1984Firebird502

PLEASE READ, AND PLEASE DON'T TELL ME SEARCH THE ARCHIVES, because I have, many times, and read and read. I have a carbed 1984 firebird with a 2.8 v6 in it and T5. I also have a 1985 z28 engine and a rebuilt 700r4. In the car now has a t5 5 speed in it. Is a swap even worth it? Should I just look for a new 3rd gen? I've been trying to find a v8 car for such a long time (to make the swap easier) and no find (junk yards, friends etc). I've also tried to find a 350 for SUCH A LONG TIME. What would you guys do? I'm only 17 and the fact that v6 to v8, PLUS, manual to automatic. Plus, I have to rebuild the 305, and it's a 305. Why do I want to put all that money into a 305? It's currently down to bare block. Is it even worth it? If it was a trans am, maybe, but it's just an SE. This site may help:

Http://geocities.com/jmboriss/bluecar.html

The car also has a lot of rust on it and little dents.

Plus a guy down the street from me is selling a 350 built 83' camaro with turbo tranny etc for 2,000. That sounds SO appealing. That's why I'm thinking about selling mine.

EVEN IF YOU'RE JUST BROWSING, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE RESPOND, even if it's a smart alick remark. I respect older people and thier advice. Thank you.

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1984 Firebird SE
1985 Camaro z28 305 engine T-5 Five Speed Tranny, 92 Camaro Leather Seats Console, carpet everything. Soon to put in 700R4 and 427CI. (Hopefully.
To view my car go to:

http://geocities.com/jmboriss/bluecar.html

It is also for sale, please make me an offer. Thanks.

jtmiller92

iTrader: (42)

If you have the 2 grand for the 83 it would probably be worth it to just buy it and sell what you have......just my .02

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92RS

F-BIRD'88

Why dump all kinds of money and work into swaping out a running 2.8 for a tired 305
on a rusty beater. there are plenty
beau-dee 2.8 litre f-bodies with a tired
motor and a smooth body just ripe for a good 350 or 383 upgrade swap. I'd sell off all
that tired stuff, keep driving the 2.8 till you can find a better car to start a project with. Then all you effort will be worth something.

Imark

Looking at your webpage you need the money for school. Use the $2000 (you might use on the other guys car)for school. Keep your car until the wheels fall off or you can get more cash.
I know from experience. Really great cars will come and go but your education (if done right) will buy hundreds of cars later.

firbird

it also depends on how much tools and knowledge you have and is there anyone to help you out too. i just recently took my 305 out and put in a 350 and for the first time and the only one working on it i have to say it was quit dificault at some points in time, but you wanna put in a v8 from a v6 and not to mention you have to swap the tranny to put in a 700r4 and it will be a stick to a auto, i will have to say it would not be really worth it if you ask me, too much work and you would be putting in a engine that is not even that great in the first place, i would think twice about it befor you go and do this. either you get a engine worth the hassel or just get a nother car in less you are hooked to you car like me even though its a peice

1984Firebird502

Yes all of you are right, I bought the car for really cheap and it came with a lot of stuff (all the stuff on the website). THIS CAR ISN'T MY DAILY DRIVER and I've only had it for about a year so I don't really care what happens to it. The more I've been on thirdgen.org the more I've realized HOW MUCH work it'll be. Does anyone else have anything to add? Plus the T5, is a v6 T5. I wanted to put the 305 up to that but that would be dumb ya know? Oh well, anyone else? Can everyone post thier .02 thanks.

Mikel

Probably not worth it. It's not that big of a deal, but if you are having problems finding a 350, you probably don't have the resources for a motor swap to be honest

87RS402

By the time you rebuild the 305 and buy all of the other swap parts you'll have spent alot more than $2000. The '83 Camaro down the street would be the cheaper and easier way to go.

Z03Z28

Dude if you have 2k to spend or
$1500 you can get a 3dr gen T/A or
Z28 maybeeven with a 350.Trust me
from what you wrote i wouldn't put
any money into that 84 firebird.So
just take your time and look for the
car you want.I bought a 92 Z28 that
only needed a nose 1 fender and a map
sensor for $1,100 it only has 61,000
miles.Oh yeah it needed a vats module.
it costed me about $600 to get it runn-
ing it still needs paint.It also has a 350
in it.It is fully loaded. no t-tops.

