Ken73

Hi guys, I figured I've been hanging around enough that it's time I contribute something big! (Well, I hope some of you think this is big.)

I've been working in great detail with a friend writing a Windows 160 baud ALDL scanner - not only does it read in the data and display it raw (ala Peter Gargano's interface) but it also converts the values, displays all the error codes, and does something that I don't think any other program does;

It actually MAPS OUT the BLM and INT's for you.

That's right, it maps them out. What we did was create tables in the program that are identical to what's in TunerCat (MAP vs. RPM.) When a data line comes in, the program looks at it, and puts the INT and BLM into the corresponding cell. We discussed at length whether the value in each cell should be averaged or the last value, and whether the maps should use values "in between" or only ones close to the stated value. Rather than argue about it, we just put all four options in so you can choose for yourself. The program also maps out O2 sensor voltages.

Another neat feature is the Spark Counts map. I don't know if it works *correctly* or not, but this is how we perceived it to work and made it this way;

The map once again duplicates the TunerCat spark map. (MAP vs. RPM) If the "spark counts" counter goes up (by any number) in any given data line, the cell (for that data line) is increased by that number of increased spark counts. (The difference between that particular data line and the previous.)

The idea is to make the reading in of the data a little easier, so hopefully you can tune a little quicker, and maybe (?) help flatten the learning curve of tuning.

The program uses Peter Gargano's single-transistor interface. I'm running it and it runs great. I incorporated a tiny PCB with the transistor and two resistors into my conversion pigtail (I'm running a CrossFire with it) and all I have to do is send ground and signal (two wires) to my laptop. No messy wiring all over the place, and nothing dangling around. I simply mounted a 1/8" mono jack in my ashtray and use a pre-made 1/8" mono audio cable from Radio Shack ($1.99?) to a DB9 connector. It made a much cleaner installation.

The best part? It's FREEWARE. It's in Beta form right now, at version 0.96 - we are working out the last details of how we're going to distribute it and install it, etc. Hopefully I'll be able to put it out on the GMECM ftp site soon. (I'll post a link when it's ready.)

Currently it mainly supports the '7747, since that's what I'm using. It shows support for a couple of other older ECM's ('6430 and '6026) which are original CrossFire ECM's. I don't think those are 100% functional right now, and the maps probably wouldn't match. (No one has hacked those ECM's to my knowledge.) Support for other ECM's shouldn't be a big deal - however, we WILL need to know all the data that comes in if it's different from the '7747.

We don't have a "minimum requirement" for a computer right now, as we're not sure what it needs. I run it on a P166 laptop with 64mbs of RAM and it works great. WinNT will probably not like the serial port issue, so I'm not sure if it will run on that or not. I'm running it under Win98 with no issues.

If anyone has any input, I'd like to hear it. I realize 160 baud isn't the greatest for tuning, but this might help a little. It'll certainly help you get closer to the mark.

Please feel free to e-mail me privately at ken73@ken73.homeip.net if you want to discuss it in more detail, or reply in this thread.

Ken

lars92RS

Dude, it is great to hear someone is finally giving the 160 Baud ECM the credit they deserve. Thank you for taking some time to do this. I know nothing about programming that kind of stuff. Is there anyway you could possibly include the 8746 ECM into your Program? I have the ALDL stream for that ECM if you would like me to send it to you I can. I don't know what else you need to map the program out. the 8746 has been fully hacked so anything you need is out there and I'll even find it for you if you can integrate the 8746 into it. Sounds like a great project!!!

-Lars

JPrevost

I can't wait to see this. You had better put up a good website with good pictures.
If you could get screen shots and some how detail the interface cable design (for us busy people). Awesome job and I second the 8746 support.

------------------
, Jon (350 TBI!)
91 Red My website

Ken73

Sure, I don't see why we can't include the '8746. Someone send me the datastream! I'll get it to him and maybe we can even have it in the beta before we release it.

