icanoutfishyou

Alright, I have a 1985 camaro z28 w/350 crate GM. I recently put a edelbrock performer intake manifold, an edelbrock 1406 600 cfm performer carb on and a mallory unilite distributor.

my car starts and runs. excuse the language but it runs quite ****ty. very ****ty in fact. it's pissing me off. I've been trying to tune this car for six months now and it's still a piece of ****. big ol' pile of ****.

The car pops loudly when it runs. I tried to check the timing but it won't register even with a light. (why me?) even when i've tried to adjust the timing while it's running it still runs like crap no matter where i rotate the cap. the cap is brand new, as are the wires the coil and the distributor. they aren't the problem. The carb has been adjusted and it just has not helped. when I step on the gas the car refuses to run higher rpm's. I can't even get it to move without stalling.

What is the problem? Can anyone help? Should I just give up and crawl into the fetal position.?

mikesz1984

have you checked to see if the plugs are the right ones, or if you might have a dead plug

hydric

hmm, since it starts and least runs, i would say the distrib isn;t 180 out. have you checkd the fuel pressure? a fuel pump that isnt pumpiing enough gas will not rev high without dying... change the fuel filter? not saying thats your problem, seeing its pobably a timing issue with your mallory somehow...

What do you mean it wont register? what rpm does it idle at?

are your vacuum hoses hooked up?

icanoutfishyou

I have a brand new fuel pump, and pushrod. Brand new spark plugs, correct for the engine. There is no vacuum advance for the distributor.

I was told by a certified mechanic today that I should just swap back to the computer controlled setup. I think i'm going to attempt that and get rid of this unilite.

so if anyone is lookin to buy a unilite, coil, and ballast resistor give me a holler. It's got brand new accel plug wires as well

mrt89rs

what type of distrebutor do you have?(not brand) if you want to run your car with out a computer then you need to use a vacum advaced HEI Distrabutor the one with the coil on the cap. or pionts vacum advaced

if your distrabutor is on 180* backwords the huge fireballs would shot out of the carb and the car would not run at all.

check your fireing order in case you don't know it, it's 18436572 the plug wires are supose to go on to the distrabutor cap in that order and clock wise. and your #1 plug is supose to fire when your #1 piston is at top dead ceanter of compression. when your #1 piston is an tdc your oil pump rod is supose point starte at the #1piston other wise you could have the distrabutor on in a postion where you can't retard your timing enuff to compensate for the inproper instalation.

hope this helps

IROCaholic

Have you checked your exhaust? My friend had a clogged catalytic converter in his bird and it would barely rev and it would stall if you tried to drive it. So maybe your exhuast is plugged up somewhere. Just a thought.

dans82bird

Probably because he didn't wanna mess with it b/c he's a moron. Just because some guy is a certified 'master mechanic' doesn't mean they know their ****, i've seen ase 'master' techs who couldn't diagnose their way out of a wet paper bag, just basically parts swappers is what they are... change different parts until the thing runs.

Assure your firing order is right, check for spark, check for fuel, is your timing chain off? If your not getting spark then check the coil if no then replace the distributor with a known good unit... your old HEI setup will spark w/o the computer hooked up.

how much ya want for it ?

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

did you paint your balancer when you painted the motor? i couldn't read the mark on my balancer because i painted everything black. i colored the mark on the balancer white with a painte pen and vuala! i had a mark i could read with the timing light. just something to think about. also, again, check that firing order.

dans82bird

been there, done that

icanoutfishyou

Yea, I painted it. Currently the car is just sitting. I'm almost certain that it's the carbuerator that I put on there, I got it from a friend who *said* it worked. well two big backfires and one true fire and the car still sits.
I know it isn't the firing order, I checked it three times. I also set the timing at least 10 - 15 times with four different distributors. Has to be the carb.
I'm waiting on some money that I have coming, and getting it flatbedded to someone who knows what they're doing. I appreciate the help though!

82-T/A [Work]

Hey man, just swap out the carb. Don't send it off to another mechanic. Why not do it yourself?

An Edelbrock 1406 Carburetor flows to 600cfm. They come OUT OF THE BOX configured for a 350 V8.

If you're absolutely sure your friend's Edelbrock is the problem, then do this. You can get them honestly for like $200 bucks at your local Discount Auto Parts (cheaper than getting it from even Summit Racing). THey have to special order it, but they can probably have it in a day or two.

The other thing I would check of course are the spark plugs. I know you said you checked them already, but check them again. Are they new plugs? Or old worn out ones that you are re-using.

Check your fuel pressure. Are you still using the electric FUEL INJECTION pump on your carburetor? If you are, then you're giving the motor WAAAY too much fuel.

If the catalytic converter is clogged you should hear a hissing noise from the exhaust.