Bird_of_Prey

first off.. NOTHING WRONG WITH A 305.. so what if it's smaller then a 350... why do ppl rip so much on 305's.. so it's not the biggest small block.. *shrugs*.. still spins the tires.. and u can make 305's move fast..
neways.. my two cents.. well.. first off.. that 83 camaro looks like a good option.. all in all, i'd sell that car, go to university.. it's more important.. and it's pretty fun to boot. but if you're hell bent on having a thirdgen then store it.. keep it for later or bored weekends (when u can rebuit that 305).. or if you're all in with the 350 crowd (suffercation), auto wrecker for a 350 block and built it up with aftermarket parts when the cash comes in..
but priorities first.. and university would be my top priority.

------------------
87 formula
LB9, Automatic
K&N
3" catback v-force muffler
Hypertech preformance chip

FiReBReTHa

oik bud, im with you, im 17, i have a 91 pont firebird 305. if you see my page, then you know how i feel a bout my car, my g friends know about how i feel about my car, hell, the gf says ithat shell kick my *** if i love that car more than here...

FIRST SCHOOL!!! im serious bud, im looking now, i wish i only spent a 1.4 of what i spent on my car and put the rest into savings, this ****s gonna hit me hard next year, cause im not too prepped and IM frekin worried/scared cause i want to go somewhere near my gf, cause im really stuck on here, and in love, (mock and die......)
so i have to bust my self for this, so i figure this winter busting my *** for $$$ because i want sheitload for school, then the rest for car, soon mods are C5 Rims, T-56 swap, and air suspension... cheap? i think not, but school is now first priority...

take advice to all around and learn bout college i didnt get to read to much of the post cause im in school right now,

and then once your stable with income, grab a good V-6 with good body, (cheaper insurance) and then good body, and just asking for you to dorp in a new motor and get better suspension springs(heavy engine)
thats the way to go bud...


Gluck
~FiRe

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91 FireBird 305 V-8
Edelbrock Catback, Custom Alarm. Fourth Gen Console. i have six cupholders. all for starbucks!
Go|)Created The Earth, And Then Turned Up The Bass.
Here's My Audio Install!

"Honda's FOR ME TO POOP ON!" -Triumph...

85transamtpi

Go to school,
Get a job,
Get a 2002 Collectors edition
Run 12's all day

Just an opinion, but those yellow TA's look pretty DANK!!

V8Astro Captain

iTrader: (1)

If the car that guy is selling runs good, then get it. Why waste time and money on something your not sure is gonna work out. Even so, you never get from a car what you put into it, so that guy prolly has WAY more than 2 G's in it.

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'92 Astro, GM crate 350, Performer TBI intake, MSD 6AL, 3.42's, 2.5" exhaust, Flowmaster 40 2 chamber, B&M 2nd stage shift kit, 255 60 R15 tires on AR-727's, Polished & Bored TBI, Custom EPROM in progress

1984Firebird502

You guys are my best friends . Thanks. I'll still deciding if I should just keep it and store it, or sell everything and use it for college. Thanks for all you guy's help. Oh, BTW I went to see that camaro again today and it's not worth 2000. 1500 at the most. Firebreatha, I feel for you man. I'm broke too. I don't even have money to rebuild the 305 yet!

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1984 Firebird SE
1985 Camaro z28 305 engine T-5 Five Speed Tranny, 92 Camaro Leather Seats Console, carpet everything. Soon to put in 700R4 and 427CI. (Hopefully.
To view my car go to:

http://geocities.com/jmboriss/bluecar.html

It is for sale, asking $2000.

FiReBReTHa

run it till its dead, lol, get your driving out of it, expect probs, but once your ready to go with $$ and all is set, bam, slap down, sheit the junker and move on and drop in, right now im reading about LT5's
lol..... yea. right.
lol....

