jrg77

I am thinking about a GM crate 350. I have a LG4. I need to spend about $450 to get the carb rebuilt and tuned on my '85 Camaro so I can drive while saving for the 350. Will my carb, intake, etc. work on the 350?

Thanks,
Jason

rhuarc31

450 bucks to rebuild your carburetor? dude you're getting ripped off. It's a 2 hour job (maybe 2.5, can't remember the exact book rate). If your gonna spend that kind've money, buy carb and junk the ccc, it'll be cheaper. Even at dealership rates it shouldn't be more than a couple hundred. Buy doug roe's book for 20 bucks, buy the rebuild kit from autozone for 25, and do it yourself. Hell I usually charge 75 if you pull it, 100 if i do, plus parts and if I pull it and install it I can usually get it done in right at 2 hours, including adjustments.

But yes, the intake etc will swap from a 305 to a 350.

Hell for 450 you could buy a used but running 350 or a tpi set up if you shop around.

jrg77

Good thing I posted that info.

The guy said that he modifies them so they can be tuned with out taking them off of the car. He said he adds some bronze bushings and opens them up so they flow more cfm. The one he showed me had places on the sides that looked freshly machined in relation to the rest of the carb. It had little screws where he said he could adjust it. The guy supposedly has a dyno in back, so I may have assumed that he would do basic tuning on it.

When I got the car I had to take it to an emissions shop so I could get it to pass. The guy there said it was junk, and that some throttle something or other was sticking. He took it off because he said it might make the throttle stick. I have not noticed a difference either way. I would like to know what the piece was that he pitched.

So you figure a book, Autozone, and I could rebuild the carb? I've heard that they are really hard to tune, and from that I assumed that they would be even harder to rebuild. Add to that all those little hoses that I have NO clue about, and I thought professional help was advised.

I was thinking about a used 350. Most of those I saw in trucks had TBI. I am just wondering how to not get screwed and get one with a cracked block.

Thanks for the info,
Jason

hydric

screw that...

You can get a demon carb from summit for that kind of money, like 259 I think they are now...

With the left over, maybe get a new intake..

rhuarc31

Yes you can do it yourself. The mod's the guy is talking about are way to much for the two engines you are talking about. The bushings are to repair worn throttle shafts, you can get a vacuum leak there, you can make your own like shown here.
https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=206860

The book is "Rochester Carburetors" written by Doug Roe, published by HP Books.
Also check out these links.
http://www.500cid.com/mts/tech/Quad.htm
https://www.thirdgen.org/newdesign/tech/quadrajet.shtml
http://www.carbs.net/quadrajet.asp
http://www.quadrajetcarburetors.com/
https://www.thirdgen.org/newdesign/tech/rods.shtml

Also, as for the vacuum lines, 1. the trick is too use masking tape and a sharpie to label them where you take them off the carb, then it's a snap to put them back on. 2. most of that crap can actually come off. 3. you'd have to do it to swap in a 350 anyway.

And like the man said, you can buy an aftermarket carb, and an intake for what that guy was gonna charge you to rebuild one carb. Shop around you may be able to get a carb, intake, and cam for that. shop around for a 350 you can hear run and take compression checks on and you should be able to get it with the carburetor on it and save all that trouble for the same money. Hell I bought a complete fresh olds 455 complete pan to carb for $325.

jrg77

From what the guy told me I could not change the carb unless I changed the distibutor and a bunch of other stuff because it is electronic and the other carbs are mechanical. He also said it would be easier to start if I kept the electronics, especially in colder months. I wasn't trying go nutso on upgrades yet. I am just trying to get the thing running right. I am more or less satisfied with its performance for what I've spent so far. Unless I need it to keep the 305 together I would rather wait and spend it on the 350. There are enough differences that I don't want to get to excited yet.

Jason,

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

That sounds like non-CC stuff.

What has convinced you that this carb needs to be rebuilt? Most of the time, the problems blamed on the carb are caused by something else.

He's right about the CC carb being a good driver carb, though. I've put 37k+ miles on mine in 4 years of daily driving (160k on it now), and the only thing I've done to the carb is adjust it - and then only when something else was done. It just sailed through emissions testing Monday.

jrg77

What is a cc carb?

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

"Computer controlled".

Unless the car was delivered in Canada, that's what 3rd gen carbs were from the factory.

83_1/2 L69

Hey jrg77,
This mechanic is trying to rip you off. The stock CC carb is SUPER EASY TOO TUNE. All you have to do is:
1) Start the car.
2) Drive it untill the motor warms up.
3) Do some stop and go driving for about 1/2 hour.

If all the sensors and the computer are working correctly, the COMPUTER tunes the CARB perfectly for operation at idle all the way to 70% throttle.
Above 70% throttle, you can adj the "air valve" spring tension or change to differant "secondary metering rods". Both of these can be done from the out side of the carb.
All you need to do to make this carb work on a 350 is change the metering rods. The computer will re-tune the carb.
Change the computer chip for more ignition timing that a 350 likes, the 305's knock too easy, so they use less timing.

Read Jester's thread at the top of the board, then ask us questions.

jrg77

I went to Pep Boys and saw the rebuild kit was $35.00. I will have one with next week's check.

