Jason E

What I need to know is what is EVERY difference an L69 has from an LG4. This engine is going to be original down to the bolts that screw it together...I dare say 0-60 in 6.7 and the 1/4 in 15 flat should keep Matt happy

I know the cam can still be gotten through GM, but the pistons are discontinued (I almost restored an '85 SS a few years back...). L69's are a 9.5:1, correct??

Also, did all '83 L69s have 3.73s??

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Jason E

'89 Camaro RS 2.8
Medium Grey Metallic
2.8, A4, T-tops, 90k miles

'97 Z28 w/30th Anniversary package
LT1 (obviously), 6 speed, t-tops
White with orange stripes, killer system, 41k miles

Speed Kills...Wanna live forever? Drive a Ford.
Long Live #3...

RB83L69

AFAIK all L69s came with 3.73s.

Pistons are flat-tops with 4 valve reliefs.

There are entirely too many differences to list. The carb, distributor, exhaust from heads to street, pulleys, electric fan instead of clutch, pistons, rods, cam, flywheel, AIR pump, frame bracing, hood, ECM, wiring harness, gears, .... are

I have the old cam out of my L69, just took it out the other day; I don't want it, there are far better ones around that will work in an otherwise bone-stock one of those, I'd consider selling it, or measuring it. I don't have the lifters so it can't really be installed, but it's in good enough shape to be used as a pattern. Or maybe somebody can regrind it to its existing profile.

Why don't you just go find a car with that motor in the boneyard? That's a whole lot easier to deal with than somebody trying to describe all that stuff over the net... plus, there are a number of things that are extremely difficult and expensive if not impossible to obtain any other way.

Flat-top pistons (that's all the L69s are, nothing special, LG4s are dished) are available from a number of sources. Sterling can supply hypereutectic ones, or Sealed Power has forged ones.

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"So many Mustangs, so little time..."
ICON Motorsports

Jason E

I was not aware that there was THAT much difference!! Other than pistons, cam, exhaust and a few other doo dads, I figured they were the same damn engine. I have period L69 tests, and these are the differing parts that they mentioned...not anything about an AIR pump, electric fan, etc.

Guess we'll make it as stock as possible using what we can!

RB83L69

Think about it.... LG4, 145 HP; L69, 190 HP. 33% increase according to the ratings, but I think if you run the ET vs. weight calculator you'll find it actually put out a good bit more than 190. Same block. Same heads. Where is all that power coming from?

The answer is, a whole lot of places. The different compression is probably about 10 HP; the exhaust about 15; the cam about 10. The L69 pulleys are an underdrive compared to the LG4, there's 4 or 5. The electric fan is probably about 7 or 8. Etc. etc. Plus, the L69 cars were just all-around better cars in other places besides the engine room: mine has the WS6 option, (had) aluminum drums, the fiberglass hood, a whole bunch of frame bracing, quick-ratio steering; all of those things weren't on plain-jane LG4 Z28s.

Another thing I forgot to mention - my L69 came with X rods, not the usual 305 garbage.

Seriously, if you want to build yourself a L69, go find a L69 car in the junkyard and snag the motor and everything else you see that's different from your base model Z28. It will cost you less to do it that way than to try to piece it together, and you'll have ALL the cool stuff instead of just a few of the more obvious things.

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"So many Mustangs, so little time..."
ICON Motorsports

Jason E

We already have the L69 in the car I ran the VIN and it is an original L69 car...we believe the motor is the original one. It has an electric fan for one thing!! It has 170k and needs help though!!!

I just wanted to know, as we amass parts to rebuild the engine, that when it comes to engine internals I am getting the right stuff. There are many different cams/pistons for 305...just wanna get the right stuff.

[This message has been edited by Jason E (edited May 09, 2001).]

zenish

the autos came with 3.42s

super83Z

I don't think the auto L69's were 3.42. I believe all L69 cars had 3.73's

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I WOULD RATHER PUSH A CAMARO THAN DRIVE AN IMPORT

1983Z28 350w/ edelbrock performer RPM power package with 64cc aluminum heads, dynomax shorty headers, 700R-4 with shift kit, 750cfm carb, edelbrock 3" exhaust system, ASCD SS hood, 16" IROC rims.

future mods:
completely done over suspension, black paint with flames, Hurst shifter, dakota digital gauge package, procharger supercharger.

Demon Z28

My vin denotes LG4, yet I still have the 5 speed and the fiberglass hood (not sure on gears, will get back to you)

Mines confused hehehehe

eightTfourTA

iTrader: (3)

Right. That's what my auto L69 HAD, until they self-destructed after the "overkill" tranny build-up. Ironically, now i've got 3.42's.

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DR Stevens
1984 Trans Am 305HO L69
sucks gas, hauls ***
1991 Firebird 305 LO3
for days when I need a/c

Jason E

Well, its a 5 speed anyways, so I assume 3.73s...

