Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

.... followed by;

That was it. Loose alternator or coil wiring will cause engine to start, but then stall immediately. Now, get us some vids of that thing will you....

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

why does the alternator wiring matter at startup? That wire is to provide power to the coil to help recharge the battery right? Let me try to start it up again with that wire loose and see what happens

EDIT:

yep, it started at first and then had problems idling with the wire disconnected...but it did start on its own not like before. I guess it was the problem all along. I need to get a new connector for that alternator, the tang piece broke off so it nolonger snaps onto the plug female end. It shakes loose with the motor

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

I've never had a disconnected alternator keep an engine from starting, or effect the way it runs. The wiring in that plug is simply to energize the alternator to charge and sometimes a refernce wire is in there too.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Yup, conditions like the one you described will either point to loose alt/coil wiring, faulty TPS, inadequate fuel to the injectors, vacuum leak by the plenum's orifice, or a fried ECM.

FSTFBDY

iTrader: (33)

Same here.. Ive unplugged, Alt. before while running to check things out, etc.

At least ya got it back up and running.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

well something happened because it runs now and the ONLY thing was that alternator plug. It seemed to idle rough with it disconnected but it was still idling.

Soon as the rain clears i'll take the car back out

???

iTrader: (5)

I think maybe the voltage to injector comp table maybe off. since without the alt plug in your not charging and I sure haven't ever seen a car die because you unplugged the alt. I have a feeling your big injectors react way different than the stock sy/ty injectors do. which my guess is that what's in your bin.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

they may be effected by voltage thats for sure. Compensation vs battery voltage will need tweaked i'm sure, but i'm not sure which way to move the numbers. Its close to the stock SY/TY numbers but i borrowed some from 8D AUJP code to try.

Doesnt make sense to me that the alternator plug would cause my problems...but its the only thing I can go on at this moment. Nothing else was changed...battery was never dead. It cranked strong at all times and the car would fire but would not stay idling. Only when that alternator plug went back in did it start on its own.

its a two wire plug. One sends voltage to it for coil power so that the alternator can charge the battery. The other wire is a reference wire for something, i'm not sure what. Does the ECM need to sense that connection is working for the car to stay running? Its not automatically shutting the car down to save battery life is it?

I have no idea. Still calling for rain tomorrow but if its clear for a few hours i'll pull the car outside to experiment with the wiring and other things to see what may cause this car NOT to fire or not to stay running.
I do have a theory that maybe the battery voltage was draining abit with the plug not connected in the alternator so it wasnt seeing over 13-14 volts like it normally should. I did not watch the battery voltage at that time so thats one thing for me to check. I have to check my datalog during that run in which it shut down to see if it recorded battery volts and see if that didnt drop dramatically and cause the car to lean out and die or maybe flood out and stall.

If thats the case, then compensation of injector pulsewidth vs batt voltage will need adjusted.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Just checked my log during that day and noticed that when it was on its way to shutdown, voltage dipped to high 12's. 12.7 volts or so some spots abit less. Air fuel was commanded 14.7 (actual between 13.8 and 14.1) then dropped to 9.3 right at shut down which i believe is just my startup commanded since motor was now off and key was on.

My other logs show that during rpm drop from higher rpms to idle, voltage never varied more than .1 and never got below like 13.6 and most of the time was 13.8 or so. Did not dip to the mid high 12s like above run.

During the attempts to restart after intial shutdown voltage was in the mid high 11's. So battery was draining abit there and the fuel was completely off what it needed. Probly too rich then.

Battery may have been drained like that all the while I was trying to start it up the next few days and such but seems odd that simple connection of alternator would bring voltage up and start the car since alternator isnt spinning that fast at crank to make a difference, atleast i dont think so

gta324

With bigger injectors you need to have lower BPW vs volts. With bigger injectors yu need to tweak all the BPW adders due to voltage and so on........

I've had starting problems too with code59 due to to much fuel. I think its because I run bigger injectors.


Anyway good you have it running, my car will soon be put away during the winter..

/N.

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

There is no "coil connection" to the alternator. In fact the circuit that "turns on" the alternator is very different than the circuit that feeds the coil.

The coil gets fed voltage anything the key is on and while cranking.

The alternator is fed a signal (voltage) only while the key is on, but turns off while cranking.

