84 Challenge

A couple floor pans are rusted right through on my 83Z. One hole is about the size of a softball. The other, the size of a tennis ball. What is the best way to fix? Take it to a body shop for a whole new panel? Or can I (garage mechanic) do anything? Or should I just use this car for parts to fix up my Iron Duke Camaro?

Thanks,
Brandon

89cmrodriver

if u have a welder, or a friend with a welder, u can weld in some metal for a patch, i got a friend that did that on his and it seem to be fine...if u dont have access to a welder, u can bolt metal over the spot,t wont seal as well or look as good, ull see the bum in the carpet from the head of the bolt...but it sounds ver repairable

XThree

iTrader: (1)

J.B Weld

84 Challenge

Thanks guys for your replies. Looks like I'll need to trash her. Found some more rust holes. This time through the tranny hump. I think she's too far gone for salvage.

Brandon

Idlehands

got any pics?

85SportCoupeto89RS

Find a junkyard that has a car with good floor pans. Cut them out and cut your pans in the same place making sure to cut out any rust in the pans and cut a patch out of the junk yard pans to just overlap the hole in the cars pans.

89cmrodriver

u can also use sheet metal u can buy at some home improvement stores and patch it up, it doesnt sound to bad,though i may be under estimating it....also NEVER use J.B. Weld..there is nothing on earth cheaper, id use 2 part poxey before jd weld

XThree

iTrader: (1)

J.B. Weld IS a 2 part epoxy, I have used it to repair gas tanks that had rust holes in them and they never leaked again, that **** hardends to like steel dude.... for small holes you can't beet it but for big holes you should pop rivet in some sheet metal, cut the sheets bout an inch bigger than the hole and put some urethene caulking to 'glue' it on to stop leaks then drill holes through both floor and sheet metal you put on and pop rivet it.

89cmrodriver

i use Metal+Metal 2 part apoxey it works better than jd weld, the jd weld held my crack in my raditor for about 20 miles and leaked it all out

84 Challenge

All this could be repaired. But...floor pans mostly made up of patches? As far as the junkyard idea...I don't have the means to cut or weld. Body shop would need to perform all this. I have a 1984 Iron Duke Camaro (Texas car...NO RUST!!) Thinking about swapping the dash, etc as well as the V-8 parts including the engine/tranny later on this year into a better bodied car. All the rust can be fixed....there are other issues as well. Such as no emissions equipment, which is a must where I live. Doors also need replacement. Or maybe I can park it till $ for the new pans can be had. Junking her sounds like the best idea.

Brandon

84 Challenge

Let me ask a question...would YOU junk a car for rusted doors/floor pans? Or would you obtain new/used floor pans and take to body shop for install? The car is nothing really special to me. I like the fact that I own a Z28. But all of this plus the emissions deal + the car leaks like a mother. Would you save this?

Brandon

89cmrodriver

i dunno i might part it

XThree

iTrader: (1)

J.B Weld IS the 'original' metal+Metal 2 part epoxy, if you buy the 'real' stuff not some fake J.B weld imitation. the surfaces must have been wet or dirty or something, J.B Weld is good stuff

89cmrodriver

tell the overheated car that

84 Challenge

Update: Cut up some carpet in the Z yesterday. The floor where the driver put there feet is pretty much rotted away. We're talking about from the door to the tranny hump and from near the pedals to just in front of the seat. Some metal is still there. Even the frame is exposed near the tranny hump. The rest of the holes in the car are some good patch jobs. But this one...probably can just cut some flooring out of the parts car I have. Opinions? Is this car still salvagable? BTW, one good stomp on the floor and the rest of the metal will fall away on the road.

Brandon

84 Challenge

Here's a pic I found of someone else's floor pan. If you chip a way all the rusted areas, this whole is what you get. That whited out portion represents the frame. That circle in the frame is part of frame exposed. Does this look like a professional job or can I do it myself? Actually that whole will extend to the frame. So the whole is bigger than in the pic.

Thanks,
Brandon

CamaroFreak85

im not sure where i saw this but they are now starting to make new weld in floorpannels for 3rd gens two pieces i think a left and a right. Ive parted out a wrecked camaro before and i regret it every day because it could have probably been fixed but i didnt so try and fix it we need all the 3rd gens on the road as we can keep

84 Challenge

I seriously wanna fix her. I love this car! But to spend a few thousand installing new floor pans??? Thought about cutting what I need to fix this outta my spare car, since it's not worth anything.

Brandon

85SportCoupeto89RS

Heres what I would cut out, its much cheaper to go to a junk yard and retrieve a used rustless floorpan. Find someone or even the junkyard should have a cutting torch to cut out what you need. Cut off a little extra so you can have something to work with.

