Justin93

Hey everyone, im looking to upgrade my system and will be purchasing all brand new parts.

This includes but is not secluded to:
- 4x6's Suggestions?
- 6x9's Suggestions?
- 2 10's



I would like to build a clean, setup with the ability to tremble at the convenience of a few clicks up of the volume **** yet retain clarity.

let me start by listing the two alpine amps i currently have installed.

Alpine MRV-F303 4/3/2/ channel Amp.
I have this powering my fathers dual 10's MTX.. not sure on the rating of those subs are.
Interested in either JBL or Alpine for the subs. And i know people say mono amp is better but i bridged this @ 2 ohms through the voice coils.. it sounds alright but i wan't some thump out my trunk. Suggestions ? prefer to keep my pops amps but wouldn't mind investing in new equipment IF it would produce any SIGNIFICANT changes and competition grade sound.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Alpine-V12-MRV-F303-4-3-2-Channel-Amplifier-/251295610309?pt=Car_Amplifiers&vxp=mtr&hash=item3a8262b5c5another link with specs..
http://vault.alpine-usa.com/products...M_MRV-F303.PDF

And for my Speakers, im running an Alpine MRV-F405 4/3/2 channel amplifier.
http://amp-performance.de/413-Alpine-MRV-F405.html


I would like to get Quality Speakers and a pair of subs to mate what amps im currently running.
I know that Alpine/JBL produce some GREAT stuff, i like to stick by those two companies but if there is another option available by all means please share

There are a few speakers i've seen around such as.. but not limited to:
Alpine SPS-406 4x6's - which will fit with the plastic adapter they provide.
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-V9ekGX5...e-SPS-406.html

Apline SPS-619 3 way speakers
I don't stay up to date with todays speakers and quality, im more of a mechanical guy.
Im willing to drop under 500$ on a full set of quality components that will operate/integrate at its full potential.

I want it done RIGHT not half assed and with the OPTIMAL parts for what i have.
I would prefer to keep the amps to stay at my budget so suggestions of what i CAN do would also be appreciated.

I know there's tons of people out there that understand this and eat/sleep sound systems.

Hopefully someone with experience and compassion can better appoint me in the right direction because everytime i turn i pull a homer simpson and



Any and all information shared will be greatly appreciated!

SwizzyPlz

You have a pretty good start with those type s alpines. Although I don't really like coaxals for your budget they should be a great buy. Here's a cart I put together for you but its a hair off your budget.

Front stage: https://www.sonicelectronix.com/item...e-SPS-406.html

Rear stage: https://www.sonicelectronix.com/item...e-SPS-619.html

Sub: https://www.sonicelectronix.com/item...-11P2D412.html

I'm sorry but I don't think there is any saving your old amp you used with your sub's. That being said the sub I listed above should give you great output for the price. Pairing that with https://www.sonicelectronix.com/item...nce-1300a.html or maybe this clarion but I don't know that brand that well. https://www.sonicelectronix.com/item...on-XR2120.html

HU: https://www.sonicelectronix.com/item...C-BT852HD.html this head unit should be enought to power the coaxals well my friend has a pair of type s alpines pair to a Kenwood hu with a similar (if not identical) internal amp and they sound great! Also ordering the hu from sonic electronics will get you the dash kit and harness for free. You can use that 4 channel amp for your front and rear instead of hu power but thats up to you.

This all comes out to about $515 but you still need wiring for the amp(s) fuses fuse holders ring terminals etc. That might be another $50ish but I think you will be very happy with it.

Also what are you putting the sub in, where will it be located and what kind of music do you listen to? This helps me figure out what enclosure is right for you. Any other questions just feel free to ask.

Justin93

Whats your reasoning for not liking Coaxials? What would you prefer over Coaxials?

Those alpine Type- S speakers were just examples, I would like to get the best speaker quality and clarity as i listen to mostly Electronic, Old School, Classical, UG Hip-hop, Country and occasionally ill throw on some gangsta rap haha.

