Steve91Z28 L98

I just got some AT29C256 eproms today (thanks Craig Moates) and went to burn a .bin file that I have been playing with for a while now. I thought I had burned it successfully but here's what happened when I installed the eprom. I'm using Craig Moates' memcal adapter by the way. The car will start right up and idles smooth but once I start to drive it, it runs terrible. It stutters and feels like it's pulling alot of timing. I tried burning the chip again and the same thing happened. I thought maybe I installed it backwards so I turned it around on the memcal adapter and all that does is make the fans stay on all the time. The car will still start and runs the same. Thinking I might have done something wrong in my .bin file, I burned a stock '90 350 bin file and it did the same thing. I'm thinking that maybe the computer is just running in limp home mode because I did something wrong in the process of burning it.

Here's what I am doing in the Pocket Programmer ver. 1.39 software. I selected the AT29C256 device. I'm filling the buffer with FF like I thought I was supposed to do. Then I'm clicking "Load Buffer" and selecting the .bin file I want and then clicking "Program Device".

Someone please tell me if I'm leaving something out or not doing something right.

Thanks,
Stephen

Steve91Z28 L98

Oh yeah, besides what's in my signature I also put in 30 lb/hr SVO injectors and set the injector constant to 33 lbs/hr. The fuel pressure is at about 47 psi. Should I lower it to closer to 43 psi? The car was running rich at idle.

Grim Reaper

If you program it with the Windows Version, you don't have to prep the Flash Prom with Hex FFs. You should be able to program direct after you have loaded the file in the buffer. Also, if it "Auto Verifies", then I say you PP has program the BIN as it expected.

My raw gut says your specific BIN has problems. Copy you stock GM Memcal to the PP and then burn it onto the Flash Prom. Also, are you having a scan tool connected when you are trying this? If so, make sure you are operating in "Normal Mode". Default is for ALDL mode which "overrides" certain sensor readings. For SD you want to be in Normal Mode when hooking a Scan Tool up.

But if the PP (or Windows Version Software) were the problem you wouldn't run. It's either the BIN itself or possibly your Scan Tool affecting the ALDL.

Steve91Z28 L98

I don't have a scantool right now so I can't verify that. I do have a cable that I'll be using with Craig Moates' software but my laptop isn't with me right now. I also tried to check any codes with the method of jumping the top two ALDL terminals but with the new prom, and the ignition on, the engine light just stays on the whole time. When I went back to the stock prom, it was fine and didn't flash any codes.

How exactly would I go about copying my stock bin file? I think I heard you can do it with Craig's software but I'm not positive.

Thanks for the help.

Steve91Z28 L98

Well I've tried a few different bin files and still have the same trouble. One of them was the stock '90 350 bin...pretty sure the bcc was AUJP. I still get a check engine light at all times and very poor performance when the motor reaches about 2000 rpm. If I put the stock prom back in, it runs fine. Maybe the bin image I have is corrupted in some way. Could someone send me an AUJP.bin that is known to work? I can't get on to the ftp site with all the bin files due to a firewall. If that doesn't work then there has to be something wrong with how I'm burning the prom or a problem with the Power Programmer (although it's brand new). Maybe even something could be wrong with the memcal adapter. I'll investigate it.

Thanks,
Stephen

Craig Moates

Steve,

May want to do a close visual inspection of the adapter and make sure I didn't miss a solder joint or something. Also make sure it's snapped down snugly into the Memcal slot in the ECM. I haven't had a unit come back yet, but hey, yours could be the first...

One thing you might want to try also is gently prying the ZIF out and putting the chip directly into the socket. Could be something up with the ZIF. Just be careful and apply pressure uniformly.

The little half-moon divot in the chip should face toward the outer edge of the socket.

-Craig

Steve91Z28 L98

Ok thanks Craig I'll see if I can pry the ZIF off. I've tried the prom both ways in the adapter and when the half moon divot is facing the outer edge (away from the lever) the fan stays on all the time and the car runs the same. Does the prom have to go a certain way in the programmer? I've only done it one way....with the half moon facing the lever but in the farthest slot away from the lever. Pretty much just like the diagram next to the ZIF on the programmer.

Steve87Pont

One thing to check. I ran into a slight problem with my adapter when I installed it once. With the Calpack installed the adapter goes in at a slight (very slight angle) I ended up bending one pin in the ECU socket. My fault in not taking the time to make sure it was lined up correctly installing it into the computer.

