your seat hard at the top end. Now it starts to drop off and has a hard time hitting 119-120 in the 1/4.I'm sure the valve springs are the reason I'm loosing my top end charge.It might also be the flat hood I'm running. The carb is only about a half inch from the top. In my old camaro I had a 4" cowl like yours.

MrDude_1

try removing the rear hood seal, and using some washers to shim up the rear of the hood 1/4"

i know it sounds like a tiny amount, but when my friends carb was really close (drag car, RS hood, no air filter) doing that fixed his carb metering problems... the hood was just too close for the air to turn in smoothly.

Free Bird

iTrader: (1)

set the 2 step to 6k and dump the clutch. it's a good way to break shat, but it'll yank the tires.

87TPI350KID

I'm running an auto. I think I need to get some chasis/suspension mods now. I need my car to grab while power breaking. I rev it to about 1400 and I start hearing the tires squeak. I need a stall... I just don't have the knowledge to put it in.

Im running a 9 bolt borg warner rear with stock rear suspension.
3.27 gears with a posi. It launches very strait, just not hard enough.

Rogue86

Listen to what IHI and I myself said. GET STICKY TIRES. They'll stay planted when you stall the converter. Don't waste your time with suspension mods when you can pick up a pair of slicks for cheap! They'll hook you up, end of story.

84firebird383

Hey thanks! thats a great Idea.I really don't want to loose my sleeper look and I've got 2 races lined up for aug 6th. One againts a low 11 sec 84 5 speed camaro and then a 350 S10 on a 150 shot.Hopefully your trick will give me the extra top end kick I need with out loosing the stock look

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

i seen alot of LS1 guys in that situation with mid 11 seconds at 120mph. seems about right to me

IHI

iTrader: (1)

Sleepers are waaay cool

Hope that trick works for ya!!

Or you could go this route when I first got the car, flakey paint, hole in hood with breather sticking through, blue back bumper...made a few vettes wonder WTF was that LOL!!!

84firebird383

LOL thats funny, I have a hood in my garage I just cut a hole in.I was going to run it to see how big of a difference it made, But I think I'm going to try the other trick first.

sixpackmtrspts

i just leave off the trans barke at full throttle rpm depends on what chip i have in the 2 step.

Night rider327

iTrader: (13)

Knowing how to drive your car can really go along way.. Sure anybody can just step on the throttle and go, but that aint gonna work the best for 90% of us.

With mine, my pass is dead if I don't roll into the throttle.

I'm traction limited, high HP. (12.80's @ 118 mph, 2.30's 60')

I'll talk in 0-60 mph times as I made more of those runs on the street trying to figure out where mine will grip at.

If I just floor throttle from an idle 0-60 in 6.6 to 7.0 seconds.

If I do like you said 87TPI350KID 0-60 in 6.2

If I come up on my converter and stall it high, then launch WOT 0-60 over 8 seconds. (spin till 6200 rpm shift point, shift, spin till 5600 rpm shift point, and chrip going into third gear)

but now if I keep it at an idle, push the throttle about 10%, then slowly work my way to 100% throttle through about 40-50 feet my 0-60 mph times comes way down. 0 wheel spin

3.9 to 4.3 seconds

So for me to pull off 3.9, 4.0, etc 0-60 mph times I launch like this.. Stop, foot on brake, engine at 750 rpm idle. push throttle a twitch (2 or 3%), let off brake, go to 10% throttle, now push alittle more, now alittle more, now alittle more, now a little more, now alittle more and now i'm at WOT.

I done it so much (like you should) I can feel when, where and hard much more to push the throttle down before it wheel spins. Plus I done pretty well "trained" myself time wise to know when I need to be and can be at 100% throttle.

MrDude_1

whoa!

stop right there.

90% of "us" have sub 300rwhp cars...

if you cannot floor the car straight off the line, you need to work on traction.

peroid.

theres a half second off "90%" of the peoples times right there.



for most of you, it just means ET streets on some $50 rims. hell, buy them used for less then $200.


that alone will make the car faster at the strip then any of the other small underhood mods people here love... and do first for some reason...


next... alot of you guys dont have a posi........ GET ONE.
it makes the car more fun to drive. it doubles your traction. and it keeps you from looking like a one-tire-fire idiot.

worried about cost? GET A USED ONE... if you open your eyes, you can get a posi for $50... or less!









but sadly, "90%" of the people reading this, arnt going to do it... athough the fast guys are already nodding their heads in agreement...