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91 FireBird 305 V-8
Edelbrock Catback, Custom Alarm. Fourth Gen Console. i have six cupholders. all for starbucks!
Go|)Created The Earth, And Then Turned Up The Bass.
Here's My Audio Install!

"Honda's FOR ME TO POOP ON!" -Triumph...

dhirocz

iTrader: (2)

if the 2.8 car is anything less than perfect, start with a V8 car so you know the appropriate equipment will be there. Or make sure V8 partscars where you could get things like swaybars are readily availble and cheap. My advice would be to start with a V8 car as the V6 cars are usually rigged for light duty driving unlike some RS's, Z28's and IROC-Z's. Since you are in school like I wish I was (19 and regretful, trust me), use the money for school, put aside a small budget to grow and drive the 2.8 until the literally falls apart, then sell it and get a V8 car. Just use your best judgement.

87kevroc

Forget the swap. Drive the Firebird , keep it in good running condition, sell the extra parts. Look for a deal on a V8, be patient, the right deal will come along. Education is a higher priority, but that doesn’t mean you can’t have the car you want, but it may have to wait longer than you want.

Ray87Z

Buy a friggin' AutoTrader and find yourself a cheap V8 thirdgen...

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Ray87Z
-Vortec headed 350.
86 IROC w/ a cammed 305 TPI.
Formerly Ray86IROC.
www.inter-scape.com/Ray

gaseatingbird

Bud i did the exact same thing. i swaped my 2.8/200c to a 305/th350, then to a 355/700r4. Now my 700r4 is dead again and i just bought another th350 because im stupid. I have had 3 engines and 5 transmissions and every 2nd oil change i replace the 2 back tires. ive spent over 10000 bucks on a stupid 1983 firebird. the car is fast but i can't keep gas in it. i drive a stupid 4cyl nissan truck to work because my V8 is not practical anymore. if i was you, i would keep the 2.8L and put a down payment on a 2002 f-body. my $.02

1984Firebird502

That's what I do everyday in study hall. Also I check on all the classifieds websites etc.

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1984 Firebird SE
1985 Camaro z28 305 engine T-5 Five Speed Tranny, 92 Camaro Leather Seats Console, carpet everything. Soon to put in 700R4 and 427CI. (Hopefully.
To view my car go to:

http://geocities.com/jmboriss/bluecar.html

It is for sale, asking $2000.

dmair5_0

Listen to everyone else about the education part. I'm 22 and finishing college this semester, I have wanted to mod my 91 Firebird since I got it when I was 17, but never had the money. Luckily my parents have some sense and threatened to to end me if I did anything stupid with the car, and for what it's worth, they were right! So I didn't do anything with it, saved my money and got through school with no loans, now I'm getting a real job and will have gobs of money to throw at the car, and it won't make me cry every time I do it. Just be patient, soon enough you will be able to do what you want with the car. And hey, if the car has sentimental value to you, then don't go buy a cheap V8 thirdgen, it is worth making the swap if you love your car. I think I'll be hella happy when I'm done, and proud too.

Damon

I've bought and sold some 25+ cars in my life. Many of them were project cars, as this one would be.

Let me clue you in on a few truths about cars:

1. Body work is 20X more expensive than engine work. If you think you are going to fix up the body of that old 'Bird for $2000 you're dreaming. Even half-decent body work costs a mint.

2. A 305 and auto trans will not just "drop right in" in place of the 2.8. If it was that easy he would have done it already. There's a million details to be ironed out. Do you get the feeling this guy got in over his head on a project and now just wants to get out of it? Yes. So do I. Do not in any way think this will be "easy." It won't. Nor will it be inexpensive.

3. You can buy a complete car in good condition for less than it costs to fix up a clunker. This is the universal truth of cars. Buy a V8 powered car with a good body and interior for $5000-6000 and you'll be WAY WAY ahead of buying this guy's problems and trying to fix it up.

TomP

Plus, it doesn't seem like you have the fuel injection stuff for the V8... you'd have to buy either the injection stuff & a computer, or a carb- and if you have emissions laws, you can't just throw any 'ol carb on.

The swap from manual-to-automatic wouldn't be difficult at all, though. It's going the other way that's a killer.

