nascarfan7

So I've been waiting for a long time to purchase my perfect Camaro and I think I've found it.

http://nh.craigslist.org/cto/1270344054.html

1992 Z28 1LE with the heritage package. If I'm correct 705 1LE Camaros were made in 1992 which includes the B4C. (116 1LE and 589 B4C)

I don't know how many of those were also optioned with the Z03 Heritage Package.

It's a 5.7 which means an auto. He mentioned the G92 option but with 3.27 gears. I thought 3.23 was the gear used with the auto and 3.42 with the manual. Did 1LE cars use different ratios? Typo?

Could someone up on their 1LE knowledge give me an idea as to how rare this is and what to look for? (no A/C, correct?)

Thirdgen Ranch

iTrader: (5)

Well, I own a '92 1LE Heritage Z28 and I know of seven in existence. Two of them are white and five are red. (I have a red 305/5-speed with a black interior.) If this car is a 1LE I believe it is one that I didn't know of so that would make eight.

However, I don't believe this car is a 1LE. The 1LEs didn't come with driving/fog lights and this car has them. It's possible they were added later but my guess is that this car is just a normal Z28.

The seller has some incorrect 1LE info in his ad so I'm guessing he doesn't know what he's talking about. (Unfortunately, there is a lot of bad information on the internet that has convinced some people that any car with G92 is a 1LE and that's not the case.)

Yes, you're right, The car would have a 3.23 gear not 3.27. The easiest way to verify it's the real deal is to check the SPID label on the inside of the rear storage compartment door on the driver's side. If the code "1LE" is on there it's the real thing. If it's not there, it's NOT a 1LE.

If it's a 1LE it's a very rare car and definitely worth picking up but I'm guessing it's not.

okfoz

The picture of the sheet he has there is too small to read... I would see if he would send you a larger more clear copy of it.

BTW, of the 705 cars made in 1992, there were also LB9/M5 cars, they were not allL98 cars.

The car looks pretty nice, I think $11K is a bit steep, for a 1LE with 103K miles... I dunno if I would do it. TImes are tough enough, especially with the economy we have been put into for the past 6 months. I would think $9K would be more reasonable with those miles personally, Last year, yeah, sure $11K, not this year.

Of coures if it is something you really want, I do not think it is wildly out of line. Especially if it is a 1LE.

nascarfan7

Questions lead me to believe it's a L98 with the Z03 package. It's loaded including A/C and fog lamps.

Sounds like a nice Z28. Not an 11K one though. 4.5-5K range I'd be interested.

Thirdgen Ranch

iTrader: (5)

That's what I would have guessed. I think $11,000 would have been a little overpriced for a 100k mile 1LE but it's way overpriced for being a regular 100k mile Z28.

scottmoyer

I was able to decipher the invoice that is listed with the item. It is not a 1LE. It is a correct Heritage Edition Z28 with G92, Delco Bose, Option group 3, rear window defrost, auto trans and 5.7 liter engine. NADA does denote the value as he listed it, however, a $198 option for the Heritage Stripes does not warrant an $11k book price increase over a standard Z28 for 1992. NADA states a regular Z with 103k miles at less than $5k. For a clean car, with proven maintenance records, I would pay maybe $7000 for this car. My reasons are because of the miles, economy, and the fact I don't believe there is any future collector value to a stripe package moreso than any regular Z. If the car had lower miles, it'd be worth more, but comparing to other 92s, I'm not out of line with my pricing. Plus, the body has been tweaked to install the front strut tower brace, the Bose system is gone, and dash is cracked. To return to stock for full value will cost considerably.

nascarfan7

It's on Ebay, with the RPO sticker.

http://tinyurl.com/m95gto

AmorgetRS

iTrader: (6)

LOL, and the SPID sheed STILL doesn't have 1LE on it...

nascarfan7

Well I've been in contact with him via e-mail trying to explain what a 1LE Camaro is but he's pretty sure he has a 1LE.

"When ordered with air conditioning ($466), RPO G92 included engine oil cooler, 4-wheel disc brakes, and dual-converter exhaust. Without air condition­ing ($675), RPO G92 added heavy-duty front brakes, aluminum driveshaft and spare wheel, special shocks and fuel pickup, and gas tank baffle. Fog lamps were deleted for weight savings and better air flow to the radiator. Available for Z28 Coupes only."

He is getting tripped up on the G92 part. He is under the impression if you ordered option G92 that makes it a 1LE because of the above statement.I guess I can see where he is getting confused and tried to point out the differences in the statement above. Sent him links and so forth. It's really local to me, think $4500 is reasonable?