87TPI350KID

Thanks for the post on launch help.

I don't think my car has enough power (yet) to be worried about severe traction problems, like spinning through second.

taengineering

got tired of reading so i will say what some might have already, "feathering" the throttle is when you lift you foot off the floor slightly to reduce the rpms and keep the tach off the limitter. I've done it many times on the street racing around town. expecially in my stick car but done it with Autos too. the tires just can't hook so you got to keep the pedal off the floor so the car gets going some before you got to shift.

IHI

iTrader: (1)

That should be a stickey quote before any of these threads even come to life. STICKEY: How to Hook

The only contents of the thread:

used posi unit, cheap steel rims and cheap used slicks...your hooking. Total invetment, $250 and this will make you alot faster than the $250 cool air intake, retuned chip, etc...I'll bet money on that cuz I've seen it first hand over the years.

I've been there dont that so I know first hand where you guys are coming from, but having worked my way up I still dont forget whereI started, you dont have to have the million dollars parts to get the job done. Start with sticky tires if your going to ANY kind of race track to push your car, even with a 1 wheel wonder it will help.

You can throw all that bolt on stuff in the world at your car, but eventually even that stuff will not do any good, unless your severly lacking under the hood. Look at it like this, if you have a miss in your engine and wonder how to get good performance while trying to manage the miss, do you come here and ask for advise on how to do so?..NO, you come here and ask how to get rid of the miss. Same with traction issues, why tackle that problem with some half azzed solution of " feathering the throttle" when the REAL answer is cheap and easy....you guys make me laugh

MrDude, one day the light will eventually come on....I hope

87TPI350KID

Yeah, this would be a nice sticky. TPI cars can be monsters off the line, but if they don't hook, they blow it. Hooking is 90% of drag racing.

IHI

iTrader: (1)

Hooking is 100% of any racing or testing

Night rider327

iTrader: (13)

MrDude_1, and others..... I agree fully, but we are posting in the "drag racing" form of this board, so I guess I let it slip my mind that there's still alot of stock-ish engines racing and posting here. I'm thinking more along the lines of any common performance built 327, 350, 377, 383, 400 with 375-425 hp, then alittle hotter 450, 475, 500 hp combos.

Sticky tires will help you more than anything when you start making power and want to hook and book, but even with some tires you may still have to roll into the throttle depending on engine's power, chassis setup, tire type and size, gear ratio, etc..
Now if your running a stock-ish 140-225 hp engine, with high (low number) gears then good tires may hurt you... I guess you aint never heard of or thought about too much traction. If the tires grip too good and the engine is weak then your gonna just bog the poor ole engine down bad out of the hole, and that will kill alot of time. I would say close to a full second on ET.


But yes tires and posi will help the most. I installed a powertrax lockright locker in mine and traction improved alot.. I killed off over 80 feet of WOT wheel spin with the locker install.

With street tires, and the locker here's what 'flooring it from a stop' looks like on mine... http://community.webshots.com/photo/...85398986PFTgXm BTW the cam. couldnt take the whole marks. They start about 15-20' before what you see and go up over the small curve, then around and down the other side for about another 50-60'

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

thats the thing with most of you guys, you are drag racers. alot of the cars we run are street cars that need handling too so drag slicks arent an option. radials are nice but tire life and wet traction is reduced greatly

to me, a street car that runs certain times on slicks isnt very impressive. that car wont turn those times on the street with street tires so that time is pointless. street car/daily driver/etc, needs to launch well on street tires

IHI

iTrader: (1)

There is quite a few people on here with these cars as daily drivers, but there are also a bunch of us with these cars as toys also. Either way, here's the real scoop-when you go to the drag strip, you actually have less chance of hooking up with your street tires than on the street. The starting line is "sheer" slick rubber that requires a hot rubber tire to stick to the track. Everytime a drag car leaves the line it is also leaving a thin coating of rubber off the tires also, rubber on rubber is like velcro.