I don't see anything wrong with putting a 305 in; but you'll have to rebuild the thing- and sure, you could do it on the cheap, but it doesn't sound like you want to!

But, you said that 2.8 and T5 are still going, right? You can always build that 305 up slowly... buy pistons one month, rings another, etc... and then, when summer comes (no school), do the swap.

Also, try going out-of-state for junkyards.


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-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l)

1984Firebird502

A guy in wisconsin is going to trade me mine for his. He has a 86 bird with a 6 cylinder and auto transmission. It has t tops too and chrome wheels. I still get to keep all the other stuff and the leather seats. I'll going to sell all the other stuff and keep the 86. That's the best deal I think. I'll still have a college car but will still make some money off all of this. Also the car is FI. That's better too.

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1984 Firebird SE
1985 Camaro z28 305 engine T-5 Five Speed Tranny, 92 Camaro Leather Seats Console, carpet everything. Soon to put in 700R4 and 427CI. (Hopefully.
To view my car go to:

http://geocities.com/jmboriss/bluecar.html

It is for sale, asking $2000.

dmair5_0

Dude, don't buy another V6 car!!!! You will end up just wanting to make it faster in the long run again, and you won't be able to cause you have ANOTHER V6!!!!!!!! Find a V8 if you are going to sell your car, trust me it is gonna be soooo worth it, you'll be sick of the V6 in a week, Fuel Injected or not.

87irocz350

whenever considering swapping in a V8 into a V6 car, you must also remember you will have to change motor mounts and reinforce the front end to compensate for the extra weight of the small block. My advice: sell the 305, sell the tranny, sell your piece of crap camaro, and try to score the other ride...

1984Firebird502

It's a firebird.

87irocz350

sorry.....sell your piece of crap firebird....firebirds suck anyway, dude....trash that tin can...

1984Firebird502

firbird

are you tring to start something 87irocz350?

TomP

Er, the frames (I4/V6/V8) are the same! You don't need to reinforce anything! The only thing that would compensate for extra weight is the front springs; but guys have put V8's over V6 springs, so it's not a "right-away, must-do".

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-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l)

FiReBReTHa

lol. 87 iroc is funny.....

funny LOOKIN!




{EDITED} For lack of smilie,
------------------
91 FireBird 305 V-8
Edelbrock Catback, Custom Alarm. Fourth Gen Console. i have six cupholders. all for starbucks!
Go|)Created The Earth, And Then Turned Up The Bass.
Here's My Audio Install!

"Honda's FOR ME TO POOP ON!" -Triumph...

[This message has been edited by FiReBReTHa (edited November 18, 2001).]

bigals87z28

hey im 17 too! cool hehehe anyway
i understand ya man. i have my dads 87 z and its soo fast even with the 305. i have won every race except for this one viper...and ever since then i wanted to make my car faster then the viper... i just dont have that kind of doe.. i also am getting ready for school and my dad keeps telling me that i should save for college. he said he is not going to sell it.. and it will always be there. i just want to know minor things or one major things i can do to make it better.. i cant wait to get some parts for my baby

Gib_Sandwich

I am in a somewhat similar situation.
I am going to university next semester and need cash for it.
Basically this means that my camaro does not have registration and insurance and will sit in the garage until I have the money.
But once I get qualified, the job I get will give me a good salary, and then I will have everything I want done to it.
So basically, yeah it's fun, drive it now while you can, drive it now as a beater and then sell it later.
Get an old 305 or something and swap a crate motor or something in later when you have a good job and you can afford it.
I'm only 19, whilst it's not old, it's 2 years older than you and believe me that money will come in handy later

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Nobody ever got cancer from smoking tires!
gibsandwich@hotmail.com
Get ICQ Page My ICQ
ICQ # 18562788
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1982 Z28 Camaro
305ci LG4, Muncie 4-Speed, Holley Carburettor (CFM Unknown), 2.5" Stainless steel exhaust all the way through.
Fibreglass hood.
Boston 4x6" CX7e 2-ways, 6x9" Nippon America (no-name?) 3-ways
Other stuff I haven't figured out yet.