As for the head unit im using right now: would this be suitable or.. ?
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...en-HD5313.html

my subs are in an enclosure fiber glass then carpeted, its tucked in the rear cargo hatch and sinks right in to the bottom of the trunk. It was made for my year camaro as many other members have them as well: http://www.google.com/search?q=91+ca...2F%3B749%3B562

As for all the little parts, terminals, connectors, Wires, Fuse amps ill worry about that when i get it finalized from the options available.. i also wont cheap out on that section as i want to have everything operating together to its full potential.

Now do you personally have any experience with any of the products you've sent me? If not what might you be running in your third gen ?

Appreciate the response

Reid Fleming

iTrader: (2)

The SPS 406 (4x6) are S series for the dash. They're a good fit as most other companies don't really fit that well in the dash. Alpine doesn't make an R series for the dash.

For the rear, skip the S series and go for the R series. SPR-69 (6x9)

SwizzyPlz

Components are better than coaxals because of the out board crossovers. But they also take up more space (also very hard to find a place to install in our cars) and not everyone(most people) don't hear or even care about the difference. You can use your current hu but if you buy comps then your hu will most likely be bottlenecking them. Anything nice comes with a price especially audio equipment. And no I haven't personally heard anything I showed you but I have heard or have had similar. I have no system in my GTA (yet) because of all the complications that are involved.

You can get this amp https://www.sonicelectronix.com/item...e-R750-1D.html with a pair of these 10s https://www.sonicelectronix.com/item...-11P1S410.html so you'll be able to keep your encloser

SwizzyPlz

I don't think there is any benefit to the type r's because he is using an old 4 channel amp and/or the hu he linked to power them

Justin93

So that subwoofer is good at 4 ohms and has an RMS power rating of 250 watts.. That amplifier you linked has an RMS power rating of 4 ohms: 250 watts x 1 chan though..

What would this result into ? with the amplifiers RMS Power @ 4 ohms 400 watts x 1 channels ? The subwoofers can only take 4 ohms: @ 250 Watts RMS power handling?

And how are these rockford fosgates uphold in todays car audio ? i mean i heard they made some GREAT stuff back in the day but what they are producing out now isn't quite up to par as what they used to make. Might not make sense, but i've heard it from a few places that they diminished in production quality.

Let me better put it as I don't want to shoot down all potential equipment, but would rather hear the quality aspects of the product.
I mean im sure alpine can better uphold there value then rockford fosgate then again i'm a mechanical guy more then audio when it comes to cars but could certainly use some enlightening on the ideal setups and what they require from each other, do we go by RMS power RATING or RMS power ?... i was confused when i read that so hopefully someone can better explain how this 'setup' would work all together.

If i did decide to get the new HU as well i would love to get a nice bluetooth wireless and usb ipod compatibly with aux or sirius/xm availabilities. Not sure of how the hu powers the rest of the speaker/car audio such as it claiming '22 watts x 4 channels RMS power output' how would this impact the setup? if someone can explain that would

SwizzyPlz

Your hu has a small amp inside along with a sound processor and other things. You can use the hu amp to power your speakers or an external amp. My friend has a kenwood with 22w per chan and so do I. They are great hu that have great dsp's and power out put without spending $500 on just the hu. And Idk who told you that Rockford isn't good anymore they are a great brand probably better than alpine and any Rockford set up I've heard was very nice(I've had Rockford and alpine stuff too). As for the amp and sub situation the amp puts out 250@4, 500@2, 750@1. The sub's I linked you are single 4 ohm. Ohms are a measurement Of resistance like back pressure in a water pipe. If you think of it that way you can imagine now that wiring both sub's in parallel You will bring the ohm load to 2, less back pressure lets you "pump" 500w out (250 to each)

I know this can be over whelming and hard to understand as a went through it my self so any other question just ask!

Justin93

Ok so ill start with the subwoofer and ohms topic.