84 Challenge

Looks like she's nothing more than a good parts car for my SC :rockon:. Found more rust all up this sidewall in the yellow circle.

Brandon

1quickIROC

Where did you get the idea it would cost a few thousand to fix floor pans? GO to www.Shermanparts.com, they have new floor pans for third gens starting for about 200.00 each side. Take the new pans to a body shop and pay about another 200.00 having them put in. It may cost close to a thousand, but you would have full new floor pans.

84 Challenge

A few folks said the price tag would be a few thousand. OK...found some new floor pans. But...what about that kick panel????? It's rusted away at the seam going up about 6 inches. Can that be repaired as well?

Brandon

Black84Z28

Just find a rust free shell and swap all the good stuff from that car over. That won't cost more than 500 tops.

Belker

My car's floorpan was rusted all along the rocker panel and under the drivers feet and in the backseat footwells. I couldn't afford to get it fixed properly (and can't justify spending over $1k on a car thats only worth a few grand) so I patched it myself.

I figured out where all the rust was by poking at it hard with a screwdriver, then I cut out all this area with a cutoff blade on a cheap angle grinder. I then painted all the remaining metal with Por-15 and painted some scrap metal with Por-15. I cut patch panels and trimmed and bent them to fit. It took numerous patches to complete the floor. I overlapped all the seems and used silicon caulk sandwiched between the seems. I used many rivots (about every inch or two - some put in from the top, some from the bottom) and a bunch of self-tapping sheet metal screws. When done I again painted the floor with Por-15 on both the inside and outside.

I did this a year ago and it has held up fine. The floor is rock solid and I hope it will last for years. HOWEVER, the repair looks like total crap and this kind of repair could never be done to a car that would see a car show. Look under the car and its obvious that patches were rivoted in. Pull the carpet up and its obvious that it wasn't repaired correctly. BUT the floor is solid and safe and the rust has been greatly slowed or stopped. The rest of the car is in pretty decent shape but this car is a 3.1V6 and will never really be worth a whole lot. If the car ever get restored I'm sure the whole floor pan will be replaced with new metal. For now this has been a solution that completely met my needs and was cheap.

Good luck.

Belker

I didn't have a welder or I probably would have tried welding up the patches. This, however, would require much more accurate patches to be fabricated.

Getting big chunks of a floorpan from a donor car would make everything much easier. I, however, couldn't find a good floorpan in a junkyard close to me and I already had some sheetmetal so it didn't cost me anything.

It took me at least 16 hours to do the drivers side and about 8 hours to do the passengers side so it was no small project. (But it hardly cost me anything in dollars.)

84 Challenge

Don't get me wrong! My car can patched just like yours. Like yours....the floor will be made up of patches. In addition to the rusted floor pans, the doors & fender must be replaced due to rust. The hatch...mine as well! Then we're talking about the probablilty of more rust in the engine bay. The radiator core support is rusted. I mean...we're talking about, to do it right, about a couple grand to repair the floor pans & purchase t-top weather stripping. I just can't see the point in putting all this work into this car, just to stop or repair rust damage. I love this car!!! The car has other problems besides rust. Before you know it...it's a $3000 car when it looks and drives like a $1000 car. I believe a welder will have to get involved, that could turn into some $$$.

Brandon

The_Maniac

iTrader: (2)

84 Challenge - Those floor pan pics are from my car..... Perhaps I can provide you more information.... Obviously, you already saw and read the info I have on this page:
http://crzyz28.sytes.net/floor.html

I did not bother to read this entire thread, as I was not sure where you really stood with this project.

I can tell you this, replacing the entire floor pan is a HUGE mess. Mine (as you see from the pics) was REALLY bad. If you have some small holes, there may be other avenues.

If you have to replace the pan, it is almost impossible to make a clean pull of a car from a junk yard. The pans on those are probably as bad, and is not, the the remove of them is next to impossible without bending, disfiguring and requiring some patching to finish. You might as well save time and trouble and buy replacement pans from Classic Industries.

In anycase, if you need some input, ,y skills are limitted, but I know a thing or two from this project.... And when my father, his neighbor and I ripped into it, we had NO idea what to really expect....

84 Challenge

I definitely read your article. Good job, by the way! Here's the story. Just bought the car a few weeks ago. Did not check to see the condition of the floor pans before hand . Only paid $1000 for this car. Hate to sink another grand into her for something like this. Anyhow.... The driver's side is a MESS! Just as bad as yours. The rust goes up into the driver's kick panel as well. I was hoping to patch this up the best I can and dowse it with POR-15 under and over. The rest of the car are small patchable holes. I don't care what it looks like, just so long as the car is strong, drivable, and last for many years. This will not be a show car. BTW, I don't have access to a welder. That's why the patch idea came to mind.

