Need to solve this coolant situ.
08-19-2006, 06:45 PM
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Car: 1988 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z
Engine: TPI 5.7L (L98)
Transmission: Automatic w/OD (700R4)
Axle/Gears: Stock Axle 2.77 gears
Need to solve this coolant situ.
OK guys this problem has been going on long enough and I need some help if I am ever going to solve it, so here it goes.
Ever since I have had my 88 IROC 350, I have had a coolant issue. At first, after driving the car and turning it off, I would hear and see the coolant boiling back into the radiator. Every weekend, I would have to refill the reservoir, because it would be empty. I thought this was strange, because my gauge always said I was running at 220 or below, except for a few select times when it spiked while driving in heavy traffic on a really hot day. It would drop back down to operating range pretty quickly though. Someone told me to try and replace my radiator cap, so I did replace it with a GM 15 lb OEM cap. After I replaced the cap, the boiling of the coolant stopped, but I would still have to refill the reservoir once a week, so it didn't solve the mysterious coolant loss.
The next issue involved my heater control valve. A piece of this part broke off in one of its connecting rubber hoses, and antifreeze was shooting everywhere. I thought maybe a loose connection here could be the answer to my coolant loss, so I replaced the HCV with a OEM part. It didn't help the issue, I still had to replace the coolant at the end of every week.
Now that you know the issues here are the known facts. I think my secondary fan or one of its switches/relays could be faulty. My primary fan always kicks on at 220, but the few times my car has gone to 240 or above, the secondary fan wouldn't turn on. I tried to test the secondary fan by putting my A/C on max and also by tapping into the ALDL, which should activate it. Neither of these things started the secondary fan. I'm not sure if the fan itself is junk or one of its relays, but I have trouble believing this is causing the loss of fluid because my gauge barely ever goes above normal operating range.
There is never any visual signs of coolant loss, on the ground or under the car, no visible leaks near any hoses or the radiator itself. My oil and tranny fluid are not contaminated with coolant. My car never blows white exhaust and doesn't smell fishy, (well it started to a little after the HCV blew coolant all over my engine, but that is self-explanatory). But every weekend, the fluid reservoir is empty. Even though the coolant doesn't viciously boil back in the reservoir anymore, after it has been filled and driven it does steam a bit out the vented reservoir cap, like it may be a bit too hot. I always fill the reservoir with an even 50/50 mix of Prestone green and H2O.
What I am hoping you guys can help me do is come up with a plan of attack that will help me cancel out things so I can figure out what the issue is. I don't want to bring it to a general mechanic and ask him to check out the cooling system, because I know they will just start replacing everything and it will get costly. Would anyone be willing to conjure up a list starting with the easy small stuff and working up to the bigger things, so that I can begin to figure out what is wrong here? Any input or ideas would be totally appreciated. Sorry for the long post, I just want anyone interested in helping to understand all aspects of what I am dealing with here. Thanks in advance for your advice!!
JCRULZ
Ever since I have had my 88 IROC 350, I have had a coolant issue. At first, after driving the car and turning it off, I would hear and see the coolant boiling back into the radiator. Every weekend, I would have to refill the reservoir, because it would be empty. I thought this was strange, because my gauge always said I was running at 220 or below, except for a few select times when it spiked while driving in heavy traffic on a really hot day. It would drop back down to operating range pretty quickly though. Someone told me to try and replace my radiator cap, so I did replace it with a GM 15 lb OEM cap. After I replaced the cap, the boiling of the coolant stopped, but I would still have to refill the reservoir once a week, so it didn't solve the mysterious coolant loss.
The next issue involved my heater control valve. A piece of this part broke off in one of its connecting rubber hoses, and antifreeze was shooting everywhere. I thought maybe a loose connection here could be the answer to my coolant loss, so I replaced the HCV with a OEM part. It didn't help the issue, I still had to replace the coolant at the end of every week.
Now that you know the issues here are the known facts. I think my secondary fan or one of its switches/relays could be faulty. My primary fan always kicks on at 220, but the few times my car has gone to 240 or above, the secondary fan wouldn't turn on. I tried to test the secondary fan by putting my A/C on max and also by tapping into the ALDL, which should activate it. Neither of these things started the secondary fan. I'm not sure if the fan itself is junk or one of its relays, but I have trouble believing this is causing the loss of fluid because my gauge barely ever goes above normal operating range.