So if we wire them in parallel from a 4 ohm amplifier, wire it in parallel with both subs to the amp that would bring the ohms to 2 correct?
And at 2 ohms how will this affect the subwoofer power output? example the setup you sent me both the rockford fosgate amp and subs.
how would that make the power output the subs are making to be 250w each (500 total) when it says the amplifier RMS power rating is 2 ohms: 500 watts x 1 chan.
? is this amplifier 2 ohm stable?

so as we lower impedance (ohms) from 4 to 2.. the power generally doubles if ran through a parallel wiring setup for the subs. However, the generated Power Wattage you would see on the rockford amplifier example, would be 500 watts@2 ohms DIVIDED BETWEEN YOUR SPEAKERS/SUB WIRED IN PARALLEL = 250 watts EACH which amounts to the 2 ohms load @ 500 watts TOTAL.
Is this a 2 ohm stable amp? is that hard on any of the components or is it a perfect match; speaking of terms of the amp and sub combo u provided.

I think im getting it but any discrepancies we should definetly clear up as i don't want to confuse myself over it.

appreciate the sharing of knowledge swizzy, thanks man im eager to learn and can distinguish series from parallel but need some assurance of how the power gets transferred from ohm load to wattage and if that is the goal wattage you want to match to your RMS power handling of your subwoofers/or speakers your seeking to wire. given the situation that we will be wiring in parallel.

Hopefully i didn't confuse you swizzy just trying to get my thoughts across the board so i can get some criticism of the actual function rather then speculation of how it works.

SwizzyPlz

yeah I think you got it. The amp is stable from 4-1 ohms so running it at 2 ohms is somewhat babying it. And the sub's will probably see a little less than 250w each so as long as you set your gains and crossovers correctly you should be good to go in the bass department

Justin93

Cool! Sounds like the subwoofer and amp combination seems like a solid route.
Is there any other room for further speaker and head unit combination?

I read earlier that you say you don't like coaxials, why's that?
And if so what would be the next step up from what we have listed?

Also if im running the mono block amp in parallel to the subs @ 2 ohms, would this create a less clear output than say running it at 4 ohms? 1 Ohm?

Lastly, Is there even a need to have a separate amp boosting the speakers ? I say this in comparison to having a head unit that matches the speaker setup.

If so could you shed some light on what to look for to match every component/equipment . mostly in the headunit to speaker aspect.

Thanks again swizzy, you've helped me alot your the man!!


Here's a current list of what we have right now.

Head unit - http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...C-BT852HD.html

4x6 speakers - http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...e-SPS-406.html

6x9 speakers - http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...e-SPS-619.html

Mono Block Amp - http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...d=scsho3608109

10" Subwoofers - http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...-11P2D412.html

jwfirebird

iTrader: (2)

the use of a 4ch amp for the fronts sort of depends on what kind of music you listen to and what is important. if its rap you wont likely care for more than the HU hooked to the speakers. i like to listen to rock, new and classic, loud. so i have two 10 in. kicker subs in custom sealed boxes. polk 6x9's and polk 6.5s. (this is in my daily) i had a clarion pro 845mc HU powering the speakers directly and seemed good but eventually i tried putting a 50wrms per ch amp on them and its a very significant difference. the sound is alot more clear and full and distortion free at louder levels.

i would say dont worry about it for now its not that difficult to add later, unless rock is mostly all you listen to. the rms output of the HU you want is only half of the 4x6 power and like 25% of what the 6x9's would want. what type of box are you going to use?

Justin93

I have this amplifier currently powering my speakers - http://amp-performance.de/413-Alpine-MRV-F405.html

Sounds like ill be looking for a second amp for a clean speaker setup. I listen to alot of classical, rock, electronic and i like all of it loud and just as clear on the lower volume.

So if im using an amp to power the subs, and an amp to power the speakers.
How would the hu effect anything else?.. What should i look for in a head unit any special features like built in cross over etc,..

Like i said, im not to familiar with new car audio products and what todays technology has - im just looking for a clean combination of car audio equipment that will operate well together and perform just as clear on 40 as it does on 10.


