theshmo891

Alright, I just saw this guy's post of the heater and ac control thing. And I was wondering, when everyone does these things, what kind of paper do you use, is it like store bought, or do you have to be in the printing buisness or whatever, and if the reg joe can or has done it, can you post up templates or the finished prod? thanks

BlackMagic

you can print them up at home, if you have a scanner you can scann the original one for a template. And work off of that. As far as paper, i do not know, but i am sure it has to be like card stock so that it is not flimsy

-Kevin

theshmo891

would they light up right?

Faded

If you're feeling really good about the design bring it to a local print shop and have them print it out on high quality paper. It will look 100% better than from a standard printer on plain white paper.

I also recommend taking some time to cut out the parts of it you want lighted with an exacto knife. Be sure to take your time on this part... it's time consuming. Then take a sheet of colored semi-transparent plastic and put it on the back of the gauges. The glow from this method is much better than just letting it shine through the paper, especially if you used the thicker high quality paper.

Hope this helped.

theshmo891

alright, this clears a little bit up, but what do you mean about cutting with an Xacto knife? damn, someone needs to make a tutorial on how to do this.

OutLaw305

like you take a knife and actually cut the numbers or letter out. An Xacto knife is just a very sharp and small knife used by hobbyists when working with stuff like this. You can pic one up for 2 bucks at any drug store.

theshmo891

yea i know what an Xacto knife is, so you would just have to cut the numbers out so you can see the old panel, so it can shine through? WHats th point of coloring the numbers then?

Faded

Just like Outlaw said, cut out the numbers and letters (and ticks too) so the light can shine through.

Just to be a little more clear... for the transparent backing get something that is sort of clouded. This will make the light more evenly dispersed and you will not be able to see the bulbs.

Faded

If it were me I'd take out the old overlay, but that's up to you.

There really is no point in coloring the numbers. You just need enough contrast between the numbers and their background to have a good line to follow when cutting.

You don't actually have to do either of these, but if you do it will look much better, IMO.

theshmo891

danm, im pretty sure im like brainfarting, because im not getting what you mean. So the finished project woud be : A sheet with like cold and hot and all that stuff cut out? Damn, i am comfused

theshmo891

<img src="http://www.freefilehosting.net/file.cfm?id=F4EBFF5E-CF1F-D571-A4CE5B185B341523" alt="FreeFileHosting.Net">
I just made this, Its probably too detailed to be actually used, but this is kinda the feel i want to incorporate into mine. But i want it to glow, ot put blue xenon lights behind it, i need to figure it out.

theratdude64

http://www.rangerpowersports.com/tec...tomgauge.shtml

ignore that its for a ford... but this could probally help eh? I'm in the middle of doing this to my bronco, and when I start driving the camaro more, I'll do it to it too. My car is out for right now

bnoon

I used to make backlit gauges for Ford Contours and Mercury Cougars back before they finally caught on with the aftermarket El Glow brand gauges (which I helped get made for them). I need to dig up my old pics from my old storefront website...

Basically, get the images scanned in at a vinyl sign shop. Have them foil print the colored areas onto clear automotive grade vinyl sticker material. The light will shine through the white (and other lighter colors), so you have to prime the lightly colored spots that you don't want light coming through with a black layer if you're making white faced gauges. Black faced gauges are easy as the light doesn't come through the black anyway, so you just make the numbers white...

Once you get the prints figured out, apply them to a thin clear Lexan plastic. I think I still have a bunch of that stuff left, I'll check over lunch. It's about 1/32 of an inch thick or so, to give the new face enough heft to not warp or have problems during installation. I cut all of the center holes for the needles and pegs using a leather punch in a drill... nice clean repeatable holes every time.

You can even use a translucent color vinyl over the back side of the gauge if you want to change the glow color... it works VERY well. I did custom guages for car show cars too... I have a copy of several of the faces around still...

Then just cut out around the print and viola, excellent gauges... dang, I'd better fire up the camera over lunch too.... It's hard to explain this stuff... The results are 100% better than any paper or cardboard printed gauge faces, no matter what paper you use or who does the printing...

theshmo891

I wish i knew someone in the sticker/vinyl buisness, it soulds kinda cofusing, i would really appreciate those pics. I need to get an idea on gauges, because im planning on making everything blue black and white in my interior, because im planning on having my paint job be viper blue with white stripes, so far thats the coolest paint job ive seen. What is the best quality to save an image at btw?

bnoon

Sorry about being so slow to get you pics. Batteries were low in the camera as well, so they're blurry, but you get the general idea... Yadda yadda yadda...

Here's a set of GTP gauges I did. The warning lights are printed on the black primer layer, but not on the white face layer in order to "hide" the light until they are lit up (shines through the white, but not the black). Note that the gauges are still covered with the masking tape in order to apply them to the Lexan backing material.



This shows the parts that will shine through when lit up. Apply any translucent color you wish to the back side of the Lexan to make these spots glow. Some gauge clusters require a bit of trial and error work with masking tape to dull down and diffuse any "bright" spots because of various bulb placement.



This shows the backside of the gauge print before application. Here you can see the differences of what needs to be printed on the primer black layer and what should be printed on the face layer. Obviously if you're making black face gauges, the numbers would just be plain old white with no primer layer printed behind the numbers...




Here's some gauges laid out on some Lexan. You can see the glow color applied to the back of the Lexan is blue while the gauge stickers are applied to the front side.