The reference wire (large red), is a reference for the voltage regulator to make sure that the voltage being fed out, matches what is on the reference.

No, The ECM will not shut down the engine at "low voltage" especially not in the 12V range. The ECM will stop functioning correctly around the 8V level though, and may shut down.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

I had a similiar problem a couple of years ago, which is why I immediately knew it was the loose alternator connection. We were chasing the same exact symptom for an entire weekend, and it was just a little too obvious to even look at the alternator wiring. It got to the point where I spoke w/one of the guys that I know over at IDA Automotive, who are located right down the street from me, and when I told him the only thing that I did was swap to a v-belt setup from the serpentine setup, without even looking at it, he told me to inspect the alternator connection. Sure enough, the alternator connection was loose....

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Interesting... some say it does nothing and then some people have experienced a similar problem. I will test it again today.

I'll have to go into my injector offset tables and lower the numbers abit in the 11-12 volt range and see if that may help.

I am just concerned my header temps are pretty hot in the rear cylinders and cooler up front. Idle air issue possibly, which I did not expect withthis intake.

???

iTrader: (5)

add a few * of timing at idle?

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Ok heres an update. I got the car idling great (enough for driving use and enough to satisfy me, no worse than my 383 last year) and have been driving the car around, just starting to work my way to WOT and boost.

This past weekend I was on the throttle several times working the boost tune and had it going well until late yesterday. I pulled in the driveway and idle started acting up again, surging/hunting alot. Shut down let it cool and then restart and same thing.

Today, same thing. AFter it comes out of cold start idle where its in the mid 12's to 1 air fuel and very smooth/stable, just idles high near 1200 rpm, it will start swinging idle back and forth a few hundred rpm and just is NOT acceptable. I didnt do anything to the tune, the car drove fine for many days and now idle is going crazy.

I check voltage and everythings fine. Cold start is still a problem with me but i'm working at it. Takes a few crank trys to get it to fire up when dead cold. its been chilly here the last few days which is the only major change.. i'm wondering if cold air really could effect the tune?

I wouldnt think it would matter, since MAP is not air density based like MAF which is effected by colder denser air. Unless somewhere in the tune MAT function is changing fuel input.

I'm abit frustrated at this because i had it good. Driveability at all part throttles is PERFECT now , i love it. Boost is getting there, needs richened up alot at higher rpms/boost but its still spinning tire like mad... I mean impossible to go WOT on the street under 50mph and its only seeing like 8 psi. But idle in park/neutral is shaky at best and bit variant in drive

I am noticing how sensitive the VE adjustments are with 80 lb injectors. Minor changes will definately cause big changes in Air/Fuel ratios. My current tune needs fuel in the 81-100KPA range then goes to 12 to 1 under decent boost so its getting close, i want low 11's to 1 air fuel.

But idle seems to vary with this setup from time to time...and i cant track down why. Just when i have it good, it gets bad.

???

iTrader: (5)

what kinda air temp sensor are you running? I think I remember the code is setup to use the big brass one screwed in the intake, instead of the little plastic one in the intake tube.

???

iTrader: (5)

oh and the only time I had any idle weirdness ended up being a vac leak around an injector but I only have 42#. I found it spraying some carb cleaner around. could have also hurt or glazed a plug. just guesses at best. hope you find it.

gta324

How is your fuel lines connected?

I've found out the hard way that my setup is (more?) sensitive to changes in the fuel line setup that I've never would have guessed......

Send me a log if you like.

To tune I've found out that a 2step change in VE is about 1 AFR on my setup, good to know when you play with VE.

Please elaborate the MAT thing, I have the plastic one on my car..........

???

iTrader: (5)

I could be wrong about this, and its been a while since I read it. but looking at the notes in the 59 xdf on the coolant temp table and air temp table. sounds to me like coolant temp isn't used, but could be. but as is, it only uses the intake/air temp table since being the big brass lump kind, it tells the intake temp and that has the most effect on the air, since its in the intake much longer than the head. that's how I understood it anyways. I had the plastic one in the intake tube too. if I'm reading that wrong let me know, but I think it only uses one or the other, not both. if so, the air temp without intake temp leaves a hole in the tune.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Ok i got the big brass intake sensor for MAT reading.

