customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

before u flame me heres the situation. just built a 15 grand 383 with trans and a HSR with aluminum heads, custom tuning and all the goodies. i had 15grand in the engine/trans and all the EFI stuff. just to have it all stolen from me with less than 3,000 miles on the engine!

In a fit of rage and mental instability im going on the cheap. i was able to aquire a 460cuin BBF complete with a C6 3 speed automatic. IM GONA MAKE THIS HUGE THING FIT!

heres wat ive done, had the block worked over, bored .030 and i purchased a stroker kit for a mild 521 cuin . block should weigh in around 580-600lbs complete when im done (aluminum heads/intake/waterpump etc). i mocked up motor mounts on the BBF that uses the stock poly clamshell bushings that the 383 used in the stock location. ran into a problem... i got the block to drop right in but im gona have some clearance issues! the front of the 460 crank is 5.5" in length from the front main bearing! thats HUGE! thats how far it sticks out from the front of the block! this would put it in contact with the TDS wonderbar and front sway bar with a harmonic balancer and crank pulley. I had tons of clearance behind the engine like almost 4". so i moved the motor mounts on the Kmember back 3" pushing it to the back edge of the Kmemeber (easier said then done!) i also drilled new holes for all 4 bolts where they only used 3 stock each.

Now i remeasured the distances and ive come to the conclusion that im close to the clearances i need in the front (maybe push the motor back 2 more inches!) but at this moment im right up against the firewall on the driver side. right where the gas pedal is. Is there a way to relocate the gas pedal? or clearance the firewall and move the gas pedal forward into the car? this is my delema.

u can see how long the BBF crank snout is here
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=...w=1680&bih=874

AlkyIROC

Any swap can be done with enough time and money. Don't ask if it can be done. If that's what you want to do then just do it.

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

understood. so am i able to relocate the gas pedal? wats incorporated with the relocation?

Atilla the Fun

I think you'd be among the first to do such a thing to one of these cars, but I think it's just a simple sheet-metal cut-and-weld job.

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

ok well i hope it is... i mocked the engine up today to see how she sits in the car, i was right on the money with the engine placement, its right up against the firewall right at the gas pedal. looks like ill be hacking away. is there anything behind the firewall around the trans tunnel on the inside? besides carpeting and some wiring.

Atilla the Fun

the footwell ducting for the heat/ air cond. is there.

AlkyIROC

Because I have my seat moved back at least 6", having the throttle pedal mounted on the firewall was too far away when I went to WOT. I found a good spring loaded pedal assembly out of some minivan and fabricated a support farther up the firewall to position the pedal closer to me. Since my car is a drag racing car only, cosmetics wasn't an issue. I also use linkage instead of a cable.

I plan on cutting out the tranny tunnel this winter to make a removable tunnel and with the pedal moved away from the tunnel/firewall, I can cut more of the firewall to provide better access. My engine is set back about an inch and accessing the bellhousing bolts is almost impossible. None can be done from the top.

Before you start modifying the firewall or tranny tunnel, you should remove as much interior from that area as possible. Cutting and welding will cause lots of damage to the inside.

Guest

Can you get us some pics? Please?

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

in reference to wat?

also alkyiroc... wat linkage setup do u have? ive got the engine to fit now... moved back another 1/2" so its a total of 3.5" back from stock. I hacked into the firewall after pulling the carpet up etc. gas pedal is only held on by 2 studs? lol geez. i guess mounting them to the new firewall wont be too bad.

AlkyIROC

On the tunnel ram is an Enderle dual linkage setup. There's a CO2 cylinder attached to that and the rest is custom made. It's solid rod linkage. If I have to, I can quickly disconnect the rod with the CO2 cylinder and replace it with just a solid rod.

I use the CO2 cylinder as a starting line enhancer. Pushing a button releases the CO2 and the cylinder extends. The throttle pedal is all the way down and I'm at an idle. As soon as I let go of the transbrake button, the delay box reactivates the CO2 cylinder and the throttle goes to WOT.

That way I can stage with my foot to the floor and sit at an idle for as long as I need to. It can also be done using a throttle cable system but it's not as easy to do. I need to bend the brake and throttle so they're more towards the left side away from the tranny tunnel before I cut out the tunnel. I'm thinking about finding a manual tranny brake pedal for a smaller pedal.

I can't remember exactly what kind of minivan I pulled the throttle pedal out of. I've hacked and modified it to work the way I want. It's spring loaded so even if the throttle springs break, the pedal will still close the throttle. The bolt near the top of the pedal is a mechanical stop. It prevents me from forcing the linkage past the WOT setting since the pedal itself doesn't get anywhere near the floor. The tow hook is mandatory with mechanical linkage so you can pull the throttle closed. With the pedal return spring, I've never needed it but the rulebook still says I have to have it. If all the return springs happen to break at the same time, I can still close the throttle.