Your distributor SHOULD have a timing advance on it, whether vacuum, mechanical, or whatever. There has to be an advance on it, or the motor would run like **** in anything but idle.

Sounds weird to me, why would you need a balast resistor? I thought that was for only the oldest style points distributors.. like, completely a thing of the past? Why not just get yourself a regular run of the mill GM HEI Non Computer Controlled Ignition?

By the way, if you want a running distributor, I have a points distributor on the internet, do a search for 71 Corvette. It runs perfect, I pulled it off my 1976 Camaro before I junked the car. The motor was running perfect, so I pulled the whole assembly and dropped it into my 81 TransAm. I decided to go HEI personally because the 81 T/A already had the hookups for the distributor (TACH and IGNITION wire)


Good luck, but don't get in the habbit of paying someone to work on your car for you. It gets really expensive, and you usually lose out.

icanoutfishyou

Yea, i was thinking about that, but I'm kind of fed up with this car. It's been sitting in my yard since July. And these are the only problems I've talked about... there's more.

There's some kind of fluid dripping out onto the exhaust manifold (antifreeze?) so yea, my luck a head gasket.
There is gas in the oil. (wonderful too huh?

The spark plugs are brand new AC Delco.

Fuel Pressure is from a Mechanical Pump. It was formerly carburated.

Cat is gutted

Ballast resistor is required for mallory ignition; I swapped back to CC ignition. Neither worked. Has to be carb.

I figure with my luck I'll buy that new carburator. put it on there. car won't run, and i will grab a sledge and destroy the car. that is my fear, because i've come this cloes before |____|

82-T/A [Work]

Yeah, I know you're bummed. But don't lose your perspective here.

Look, I don't know how good your mechanical experience with cars is yet...
But I've given up on a few good cars in times past because I didn't know
enough, and gave up on the car for a simple problem. It does sound like
it could be the carburetor.

However, in my experience, I find it best if.. when you get a new motor,
you get it running / break it in with parts that you KNOW work well.
So like for example, if you just dropped this 350 small block chevy into
an otherwise running 305 3rd gen F-body. You should use ALL the factory
components JUST to break in the motor and make sure it works.

Then, upgrade from there. Distributor and carburetor.

That way, you at least already know that there's nothing wrong with the motor.
Don't try to do too much too soon or you'll end up having to back-track like
you're doing now.

Just some words of advice from someone who's screwed up a lot of cars and
broken many bolts and studs.


Also.... keep your perspective. You have a brand new GM ZZ4?? Crate Motor...
that's not just some 305 junker block from a salvage yard. That's a decent
motor. If you get absolutely fed-up with this car, you can ALWAYS sell the body
go on the Auto Trader, or eBay and find yourself a nice rolling chassis
to drop that sucker into.

That's basically what I did. Through a friend, I located a 1976 Camaro that
I was told was in the middle of a restoration when someone gave up on it.
I got it for free. What looked like a piece of junk, it turned out to have a
350 4-bolt CMJ block from a 74 Impala Police Car, with 71 Corvette camel hump
cyl heads. (2.02:1 intake and 1.6:1 exhuast). Plus some wicked low to mid-range
torque cam. The motor is a beast (and it had just been rebuilt 10k miles prior)

So I took the engine out of the Camaro and junked the body (waay to rusty in
the rear quarters). I went searching for a car I could drop the motor in..
I came across a 1981 TransAm with the hard to find C&C TTOPs.

icanoutfishyou

Yea, I know the motor runs, that's what really bothers me.. lol
I took the stuff off the 305 and swapped it over to the 350. It ran; that's why i'm so irked about my current situation. I've put so much work into it that i've near given up.

82-T/A [Work]

All the more reason why you SHOULDN'T give up...































but if you do, shoot me an e-mail. I'll have a flat-bed over there and a check for $1,000 bucks in about an hour.

icanoutfishyou

yea.
Well regardless i'm still going to have to wait for that settlement check to come in. I guess I'll probably try to sell the other carb, re-attach the mallory ; or buy a Non-CC distributor, and buy a new 1406 edelbrock

Do you think I should buy a holley? I had contemplated before.. now i'm not sure since i'm going to be doing this again.

Also on my list - fuel pressure regulator.

lol

icanoutfishyou

Can't part with my baby though, i love her too much. (i'm sure you know the feeling)

82-T/A [Work]

Well, what does the ZZ4 motor put out? 275-300 horsepower?

In my opinion, I would just stick with the Edelbrock. The ONLY thing I don't like about the Edelbrock 1406 carburetor is that it's a pain in the *** to hook the transmission, throttle, and cruise control cables up to. You really kind of have to fabricate your own attachments.

Other than that, the 1406 Edelbrock is a GREAT carburetor out of the box.

