Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

Ok, In your opinion how bad are these floors and would you reccomend Entire Floor pan replacement, or just patching it with sheet metal. I would like to know how hard is it for someone to do this, Who is mechanically inclinded.There basically is no driver side floor, But let me know Because i got a quote of 2,500 bucks to get them done at a restoration place.I think thats a little expensive.So im thinking about doing this myself. So guys thank you for looking, and let me get your opinions every opinion matters to me. Thanks again.




passenger side floor pan is 1st picture. Drivers side is the 2nd picture.

2007xl50

Not sure of the cost, i never do floors, if a car needs floors i dont get or keep the car. I would say you need a whole new floor, not just patches to do it right, my god thats bad, i mean all i see it carpet. If it was mine it would be parted out or a doner car then scrap the rest.

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Being a unibody car, the floor is the frame.

Would take a lot of work and very skilled metalworking to repair it and be up to factory quality.

Price sounds about right.

If it were me, I would look for a more solid shell and swap your good parts over.

Thats a ton of work on a car that will not be worth a lot.

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

Finnaly, i get some opinions, I know its alot of work. But to find another 92 formula 5 speed with rear disc, triple black,with t tops,and all the other options, for a good price is a challenge. But the winters have destoyed this car, it was my daily driver for a long time. I have alot of money invested in this car. But thats what im debating, is it worth it to do it,knowing the rest of the car needs everything else. And to think in 2006, the only rust on the entire car was the door.I mean even sentimental value has a price.lol So the votes so far is that it isnt worth it ok. Keep these opinions coming guys. lol

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Thats why I said find a shell, doesn't matter if it has the options, buy a solid roller shell, and swap your drivertrain and interior over. It would be easyier then replacing the floors if you are not a body man.

I understand the sentimental value, if its really that high, then save up the coin and pay a body shop to do it.

If you have never done major body repair, this is not the palce to start.

psychedelic_leg

I know a lot of people are saying to scrap the car, don't keep it, etc. But if it has value to you, don't scrap it. Your floors aren't half as bad as mine were. in fact your floors look pretty solid other than the rusty parts and hole in drivers side. in my car thre was literally no floor left, except center and the area under the front seats. I was gonna buy the floors online but I went to a junkyard and got a whole clean floor for 200 or 300 dollz. I cut out patches and welded it in flush with cut out area and looks great. If you want to replace entire floor, do one side at a time. As for welding, just use MIG weld because it will make the whole process go a lot faster and cleaner and you wont burn through the floor. Oh and one thing that I didn't do as well.. make sure you clean off the paint and seam sealer where you are going to be welding. Else you'll be breathing out the seam sealer days later, rofl. Oh and be careful around the fuel lines, and don't rivet the floors in, you will have to redo them, welding is the right way to do these things. just remove seats console carpet and maybe the dash (I didn't remove mine, but that was a bad mistake, I suggest removing it) and you're good to go, a few days of prepping, cutting, welding, sealing, and protecting will be worth it.

I was in the same situation except my car had rusty quarter panels and wheel Wells were shot. and the fenders rusty on the bottom. everyone told me to throw it away, my bud that that works on car bodies told be to part it out (rofl). nope, I put in rust free floors, mini tubs, and I'm finishing up the quarter panels and it will look like new soon. plus actually restoring a car rather than junking it makes your car mean a lot more to you than just getting a shell. i feel a lot more satisfied getting the experience of restoring a car and having a car i brought back from the dead rather than buying a complete car with no work needs. but hey its up to you man
yea my text is pretty bad coz I'm writing this from my phone, oh and If you think your floors are bad just search rusted out floors on these forums, people diy'd some nasty *** floors before and it can be done. you just need to have the will and the motivation to do it

T/Aperformance

I personally would replace the floor and remove all the rust. And after its done I would bit an undercoating of some sort like maybe spray on bed coating on both the underside and the interior. This way it will last a long time.
Those that say junk the car maybe to afraid of doing something like this, Or they just want one less third gen out here, Your car can be saved and in my opinion it should be.