There is never any visual signs of coolant loss, on the ground or under the car, no visible leaks near any hoses or the radiator itself. My oil and tranny fluid are not contaminated with coolant. My car never blows white exhaust and doesn't smell fishy, (well it started to a little after the HCV blew coolant all over my engine, but that is self-explanatory). But every weekend, the fluid reservoir is empty. Even though the coolant doesn't viciously boil back in the reservoir anymore, after it has been filled and driven it does steam a bit out the vented reservoir cap, like it may be a bit too hot. I always fill the reservoir with an even 50/50 mix of Prestone green and H2O.
What I am hoping you guys can help me do is come up with a plan of attack that will help me cancel out things so I can figure out what the issue is. I don't want to bring it to a general mechanic and ask him to check out the cooling system, because I know they will just start replacing everything and it will get costly. Would anyone be willing to conjure up a list starting with the easy small stuff and working up to the bigger things, so that I can begin to figure out what is wrong here? Any input or ideas would be totally appreciated. Sorry for the long post, I just want anyone interested in helping to understand all aspects of what I am dealing with here. Thanks in advance for your advice!!
JCRULZ
Last edited by jcrules78; 08-19-2006 at 07:28 PM. Reason: I didn't finish writing the stupid post!
08-19-2006, 07:29 PM
#3
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Car: 1988 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z
Engine: TPI 5.7L (L98)
Transmission: Automatic w/OD (700R4)
Axle/Gears: Stock Axle 2.77 gears
sorry man, I accidentally sent the post before I finished writing it. I am numb.
08-19-2006, 10:41 PM
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[QUOTE=jcrules78;3028607]OK guys this problem has been going on long enough and I need some help if I am ever going to solve it, so here it goes.
Ever since I have had my 88 IROC 350, I have had a coolant issue. At first, after driving the car and turning it off, I would hear and see the coolant boiling back into the radiator. Every weekend, I would have to refill the reservoir, because it would be empty. I thought this was strange, because my gauge always said I was running at 220 or below, except for a few select times when it spiked while driving in heavy traffic on a really hot day. It would drop back down to operating range pretty quickly though. Someone told me to try and replace my radiator cap, so I did replace it with a GM 15 lb OEM cap. After I replaced the cap, the boiling of the coolant stopped, but I would still have to refill the reservoir once a week, so it didn't solve the mysterious coolant loss.
The next issue involved my heater control valve. A piece of this part broke off in one of its connecting rubber hoses, and antifreeze was shooting everywhere. I thought maybe a loose connection here could be the answer to my coolant loss, so I replaced the HCV with a OEM part. It didn't help the issue, I still had to replace the coolant at the end of every week.
Now that you know the issues here are the known facts. I think my secondary fan or one of its switches/relays could be faulty. My primary fan always kicks on at 220, but the few times my car has gone to 240 or above, the secondary fan wouldn't turn on. I tried to test the secondary fan by putting my A/C on max and also by tapping into the ALDL, which should activate it. Neither of these things started the secondary fan. I'm not sure if the fan itself is junk or one of its relays, but I have trouble believing this is causing the loss of fluid because my gauge barely ever goes above normal operating range.
There is never any visual signs of coolant loss, on the ground or under the car, no visible leaks near any hoses or the radiator itself. My oil and tranny fluid are not contaminated with coolant. My car never blows white exhaust and doesn't smell fishy, (well it started to a little after the HCV blew coolant all over my engine, but that is self-explanatory). But every weekend, the fluid reservoir is empty. Even though the coolant doesn't viciously boil back in the reservoir anymore, after it has been filled and driven it does steam a bit out the vented reservoir cap, like it may be a bit too hot. I always fill the reservoir with an even 50/50 mix of Prestone green and H2O.
What I am hoping you guys can help me do is come up with a plan of attack that will help me cancel out things so I can figure out what the issue is. I don't want to bring it to a general mechanic and ask him to check out the cooling system, because I know they will just start replacing everything and it will get costly. Would anyone be willing to conjure up a list starting with the easy small stuff and working up to the bigger things, so that I can begin to figure out what is wrong here? Any input or ideas would be totally appreciated. Sorry for the long post, I just want anyone interested in helping to understand all aspects of what I am dealing with here. Thanks in advance for your advice!!
use a pressure tester and pressurize the system to check for a leak also with the radiator pressure tester still hooked up start the vehicle and then watch if the gage starts to clime to see if possable blown head gasket good luck!
