DrummerDad

I have a 91 firebird, with a tilt-wheel column. Also has an airbag. A while back I failed the VA inspection because it is loose. I took it apart, and it appears to have pins in it. One is loose. The car is still drivable, but evidently the previous owner used the wheel as a means of egression. I tried to tap( and then gently persuade) the pin back in. I didnt see any threads, or any other way of getting it to go back in. Its only on the left side, and when you pull on the wheel it sags to the left. The tilt still works, but you can force it to drop all the way down without pulling the stalk. Am I going to have to replace the column?

hitman

Dude, don't waste your money on having somebody rebuilding the coulmn or buying a replacement. I got an estimate and the minimum cost would be $125.00 (excluding parts). I looked at buying another coulmn from a bone yard, and they wanted $150.00. I also looked up Coulmns Galore on the net, and they wanted like $300.00. Way too much money all the way around. I just rebuilt the coulmn from my 92 z and it only cost me $40.00 and some time. It sounds like you need to replace the metal pivoting collar ( I don't know the technical term for it). The pivoting collar has two teeth like prongs at the top of it, this is what keeps the tilt in the desired position. It may be that the two prongs may not be properly aligned. Pull the stalk back and tilt allowing it to rest in the full upward position. While the coulmn is moving upwards, try to push the pins in with your thumbs. If the pins are in and the tilt still moves without using the stalk, just replace the pivot collar (the prongs probably have worn teeth and don't grab.) If your a DIY kinda a guy, I have a spare pivot collar in good condition that I would let you have for $20.00 plus shipping.
I know how crappy the wheel must feel. I was driving my car in the same condition for about two years. After I finished the rebuild, I notice a world of diffrence.
Good luck

astoria18

There's a technical article about tightening up the tilt column. You can find it here:
https://www.thirdgen.org/newdesign/t...ngcolumn.shtml
Good luck.

DrummerDad

After the inspection guy failed me, I went home and took it apart. I had the tilt wheel up, and the left side( sitting in the car) pin is out a little. I tried pushing it in. I even gently tapped it with a dead blow hammer.But, I found it odd there were no threads, or provisions to tighten the pin. All I can figure is it has been in this condition for so long, it has created a groove or ledge, keeping it from being pushed in. I dont know if I can replace just the pin or if the whole assembly has to go. What do you all think? If I need the ring P.M. me hitman, and well work something out with shipping etc...

87CIZ

iTrader: (8)

those pins dont cause it to be loose, there are 4 torx screws that loosen up over time that need to be tightened up. I believe i read the tech article when i did mine a couple years ago. The only thing thats bad is the pin puller tool. those pins you hit need to be removed in order to get to the bolts.

DanTheMan_smlk

kinda off topic, but i have 91 with air bags and tilt. I can push down on the steering wheel and it springs back up...whats wrong?

hitman

What exactly is loose, the shaft or the metal collar? As far as the pins go, there are no threads, this allows the metal collar to glide up and down when using the tilt mechanisms. The pins just tap in. As far as the pivot pin puller tool, I bought mine off the net for like $15 shipped. The one I bought was a Leslie brand, but so far it has worked great for me. You might get lucky and find the puller at Pepboys or AZ.

DanTheMan
If the wheel still feels tight on the column, most likely the teeth are worn or the little bars that catch the teeth are bad. When I tore my coulmn down I was able to see how simple all the components work. The problem is that the teeth at the top of metal collar seem hard to take out. It looks like there is some kind of rivet or lip that keeps the pins in place. Also the teeth appear to be under some type of load (that's why the stalk bounces back in place), it may be easier to get a cheap donor column and use it for parts. Even the theft recovered columns would work, because the thief is only tearing up the plastic collar, and small metal ignition gear, almost all the internals are still usable, and GM whored out the tilt column on just about all their trucks and cars so availablity should not be a problem.