You can see my fabricated steering column. The support under the dash to hold it up and the bearing support through the firewall. The hole through the firewall was relocated up and outward slightly to clear the header tubes.

t-top havoc

iTrader: (3)

I know Alky's car is for racing. What's your plan?
Are you going to have to relocate the trans X-member since the motor is sofar back?
I ask only because it's interesting to see the dif ways things are done.

Good luck in the venture!!

AlkyIROC

Making a new tranny crossmember isn't hard. I've made a couple of them over the years as I've changed things around. The last couple I've done, I incorporated a driveshaft loop right onto the crossmember so I didn't have to attach it to the floor.

Atilla the Fun

Ahh, progress......Excellent!

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

hmmm gas pedal looks interesting lol. im going to have to rip out the stock pedal and see how it works and then mod the firewall and see if i can get it to work. but otherwise i might have to go with wat u have. but u converted to solid linkage... is there a reason for that besides the CO2 cylinder/racing aspect? if i move my gas pedal will i not be able to use the stock cable linkage?


T-tophavok... im not worried about the trans... making the cross member is easy... the motor mounts were a PITA!!! the motor mounts are 5" tall so the pan would clear the idler arm. the car will no longer be a DD but a street monster and a track car. i will still drive it when its nice out and warm but its done for in the winter. i just want to stomp on this thing. im hoping for alittle better weight ratio now that the engine has been pushed back. not like i pushed it back a foot or so but still... the block itself is big tho... 19" not including the timing cover, just the bare block head surface.

Alkyiroc... sounds like a good idea! i originally had a jegster bolt in drive shaft safety loop but those ****** took that too when they stole everything. might kill 2 birds with one stone with that. C6 has a different kind of trans mount tho... not like a GM bushing... its sandwiched from the sides i think.

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

but u got any pics of the crossmembers? id like to see what uve done for ideas.

Atilla the Fun

Jeg's offers a short torque arm that doesn't need to attach to the trans, that'd really help with using the C6.

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

already have the jegster shorty tunnel mount tq arm. I purchased it used off this forum, but i didnt like that it was non adjustable when i lowered the car, so i made my own adjustable tubular shorty tq arm using the jegster tunnel mount (basiaclly just swapped out tq arms.

the trans isnt a problem as far as the suspension goes since the tq arm isnt connected to it... its the actual trans mount. the C6 doesnt have a bushing attachment (threaded holes for poly bushing)
hard to see in the pic but theres no mount on the bottom tailshaft/body for a bushing
http://www.charlietranny.com/C6bbps.JPG

newer versions have the bushing flange for a regular trans mount but mine do not (AKA long tailshaft). to swap the rear covers i would have to change the output shaft since the nose will be much shorter (AKA short tailshaft).

AlkyIROC

It looks like a Spohn crossmember without a torque arm mount. My car uses 4-link suspension so I don't need a torque arm mount. Two pieces of angle iron bolted to the body. Two 1" tubes connected across. A pad in the middle to put the tranny mount on.

With a front and mid plate on the engine, my tranny crossmember holds very little weight. It's only really giving a little bit of stability to the tranny and provides a spot to mount the driveshaft loop. The transmission can easily hang off the back of the engine as long as the engine is supported at the front and rear. I also have an engine stabilizer to keep it from moving front to back since motor plates will flex. Go look at a dragster. They'll use a shorty Powerglide. It doesn't have a long tailshaft and there's no tranny crossmember.

As for the solid linkage, it was the easiest way to use a CO2 cylinder. You can always find different length OEM cables. Third gens with carbs/TBI use a different length cable than TPI systems. Even a V6/V8 cable may be different lengths.

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

oh ok, my transmount will def see some forces then lol no motor plates for me.

so I cant use a TPI cable for a carb? does the length matter? besides the fact that it could bind if not ran correctly?

AlkyIROC

You can use whatever cable you want as long as it doesn't bind. The TPI cable is long as the throttle body is at the front of the engine. The carb/TBI cable is shorter since it only needs to go to the middle of the engine.

You can't leave the cable's firewall passthrough connection in the same location and move the pedal somewhere else without remodifying the pedal so that the cable stays in the same location.

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

hmmm i understand. since i have to modify the firewall anyway to that location (basically flatten out the entire firewall esp the driver side cat hump) i will relocate the firewall pass through.

since ive changed the height of the motor does that mean ive also essentially changed the pinion angle correct? raising the trans with the motor means i need to change the pinion angle on the tq arm/rear end.