Once you start using a hard compound rubber with sipes and lugs, you are taking away foot print and are not optimized with the hard rubber tire compound to have any realistic chance of "dead hooking" Sure you may go out and have a few 60's repeat in the course of an evening, but the trick with running at the dragstrip is to hook the same....how are you going to realistically know wtf you are gaining/losing with your in pit tuneups/changes when you cant even hook up and get a good baseline to compare to consistantly.

Tires are just like any bolt on performance mod, just like your LCA brackets, torque arm, shocks, springs, etc...people want to hook, start with the most obvious

I've running NOTHING BUT DOT slicks on my car for 4 years now, you have to drive your car within it's limits, just like if it's set up box stock-there are safe limits as to waht you can and cant do. For no more space than a set of tires takes up and the whole 15 minutes it takes to change them at the track-which ALOT of guys do....just get a set and quit whining and asking "launch technique", "help me launch", "how to launch", "how to feather", "how do you guys launch", "what to buy to hook".....

I've been wanting to buy some radials for my car just to toodle around town with so I'm not so scared of running over nails and such....after I install them should I come back and ask how to hook? NO, I'll throw the other set of rims with stickes on and go run cuz I KNOW what the results will be.

You guys are really making me contemplate yet another business venture, tire rental at the track....I would make a killin!!!!! Have the most popular street car rims with slicks mounted already, then have some on standby for the odd ball cars, then just charge by the amount of tire used. Have compressor with air tools and jack for quicker tire swaps.....gonna talk with track manager this weekend and see what the tracks cut would have to be on this as it sounds very good!!!!

MrDude_1

lol, not a bad idea! just be sure they sign a wavier stating that if your tires break their car, its not your fault.... lol

well, i used to think that way too.. but lets think about this.

its about $250 for tires and rims (assuming you dont mind them not being pretty)... that means theres ZERO handling issues.. afterall.. you swap tires at the track.. zero wet traction issues, ect...


ok thats taken care of. so its not the same as the street... lets not forget the point of this:

you're there for fun. or you're there to see/measure improvements.

fun? well yes. with fun, traction doesnt matter. ETs dont matter. nothing matters except it... my car with the potenzas was scary fun.. i mean, every shift, it kicked the *** around.. i spun thru most of the 1/8th with thoes tires... very very fun. i loved it.


but.... you cant measure anything that way... and i still have loads of fun with a car that hooks... matter of fact, more fun because i dont fear smacking the wall.. i almost hit the wall TWICE with the car in full street trim... sure im not stock, but you get the point.

ok, you're there to see what she can do... what she does on the street is totally irrelevent. on the street, traction changes constantly. your launches are always slightly diffrent. there is nothing accurate enough to measure a 100th of a second.

at the track, you're most likely there to see if that cold air intake helped... or if your tuneup helped, or just for a baseline.

you go there on street tires, and you're all over the place.. 60's changing on every run.. and even if they're the same, you dont KNOW if you feathered it the same each time.
just bolt on your ETstreets (heck, the night before, bolt them on, drop the swaybar, ect and drive carefully to the track) and you get better 60s... ok, so your ET is lower..... big deal, that doesnt mean anything to you, the guy out there to "see what she does" for fun.... what matters to you is you can now see that 10th of improvement with the tuneup and more timing...


its for when you're out there for ANY reason besides fun... obviously my 8.6s were for fun.. look at them.. all over the place.. i wish i had video.. lol. sure when i bolt on slicks, it'll drop to 8.4s area..... but it wont be any less fun. and i can then see if my little changes work.. or even my big ones.... i have friends with HIGHER ETs when on nitrous... why? because they spin harder with street tires.... totally stock mustang with street tires and nitrous running 9.0s.... why? because of traction. (all times in this paragraphish group of words are 1/8th mile obviously.... lol)



want to go fast? want to go straight? want to use the track to tune? you need traction.. and the best thing you can do for traction is tires... it MIGHT be all you need...