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

Its good to see so many people telling me to save this. Due to my inexperience with body work im going the restoration place tommarow to get a 2nd opinion about the entire car. It will be saved if I have anything to say about it. This car took me to high school, college,everything else. It deserves to be my wedding ride in 10 years lol or so lol

83RecaroTA

I was in the same boat as you. I saved money for 3 years to fix my floor. Last year this time my car was just going into the shop and had the full floor cut out of it. Once they tore into it they found that the firewall extensions were completely rotted away. We did not realize just how much fab had to be done until they got into it. They did quite a bit of work to it and it ended up coming out to 3.2k but to me it was worth every dime. I feel I should point out the importance of having a competent person doing the work. My car was done at my friends shop and I was comfortable that this was within their area of expertise. A lot of shops primarily do collision work. I wouldn't give my car to a shop like that, That is provided they are even willing to touch it. As others have stated the floor of these cars is a major structural component. If you were to try and cut the entire thing out at once the car would fold in on itself. If everything isnt properly welded it will lead to problems later on. Try to find a shop with a good local reputation for doing body work on old cars. A good place to inquire is at local car shows. When mine got done we decided to reuse the original transmission tunnel section. They cut out the lower pans and replaced them 1 side at a time. This left 2/3 of the floor in the car at all times. This worked for mine but I have seen others around here go as far as to weld in metal bracing to ensure none of the geometry changes. I could have taken the 3.2k and found a cleaner car to start with and swapped my parts onto it. Heck at one point I was even stopping on the side of the road looking under ones with for sale signs in them but I realized that every bird i could find needed expensive work one way or another and at the end of the day id rather have my car. The ones that were hit, the ones that needed motors, the ones that the paint was shot on etc. at the end of the day it would not have been the same car and it would not have been a real recaro trans am. This particular one was in my family since 85', Has never been in an accident to date and has sentimental value. Anyway the point I am getting at is if its something you want to and you have the money then go for it. Just think about it and weigh the costs of what the car needs vs replacement vs how long you want to spend working on it so you don't have any regrets later on.

6SIX6

iTrader: (35)

Its true it is bad but if your willing to put the time and effort into doin them go for it. Worst comes to worse you end up screwing it up and gettin a pro to do it. So if you do it its the cost of a driver pan and some sheet metal for the passenger side. Few hundred bucks and your time with a welder. I say go for it and do it up. My 85 was WAY WORSE and i fixed it and it lasted awhile till I found a cleaner shell as more rust kept popping up and it was too much to keep up with. Go luck and let us know what you decide

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Lets look at what this will take to get fixed.


First the car needs to be up in the air, so that means a lift, rotisorrie or good jack stands, and lots of time on your back.

Next, ALL the interior needs to be removed, including wiring, or atl east move and protect wiring.

Fuel tank and lines must be removed, as well as driveshaft, brake lines, torque arm, and probably the rear end. Tranmission should be removed as well.

Then you must cut all and beyond the rust out.

At this point you will see if there are any inner rockers left, lets hope so.

By this point you should have new floor pans on hand to make sure you don't cut too far.

Once its all trimmed to fit, you can the begin spot welding the floor in with a good mig welder.

You will probably have to cut the seat mounts and console mounts off the old floor and weld them to the new as well.

Once its all welded up, you can then seal, prime and paint all the new metal and beyond.

Then you can begin reassembly.

Makes that $2500 quote sound pretty good huh?

Of course you can skip some of these steps, but you run the risk of catching your car on fire or worse, or end up with a poor installation and a car that breaks in half.

As I stated before, if you have that much sentimental value in the car, go ahead, if you have $2500. Make sure you get it in righting, and be prepared for your car to be gone for a real long time, body shop purgetory is a real place. Expect that quote to climb as work begins.


Or as I suggested, go find a solid shell, you can probably find on for less then a grand and swap your stuff over.


If you do not have experience with sheet metal replacement and welding, this is not a project ot learn on.

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

BTW, I noticed in your second pic, your inner rocker looks pretty rough.

Thats not good. I am not sure if they reproduce that yet, but that needs to be replaced with solid metal. Think of it as the frame rail to your car. Very important part of the structural intergrity of the car.