I was thinking possible vacuum leak now somewhere but not sure where i dont visabily see anything wrong with my lines but I havent investigated it too much.

I was running the car pretty hard to get a feel for boost tune and at one point since it was so lean the turbo was glowing. Ran fine the next day when i added more fuel and go into the boost. I got home and idle started acting up. It was hot under the hood thats for sure but i dont think it hurt anything.

If the plug was hurt wouldnt part throttle and WOT be acting up? Car drives great...really smooth. WOT seems somewhat ok but there is a lean spot going into boost at 3000-3500 rpm. I smoothed and reworked the VE table, which brought some values down 1-2 which really changed the air fuel from high 13's to near 16 to 1. So its sensitive to VE with 80 lb-rs.

Its a bit of a pain in the *** to check plugs on this setup... I made a new sparkplug wrench which will help but I guess its time to investigate. Last year, my nitrous motor had one spark plug ground strap torn off... nothing there but the car ran fine.... go figure. ignition was strong i guess....

Fuel lines? i got the victor EFI manifold. rails are bolted down, i dont think they could lift up at all. I will look into that. Fuel line feed goes into the rear of the driver rail, crossover in front then out the back passenger rail into regulator then to gas tank. Would this cause distribution issues at all since its not a parallel feed setup?? That may explain my apparent bank to bank issue with heat differences but hard to say. I havent been able to put my WB02 into the driver downpipe since the bung cap is stuck...

???

iTrader: (5)

I read that to mean if any big changes in coolant and intake temps change after out of cold startup. without the intake temp type of sensor then nothing is done about it.

say if your not running a t stat or something. going fro, a hot day to a cool time of day.

???

iTrader: (5)

sorry about the unneeded post, I was searching for the quote and didn't notice you had already said which sensor you had.

as for idle, any chance it is just idleing a few 100rpms different, or at a different map kpa that you just hadn't got the tune yet?

are the iac counts the same, tps? maybe boost made you TB stick a bit? my super charged car did that once with a mono blade, even with a bypass.


I'll be following along about the fuel line/ rail.

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

Whether the MAT sensor is one that threads into the intake, and looks similar to a coolant sensor, or is plastic and is installed in the air box, they both have the same signals and work the same way.

Personally I prefer to sample the intake temps in the manifold, so that the temp is known close to the cylinder, large temperature changes can happen between the air filter and the head(s), especially when forced induction is used.

???

iTrader: (5)

well there's 2 kinds of big ones that go in the intake too, one is a big brass thing, the other used some some 6cyl apps is open element that is said to be better at checking air temps, where the big brass one, the manifold itself has a lot to to with temps..


I like the idea of the gen 7 dfi where they have coolant temp, manifold temp and air temp sensors and tables, but what can ya do.

either way, doesn't sound like its his issue so I'll stop now lol

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

The "closed element" MAT sensor IS a coolant sensor, still works just the same as the open element and air box plastic sensors, as far as electrically is concerned. Same resistance values.

I prefer the open element or "caged" MAT sensors, simply because the element is more isolated from the intake manifold itself and won't conduct heat from the manifold to the element, taking a temp reading of the manifold, not the air.

???

iTrader: (5)

yeah, that's what I'm saying, the code is setup for the brass one that reads the intake temp, that's why it doesn't look at coolant temp.(one sensor kinda does both) which I thought atleast on my car left a temp hole in my tune. because I have the open element type right in front of the TB.

I need to get a stat back in my car and make sure the cooling system is up to the task of runing the same coolant temp all the time.

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

No, there is no difference as far as the code is concerned, as long as it's seeing values on the MAT input, it uses those values, regardless of the type of sensor being used. All "3" types of IAT/MAT sensors should read the same values given the same conditions, or at least very close to the same. There might be some variation with the closed element, just due to heat conductivity, but I haven't tested that theory. Both open element snesors should read the same, since they are the same sensor just using two different methods to mount them.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

It idles fine and very stable on initial startup...but at 12 to 1 air fuel, sometimes near 13 depending on if it was hotter restart or first cold startup of the day. I guess its in cold start mode and after a few seconds of idle that way, it will go into normal operation and idle will start to deteriorate. air fuel swings lean/rich now and idle goes up and down...map changes back and forth from 40's to 60's. Timing is locked, TPS is closed and normal voltage. I havent beable to watch IAC counts yesterday as my primary tuning laptop just died and i tried a backup but wouldnt connect. Got my work laptop to work but didnt do any datalogs. Hope to do that tonight.