Gib_Sandwich

Oh yeah, I forgot to say, most people aren't interested in buying cars with parts.
I tried to sell the car I learnt to drive in with tons of parts which you think "I have a spare motor, distributor, ignition coil, tow bar, fusable links box, headlights, taillights...blah blah" and most people just want to know about the car
So if it's a pos, don't expect lots of money back
I think you should just put ads in your local paper for the engines sell all your old stuff, like the 305, auto transmission etc. and use the cash for other things hopefully after you sell it all you won't have lost too much money

------------------
Nobody ever got cancer from smoking tires!
gibsandwich@hotmail.com
Get ICQ Page My ICQ
ICQ # 18562788
------------------

1982 Z28 Camaro
305ci LG4, Muncie 4-Speed, Holley Carburettor (CFM Unknown), 2.5" Stainless steel exhaust all the way through.
Fibreglass hood.
Boston 4x6" CX7e 2-ways, 6x9" Nippon America (no-name?) 3-ways
Other stuff I haven't figured out yet.

dmair5_0

Uh, just so you know, I doubt there is anything you can do to make an 87' Z faster than a viper, except for maybe taking the wheels off the Viper! Shoot for the Mustangs first!

Boosted GTA

I can see you are interested in a faster car, but believe me, just be patient. Soo much easier than trying to do that swap.

Even if the car is not in your area, check places like Traderonline.com and have a car shipped. There was a GTA down here in Central Florida for 3500 bucks! Beautiful car, and well worth waiting for!

JBIROCZ

Man, it's not worth it. I had an old beater 2.8ltr and thought about dropping a 350 in it and the cost was not worth the blood, sweat and tears. Be good to yourself, sell what you can and buy a car that doesn't need that muh work.

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90 IROC-Z grey/dark grey 305TBI beauty

jharms

If anyone should talk about "not worth it" engine swaps it's me. I'm the sucker that's dropping a 455 Olds. in place of my 305. Hmm. that's not easy, or cheap, and I'm in college. But I'm in the military so that pays for most of it. Reading the exhaustingly long posts, I see a central theme, that I COMPLETELY concur with. Don't build-up your Firebird. Find one that has a straight body, no rust. Or one that has a drive-train you are completely happy with. Don't find one that needs both. I bought my '86 'Bird 3 years ago, and it needed a new interior, new quarter panels and a paint job. Not to mention I wasn't satisfied with the engine. SO, now $5,000 later, I have a nicely redone interior and new panels, paint, and Torq. Thrust II rims that look GREAT! BUT it's not faster at all! I could have saved myself the some serious money if I had at least started off with 1 of the 3 things major things already done. (body, enine, interior) That's my thoughts on the subject.

loomdog32

school is way more important than a car. stupid me i dropped out of school so i could work to make my car payments on my 96 maro i HAD at the time. i ended up loosin my job and the car was repoed. and since i lost my job i eneded up defaulting on my student loans. im back on track with my loans now, but ill never be able to get more to go back since i screwed up. i just got a 83 maro with a straight body, but the engine blew (2.8) a couple days after i bought it. after lookin into swapping a v8 in it wouldve been cheaper to just go out and buy a v8 car complete. so now to drop in a new 2.8 (ugh) and sell the 83. ($500 car - $350 engine.. sell car $1000 uhhh.. probably only get $600-800) then i still gotta smog the piece of ****. if i knew what i was gettin into, i never wouldve bought it. oh well. i found a 86 IROC for $2k. Thatll be my next project if it hasnt been sold when i get the money to buy it. since this has gone on forever ill shut up now.

Project: 85 2.8 bird

loomdog32, put in a 3.4 instead of the 2.8, do a search on this. apparently everyone who has done this is quite happy.


------------------
$150.00 2.8 Auto.
short block now
turbo eventually, 3.4 may be in the future
Giving the enemy the opportunity to die for their country

southerndude_31

dude i am in the middle of a swap fron 2.8 to 350 and it was a pain in the *** not to mention way more expensive than i thought unless you have time and lots of money drive the car till it blows then buy another they are cheap

89rsragtop

Just drive your bird and go to school. When you are ready the perfect car will show up. Remember when it comes to used cars, the deal of a lifetime comes by every 7 to 10 days. P.S. i'm 46 and I know!!!!