DanTheMan_smlk

ok, well it seems fine for now, i have to use a bit of force to push it down....i'll save my money up untill it gets worse

DrummerDad

Hitman

The pivot point in the column is loose. The outside pin (left facing the wheel) is sticking out about 1/16 inch, and the column at the pivot is loose. When I pull down on the wheel, straight down, it pulls slightly to the left, and probably moves about 2-3 inches, down. It only does it going down, but Im guessing its because of the sprung tension to make the column go up when you pull the stalk. Evevrything works fine, it just moves when you put downward pressure on it, and with enough force, actually not alot at all, the column will slip all the way down. Im guessing its because the previous owner used the wheel as a lifting point to get out of the car. I dont feel the wheel is dangerous, and it doesnt effect the way the car steers, but it is annoying.

hitman

without looking at the coulumn first hand, I would say that your shaft bearrings may need replacing. If the pin is the out by 1/16, it's not that big a deal. You may want to pull the left pin and see if it shows any signs of wear. If there are any groves or signs of uneven wear, try getting a replacement pin for it to see if it takes out the slack.


That is not a good thing. The reason I say that is because with that much movement, if the locking plate hits the lock shaft while driving, your wheel could get temporarily stuck in that position (accident waiting to happen). The tolerances inside the coulmn are somewhat tight. I'll try to post up some pics (or e-mail them to you) so that I can better explain the problem areas to look for.

SLAYER6669

iTrader: (1)

Drummer, is you're wheel tilting down in a 7:00 / 2:00 kind of movement? Mine has been doing that and seems alot of people with columns in the early 90s do it.. All 4 of my torx bolts (actually they are hex bolts in my column) were all tight. Heres a video of what I'm talking about.. You'd need quicktime to view.. Not sure if this is what you are seeing happen though..

http://68.37.70.188:300/images/my91z28/column.3g2

If this is the case and you're pivot pins are sticking out and come out easily without a pivot pin puller then chances are the tilt housings are worn out where the pins slide in.. That's whats wrong with mine.. From what I've been told the housings are aluminum and wear out over time from tilting etc. I've been told you can possibly drill out those holes and install oversized pins maybe.. Other than that the only other thing is to replace the housings, which are expensive.. Columns Galore replaces one of them with a new peice for $75, and for the other one they reuse a good used one as a replacement for $90 beacuse they are $180 for a new one (or so they say). Then it's $100 labor for repair, or $150 to rebuild (decrease/sandblast/repack bearings/paint). Losta cash I got sick and tired of messing with the damn thing so I just gave in and sent it to them.. I've gotta talk to Bruce at hawks beacuse he sold me one with the same problem my stock one had. Hopefully this isn't you're problem.

hitman

DrummerDad

I am guess I am lucky in more ways than one.
It only cost me $40.00 and a week-end to rebuild my coulmn. Yah, I could have taken a little more time to sand paint and degrease, but all these things still looked really clean ( no real wear) and all the pivot points are still in good shape. Don't scared into spending $$ when you really don't have to. One of the guys on the board (Trickster?) e-mailed me a copy of the GM service manual for the column. After looking at everything closly as I took it apart, it's really not very complicated to do, even for a novice like me. With all the extra money you could save doing this on your own, the extra ca$h could be sent on mods or upgrades.

Two factors that contribute to the problem are heavy airbags and all the added weight that was applied to enter and exit the vehicle.

I do believe I have both the lower and upper metal collars that Slayer was talking about (spares). The lower collar is still mounted to the donor column, I'll see how easy/hard it is to take off. If your interested, Ill sell them to ya.

Either way, good luck man

DrummerDad

I appreciate all the help guys. That video is exactly like my column. It swings out and down. I agree its from years of using the column for a handle. I am capable of fixing the column, with the correct information on what im looking at. I work on helicopters at work, so we have some good tools and plenty of help with good dexterity. Can I ask to get a copy of those pages hitman, if you still have them? I also tried to pull the pin out, But didnt want to force it. It wouldnt come out with quite a bit of effort, and that is where I got the idea that it has worn a groove in it. Also if you decide to sell those parts, let me know, P.M. me and we'll talk.

hitman

if I still have that attachment(service manual pages), if so I'll send it to ya.


Edit:
Found the PDF. You got PM.

DrummerDad

Thank you, you also have a p.m.