I dont think the throttle body is sticking. I'll check tho. I tried to command slightly higher idle speed to help stabilize but it didnt help. I dont want to go higher than 1000 rpm.

I am wondering if the heat from the turbo/manifolds may have fried something. Some of the plastic tubing covers on the wiring on the firewall melted but wires are fine. may be another loose wire somewhere as it happens to me as of late.....

I wonder if my O2 sensor is good, air fuel looks correct as before, but I hope it didnt recieve much over 900 degree heat as Innovate says that can damage o2 sensors. Code59 doesnt use wideband input for fueling does it? Just there to compare to commanded correct?

gta324

code$59 can use WBO2 to control fuel, there is a flag for it.

How is the fuel lines connected? Fuel pressure stable and OK?

skwayb

That is a yes/no answer.... If you remember the formula for 59 it is:

BPW = BPC * MAP * T' * AFR * F29x * F33C * BLM * DFCO * DE * CLT * F77x

BPW = Base Pulse Width
BPC = Base Pulse Constant Term
MAP = Manifold Pressure Term
T' = Inverse Temperature Term (F31 and F31M)
AFR = Inverse Air Fuel Ratio Term
VE = Volumetric Efficiency Term - F29x Table
F33C = Battery Voltage Correction Term
BLM = Block Learn Correction Term
DFCO = Decel Fuel Cutoff Term
DE = Decel Enleanment Term
CLT = Closed Loop Correction Term
F77x= Turbo Boost Multiplier

58 uses the same formula, we just tweaked it to use bigger tables, an afr table and wideband input if turned on.


If you have the Use Desired AFR Table (F29_AFR) flag turned on, then the constant Stoichmetric AFR 14.7 Ratio (KAFSTCN) is no longer used and the values in the F29 AFR are then used (until you go into PE and then the F61 AFR numbers are used when in PE) to calculate the BPW. Even in OPEN LOOP the AFR Term will still affect the BPW. Just that there will be no correction to the fueling. It is just used to calculate the BPW with what ever number you have in the F29 AFR table. So if you have 15 afr in some cells, it will affect the PW in that area.

Now if you have the Enable WBO2 Sensor for Closed Loop Operation flag turned on and you put it in closed loop, then the BLM algorithms will get turned on and this is where we put the WBo2 Correction code. If the flag is checked, then the BLM/INT is locked at 128 and we use the reading from the WBo2 sensor to make the fuel corrections. If the flag is off, then the BLM/INT code will be used to make the fuel corrections just like in the stock code.

Side Note: You essentially could turn off all code59 flags to revert the code back to the stock 58 except it will be 3bar and not 2 bar.

So anyway if the Use Desired AFR Table (F29_AFR) flag is on, it will affect your BPW if it is different from 14.7 regardless if you are in open or closed loop since you will no longer be shooting for 14.7 AFR.

Make sense?

???

iTrader: (5)

I understand that if you put both type of sensor in say 100* water, they would both read the same ohm. but judging from the 8D code, switching from the brass to open element makes a huge difference. as in the whole grams per min of air flow table needs changed, and Rbob posted up the string of how its uses the mat in the code. I believe it was used differently than a iac would be used, and it effects everything.

does any other code besides 58/59 not use the coolant temp sensor in normal fueling? so that's why I felt the mat sensor values were used in 59 much different than it would be if the factory used an open element type for air temp. not that any of this matters lol. again, sorry for the hijack.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Interesting. I knew about closed loop control but didnt think anyone really ran that option, but didnt know it was still used in open loop. I am using the F29 AFR table. So the values in the TABLE are used to calculate BPW and not necessarily the WB reading (Actual AFR)?

So i guess i can fine tune idle fueling by changing commanded Air/Fuel in F29AFR?

If i can just tame this idle problem, the rest is set. Car drives great and just few more tweaks to WOT and such and I should be good to track this beast.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Did a log today think i found my problem, some reason my IAC counts are way up... 149 at idle instead of usual low teens.... Probly why idle is abit eratic...now need to know WHY IAC is doing this. Something in the wiring or stuck IAC ?