Jason444

iTrader: (6)

He doesn't have enough sense to read his own SPID? If it doesn't say 1LE, its not a 1LE. That seems pretty simple.

okfoz

And he probably wonders why no one has bid on it...

Edit: I guess you could ask him where it shows it as a 1LE on the SPID. Tell him that you are haveing a hard time finding it.

John

nascarfan7

Oh I've told him, lol.

"Just because it doesn't say it on the sticker doesn't mean it's not a 1le. According to my sources ordering the g92 option makes it one because you get the same things"

That made my head spin. No idea what sources he has but they're...wrong. I've invited him to check out thirdgen.org for the truth. He stopped answering my e-mails when I said the market might fetch $4500-$5500 for a Z in that condition.

Dmans85

Less than 1 in 3 G92's ended up being 1Le's for the record in '92.

I have a hard time believing he might be that dense. Probably just hoping for that sucker born every minute.
Reminds me of a 92 around here for sale. A bare bones no frills Lo3 formula into the 100k mile range for 8k. Listed in paper as a "collector".

okfoz

Or he may be mislead. You might ask him if the car has the 12" front brakes with the PBR calipers that were 1LE exclusive... More or less that was the major difference that can be easily seen. Also if it has AC then it is NOT a 1LE unless it is a B4C... The B4C was not available with the Z03 stripes from the factory.

nascarfan7

Oh brother...

Now he has a disclaimer on why it's a 1LE...sigh. Can anyone who looks at his craigslist ad flag it for removal, he's gone off the deep end.

http://nh.craigslist.org/cto/1270344054.html

Iroctopless

WOW!
I knew that the general 1LE's were fairly rare, but he has one of the few unofficial official, phantom, off the record, undocumented yet recognised, extremely unique, slipped through the cracks, unadverstised, under the table, always wanted but never heard of, one of one and custom made right from Chevrolet themselves!
The . . .
1LE Stealth!!!

I've heard rumours that it was actually offered in the '92 brochures, but you won't find it. Some say it was on the back page. The text was written with the same invisible ink that was used on the RPO SPID label.
The Camaro Stealth was quickly cancelled after building only one due to Dodge already releasing their own well known Stealth the year before.

scottmoyer

I sent him an email informing him that his car is not a 1LE. I also sent him the documentation on how to determine if his car is a 1LE. In that documentation, I flagged the air conditioning and fog lights section and how a 1LE was originally purchased. I wonder if he'll respond.

scottmoyer

I received a response from the seller. I believe the issue lies in what he has been led to believe. He was also directed to camarosource.ca and it can be confusing what Paul has written about what makes a 1LE a 1LE. I'm not sure he knows what the RPO codes really mean and how they tell what a car really is. I responded back to him with more of an explanation. What he does with it, is up to him. Here was his response to me originally:

I know it's not a 1le. I never stated this has the 1le RPO. I stated it
is one of 705 cars ordered with the "1le" special performance equipment
package. Not that it has the 1le RPO. Chevrolet told me that the B4C car
will have the 1le RPO but the combo that I have will not show the 1le
RPO.

The information I am going on comes directly from Chevrolet. I was
pointed to this site to understand what the "1le" special performance
equipment package that my car came with was as follows (All of which my
car has)


Package consisted of (G92 Was Ordered With A/C) [Street Vehicle]:

* engine oil cooler
* 4-wheel disc brakes
* Performance exhaust system (N10) (dual catalytic converters)
* Tires P245/50 ZR16 Goodyear Gatorback


So what am I wrong about in my postings? I am not claiming the car has
the 1le RPO code, I claim it has the "1le special performance equipment
package". This is what Chevrolet has told me is accurate information and
a correct portrayal of my car and the number of 705 produced with these
options.

vjl

nascarfan7

"So what am I wrong about in my postings? I am not claiming the car has
the 1le RPO code"

And from his craigslist ad....

"This is an extremely rare 1992 25'th anniversary heritage edition Z28 Camaro. Only 705 of these cars were made with the 5.7l engine and the "1le" special performance equipment package for 1992"

I don't know, maybe I'm being overly **** about this guys ads. On one hand he could be just misinformed and on the other knows what he has and is trying to pass it off as a 1LE. He even changed his Craiglist ad so he must be getting a few people telling him what he really has. Sell the car on it's own merits. It's a loaded, 1992 5.7 Z28 G92, Z03 package, 100K+ miles with some mods and minor issues.