IROCmenace

iTrader: (1)

Dude; here is a suggestion; go to Autozone and buy a Remanufactured Comp Cont Carb. You get a warranty, a Carb that is as good as new and you save alot of trouble; they are usually around $270. I did to my L69 and it made a big difference.
If you rebuild at the ouse, among the other stuff you will need a vat of cleaning fluid to soak it in and that may not get all of it. Plus buyig a new one would save you 5 years of brain cells


I feel your pain; I hate emission testing; if I didn't have it in my county I would go with a regular Carb; but no.... My politicians need to pay for their Escaladw's.....

jrg77

I have a parts washer so that is not a big deal. I will still probably purchase one, and learn on my old one. I bought the Doug Roe book so I'll probably have that done soon.
The thing I am beginning to dislike is that one can have all this electrnoic programmable engine management stuff and STILL not pass with fuel injection. Seat of the pants can generally indicate if the car is going fatser, but no nose is calibrated to NOx and CO2. That carb guy has a dyno, but no exhaust analyzer. One would think that would go part and parcel with tuning for power in an emissions county.
So here's the plan (I think).

1. Replace the carb.
2. Get a dual plane intake with an EGR valve.
3. Run that and save for a 350/4 bolt main/1 piece rear seal block.
4. Get a forged crank and 6.000 rods.
5. Get forged 10:1 pistons sized for 4.03 bore.
6. Get AFR heads with hydra-rev.
7. Find a cam and hydraulic rollers.
8. Figure out how to put it all together.
9. Take out the 305.
10. Put in the carb 350.
11. Break the motor in gently.
12. End up breaking the trans.
13. Save up for a T56.
14. Move to a non-emissions county.
15. Save for fuel injection.
16. Save for forced induction.
17. Break 9 bolt.
18. Save for Strange 12 bolt.

I figure this is a nice 4 year plan that allows me to drive the car most of the time, right?

Anything missing?

mrt89rs

i dont' know where you live at but in az you don't need no egr to pass imissions. i think you need to find out exctly what you need to pass imissions where you live, befor you diced what you want to buy.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Some areas in AZ do need EGR to pass visual, at least. If the sniffer checks for NOx, you're better off having it, too. Plus, EGR is a zero-cost item from a performance perspective. Finally, if you stay with CC (a very good idea for a driver), it's much happier with a functioning EGR.

mrt89rs

where in az? i know that only pheonix and tucson have to go throw emissions in the state of az.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

I've been told by those in the Phoenix area that they have visual.

But, I've been wrong/mislead before...

mrt89rs

we do have visual but we don't have to have to have an egr in your car just needs emissions equipment and cats

jrg77

My goal is to pass the sniffer. I don't think they are going to make me pop the hood. They didn't this time and my thorw out bearing was tweeting like a brd. they chalked it up to noise under my car, and made me sign a liability waiver.

Are you telling me that you don't need all of the emission control devices attached to the car to pass?

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

The old "probe-up-the-tailpipe" is not very sophisticated. If the car is running clean and the cat is in good shape, you're likely to pass that type of test.

A fresh tune-up, fresh oil change, good cat, will most likely get you through. A functioning A.I.R. system improves your chances. EGR affects NOx, which isn't measured by tailpipe probes (that I've seen, anyway - between CA & CO).

jrg77

I went to the car and pulled my Vehicle Inspection Report.

HC CO NOx
Standards: 2.00 30.00 3.00
Readings: 1.72 19.50 0.77
Results: Pass PASS N/A

Is it safe to say the test procedures won't become more strict?
I figure as long as I can make these numbers, show cats underneathe, and they don't change the rule and start looking under the hood I can pass.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Hmmm, NOx results "N/A", even though they have a standard and a reading. Very interesting. Is this a probe, or a hose they put over the tailpipe?

If they don't get stricter (no clue if that would happen - it has here), and NOx remains "N/A", one would think you'll be able to pass.

jrg77

They put a hose over each tailpipe.

jrg77

How did they become more strict? Did you have to change anything?

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Hose over the tailpipe is the more sophisticated type.

When Colorado first implemented the enhanced testing, they deliberately allowed higher emissions across the board to give the public a chance to get their cars up to snuff (and to lessen the outcry against the system). After people had been through a couple of testing cycles, or had gotten a newer car, they started bringing the requirements back down to the original standards imposed on the factory by the EPA. My full size '84 Chevy van was one "victim" of that on its 2nd time to be tested. Although it was producing the same numbers as it did the first time, it failed the 2nd time when it passed the 1st time.

NOx may be one they crack down on in your case.

jrg77

Ah HA.

Well at least I knw where the standard is. Is there a way to get the OEM standards?

mrt89rs

'

wtf? what does an oil change have to do with emissions?


all i have on my car are the air tubes and the and the air pump. they are not fuctional and i also donot have a cat it's just a strait pipe with heat shields that make it look like cats not to mention that fact that i put a cam on my car and i have a holley carb on it and i passed emissions with out a problem. emissions is all about how your car is tuned and that you have a cat and something that resembles an air system. well at least in arizona.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Oil plays a big part in sealing combustion. Clean oil does it better. And, yes, it can make a difference.