Can anyone give me the came specs?? 9.5:1 CR, right?

super83Z

Demon is your car an 83? All 83 Z28's came with a fiberglass hood. 83 was the first year for the 5-speed also. Yes the comp ratio on the L69 is 9.5:1 ALL L69's came with 3.73's those gears are part of the H.O. package. The Ho's also had a freer flowing exhaust and cat(from the corvette). I have a 1983 Camaro shop manual and unfortunately all it list for cam specs is the lift at .002 (good luck figuring it out from there) well anyways here that is:

Intake: .269 Exhaust: .276

sorry I couldn't be anymore help on the cam stuff

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I WOULD RATHER PUSH A CAMARO THAN DRIVE AN IMPORT

1983Z28 350w/ edelbrock performer RPM power package with 64cc aluminum heads, dynomax shorty headers, 700R-4 with shift kit, 750cfm carb, edelbrock 3" exhaust system, ASCD SS hood, 16" IROC rims.

future mods:
completely done over suspension, black paint with flames, Hurst shifter, dakota digital gauge package, procharger supercharger.

orange rocket

I love how some just love to argue with jason. All he is doing is trying to figure out how I can keep this car original and not going to a bone yard finding a pos. That makes no sense I have a good one already. If you don't want to help then don't give him a hard time for helping me out. Thanks to all that have had some positive input it I am thankful.

Kevin91Z

iTrader: (1)

Why do you want it to be all original? Throw in a hotter cam and lifters, put in some better pistons, and port match the heads and intake, and have yourself a better car.

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1991 Camaro Z28
5.7L 5-Speed (originally 305)
13.23 @ 107.62 MPH
Southern California
Member: SoCal 3rd Gen F-Bodies
Webmaster: SoCal F-Bodies
-=ICON Motorsports=-

Jason E

The idea here isn't to make a hot rod...its to restore an interesting piece of third gen history. No one here can tell me a modded car will be worth more than a stock one.

Also, no one here can tell me that a factory car that can do 0-60 in under 7 sec and the 1/4 in 15 flat really NEEDS to be modded to be a nice car. This isn't a 305 TBI...all I'm trying to do is find info on how to restore it STOCK. I figured someone around here should know!!

super83Z

Hey its cool Jason shoot me a mail if you don't want to post I will try my best to help you. I say restore that 83H.O. because everyone else modded theirs or cracked it up. I wish I had one I would mod it but keep all the factory parts in my garage.

Oh yeah and I am surprised we haven't ran into the "why are you going to restore a thirdgen? They are never going to be worth anything blah blah blah." Yup that is what they said about those 1st gens in the 70's never going to be worth anything. yeah right. The thirdgen: Era that performance came back to the Camaro, 83 5.0 H.O. the first real succesful attempt at performance, and also one of the most popular styles.

Keep up the good work Jason! So yes you are looking at a special carb, intake, higher compression, special air cleaner, 3.73's and a special cam. Does it still have the dual snorkel on it? IF it doesn't I think I saw one on Ebay. later man and keep me posted

How long do you guys expect to take with it?

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I WOULD RATHER PUSH A CAMARO THAN DRIVE AN IMPORT

1983Z28 350w/ edelbrock performer RPM power package with 64cc aluminum heads, dynomax shorty headers, 700R-4 with shift kit, 750cfm carb, edelbrock 3" exhaust system, ASCD SS hood, 16" IROC rims.

future mods:
completely done over suspension, black paint with flames, Hurst shifter, dakota digital gauge package, procharger supercharger.

black84ta

that kicks *** that someone is restoring an ho to stock! i'm so ****ing tired of seeing ugly modified 3rdgens with 350's in them. good luck man!

Jason E

Hehe...thanks for the support guys. I have always been into STOCK cars...anyone can mod a car, but it takes a lotta effort sometimes to keep (or make) a car in mint, original condition. My '97 30th Anniversary Z is staying absolutely stock, aside from a nasty stereo system. Even then, not one thing in the car is being "hacked."

We will be taking awhile on this. And seeing as how Matt is moving to FL in August, it'll take even longer after that point. The car just showed up at his house today, and this was the first time I had seen it on level ground, let alone pavement!! It looked, well, not so good...

According to my road tests (I have 3 '83 L69 tests), the major differences between an L69 and an LG4 or LU5 was the "Corvette" cam (their words, not mine), the 9.5:1 pistons, rejetted carb, dual snorkel air cleaner and larger exhaust. The intake was unique as well?? How so?? We haven't even been able to determine that this is the original engine yet (gotta bring the serial # to a dealer ASAP), but it sure looks it. The air cleaner is there, but missing the snorkels. I think he'll find NOS snorkels...

As much as he wants to mod it (IROC wheels, 4th gen seats, IROC tailights), I've convinced him not to do any of this stuff. Having a completely original '83 Z is gonna be awesome. And when you factor in what this car represents??? This car will get some SERIOUS attention.

Super 83Z, thanks for your offers to help. I know all there is to knpw about stock TPI, but carbed motors I don't know crap about. I'm just glad that even though Matt is restoring this thing, I saved it from where it more than likely would have ended up in 6 months...the bone yard.