I need to know the entire datastream (including mode words and error codes) and I also need to know how the tables are laid out in TunerCat for the main fuel and main spark tables. (i.e. map = 30,35,40,45,etc. and RPM = 1200,1400,1600,1800,etc.) I need those values for both tables.

Let me dig up a .GIF I made and I'll post it here...

Ken

Ken73

Here's a preview of one of the tables it makes;



Here's the interface circuit - if it looks familiar it's because it's a simplified version of Peter Gargano's circuit - the unecessary stuff has been removed.



Q2 is a 2N2222 or similar switching transistor.

Ken

[This message has been edited by Ken73 (edited October 04, 2001).]

Craig Moates

Looks great! Good contributions!

JPrevost

The 8746 ecm hack word document
Sorry that's all I got. I hope somebody knows where to get the data stream data. Grumpy, Craig, any ideas?

------------------
, Jon (350 TBI!)
91 Red My website

lars92RS

I've got the data stream. I'll have it emailed to you by Monday.

-lars

Craig Moates

Let me know what datastreams you need, I'll send them along.

JoBy

Hello!

I am Ken73's 'friend'.

I can try to add the 8746 ECM. What I need is a description of the ALDL data stream.

This is what I used for the 7747 ECM:
http://www.geocities.com/ecmguy.geo/.../7747aldl.html

If you have something similar for the 8746 you can mail it to Ken or me ( joby.teknik@telia.com ).

------------------
Jonas Bylund



[This message has been edited by JoBy (edited October 05, 2001).]

Ken73

Here's the link that JoBy made..

http://w1.601.telia.com/~u60113744/s...dl/winaldl.htm

It shows screen shots and the interface. I've had this working with my '7747 for about a month or so (maybe more?) on my CrossFire just fine.

JPrevost, I couldn't open that word document? What version is it in? The scanner should work fine but some of the modes and error codes won't be right - most everything else should be though.

Ken

Ken73

Okay, I got into the hack, and found the ALDL list, but it's only 19 bytes - the full output is supposed to be 20 bytes. I think it's missing the 1st byte. Anyone know what it is??

Ken

fast_broker

iTrader: (1)

Way to go, Ken!!!

Two questions:

1) Are the BLM data in the table "live", ie BLM values are the last value at the time the engine was in that MAP/RPM cell? Or are the data some averaged number?

2) Pardon my ignorance but I do not have the EE skills to make/solder that interface together, I think. Is there ANY way I can get one made by you/anyone here and pay for it?????? Can I see a PIX of the cable setup? Maybe I can find someone near me to help me with it if I shown them your schematic and pix...



[This message has been edited by fast_broker (edited October 05, 2001).]

lars92RS

My ALDL Data stream file also only has 19 bytes. So here are the First and last bytes and maybe they aren't the same.

1st: 1. eprom id lsb
last: 19. IAT, a/d

If they aren't the same let me know and i'll send you the file i have.

Fast_broker: Wher are you at. I could make one of thos cables pretty quick. Email me. lars_101@hotmail.com

-lars

JoBy

fast_broker,

1) Yes and Yes !!! You can select four different modes and you mentioned two of them ...

lars92RS,

I just got a copy from ken and it matches your first and last byte. The data is almost an exact match to the 7747 but it is missing the first byte. If you try it with the 7747 setting it should work just fine!



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Jonas Bylund

fast_broker

iTrader: (1)

Thanks Lars, I'll email you when I get home. I am in CT. A MILLION thanks...

I'll email you later, (my home email is fast_broker@hotmail.com) I cannot WAIT to get this going. BLM problems are the reason I took out the Hot Cam and went with a ZZ4 cam with 1.6/1.5 rockers...


Thanks for the answer on the BLM cells, too. 4 modes, what more could anyone need?

Oh, how do we get the program? I don't remember seeing a link or website, sorry if it is plain site.



[This message has been edited by fast_broker (edited October 05, 2001).]

JoBy

This is a link to my WINALDL page:

http://w1.601.telia.com/~u60113744/s...dl/winaldl.htm

On that page you can download the program ( a zip file )



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Jonas Bylund

fast_broker

iTrader: (1)

Thanks, Jonas. How can I be the man if...