Steve91Z28 L98

Well I removed the ZIF socket and installed the prom straight into the adapter with no luck. Also, I realized that I was putting the prom the correct way in the programmer (backwards will bring up a "device not installed properly" error). In the car though, I can install it either way and the car will still start but run rough. Also, if I install it the way you said Craig, with the half moon shaped divot facing away from the adapter, it causes the fans to autimatically come on and stay on. The other way, the fans are off. I must be doing something wrong in burning the proms because the adapter looks to be ok. I'll check it with a continuity tester tomorrow. I'll also double check the pins on the ecm socket. Anymore ideas??

Thanks again

Craig Moates

This should be the correct way...

Steve91Z28 L98

Wouldn't a flaw in the memcal adapter (unsoldered joint, shorted terminals, etc) cause the car to not run at all?? Or would it cause the computer to go into limp home mode? I can't verify what mode it's in until I get the laptop in a day or two.

I've tried about 5 or 6 different bin images (stock and modified) all with the same results....a check engine light and poor drivability. I'm stumped.

Z_Ghost

I would take a voltmeter and check the adapter to make sure it is right. I just got Craig’s adapter in last week and have burned about 6 chips and no problems. Did you take the blue cover off the stock chip, I was going to leave it on, but it looked like it would hit the board so I took it off. I am sending you the stock 92 Z bin I know it is good as this is what I am working on.

Steve91Z28 L98

Thanks Z_Ghost I'm gonna try that bin right away. Just for clarification, when burning the prom, which parameter should be selected? Word High/Even, Word Low/Odd, or Byte Program?

Thanks

Steve91Z28 L98

Well I tried the stock '92 Z bin file that Z_Ghost sent me with no luck. If I install the prom in the ZIF the correct way (half moon away from the adapter), the fans are always on and the car runs like crap. If I turn it around the car still runs like crap but the fans are off. I thought for sure that the motor is either going into limp home mode or some of the pins are crossed/disconnected on the adapter. I figured if the car was in limp home mode that it wasn't even reading the prom so I took the prom out of the ZIF and started the car. It was running exactly like before with a check engine light and the fans stayed on. What sounds like is the weak link here??

Steve91Z28 L98

OK this is starting to get ridiculous. No matter what bin file I use it doesn't make a difference in how the car runs. If I put the stock memcal back in the car runs fine with no check engine light. I've triple checked the adapter and it seems to be fine. When I program the flash prom all seems to go well. It even says "Device Has Been Programmed". No errors whatsoever. For the life of me I can't figure out what is wrong. Could the Pocket Programmer be broken or the flash proms be bad (I've tried all 3 that I have) even though it says the burn was successful??? If anyone has any ideas, even simple things that I may have overlooked or something even completely unrelated to the prom, let me hear them.

Z_Ghost

Your wecome.

I never selected anything under the BYTE PROGRAM button and I looked to see if it would show me what was selected, but it does not show what it is using. The only thing I selected was the chip, I never changed anything else. It sounds like the PP is working, I still think it’s the adapter that is bad or you have a bent pin some were. Wish I could be more help.

Steve91Z28 L98

I've pretty much narrowed it down to a bad memcal adapter. We'll see for sure this weekend when I try to use my friend's adapter. Otherwise it has to be a faulty Pocket Programmer.

Craig Moates

I'd bet it's the adapter. The most suspect contact would probably be the IDC sockets where they're soldered to the board. Send it back and I'll get you a new one out Monday via FedEx if you think that's what's wrong.

Zepher

iTrader: (1)

It's the programmer. I am having the same problem.
I use the same chips, PP2 software programs the chip and verifies to buffer, everything looks just peachy.

I bet if you start the car without the prom, it will run identical as if it were plugged in. I did it on my 86 converted to SD.

A local friend of mine re-burned the same bin file on his programmer to my chip that I was using and everything worked fine.

And yes, your car is in limp home mode, it runs very, very rich.

Also, you can't get any data from the ECM if your prom is bad.
We tried 3 scanners and I even hooked up the scanners straight to the wires on the ECM thinking it was a wiring problem.
2 months later and I find out that my programmer was burning bad chips.

I ran a 14.74 @93mph in limp home mode with my little 305 which I think is pretty darn good.

Craig Moates

So did the Xtronics folks take care of things? Are they aware of the problem? What about with different revision of software for burning? Is this isolated to the newer burners (PP2)?

Very interesting...

Steve, I sent out another adapter to you just in case. Keep us posted on what you find out.

-Craig

Zepher

iTrader: (1)

I got a couple of Emails from Karl Schmidt over at xtronics and he told me to test the vpp voltage at the pins on the programmer.
I just downloaded V1.4 of the PP2 windows software and am going to do some tests to see if it was the older V1.3 of the software.

I'll keep you all updated on what I find.