I'll post pics of it ASAP, so that you guys can see that while its solid, we got a LONG road...

TOM 85T/A

I have an 85 T/A H.O 5spd WS6 thats all stock had it since new,only 72000 on it.If I can be of any help let me know.

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73SDT/A 77 T/A6.6 85H.OT/A

orange rocket

If I wanted power I will hop in my 00 T/A I wouldn't be restoring a 83 for performance. I am doing this because I like Jason's 89 original and a original V8 will be nice. So when we jack this car up does anyone know where we should be looking for the block tags so we can match it up to the vin #. Sooner the better so I know this is where I want my money to go. I am glad to see that I know have people supporting me doing this and not hopping it up and half as*ing it. When I do something it is done right and that means this will cost a small fortune. everything will be new as many parts as I can from dealer or Classic Ind. Any more advise or block #location would be app. Thanks, Matt

super83Z

on either side of the block behind the heads there is a little flat spot that is where the numbers are. The Tranny numbers are on the passenger side but I am not sure where abouts.

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I WOULD RATHER PUSH A CAMARO THAN DRIVE AN IMPORT

1983Z28 350w/ edelbrock performer RPM power package , dynomax shorty headers, 700R-4 with shift kit, 750cfm carb, edelbrock 3" exhaust system, ASCD SS hood, 16" IROC rims.

future mods:
completely done over suspension, black paint with flames, Hurst shifter, dakota digital gauge package, procharger supercharger.

b4z

Jason,

Good for you. Good luck in your quest.
I had both a '83Z with the 150 hp LG4 and a '84 H.O. Z with the 5 speed and an open rear end.

The L69 car was a real screamer and i suspect that it actually had about 205 hp. It had more top end than the TPI car i have now.

Just wanted to pass on some info from my 11 month ownership of this car.

From the day i bought it it had terrible vapor lock problems. The fuel line was too close to the exhaust system. After much
talk with GM trying to fix the problem a TSB was announced putting a electric intake fuel pump in the car. It totally fixed the problem and i was actually able to run the car up through the gears. Check and see if yours has the in tank fuel pump because you will definitely need it.

My car was the silver grey with dark grey lower rocker panels and wheels. I took the stripes off. It was absolutely beautiful.

Jason E

b4z,

I know the EXACT color combo you are referring to, and that was a great looking car. There's an '85 Z running around town with that same combo, only he redid the red perimeter stripe. It's too bad, because while it looks great, he beats the crap out of it.

We've had the car running, and it appears to run very good. We can't get it out of 1st gear because something's messed up, but it definitely has some power!! I've been told that L69s were underrated, and even this 170k mile one feels like it could be quick. We'll see what happens when we can shift it

orange rocket

Well, I got some help with some one moving the pedal to day and discovered that the linkage was snaped right at the bend where it bolts to the frame. Now I need to track this part down and it will go down the road with out question. I'm going to the dealer tomorrow and see if a nos is still available. If not any ideas as to where a 83 clutch linkage may be obtained?

AirN1

i just pulled my 305 HO (L69) out of my 84 T/A......and its gunna sit....if u need any parts or any info id be happy to help you out....its all factory cept for the distributor....

import'sdread

Yes! Restore your car. I plan on restoring my '89 TA to factory stock. To bad for me the 305 is a replacement done by the dealer early in the cars' life. You still have the factory motor! As far as the money, who cares? It will still have value to you.

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1989 Trans Am, 305 TPI 5-speed, T-Tops(love 'em),4-wheel disc, 3.73 posi(the toy). '97 Camaro V-6 T-Tops(daily driver)

N2TRUX

Unless you guys are refering to 83 L69's only, this statement is incorrect. My 84 H.O.(L69)auto has 3.42's. We ordered the car, and hand picked everything. I can't remember if we specified 3'42's over 3.73's, but regardless mine has "factory" 3.42's...



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84 Z-28 H.O.
The only "car" I own!

MRZ28HO

1984 L69s that specified the optional RPO code GT4 got the 3.73s. Very few were not specified and got the standard gearing. My 3rd gen does not specify at all a GTx code, so it was probably a 3.42 gear ratio originally. Yet I do have another '84, but it does specify GT4 = 3.73s.

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George P. Lara
3rd Gen, 4th Gen
SCCA, SCFB, SC3GFB

Ed Maher

A few posts back someone mentioned the 'special' intake the L69 got...thats not entirely true. By 83 most LG4s were also getting the Al intake (standard was supposed to be iron.) I personally have never even seen an iron intaked LG4, even my 83 grand prix had Al. The only LG4s that i know got Fe intakes were canadian models, even kevin vandevennes old 85 LG4 had iron.
But this intake is a perfect example of how the LG4 was also underated through the years. Also, most LG4s seemingly got L69 carbs as well, with a wider opening AV. When you see someone complaining about a 17second LG4, you can bet he has the ****ty opening AV.
...ed