If anyone needs a more in depth "how to", just give me a shout in PM and I'll do my best to help you out, or even to help you get prints made.

Bunker82

bnoon,

That is some good stuff there! I need to talk you into making some 90-92 Camaro overlays that are black faced like stock, only with white numbers instead of the hideous yellow. I know I'm not the only one looking for them!

OutLaw305

SWEET JESUS I NEED THE EXACT THING !!! I hate the yellow nubers, but dont want white face gauges. I also drive a 92 camaro. I dont exactly have a lot of downtime available with my car as i will be driving it every day (kinda need gauges for that. OK well not NEED but its alwys nice.) so please do a write up or something like step by step so we can get this done ! Sweetness !

wilyk9

iTrader: (13)

Not sure that I understand the use of the masking tape in that first pic. I see that it is holding it to the lexan, but obviously not permanently. So why use the masking tape at that point? And is the white printed (can white be printed??) on a clear material, or is it black numbers/ticks on a white material, then you cut out the numbers/ticks?

And is the black layer one you printed? or is it the factory layer?

I am currently working on some artwork for a set of custom overlays for my TA, and am using Freehand for a crisper image (as opposed to Photoshop). I have been thinking of doing something similiar to get the effect I want, using the layers. So at some point, I will have a need to get these printed. Having a better understanding on the printing process before that would be a great help. Also helps to better understand the printing when designing the graphics.

Sorry for so many questions, but I guess I am still somewhat confused on some details. bnoon, If you could do a more detailed how to with more specifics on the steps of the process, it would be very helpful. I posted these questions rather than pm you as I think it would be helpful to other diy guys out there. If you would rather me pm you, no problem, just say the word.

bnoon

I'll segment your post, because you ask some very good questions.

The masking tape is only used to pull the printed gauges from the clear vinyl backing material, then used to protect the printed surface from the squeegee when applying the print to the thicker Lexan backing. In the first pic, the gauges are still on the flimsy clear vinyl backing material that the vinyl comes on via the roll.

Black layer is printed on the clear vinyl first. Only print the items you'll want "blacked out" on the gauges as light does not shine through the black printed areas. The white layer is printed directly on top of the black layer if you're doing white face gauges, then ANOTHER black layer is printed on top for the letters/numbers/etc on the speedo/tach to give them the outlined look shown in pic 2. Note that the numbers printed on the second black layer must be slightly smaller than the "negative" numbers on the first black primer layer.

Printing black face gauges are much easier. Print the black layer with negatives for the numbers, lines, etc (anything you want to shine at night when the headlights are on). Then print a color for the numbers/etc directly in that negative left by the primer layer. There is no cutting out of letters for light to shine through as the light shines through just about any color but the black.

FYI, when applying the gauges, add a few drops of liquid hand soap (not dish washing liquid as it disolves the glue on the vinyl) to about 8oz of water into a spray bottle. Spray the backs of the gauge prints and the Lexan both. The soap/water mix helps you ease out the bubbles. Let dry several hours before removing the masking tape to avoid problems.

Black layer is printed first on the clear vinyl. See above.

The best info you can give someone at a sign shop is a general idea of what you're after. Don't spend a whole lot of time on actual art work because the sign shop won't use much of it anyway. Give them a general idea of the fonts you want and any jpg's you might want to bring into the design, but the sign shop will have to modify anything you'll bring in anyway. It's better for them to actually scan the image themselves directly instead of importing images from other programs. They usually use proprietary software made for their printers.

Just FYI to all, it cost me about $150 in printing to get my first gauge set made back when I did mine for my Ford Contour, so be ready for some experimentation. If I end up getting gauge faces made for my TA, I'll let you know. That way, you can eliminate much of the set up costs. If someone you know already had gauges made at a sign shop like this, tell them to spill the beans for contact info or offer prints for sale or something...

Tip: Take your gauge cluster out, remove any "stop" pins from the needle rest point, note where the needle comes to rest, carefully remove the needles (a pair of side cutters can beused to leverage the needles off of their post, just don't cut the needle ,LOL!), carefully peel off the stock overlays, scan them, print paper versions, and put the paper version back on for temporary use while you work with the print shop on your other ones.

If you were careful in determining the needle pin rest positions, your gauge needles should be in the correct place. You might have to adjust the needles depening on how much the needle pin moved during your removal/install. You should be able to get the stock ones removed, printed, and reinstalled in an afternoon if you know your way around your car and the computer.

bnoon

BTW, here's the Ford Contour gauge from above shown glowing at night as installed on my old Contour:

wilyk9

iTrader: (13)

Thanks bnoon, lots of good info there. Think I am understanding it now. I would expect the end result could be very similiar to the factory guages in quality.

One last question, just to confirm what I already think. You apply the printed vinyl overlay to a clear sheet of lexan, which is then used to replace the original plastic guage face, correct?

bnoon

You're welcome, and yes, they do rival screen printing like how the factory gauges are done. The illumination can be tricky to figure out though on some clusters though due to bulb placement. Factory gauges have this part already figured out and are printed accordingly with extra layers printed where they need it, and bare minimum in the "dark" areas.

Yes, the vinyl print is applied to the lexan material to give it some strength, as well as to provide a back that glow colors can be applied to. Even though you get a color printed on the front, let say red for a redline on a tach... you'll still want to use some translucent red on the backside in those locations for better color glow at night. The translucent colors just diffuse the light better anyway. To match the stock Pontiac red, I chose a light red-ish orange translucent vinyl for those GTP gauges.