I'm not sure what they charge for these now, but as far as the distributor goes.... I think you're best bet is to just get yourself a NORMAL vacuum advance non computer controlled HEI distributor. If you want to save money, buy a used one off eBay, and then rebuild it. They're VERY easy to rebuild. You just have to pop out the pin in the shaft and the entire thing comes apart. You clean the leads and replace that little coil thingy around the top of the shaft under where the rotor goes.

I would NOT get a 3701 or 2101 intake unless you plan on going with a QuadraJET replacement... which you CAN do you know. It's a bit more money, but Edelbrock sells rebuild performance replacements for the standard quadrajet. You can get a NON computer controlled one for pretty cheap. Discount Auto Parts / Advance Auto can probably order it for you too.

If you go with the 1406 carb with the electric choke, get the corresponding intake manifold (which is NOT the 3701 / 2101).

If you decide to stick with a QuadraJET, then go with a 3701 or 2101.

I recommend going with the 3701 because it still has the EGR. A lot of people don't realize this, but the EGR is actually beneficial to the motor (it helps cool the piston tops and improves fuel economy. You don't really gain any horsepower whatsoever by removing the EGR setup. Do away with the AIR crap if you can, or if you haven't already.

icanoutfishyou

I already have an edelbrock performer intake on there
It's not a ZZ4 engine, wish it was,
it's only a Goodwrench .. *supposedly* puts out 250.
something like 7.8:1 compression

For a vacuum advance distributor it's $100, i'm willing to cough that up.. It's probably cheaper than getting a mechanic to fix the damn car. I'm estimating a mechanic's help at $1000 +.

any guesses on the fluid on the exhaust manifold?

82-T/A [Work]

Hey, 250hp is MUCH better than 145hp from an LG4, I'm sure we can agree on that!


DAMN!!! $1,000 bucks. Dude, I'll fly there and fix your car for that much.

First things first.... what kind of fluid is it in the exhaust? You said it smells like gasoline? If that's the case, it could be because your carburetor is running your motor extremely rich (which would ALSO be the reason for the hesitation / stumble / dying).

When you purchased the crate motor, it was assembled LONG-BLOCK, right? Were the lifters / pushrods / rocker arms torqued down as well with the proper valve lash (already?). I assume it came with valve covers too.. but it didn't come with an intake manifold, right?

If the fluid looks and smells like coolant, then you're probably dumping coolant directly into one of your intake ports which inevitably ends up in your exhaust.

So long as your OIL doesn't look like a milkshake, your motor is free from damage.

THIS is what I would do (If, for example, your car miraculously ended up on my driveway with the title signed over to me).

I would pull the distributor, the carburetor, all the plug wires, the plugs, and the carburetor.

I would remove the valve covers, inspect for any damage, anything (not that you have any). I would then REMOVE the intake manifold (because of the presence of fluid in your exhaust) and replace the intake manifold gaskets with BRAND NEW gaskets.

The NEXT thing I would do would be to go out and purchase a NON CC HEI distributor. I would open up my Haynes manual for general SBC repair / maintenance (that I bought earlier that day after finding the car in my driveway) and I'd set the motor to 0 degrees TDC. I'd then install the distributor with the rotor pointing to the pin on the cap that I would then use for spark plug 1.

I would then (using the manual) hook up the plug wires and install the new spark plugs one by one (making sure that my spark plug was gapped properly.

NEXT, I would purchase a carburetor. I'd either get a rebuilt Edelbrock or Holley QuadraJET replacement, or I'd go out and buy the 1406 Edelbrock carburetor. (Whichever one works on the Edelbrock Performer, I forget which one that is).

I'd hook up the fuel, line and I'd try to start it.

That's at least what I would do. I know you've done some of those steps already, so you can take from this what you want to / need to.

A good backup for your mechanical fuel pump would be to install one of those little itty bitty cheap Purolator Electric Fuel Pumps. They provide something like 4-6psi of fuel pressure. I use one on my 81 TransAm, and my 73 Volkswagen Transporter. They make excellent pusher pumps (to go in-line before your mechanical pump). You'll have much quicker starts too. I think they sell them for ~$25-30 bucks.


Hope that helps some...

icanoutfishyou

Yep, you're pretty much right, I have done most of that.

The fluid isn't in the exhaust, it's dripping down the side of it. Gaskets are new.
Pulled the valve covers, checked already. Everything is mint. new gaskets too.

Oil is fine, has gas in it from the old carb leaking through the gasket & into the cylinders.

Set TDC 100 times it seems..lol
I'm just gonna have to buy the carb and Non-CC distributor and take a gamble. If it doesn't work then I'm completely baffled..
that's pretty much where i've been. I just didn't understand why it wouldn't run.