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

No, they don't make one yet. You would have to find a clean one at a junkyard which around here, there either wrecked or rotted. So I went to the restoration place today he said, even with sentimental value its not worth having it done. It needs Entire floor, Wheel wells,Quarter panel.He said it would be just for the floors now, because he saw them last year. Now the quote is 3k to start and he said he will find soo much other stuff while doing the floors that the price could go up to 6k. I have a lot of sentimental value in this car but not 6k worth. lol . For 2k more you can find a grand national lol So at the moment I don't know what im doing, I must think about this or a replacement, or something else. Its kinda a bummer because cash doesn't grow on trees. This firebird could be approaching retirement. Or keep it for 10 years until I have the cash to do it. Which in ten years I don't know what it will look like. lol

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Start looking for a solid shell, they are out there. If you really want a 3rd gen.


Otherwise, part it out and save up for a GN, if thats your thing.

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

I agree, there is probably more rust hiding.


People think what they see is it, but if what you see is this bad, like the body man said, the wheel well, quarters, toe boards, rockers, etc.. are probably getting close too.

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

Yes its a lot of work and a lot of money to bring her back. I test drove a 1986 buick grand nat back in 2009. I fell in love immediately. I would highly recommend any1 to at least drive one. Too bad the price tags on them are soo expensive.

Sudsy

Aww this thread is heart breaking to me lol. I am doing EVERYTHING I can to keep my 91 pontiac firebird formula on the road and purring like a kitten too. It sure hasnt been easy getting my parts AND having work done as I am not a mechanic either so the work costs money for me too lol. But my firebird is soooo worth it to me Hope you find a solution to your problems sure hate to see a bird go down

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

Do you wanna know whats sad to me. Im mechannicaly inclined and this firebird is running 10/10 but all rotted its depressing me but it is what it is. I have no idea what to do. Do I patch the floor to keep driving it or do I do nothing and watch it rot. I do have experience with patching floors. But not entire floor replacement you know. I can have this floor put all back together for about 75 bucks, menards sheet metal. Or do do I let a fellow third gen die in my hands. I think I will patch it soon. This patch job could last years we shall see. lol

Sudsy

Lol i hear you, in my opinion....do whatever it takes to keep it on the road lol. Our birds are very rare now. Mine is same as yours, same engine and all, mine is maui blue, found out only 902 of them made. Makes me wonder how many of them left on the road, much less as pretty as my Bella still is. So i am keeping her cherry as long as i possibly can. I will keep my fingers crossed for you.

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

Your bella sounds just as beautiful as mine.lol. I named mine gloria, yea all the options our firebirds have make them rare. Considering a rough estimate, theres probably about 600 maybe less left.Its a shame but i will take some pics of the quarter panel today when i get off work. So you can see how rough and tough my gloria looks. lol I promise i will try to keep this on the road as much as my wallet will allow of course. After im done with some small repairs on family members cars, I will take out my interior, and most likely patch the drivers side at this time.But its good to see so many people wanting me to keep it on the road. At car shows when im in the parking lot, people make me offers, even in its shape.I have people make me offers at gas stations i mean. You arent seeing many of these on the road anymore its a fact.

T/Aperformance

Randumtask2 , Well today I was at the local pic n pull in St,Louis MO, And I found a 91 firebird 5 speed car with a solid floor pan, and I took some pics, I do not know what part of Ill you are in or how far from St,Louis
Even the underside was rust free.

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

What are the odds, I live 5 hours from st.louis, and working 6 days a week yea.That is so nice of you to take pics for me. Im honestly very flatterd you would do that.

T/Aperformance

I wouldn't be to flattered, I was there looking for parts for a few other parts for other projects and taking pics of them , I always take pics because I never know what someone may need. And if the pic n pull would allow me to bring my torches in I would cut them out my self as that floor i in mint condition and I could make some $ off them I may go back just for the peddles .

mainstreetspeed

rando, hi Im new to this site but not to the restoration business. I am very much into3 gen camaros and firebirds. i have been restoring cars from the age of 14 ,now 39 i can tell you from experince these floor pans are not for the beginner . from looking at the pics you are also going to need a rocker panel and most likely need to repair the lower firewall on the driver side, the pass side is not that bad . im telling you this not to discourage you are to make you scrap the car .i still own my 85 iroc i got when i was 17 and im finally getting around to restoring it .there are things you can do to bring the cost down. you can remove and disassemble the car yourself .bring it to the shopas bare as possible, seats , rug, you get the idea. work with the shop . if you have any questions let me know