Ever since I have had my 88 IROC 350, I have had a coolant issue. At first, after driving the car and turning it off, I would hear and see the coolant boiling back into the radiator. Every weekend, I would have to refill the reservoir, because it would be empty. I thought this was strange, because my gauge always said I was running at 220 or below, except for a few select times when it spiked while driving in heavy traffic on a really hot day. It would drop back down to operating range pretty quickly though. Someone told me to try and replace my radiator cap, so I did replace it with a GM 15 lb OEM cap. After I replaced the cap, the boiling of the coolant stopped, but I would still have to refill the reservoir once a week, so it didn't solve the mysterious coolant loss.
The next issue involved my heater control valve. A piece of this part broke off in one of its connecting rubber hoses, and antifreeze was shooting everywhere. I thought maybe a loose connection here could be the answer to my coolant loss, so I replaced the HCV with a OEM part. It didn't help the issue, I still had to replace the coolant at the end of every week.
Now that you know the issues here are the known facts. I think my secondary fan or one of its switches/relays could be faulty. My primary fan always kicks on at 220, but the few times my car has gone to 240 or above, the secondary fan wouldn't turn on. I tried to test the secondary fan by putting my A/C on max and also by tapping into the ALDL, which should activate it. Neither of these things started the secondary fan. I'm not sure if the fan itself is junk or one of its relays, but I have trouble believing this is causing the loss of fluid because my gauge barely ever goes above normal operating range.
There is never any visual signs of coolant loss, on the ground or under the car, no visible leaks near any hoses or the radiator itself. My oil and tranny fluid are not contaminated with coolant. My car never blows white exhaust and doesn't smell fishy, (well it started to a little after the HCV blew coolant all over my engine, but that is self-explanatory). But every weekend, the fluid reservoir is empty. Even though the coolant doesn't viciously boil back in the reservoir anymore, after it has been filled and driven it does steam a bit out the vented reservoir cap, like it may be a bit too hot. I always fill the reservoir with an even 50/50 mix of Prestone green and H2O.
What I am hoping you guys can help me do is come up with a plan of attack that will help me cancel out things so I can figure out what the issue is. I don't want to bring it to a general mechanic and ask him to check out the cooling system, because I know they will just start replacing everything and it will get costly. Would anyone be willing to conjure up a list starting with the easy small stuff and working up to the bigger things, so that I can begin to figure out what is wrong here? Any input or ideas would be totally appreciated. Sorry for the long post, I just want anyone interested in helping to understand all aspects of what I am dealing with here. Thanks in advance for your advice!!
use a pressure tester and pressurize the system to check for a leak also with the radiator pressure tester still hooked up start the vehicle and then watch if the gage starts to clime to see if possable blown head gasket good luck!
08-19-2006, 11:07 PM
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Think of it this way man, when the coolant is hot (180 or above) the system is pressurized. Next time the car reaches operating temps, try to squeeze the upper radiator hose, you can feel the pressure in there. So when the system is pressurized, thats when any possible leaks you have become exposed, thats when coolant leaks happen. And since everything is hot and the car is usually being used its likely the coolant either drops while the car is moving, or its evaporated by the heat. On the other hand, when the system cools down its no longer pressurized. This would be when the car gets parked, when its sits, etc, etc. In this scenario this is where any possible leaks you have suck air back into the system instead of leaking fluid out. So those two things combined make it hard to pinpoint if there are leaks, and if so, where the leak is. From my experience the thing that tell you whats going on is the coolant itself. If there is a leak the coolant will likely be discolored and junk/dirt will make its way into the system. If coolant leaks out, air and dirt will leak back in. So if the coolant consistently runs clean, no discoloration, and no buildup, then its likely there are no leaks, then it becomes an issue of modifying the cooling system to work better. If in doubt you can flush the coolant, re-fill, and try again (cycle the car through operating temp and cooldown). If you do see consistent discoloration then there is a leak somewhere, and to be honest losing coolant is the least of your worries, air entering the system is the big worry. Let us know how the coolant looks and go from there. Its always possible the coolant is evaporating when reaching boiling temps in the overflow bottle, would depend on the coolant mixture.
As for the rest of the system, I recommend a 180 degree thermostat and a 180 degree fan switch. This will lower your normal operating temp to 180 degrees, gives you a 50-60 degree buffer before an overheat happens instead of the weak 20-30 degree buffer the OEM setup gives you. To make it even better I would drill a 1/8th inch hole on the thermostat fin so there is always constant flow (even if it is very small flow). Running the lower temp will also prevent the coolant mixture from reaching those boiling temps, thats might solve the missing coolant problem right there. To troubleshoot that fan I would use a DVM and ensure that the fan is getting power when its supposed to turn on, that will let you know if its the fan motor failing (which can be replaced easily) or if there is another component of the system failing (which can also be fixed), divide and conquer on that one.