Ken73

BTW, for those of you who didn't take a close look at JoBy's signature, he's the one who supercharged his CrossFire..

Ken

JPrevost

That's awesome.
I can't wait to try this out. Hopefully I can get over to the radioshack outlet store before they close today.

------------------
, Jon (350 TBI!)
91 Red My website

Ken73

They've got all you need, Jon. I believe it's a 2N2222 transistor, and two resistors. They also have the DB9 connector and shield, as well.

Ken

JoBy

And now the version is up to 0.97 Beta. (same download page)

I added support for the 8746 ECM according to the mail I got.

The 8746 has one additional analog sensor, IAT. Is that air temp? Anyway, I used the same temp conversion as coolant temp but I don't know if that is right. Does anyone have a conversion table for that?

My guess is that the fist byte ( MW2 ) is missing in the ALDL description, so I put '???' on those bits in the flag data display.

------------------
Jonas Bylund

Ken73

Yep, it's Intake Air Temperature.

Ken

nsimmons

you guys hanging out here also im busing installing windows on my laptop so i can try it out

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1984 Z51 Auto, Ported and polished intake, K&N, MSD, Ram air/Cold air intake, no cat, no AIR, no egr, no swirls plates

JPrevost

I'm pretty sure that the IAT isn't the same as the coolant temp. The IAT has a different resistance:temp table. The TPI cars used a similar coolant temp sensor as their IAT (aka MAT) but even that was slightly different. At least that's what I remember reading.

------------------
, Jon (350 TBI!)
91 Red My website

V8Astro Captain

iTrader: (1)

Sweet!! You kick *** .

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'92 Astro 350 TBI Edelbrock intake, MSD 6AL, 3.42's, 2.5" exhaust, Flowmaster 40 2 chamber, B&M 2nd stage shift kit, 255 60 R15 tires on AR-727's, Polished & Bored TBI, Custom EPROM in progress

fast_broker

iTrader: (1)

More questions:

How come there is not a 100 MAP column in BLM and INT modes?

Do you just plug in the ALDL connector into a running engine and start the program? ie, what is the procedure to start?

Lionsden

I have been frequenting this forum also. Just under another user name.


My laptop didn't have the 'Msflxgrd.ocx'

I kept getting an install error when running the INSTOCX.BAT while it was in a winaldl directory on the c: drive

The solution was to copy the INSTOCX.BAT directly into the Windows/System folder Run INSTOCX.BAT from there to install and register this file on the system.

Of course everyone probably knew this but me!!



------------------
Dan

nsimmons

i think the problem is it cant locate the regsrv32.exe, i had the same problem. The software works great, although my ecm is retarded and doesnt output the serial data properly..time for an upgrade

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1984 Z51 Auto, Ported and polished intake, K&N, MSD, Ram air/Cold air intake, no cat, no AIR, no egr, no swirls plates

JoBy

Found that instocx.bat problem, now it should work from any directory.

/ Jonas

JoBy

Found somehtong on this page:

http://www.sethirdgen.org/tpi1.htm#cts/iat

<quote>CTS/IAT sensors: Except for V6 Camaro's the Coolant Temp Sensor (CTS) and Intake Air Temp (IAT) sensor are the same Part Number.</quote>

If they are the same part number, they probably have the same resistance for different temperatures too ...




------------------
Jonas Bylund

JPrevost

You're right.

------------------
, Jon (350 TBI!)
91 Red My website

TC602

Has anyone tried this program with the AKM cable?

JohnnyIROC-Z

Just though tI'd let you know. I'm runnign WIN2K on my Home pc and tried to run this Program and it didn't run. No Error's or anything, just didn't run. My guess is Win2K tries to run ikt as a background process.

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1987 IROC-Z T-Tops wait... GUTTED MAF!

fast_broker

iTrader: (1)

Just letting Johnny know that I am running '98 and at first, the program didn't run. Then, I ran his program to install the file that may not exist, and then the main program ran just fine. I have not actually "used" the functions, but the program RAN fine and I could click all the tabs and stuff...

ie, maybe you need to run the install that funky file program???????????