I have a custom enclosure made for my camaro, dual 10's that fit snug in the trunk cargo area.
Did you make your own plates for the polk audio 6.5's ? If so do you have any pictures or elaborate how you made the fit ?

How do you like them too?
Maybe some links of the system your running would help me get a better idea of what i'll need to look for to get a input - output matted audio system.

jwfirebird

iTrader: (2)

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...ion-CZ702.html

this is the closest to what i have. you want six 4 or 5v rca's and you want good rca's run opposite of your power and ground wires. for the best clarity you will want to run your own 18g speaker wire to each speaker too. this is all in my daily driver monte carlo. ive tried to keep my firebird light. the monte has stock separate 6.5 and tweeter in the door and i just put the polk stuff in the stock holes. the polk sound good for highs, but sound best when accompanied by 6x9's to fill a little more mid and obviously intended to be accompanied by subs

http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/...f/7-7-11-8.jpg
http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/...f/7-7-11-7.jpg
http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/...f/7-7-11-6.jpg
http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/...f/7-7-11-5.jpg
http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/...f/7-7-11-4.jpg
http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/...f/7-7-11-9.jpg
http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/...2112033-00.jpg
http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/...ird/313-06.jpg

SwizzyPlz

Justin93, I'm a little confused with your goals now. You now have a total of $625 not including the installation hardware. What exactly are you willing to spend because you can buy way better stuff than what we have talked about earlier. It really comes down to what you want to spend.

Also I think you will be happier with a pair of these 10s than the rockford ones. http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...nce-1060W.html

Justin93

I think i would be happier with the infinitis as i don't want to replace my box (or cut) for a 12" sub. Im more interested in upgrading the cars drive train then sw size.

They seem pretty affordable but honestly i've never seen in my family or friends vehicles any infinity hardware so im unsure of the quality and longevity of the product?

The Lead IT guy at my work recommended RF's all the way as he's a big fan and component speakers quality are superb to coaxials but what price range would be looking at to get a nice setup of component speakers?
Seperate drivers and cross overs allow better dispersement of the frequency wave lengths. I would love to get some and take the extra time to mount the drivers and install, does anyone have any component speakers in there vehicle?

Suggestions of speakers in 4x6 and 6x9 ?..

I won't mind getting a RF as they have a bass **** provided most of the time to give me a little bit more control over the output accordingly to what type of music im listening to in the moment.

At this point swizzy, i don't want to confuse anyone. Im not secluded to alpine, and im not saying i WONT go with component speakers but if there's a good set for a good price that i can match with a well priced/quality amplifier then i would love to do that so i can get each section of sound with seperate drivers/cross overs for clarity.
Afterall that's what i was talking about was a nice blend of clarity and power.

I don't want to switch up the route, in fact i like what we had selected but if there's room for better component speakers (specially since our cars use the tiny 4x6's and the 6x9's mostly mids) i feel it would produce a world of a difference in sound.

Im a multi track producer and use several DAW's from Logic, Reason, NI VST's etc, however i find it slightly ironic that i'm not as knowledgable as i should be in the car audio scene
You've helped me understand alot though swizzy so i appreciate it and your timely responses!
Hope to hear back from you guys soon thanks again for all the info and help

jwfirebird

iTrader: (2)

if you get a decent hu you dont need *****. everything is done from the hu. i can adjust slopes and individual gains for the separate front rear and sub outputs. the hu is the most important part to me because if its signal is crap the amp amplifies crap and the speakers play crap

Justin93

What hu are you using currently?

I could only adjust all of the speakers with the essential treble, mid, bass, and eq settings mine is quite minimal compared to all the settings yours has..
I was cruising in my third gen last night and the front 4x6's were really playing Sh**** :/

If i upgrade the Head unit, in my eyes, i should upgrade everything.

I don't want to pick n' choose as i go, i want to install it and forget it as ill be pulling my 305 and dropping in a crate motor, t56 ford 9" custom drive shaft and the LAST thing i want to dic* around with is speakers because i already have 48 hour weeks 5 day weekdays so i try to make my weekends count.