Anyway i finally took the car out on a nice stretch of road to do a full throttle pass.

I hit 10lbs of boost. According to my logs its showing about 50mph to 80mph in 2 seconds... and it never went over 5300 rpm. Was a 3000-5300 ish third gear pull.

IT may be ready to race this weekend. It still is breaking up abit in first/second gear pulls. I think the AE may need tweaked or power enrichment. It really seems to pick up strong once PE comes in as its set to 89 kpa i believe. Plus the other fuel pump kicks onat 4-5 psi and fuel pressure probly spikes up turning these 80lb's to 90's.

???

iTrader: (5)

any chance its hitting the rev limiter between shifts?

i think i remember a 8v ty guy run into that issue. the rev limit has a different place to adjust for 4,6, and 8 cyl. i think he was adjusting the 6 still and forgot theres and 8cyl limit

bluegrassz

iTrader: (3)

[QUOTE=Orr89RocZ;4313520]IT may be ready to race this weekend. /QUOTE]

Let us know how it does.
Good luck.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

I left off at 5300 it probly would have kept goin but i needed to slow down. If my tunerpro mph is right then it was 47 to 76 mph and by those numbers and the rpms i seen, it had to be a 2nd gear pull, not 3rd like i thought i had it in. 3rd at 5200+ is like 115mph or so and I dont think i was going that fast. My speedo does not work since i never replaced the gears in the trans so i have no idea if the input to tunerpro is correct now. Oh well, if i get a chance i will try to fix my IAC sensor problem and do some more lower gear pulls to over 6000 to see how the fuel looks up there.

I'm seeing 11.0 air fuel at 10lbs and I think i have 26 degree timing. Logs show its pulling 4 degrees so I may back that timing down 2 degrees or so, but i dont think 26 is too much at 10psi? 93 octane but its got up to 10% ethanol in it.

Calling for rain this weekend so may not get to go. Dont have my front skinnies yet anyway. Should be here friday.

???

iTrader: (5)

depending on a ton of things like how good your heads are and stuff, 26 may be more than it wants. you may also pull some timing out of it and lean it out a bit and find it happier like that too. but that level of tuning may wait till you get to the track and see what it runs there. as for the rev limiter, if you picked a v6 bin off the board to start with, and haven't changed it. you very well could have it set to 5300 or less on the v8 one. their 6v trucks don't turn many rpms. so they are set pretty low in most. I believe v8 one is even lower than the v6. if you've set it higher, disregard lol

skwayb

LOL he just never looked at it and wasn't thinking he was hitting the rev limiter since it was at 5400 (V6 setting). On a V8 the 5400 V6 limit is 4100 RPMs. That is why there is 3 tables for Fuel Cutoff (V8, V6, 4 Cylinder) so you set it correctly for the number of cylinders you have the code set to that you are running.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

yeah i talked to some guys on the syty chat (v8tty and ur50slo) and they said to watch that rev limiter.
I have my V8 limiter set to 6680rpm and I use my mallory hyfire VI to control rev limiter, which will be 6400 for now. I ignored the V6 and 4cyl ones. I may make them all higher just to be safe.
I've seen 6000 rpm before so i know its not limited. Like i said, i chose to let off at 5300...was getting too fast for my comfort on this preliminary tune. I'm taking it slow.


AFR heads are pretty efficient. My 383 only ran 34 degrees timing and i tried all the way to 39 and saw nothing. Actually more torque at 34 degrees. 30-32 probly would have been fine and made just as much power. I ran 32 on my 150 shot tune. Picked up alittle mph on that.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Well after a good day of driving i still have the messed up idle when warm but its ok when colder.

so after my few minute drive, i did another autotune thing to fix some spots and started to smooth my VE table. I got take the car out on that and have some lean spots again since smoothing lowered some values.

Take it back to make some adjustments and now the car wont idle again. Wont even start and hold idle. Made many changes and nothing worked. Even tried using the closed throttle function which $59 disables at default. It has more adjustability and i got the car started but it was abit lean so I richened it up and no success.

Went back to my other tune which i drove on today and it wont start on that.

IAC was acting weird tho. This morning i started it up and it was high but car was ok. Later today it went back to normal and the counts were low...idle seemed to do well. Then started to die when put into gear...not sure why. Then i started having major issues with surging/huntin and thats when i went to closed throttle table to try that. No success.