Brandon

The_Maniac

iTrader: (2)

As for being show, mine came out nice, but my Z28 will NEVER be show after all that happened to it. I plan to do a full restoration in the next year or two (this will encompass body and engine). My engine this summer blew a bearing and, well, I can't drive it. Since I have to pull the engine I have more work that needs done while the engine is out. Bottom line, I need time and money and will be driving my Grand Am ALL summer for a few years....

Anycase, as far as your problem goes. My Camaro at MOST is worth $1,500.... I put $1,500 into to repair a quarter panel (I wrapped it around a telephone pole years ago).... And then I have done other projects (including the floor pans). I don't remember, but I think with NEW pans, carpet and materials, my floor pan project was about $500-$700 (and that was a group effort of me, my father and his neighbor in his garage with a welder). Without a welder, you increase your dificulty and possibly decrease the success of the end result....

I did read how someone on this board did his with pop-rivets. If you're looking at the work I had... Eh, you could do rivets, but I don't think it would be as solid (and solid is what you want). And I don't think you can cut the pan and tow it to a shop to be welded (as the pan REPLACES a true front to back frame and in the tow you would probably twist the body). Also, my pans were done 1 side at a time (to preserve the structure of the car).

No matter what, you're looking at a lot of work and probably a similiar $500-$700 price tag (you can shave some money off that if you don't replace the carpet). The effort involved in a full replacement is NOT worth it unless you intend to restore the car to keep for yourself (regardless of show quality). Ex. I intend to keep my Z28, and I intend to make it 100% beautiful inside and out and as best as possible on the underside of the body, but I know it will NEVER truely be a show car.....

Sorry if that's vague, it's more my 2 cents then anything.....

84 Challenge

I appreciate your comments...Maniac! Still not sure what route will be taken. Definitely would like to save this car but I don't know. You'd probably say "Holy Crap!", if you came out here to look at the damage. Still have quite a bit to do: new weatherstripping for t-tops, emissions equipment re-installed, new doors, new fender, new carpet, headliner, exhaust, e-brake cables, intake manifold, carb............................................... Love this car, but JEEZ! BTW, dont' really have a place to store car while parting out either.

Brandon

The_Maniac

iTrader: (2)

I feel your pain.... I've already restored most of the interior... Really could not do what needs done on the exterior due to lack of area to perform that kind of work... Will, now I bought a house with a 2 car garage.... I want to pull mine all apart and I'm looking at:
- Fender removal - possibly replacement
- Minor rust clean up (on the out side of the car)
- Big time strut tower repairs
- Full Engine overhaul
- All new sensor wiring (dry rot and corosion SUCKS)
- New weather stripping

And that's the TIP of the ice berg for mine.... The bright side, all the imperfections I don't like are hard to impossible to see in the pics I have of my Camaro

So do I think you're crazy.... NO! People thought I was crazy to repair my Z after I wrapped it around a telephone pole, but I did.... People thought I was crazy to repair/replace the floor pans, but I did.... And some people think I'm crazy for spending more money in my Z, but I will.....

Neil

I actually am repairing my floor pans and I had a new piece of sheet metal welded in on the drivers side from under the dash to the front of the drivers seat. The guy did an excellent job! He even shaped the metal to match the original and then coated it with a rust inhibitor. He only charged me $200 for that and fixing another hole the size of a softball.

I also have several small holes which I am patching up with wire mesh (made by Bondo) and JB WELD. So far it is working very well. I have to sand down the drain areas and then I am ready to paint. Just thought I would share this info.

84 Challenge

Maniac....Do I think you're crazy for spending more $ on your Z....YES!!! j/k . I guess you get what you pay for when only a grand is paid for a 1983 Z. It's actually a nice car for $1,000. My wife will be tough one to convince, regarding the Z.

Neil....guess there's all kinds of way to fix floor pans. Just how strong is JB Weld? Wait a minute, you're from Houston! Why are you messing with your floor pans????

Brandon

The_Maniac

iTrader: (2)

That does change the equation.

The bottom line is to be happy with your decision and to each there own.

At this point, I will butt out for a while (the current end of this thread is way to full with my opinion crap)....

But if you need info from me, I'll try and help as best I can....

Neil

Well Brandon, I am originally from Ontario, Canada, and the car was never really winter driven but it saw it's share of salty roads! I moved to Houston in '96 and I now decided it was time to clean her up.

Neil

Oh, BTW, JB Weld has provided for an incredibly strong patch! Tomorrow, I will sand it and then paint it.