383backinblack

some people get lucky

i twisted the splined end of the axles off in mine at 12.5

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

Heh, I’ve broken 6 sets of gears and one axle in 2 different 10 bolts, not even running particularly fast and the stickiest tires that I’ve had on the car were nitto drag radials. I thought that I had things whipped with the 9 bolt in my formula (it’s supposed to be as strong as a danna 44, right? ), and found that I was destroying the posi every 35passes and finally when I tried some stickier BFG DR’s I twisted an axle so bad that it actually makes the housing flex:
click here, I guarantee that you haven’t seen an axle do this before, 1MB

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

While I agree that getting a good launch would get ½ a second off of most people’s times, I don’t agree that sticky tires that will dead hook are the fastest way to go. One of my f-bodies was actually able to dead hook on a set of bfg dr’s after a decent burnout and only had enough power+gear+converter to run a 1.89 60’. Later I found that with a set of crappy radials and carefully pedaling it out of the hole I was able to run as fast as 1.81, and I’ve seen this on at least 3 different cars, just not as obviously as on that one.

As far as figuring out what worked… with the DR’s the car ran consistent 1.89-1.92 and when I figured out what it liked on the radials I was able to run consistent 1.81-1.84, and with most cars you can get a reasonable estimate of the difference that a change in 60’ will make at the big end by multiplying the difference by 1.5

IHI

iTrader: (1)

Okay, you just answered the question there. you run/ran consistant 1.89-1.92??

LOL, where is the consistency in that??!! moving .03 is not consistant, only moving .003 is. typical cars usually move .02 for every .01 they change in the 60' by the time you get to the finish line....and your supposed to get valid information if your tuning how with that sort of thing happening.

MrDude_1

oh, i agree, the perfect slip on a non-ideal drag car can makup for gearing or too tight of a converter...

but like he just said, it also means you're not as consistant... its always fun, but when im trying to figure stuff out, i put the ET streets on so that its the same (or close) each time...

mickman

Slicks are the way to go. I can only get 5.8-6.2 (0-60's Gtech) in my Lt1 powered 3rd gen with 4:10 gears. Having said that, I can't launch at full throttle, not even half throttle and absolutely no brake torque at all. I launch and watch at least a second tick off spinnin then the car races up to 60 in what looks like a high 4 or low 5, but I gotta keep my eyes on the road. These guys are right, traction is the key. I wish I hadn't blow all my money this year on mods and now I don't have the funds to get some sticky tires. You can't tune or do anything because there is NO consistency at all! Come next season the first thing I'm gonna do is get a set of BFG's that will be on my car full time. Its only a weekend toy for me. I gaurantee I'll take almost a full sec off my 0-60 time because of my terrible situation. What other mod can do that for you? I have the hardest, longest life rated perf tires on my car. I can only launch it with like 1/4 power if that off the line, it sucks! There is no way I can get them to hook with my setup. MAN I NEED BFG'S!!!

firedawg225

here my 2 cents. personnally when i go to the strip i do 2 different things depending on tracks.

only thing that changes is this.
1) (all on street tires) burn out stage, and do the brake gas thing to about 2400 then go on the 3rd yellow light. Full throttle all the way through. This worked good on my old highly modded 350TBI motor.
2) Burn out, stage, and just idle and go on the 3rd yellow. this is what i do now with the 383 HSR motor. I was told i was spinning thye tires alittle but in the car i could fell it and this is how i got my current E.T.

If i go to slick i can probuably drop .2 or .3. i think 10 bolt is still living to with all these runs. but i have a 28 spline, zenel torsen 3.73 rear drums

mdricken

PM sent! Let me know if you want to sell them.

IHI

iTrader: (1)

pm answered, 3 sets still in basement and will be adding another set by end on month.

sold one set at our night of fire a few weeks ago.

1 set-Hoosier Quick Time Pro DOT slicks 28x11.5x15 $50

2 sets-M/T 29.5x9x15 full slicks $50/set

1 set M/T 100% rubber inner tubes fit upto 29.5" tire $50/set

by end of this month another set of Hoosier 28x11.5 DOT slicks $50

87TPI350KID

Bringing this thread back to life. Went back to the track and got some new times, now im cutitng 2.14 60' times with 40 psi on street tires. Stock converter. I'm deffinately hooking much better now. I stepped up from a 245/50 to a 255/50. May not sound like much, but the times prove it. I think a mild stall should get it done.

Btw, I do have a very strong Posi. It's probably the best posi I have raced with. It donesn't whine or grind like some ive driven. These BW 9 bolts really hold up strong.

brutalform

You got a different size street tire? You should have just got, at the very least, a set of drag radials,(new, or used). I would not even spend a dime on a converter, until you get all you can out of what you have now. All you will be doing, is, putting the wagon in front of the horse.