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

That quote was included with me taking the interior out myself. Ouch right, Yesterday i was buesy working on my sisters car so i wasnt able to take any another pics. I will take pics of the quarter panel to get some more opinions. The Right Rear quarter panel is in rough shape, my mother side swipped me in the driveway when she was backing up, obviously wasnt paying attention.Where she side swipped it rust formed everywhere after that i think that happend in 2007.I mean i have bad luck, ive gotten side swipped in parking lots. People have no respect for cars anymore eh. lol People are the reason that we dont upkeep on the body of our cars anymore.I do really appreciate the advice. You wouldnt even encourage a cheap temporary floor like menards sheet metal.

RockShowTrader

iTrader: (1)

If you really love this car, and it sounds like you do. Get the minimal amount of work done ASAP, the floorboards. Then you can do more as time goes on. I wouldn't let that guy sticker shock you into trashing the car. Keep it, don't run away from her! You will ALWAYS regret letting her go.

Sudsy

Love the comment above!!

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

Ok guys as I said, the pictures are from today, here's what she looks like as of today

ok,!st picture driver side quarter,2nd picture passenger side quarter,last picture my baby. lol

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

I thank you for having support for my vehicle. Theres tons of sentimental value with her. I had to teach alot of my friends to drive stick on this. But as you can see from the pics I posted below shes not doing soo well. lol

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

'
You have to be the nicest person on this forum I have ever met. You can take that to the bank sudsy. lol Well basically this is what she looks like now. I posted pics at the end of my thread. What does yours look like current. To see if were both twins. lol

Sudsy

Wow, thanks lol. I am sure though that all these fine peeps helping you have been pretty nice too. I am definitely not as mechanicly adept as them so I pay out the butt for all the work I have done but atleast I get it done some here some there it gets done and my Bella keeps purring right on down the highway turning heads and making me smile if you tell me how to post pics of her on here i sure will. Your bird looks nice fix her up I say, save her if ya can. Yours has the wrap around spoiler and mine doesnt. Mine has the fin style.

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

Do you have a smartphone take a pic, and post it to facebook then I copy and paste it here. In the most basic thing I can say. lol I really do wanna see pics of your bella.'

Sudsy

I have a smart phone, facebook and pics of my car on both LOL but my phone isnt showing me an option to "COPY" the pic lol

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

Well if you have a pc, I would do it on a pc. But yea copy the pic and paste it In the thread.

eseibel67

$2500 won't fix that car, just the floors. I used to deal with rusted cars when I was young. But now that I'm old, I know that it's WAY WAY WAY cheaper to buy a rust free car in the first place, and it will be BETTER by far because it's never been cut up and pieced back together.

If that much rust is visible, there is much more hiding where you cannot see it. I can tell you that with 100% certainty.

As stated above, if it has sentimental value buy a solid V6 shell and transfer everything over. At least it will be half decent when you're done, and although labour intensive, it won't be that expensive.

Restoring rusted out bodies makes sense if you're working on a Duesenberg or a Hemi 'Cuda. Not a Formula.

tunedport77bird

hey dude I know that that car has a lot of sentimental value but it is too far gone, that kind of rust will cost you way over $10k to fix. and rust will still pop up after its done. like some of the other guys said buy a solid donor shell and transfer everything over. you will be way ahead. and will not cost no were near as much. I am a body man and I wouldn't fix that much rust if it was a 77 bandit 4 speed car. its a lot easier transferring all y9ur stuff to a new shell.

white gold 88

I've got to agree with the two previous posts. There are still decent bodies out there. You would be much better off. Like was said you haven't seen all of the rust yet. The more you cut into that car the more you will find. Not trying to hurt your feelings just hate to see you get into it then find what we are talking about or get it patched up and painted just to have it rust back out again.

Randomtask2

iTrader: (1)

I agree with all of you. Once i get the time i will patch the floors. Just to keep her on the road. For at least a couple more years. Its still alot of fun to drive, with or without a floor. lol