Steve91Z28 L98

Wow I'm glad to hear someone else had the same problem. What did the people at xtronics tell you to do? Did they send you a new one? I'll shoot them an email and see what they say.

Zepher

iTrader: (1)

They told me to test the vpp voltage at pins one and two when the Programmer is in test mode. I am going to go to a friends house and test my programmer on his computer and see if it works on his or not.

Here is what the readme says,

====================
= Testing Vpp Voltage =
====================

By pressing the 'T' Key with the Vpp button Selected, the Vpp Voltage that you have selected will appear at the Zif Socket pins. You can check the Vpp programming voltage using a volt meter by putting the Red (+) lead into pin 1 of the Zif socket, the pin closest to the handle, and the Black (-) lead into pin 16 of the Zif, same side as the handle but at the other end. DO NOT have or leave a Device in the socket.

Do Not try to put the meter probes into the socket, instead insert two pieces of wire and close the Zif socket. You should measure no less then 10 volts. If you measure 10-11.5 volts on all three settings, the DC-DC converter transistor has gone bad. This is the transistor on the bottom side of the board and must be replaced with a 2N4401 or MPS2222A ONLY, DO NOT use a substitute number, Radio Shack will carry one of these #'s.

This will also allow you to change the following 3 items:
1. The Program Pass, the number of times a Eprom (Only) will be reprogrammed.

2. The Program Pulse, the starting amount of time for programming a Eprom.

3. The Port Delay, a settling time delay for the data on the printer port.

These values will be saved in a file called Win_Prg.Cfg when you exit the program and reloaded the next time you start.
___________________________________________________

I haven't had a chance to test this with my unit yet.

Zepher

iTrader: (1)

I tested my PP2 and the voltages look great.
Programmed 3 chips, shut off the program after each chip, loaded up the program, moved the bin from the programmed eprom to the buffer and saved it and loaded it to tunercat and all the settings were good.
then verified the prom to the bin and it verified. Did it a few times just to make sure.
Used (2) 2732A (this is for a friends LO3 TPI motor) and (1) 29C256 (my TPI uses this one), everything seemed fine.
Will know tomorrow when I pop the chips in the 3 cars and see what happens.

Oh, I am using the 1.4 version of the PP2 software, says it runs better in WinXP, which is what I am running on my PC.

ducmon900

I'm having the same problem. When I burn the arap bin to the chip and then try to open it up with tunercat it says i need to use $6e def file. I have both the arap bin and my firsttry bin in my documents. One thing is just noticed is when I put my arrow on the arap it shows 16kb, when the arrow is on my firsttry it shows 32kb.

Zepher

iTrader: (1)

Well, one of the chips I burned worked so I am going to assume that the others worked as well.

We got that TBI motor to run a 14.97 @ 94.1mph and a 14.91 @ 91.67 mph.

Chip was a base prom image from a stock chip with the speed limiter set to 255mph and all the EGR stuff set to 255mph.

Car is a 91 L03 with LT1 cam, 4th gen 3.42 posi disc rear, subframes, LCA Relocation brackets, Holley Dominator Intake Manifold, Custom True Dual exhaust, cowl hood scoop with center section under the cowl cut open for the the open element with KN 14x3 and Xstream Air lid. I think those are most of the mods on his car.

Grim Reaper

The ARAP bin IS the "$6E.TDF", that's why TC says you need it.

If you are trying read the BIN from the Flash Prom and subsequently read it with TC, you must understand the in AT29C256 mode you are reading 32K NOT 16K. To read the BIN as the 16K BIN (so you can read it with TC) you need to set the PP to 27C128; which is what you are emulating when you burn a MAF bin on a 32K Flash Prom. You cannot read it as a Flash PROM and then subsequently use it. You are mixing "apples with oranges".

ducmon900

Thats good news, wasn't sure if I was doing something wrong or not. I'm still having trouble getting this burn to work, I wondered if you could email me your method of burning the bin to the prom. I've downloaded the current version of pp and i'm using ff's in the buffer and starting at 04000 for the burn. It verifies fine. But when I install the prom it still runs off limp home mode with a steady check engine light. ken

Grim Reaper

Do a search on "4000", the procedure has been written up numerous times. You can't miss it.

Zepher

iTrader: (1)

My settings are:
Start of buffer 00000
Start of Device 00000
End of Device 07FFF

Works for me.

polygaryd

ok guys help me out here i checked the voltages in test mode and i dont see any thing at all. there is no change between the 4 settings it is all 0v i am using version 2.25 of the pp2 software. and yes it is plugged in..

polygaryd

ok i figured it out since there was no voltage i decied to check the voltage at the plug of the adapter and i got nothing so i tried a radioshack one that had selectable voltages and it worked..