I was interested in this car, not for 11K and he's not budging.

scottmoyer

I got another response from the seller. He contacted GM about the car to get a history of it. It was GM that told him he had the street version of a 1LE. He asked why they would tell him that, if the car wasn't a 1LE. I explained the call center people and lack of knowledge they have. I also confirmed the street version, explained what that meant and how deleting AC added the 1LE brakes, etc. I also told him that by having AC, he has as close to a 1LE as you can get without having one.

I truly believe he is misinformed and was given wrong information. He is not the traditional scammer trying to rip people off. He is not willing to change his ad just yet as he wants to learn more about his car. I can appreciate a person not willing to drop their price just because 1 or 2 people said so. He wants to get what the car is worth and as of now, he believes the car is a 1LE. Try to help the uninformed or misinformed rather than always thinking they are scamming! You get better results!!!

In response to the above questions, he believes he has 1 of 705 1LE equipment packages on a non-1LE RPO code car. He is not stating that he has a 1LE but that he has the 1LE equipment package. That info is what he got from Chevrolet.

scottmoyer

New update, the seller is asking for help on wording so he can market the car fairly. Give him time to research and we'll see what happens. I told him to capitalize on the fact that it's as close to a 1LE as you can get without being a 1LE. Those keywords will still drive up the hit count.

nascarfan7

That's good he is at least willing to entertain the idea that it's not a 1LE. I've tried to tell him he has a "unique" Z28. L98, G92, Z03, last year of the third gen, ect. If he just takes out the 1LE part of his ads, what he has is good hype for the car. It's just false advertising to "market" it as a 1LE. He's one check mark shy on the order form for a 1LE. Close but no cigar.

Anyone in the market for a 1LE that knows what to look for will know what the car is. I think he is losing potential bids and buyers after they investigate further with the ad he has now. Gonna have to adjust that asking price also, that's a whole other can o'worms

scottmoyer

I got a final response from the seller. He disclosed the source of his misinformation and where Chevy got the information. See his mail below:

"Hi Scott,

So here is what I got from Chevrolet, (Man those guys are a real pain in the A$$). The first word back I got from the girl on the phone (after I called her back three times for not getting back to me when she said she would) was "yes, the car is one of the 705 produced". (Don't freak out yet, there's a whole lot more BS to come from them). Then I pressured her and told her I had gotten a lot of negative feedback from Camaro experts on the internet and wanted to know where her information was coming from. She told me it came from an "inside source". So I pushed her to go find out where that "inside source" was getting their information from. She calls me back a day later and guess what the answer I got back was, camarosource.ca.

So then I told her about you, and what you had told me. I asked her to go back to the "source's boss" to see what more could be found for me and this is the answer I got back.

=============================================================================

I've consulted with one of our researchers and his response is:

"I can confirm from the 1992 Chevrolet Passenger Options Shipments that
705 Camaros were shipped with the 1LE Special Performance Equipment
Package. However, if 1LE is not listed on either his invoice or on the
Service Parts Identification Label (on the inside of the center console
door), we can not confirm that he has this package."

=============================================================================

Now my service parts label is in the trunk in the lockbox (right?) and I have posted a picture of it on the Internet. The 1le RPO is not there so everybody who beat me up has been right all along. It's a shame you can't trust the maker of the car. Lazy people really make me angry.

So I've revised my ad on craigslist to reflect the following information below. I was wondering if you could do me one last favor and proof read it for accuracy prior to me putting this ad on any other sites. The storage facility I store the car in is closing in October and I'm not going to find this cheap of a price anyplace else. I don't want to store it outside and I don't want to pay through the nose to keep the car in another storage, so alas, it must go.

http://nh.craigslist.org/cto/1270344054.html

If you have any suggestions to better my ad I'd appreciate the help! Thanks for being cool with me! I really appreciate it. I was never out to scam anybody, just misinformed.

Thanks!

vjl"


If somone knows Paul well over at camarosource.ca, they might want to inform him that the wording he has listed for the 1LEs is not incorrect, but in the format he has it in, can cause confusion. You have to read it carefully and completely. If you read only the areas that GM read, it looks like this car can be a 1LE, which is not correct.

nascarfan7

Excellent. I'm glad he's seen the "light". So he was in actual contact with GM and alot of that info they got was from camarosource.ca? No wonder the poor guy was confused.

I feel bad he felt he was beaten up with all the responses he got. That wasn't my intention at all. I contacted him at first as an interested buyer. When I saw the SPID sticker and all the options it had, I knew either he was misinformed or out and out lying.

I'm still interested but unsure what this car should be priced at. Seems the seller is also. Without a closer inspection I still think $5000 is about right, maybe a little more.

P.S. Thank you Scott for the time you put into this