Ken73

Johnny, install the OCX file. Download the latest version and it has a better install file in it. If it doesn't run, it's because that OCX file is missing or not installed.

Ken

fast_broker

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, that's what I meant to say. that's the ticket?!

JohnnyIROC-Z

I tried that but got an error that said "regsrv.exe doesn't exist" so the OCX registration program doesn't exist in WIN2K

JoBy

JohnnyIROC-Z,

Yes it does ... I installed it on a win2k computer. Search for regsrv32.exe.

It should be in c:/winnt/system32

If so, use a command prompt and type:
c:/winnt/system32/regsvr32.exe msflxgrd.ocx


/ Jonas

fast_broker

iTrader: (1)

How come no 100 MAP columns????????? Can they be added????

JoBy

fast_broker,

Sure, if they should be there. I got the layout info from ken, and it is supposed to match the tables in the ECM. Is there a 100 MAP column in the ECM?

Are the tables identical on different ECM's? (the ones supported by the program)

------------------
Jonas Bylund



[This message has been edited by JoBy (edited October 08, 2001).]

JoBy

fast_broker,

You were right. we (Ken & I) missed that one.
You can download the new ver 0.98 Beta with the 100 kPa included.

http://w1.601.telia.com/~u60113744/s...dl/winaldl.htm



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Jonas Bylund

Pablo

iTrader: (1)

SWEET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

btw this might seem lame, but all i have is an ancient 386 laptop, would this run on 3.1? i assume no? how about a dos vers?

you guys rule
Pablo

JohnnyIROC-Z

Well, I guess I should ask this simple question. Will this work on an 87 Camaro with a 305 and TPI?

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1987 IROC-Z T-Tops wait... GUTTED MAF!

u r sofa king we tah did

no i believe this is for all those damn crossfire cars thats a sweet setup with the supercharged crossfire by the way jonas. looks great. any idea what it runs in the quartermile?

------------------
1989 Chevy Camaro IROC-Z L98 A4 Black Ext./Grey Int.
SDPC2000 TPI Crate Engine
4.10:1 Gears

1989 Chevy Corvette L98 A4 Black/Black Coupe
Stock 95k miles
3.07:1 Gears

[This message has been edited by u r sofa king we tah did (edited October 08, 2001).]

Ken73

You're not far off, really. I did it with the CrossFire group in mind, (because I have one!) but I knew it would be helpful with y'all over here as well, and thought you'd appreciate it. I'm just glad other people can enjoy it as well!

BTW, I don't know if it works with the '87 Camaro/TPI setup you've got Johnny. If it's 160 baud only, the answer would probably be "yes," but I don't think those ECM's were 160 only. Craig Moates software is probably what you want.

Ken

JoBy

u r sofa king we tah did, long name you got there ...

I don't have any 'real' track numbers yet, but I have a G-Tech ...

On June 31 this summer I made these runs, one after another. ( street tires )

12.73 sek, 116.3 mph
12.76 sek, 114.1 mph
12.89 sek, 113.9 mph

Pretty consitent with the engine getting hotter and hotter ...

I have also seen 0-60 mph of 4.7 sek. ( street tires )

300 rwhp @ 4900 rpm
350 rwtq @ 3900 rpm


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Jonas Bylund

fast_broker

iTrader: (1)

Thanks, JoBy... I have never seen so much help and ambition from people for the benefit of others...


Thanks to all involved!!!

99Hawk120

Curious, would this thing work on the carbureted ECMs? I might want to mess with it for kicks if it did...

Ken73

You might have to make a different interface since the data comes out at 12v levels and not 5v levels. (You may not even need an interface?) You'd have to find out what the data coming out *is* though, and I'm pretty sure you'd have to junction the A&B terminals. It wouldn't do much for tuning.

What carb'd car are you looking at using this on?

Ken