Any links of good HU youd recommed jwfirebird?
I have a 10" enclosure and im not planning on getting a 12" so my sub setup is restricted to just a 10" setup. I've heard there is a head unit with component speaker packages too.. are these also available?

im just not to involved in the car audio scene i guess

jwfirebird

iTrader: (2)

i have a 501 but htat isnt sold anymore but like i said above the 702 is the one with the closest specs.
not sure about the packages, i imagine not there are so many opinions on whats good and whats bad and what you need and dont. it depends on so much it would be difficult to put together a package that most would like. for example just in the hu i wanted good bluetooth and a good aux/usb ports because all i listen to is mp3s from my phone or thumbdrive and xm. others may listen to alot of radio or want hd. i dont even remember if i hooked my antenna up.

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...ion-CZ501.html

Justin93

So i spoke to a tech advisor on crutchfield, actually quite a few of them lol.

Anyways of course there prices were exceeding what i wanted to pay but i did cross reference and found the total to come out $756.87 Through ebay and with warranties.

For technical purposes i will be supplying the crutchfield links as they have all the technical data.
I would LOVE to hear you guys thoughts and opinions also suggestions on this setup!

Here are the links!
Headunit : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_500CDE1...CDE-147BT.html
4x6 Dash speakers : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_136TR40...TR400-CXi.html
6x9 Rear speakers : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_136TR69...ml#details-tab
Speaker Amplifier : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_500MRPF...-MRP-F300.html
Sub woofers : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_13610WX...v2.html?tp=111
Mono block sub Amp : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_500MRPM...00.html?tp=115

As far as installation hardware goes they also recommended these
Installation Kit : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_1204DAK...ation-Kit.html

Antenna Adapter : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_12040GM...a-Adapter.html

Receiver Wire Harness : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_1207018...e-Harness.html

Chevrolet Dash Receiver : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_1209230...eiver-Kit.html

8g Amplifier wiring kit : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_211ZN3K...3-ZN3K-08.html

T-Spec 4-Channel RCA Patch Cable :http://www.crutchfield.com/p_120RCA1...tch-Cable.html

Posi-Products Car Stereo Connectors : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_669PP50...onnectors.html

Pro.Fit Trim Panel Tool : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_042DM40...anel-Tool.html

Stinger PRO Series 16-gauge Speaker Wire : http://www.crutchfield.com/p_541SPW5...aker-Wire.html

Obviously i don't want to cheap out on my wiring equipment but also i don't want to over pay or for anything i don't need.

I believe i have alot of this Stinger pro wiring at home as i bought them prior such as speaker,sub wires and also a distribution block all new.

I would like to hear your guys opinions and thoughts of both categories.

Hope to hear back from you guys soon!

jwfirebird

iTrader: (2)

those install kits are expensive. all you need is one run of 2 or 4 with a fuse at the battery, then you can use a dist block to step the wire size down at the back to what the individual amps need. then 3 decent rca cables, and some 16 or 18g from amps to speakers, and one 14g for amp turn on two if you want to wire the amp and sub turn on separate, well my hu will i assume the alpine will

Justin93

Yeah there VERY expensive.

This is what i have from previous purchases, let me know if any of it is applicable to this setup.

What would the necessities to power these to its best operating efficiency require?.. AWG sizes, all that good stuff please leave your suggestions and advice, thanks







RCA's

jwfirebird

iTrader: (2)

that dist block will have to be used in the back, you will need a 2guage fuse and fuse holder by the battery and run one 2 gauge to the back. fuses for those amps would be the sum of the two so one is 60 and one is 50 so your fuse needs to be around 110. or you can put that dist block in the front by the battery and run two separate 8ga circuits to the back. with fuses rated the same as the fuses on the amps. those rca cables should be fine. you will need some wire to go for the amp turn on and speaker wire to go from the amps to the speakers. some 8guage for grounds. depending on how you run the primary power could need 8 to go to the dist block in the back and 2 to go to the front or no 2 and two runs of 8 to the front.