I realized i'm not using F29_AFR table... i may set that bit. I thought it was set but its not

I cant believe this car wont stay idling. I didnt even CHANGE the idle VE cells when i smoothed the table and its acting up again. I must have hurt something mechanical or electrical perhaps?

???

iTrader: (5)

i got nothing for the idle, but as i understand it the a/f table should be used. or atleast make sure the a/f table in auto tune is the same as the one in your bin.

as thats what it will target.


i was going to say, if the idle is still surges when it warms up, try adding some fuel down there to the ve. but if its changing and stuff. i got nothing man.


just to toss out an idea, have you done the relay mod to the ecm. i know your running high z injectors. but they are very large. i didn't even know they made 80lb high z's. maybe they are driving the one injector driver pretty hard? does it log battery voltage? does it change much to what the batt itself read?

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Does log battery voltage. Have seen voltage drop when idle goes to crap but i thought it was from rpms dropping so bad, voltage temporarily drops and then goes up once voltage comes back. May need more adjustment to the offset table, more than what i thought. Last log with hot coolant didnt see much voltage drop, still surged around

Whats the relay mod?

???

iTrader: (5)

the relay mod is something I saw the sy/ty guys do, they wire in a relay to the ecm injector drivers get full power. they say it helps on theirs with big injectors, but they also maybe running low z's. try a quick search on the 59 board for relay mod. I believe there's a how to.


I was wondering, what kinda ms injector times are you running at idle with those big injectors.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

well at idle so far i'm seeing between 1 and 1.2 ms of base pulsewidth. This was friday or saturday when i let it idle a bit, cold start. ran very good. For my battery voltage I had the car running good on about 610ms at 14.4 v 640 at 12.8 and 671 at 11.2

Now i think i need to rethink this and play with it again, after I check some things to see why i am now having screwy idle. It may need much less offset due to the big flow rate on these things

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

SO I just have to ask, are you running $59 or Mega Squirt?

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Code 59 still. Dont know much about megasquirt.

Was thinking of getting FAST XFI but didnt want to drop 2100 bucks on it

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

After looking back through this thread I realize now I was thinking of someone else.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Recharged my battery, it was low on amp/voltage output according to the tester so i let it charge today. But i remember yesterday once car was running voltage went up to 13.4

played with my known good bin but still erratic idle. Played with the VE values and couldnt get it to work out, so i went back to using the F29 Closed throttle table for idle...scaled down the stock table abit to reach my cars desired VE range..it wants to idle around 30 VE. raised idle to 1100 and made values around the idle cells similar or same. Its idling higher than i like and richer than i want but seeeems to be stable right now. Car free revs alot better, there is no initial hesitation or such when trying to rev so i think it was a VE spacing problem when using the MAIN VE table. VE was fluctuating alot when using main table so this closed throttle table seems to be working ok.

VE is higher at about 32 with air fuel in the mid high 12's to 1. Gonna try scaling those numbers down a touch to see if i cant lean it out, plus lower the idle speed.

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

That's how I usually attack idle tuning, start high and work down.

It seem most engines in my experiance, even with a modertaly poor tune will "idle" between 1000 and 1300 RPM.

Tune those cells, to get 14s for idle, then work down, dropping the commanded idle RPM by 100 to 200 RPM each time.

Try retarding your timing a bit in the idle cells, also look at your F2 table, I found that I have to level the table, to get rid of the surge while warming up. Then working on the F1 table got rid of the little surge at operating temp.

BTW, I added IIRC 2.3 degrees to the F@ table globally and then removed the same from the F1 table to have commanded timing relative to SA, match what is in the F1 table. Look at your idle cells, and what the difference is between commanded and what the F1 table reads and this is what is added to F2, and taken away from F1, to have the F1 table match commanded. I found the ability to have that matched up worked easier in later tuning for me. Making both of these changes to these table will keep commanded SA the same.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

I zero'd out the F2 table because i noticed it was pulling timing and what was in F1 wasnt shown on tunerpro dash.

Running 24 degrees. Tomorrow i'll run it again and see if it likes this tune or not.. if it does, its off to get inspected wednesday haha hope it passes