As for the rest of the system, I recommend a 180 degree thermostat and a 180 degree fan switch. This will lower your normal operating temp to 180 degrees, gives you a 50-60 degree buffer before an overheat happens instead of the weak 20-30 degree buffer the OEM setup gives you. To make it even better I would drill a 1/8th inch hole on the thermostat fin so there is always constant flow (even if it is very small flow). Running the lower temp will also prevent the coolant mixture from reaching those boiling temps, thats might solve the missing coolant problem right there. To troubleshoot that fan I would use a DVM and ensure that the fan is getting power when its supposed to turn on, that will let you know if its the fan motor failing (which can be replaced easily) or if there is another component of the system failing (which can also be fixed), divide and conquer on that one.
08-19-2006, 11:30 PM
#6
Supreme Member
yeah the system needs the pressure buildup, the pressure helps to cool also
need it
check that its pressurized when its hot
and that it will hld the pressure for a good length of time after shutting it down
if not then you hva e aleak somewhere, internally or externally and you need to figure it out to correct the issues
good luck
need it
check that its pressurized when its hot
and that it will hld the pressure for a good length of time after shutting it down
if not then you hva e aleak somewhere, internally or externally and you need to figure it out to correct the issues
good luck
08-20-2006, 01:20 PM
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Car: 1988 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z
Engine: TPI 5.7L (L98)
Transmission: Automatic w/OD (700R4)
Axle/Gears: Stock Axle 2.77 gears
Thanks guys for all the input, now I have some tasks I can get started on to figure out what ails my beast. I had the car running today, and I squeezed the upper radiator hose, and it didn't seem too stiff with pressure, it was pretty easily squeezed. When there is coolant in the reservoir, it is green and slightly uniformly cloudy, I do tend to see some particles floating around, but I'm not sure it it is external dirt or rust from the system itself. I thought originally that the loss of coolant was from evaporation through the vented reservoir cap, but it seems like it happens too quickly for that. I do use a 50/50 mix of Prestone and H2O. Oh and about the fan system, I would like to replace those things soon. What does the acronym DVM stand for? Diagnostic ? ? Sorry guys, I'm new to all this cooling system stuff.
I think I will get the thing pressure tested soon, and maybe even do a flush just to see if that helps. I would like to replace the thermostat and the fan switch anyway, just to upgrade, and I really want to find out what the heck is going on with that stupid secondary fan. Does that 180 switch turn on both fans or just the primary typically? Thanks again guys for all the input, I can't wait to solve these issues.
JCRULZ
I think I will get the thing pressure tested soon, and maybe even do a flush just to see if that helps. I would like to replace the thermostat and the fan switch anyway, just to upgrade, and I really want to find out what the heck is going on with that stupid secondary fan. Does that 180 switch turn on both fans or just the primary typically? Thanks again guys for all the input, I can't wait to solve these issues.
JCRULZ
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08-20-2006, 01:21 PM
#8
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Car: 1988 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z
Engine: TPI 5.7L (L98)
Transmission: Automatic w/OD (700R4)
Axle/Gears: Stock Axle 2.77 gears
Thanks guys for all the input, now I have some tasks I can get started on to figure out what ails my beast. I had the car running today, and I squeezed the upper radiator hose, and it didn't seem too stiff with pressure, it was pretty easily squeezed. When there is coolant in the reservoir, it is green and slightly uniformly cloudy, I do tend to see some particles floating around, but I'm not sure it it is external dirt or rust from the system itself. I thought originally that the loss of coolant was from evaporation through the vented reservoir cap, but it seems like it happens too quickly for that. I do use a 50/50 mix of Prestone and H2O. Oh and about the fan system, I would like to replace those things soon. What does the acronym DVM stand for? Diagnostic ? ? Sorry guys, I'm new to all this cooling system stuff.
I think I will get the thing pressure tested soon, and maybe even do a flush just to see if that helps. I would like to replace the thermostat and the fan switch anyway, just to upgrade, and I really want to find out what the heck is going on with that stupid secondary fan. Does that 180 switch turn on both fans or just the primary typically? Thanks again guys for all the input, I can't wait to solve these issues.
JCRULZ
I think I will get the thing pressure tested soon, and maybe even do a flush just to see if that helps. I would like to replace the thermostat and the fan switch anyway, just to upgrade, and I really want to find out what the heck is going on with that stupid secondary fan. Does that 180 switch turn on both fans or just the primary typically? Thanks again guys for all the input, I can't wait to solve these issues.
JCRULZ
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