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1989 rs ragtop LO3 KB subframes & edelbrock towerbrace to hold it together. edelbrock 3" cat back system.

Project: 85 2.8 bird

think of it this way, when you can finally out drive the v6, THEN you're ready for the step up to the v8.

thesasquach

well since you asked dont waste your time and money...... after spending several years selling basket case muscle cars and used parts i realised all i was selling was dreams .... there is good money in the dream business ........ i cant tell you how many times i bought back cars i sold .... at a loss to the seller ... that were partialy restored then the money ran out or the dream faded so id sell it again .... bide your time and waite till the right car, that is everything you want comes to you .... it will come to you .... then buy it and enjoy it modify it and realy enjoy it..... but dont take on a major project save that for when you are making 100k a year and do it cause you want to kill some time .... i recently bought a '91 RS V8 5 speed with 76k miles that runs like a raped ape for $2695 (wholesale for the car was $2675 they ripped me for $20)from a new car dealers used lot.deals come by all the time some times you have the money some times you dont .... use and abuse the rusty V6 bird do stupid things with it act like a teenager but dont poor good money into it and be safe. David

zfever

Id say keep the six, im currently at school with my 83 Z28, has a 305 motor in it, and sadly, VERY sadly enough ive considered switching to a six cylinder for the 7 hour trip home. while i get tons of power, my gas bills kill me. i know the power of the six is lacking, i do get jelous when i hear about other peoples gas bills. They say that the four barrel gets better milage than two barrel, but this means ALOT of self control...

89WS-6

Your asking too much for that car. I bought my car with a 350 for 1500. And it was in good condition, not paint warping like yours. No flames, just truth.

------------------
Jordan Rundell

89' Pontiac Formula WS-6
*Grant steering wheel
*Borla exhaust and tips
*BF Goodrich GForce T/A's
*That's it

1984Firebird502

Hey, compared to your deal, anything I ask for is going to be too much. Thanks for the pointers. Not everyone gets a formula for 1500.


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1984 Firebird SE
1985 Camaro z28 305 engine T-5 Five Speed Tranny, 92 Camaro Leather Seats Console, carpet everything. Soon to put in 700R4 and 427CI. (Hopefully.
To view my car go to:

http://geocities.com/jmboriss/bluecar.html

Phantomht

Im new here, but i got .02 to throw in.

Nobody [i kinda skimmed over the last few posts] asked you what your end result is going to be? Are you trying to put something together thats gonna be 100% daily driver? Grocery Getter, back and forth to SCHOOL kind of thing? If so, go with a 305. Or are you trying to build something to take to the track a couple times a month while driving something else primarily for daily use? If so, a 305 is worthless.

While driving my '84 Berlinetta 2.8L POS daily for a year and a half that i picked up for 900$, i was building a motor/trans primarily for strip use and getting me to work back and forth secondary. basically im driving my race car on the street. If your looking to do something of this nature, DONT be a tard, DONT street race, take it to a track. That other guy mentioning he's beat everything with his 305 must only racing other V6's [not trying to flame, but take it to a track and see how good you do], the other guy saying you cant build anything to beat a Viper, Vipers are an 80,000$ car, and in my opinoin, JUNK, my 377ci [all motor/no NOS] will be beating Vipers at the track after i aquire a posi rr and add a few suspension pieces. But i also have put alot of time/money into my motor. Its a passion. Nothing better than spending an entire weekend out in the garage wrenching on yer hot rod, then racing it the next weekend surrounded by other racers, not street punks in daddies car.

Focus on school, drive the v6 til the "wheels fall off" and leave all the car stuff to later. get an edukatshun then get some money together and either buy a production high-perf vehicle, or buy some tools and build one.

Again, not trying to start any wars, just throwing out my .02 worth.

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Howard
B & H Racing
http://home.earthlink.net/~phantomht/

Z28DJP1987

Lets put this POST to bed. I am to old to be scared by a engine swap. This subject has been beaten to death.