ChevyKen

iTrader: (1)

A while back there was a post regarding headlight mods on Firebirds, and I mentioned a mod I've never seen but that I think could look pretty cool if done right.
I initially had this idea when I was considering getting a C3 Corvette some years ago - but think it could look cool also on the firebird.

The idea is to instead of having the "lid" flip up to reveal the lights, it will "sink down" and create kind of a headlight pocket similar to the camaro, with the headlights in the back.
Now I've got to admit that I have NO idea of how to create mechanism to lower the lid, nor do I know if there is infact room for the headlights in the back like that - but I just thought I'd toss out the idea to those of you with birds that are looking for a way to customize your headlights.


Here is an animation of what I mean (Jim, please excuse me for using you pic ) :





Ken

scauffiel

I'm with you. I have no idea how you'd do something like that.

S.

92Transam

Hummmm, I kinda like it.

Tom Keliher

Mechanically it could probably be done. It looks killer in any case! Great idea!:hail:

SpeedCat86

That's cool. I may have to look in to something like that...

91FIREBIRDGT

that would look much better with the 91-92 front, cuz the 82-90 fronts have that opening for the turnsignals right next to the headlights. the 91-92 fronts don't have that. I'm planning on doing this mod to my 91 Firebird sometime soon when i get the funds and time to do it.
However i wouldn't have the headlight doors move down... I wouldn't wanna worry about having another motor problem with the headlight motors. which is one of the reasons i'm gonna have the fixed headlights.

92Transam

Hummm you mean like a plexi glass cover over them so they just stay there? I dunno if I like the sounds of that, but I would love to see those flip down lights Photoshoped onto a 91-92 bird. Edit: I just had an idea, I have no clue if it would work but what if you had some sort of cover over the lights that would become translusent when the lights are on and dark when off; maybe like an electrochromic devise or something I was thinking of maybe heat activated covers that would change under heat but that might take to long when you want to be off in a hurry and need light.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

I like your idea a lot! I don't think it would be that hard to do either...attach a hinge to the front bottom side of the headlight door, with an electric actuator to pull it down and extend it back out. Hmmm....

Zepher

iTrader: (1)

Nice.
Could be done with a spring loaded solenoid.
Apply power and the solenoid pulls the cover down. Release the power and the spring pushes it up.
Hardest part is cutting space for the headlights to sit in since they basically sit further back than the stock headlight assembly.

In the pic below, you can see where the lights need to be,
right under where the adjustable hood stopper sits.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

I was just checking that Zepher...you'd have to cut a small amount out of the radiator support, depending on the size of the lights used. It would work great on a 91-92, or even a KITT replica, but the 85-90 style bumper cover would be tough to make it look right. You could probably replace the plastic piece under the headlight door with steel (to weld the hinge to) and paint it either semigloss black to blend in or do it body color.

sbrice18fan

Very Cool, I like that.

Zepher

iTrader: (1)

My car is just sitting around and I have 2 extra headlight assemblies, maybe I'll try and make a mock up one and have someone build it.

ChevyKen

iTrader: (1)

For some reason I was counting on you guys (Zepher and LT1guy) to possibly like the idea

Anyways, I see the possible problem of the radiator support. Maybe it is possible to take care of some of the problem with a small extension on the hood so that the lights could be slightly farther out?

Either way, I'd love to see someone giving it a shot as I've had this idea in my head for at least 4-5 years LOL


Ken

Zepher

iTrader: (1)

I'll take a stab at it in a few days when it warms up. It got really cold again and snowed last night.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

Thats just it, I DO like the idea...I'm just thinking over how I could make it work. Believe me, that doesn't mean I'm "giving up", or don't like it. It would be a little easier on a 91-2, like I said...but if it was easy, everybody would do it!

I'm about to pull the bumper cover off my 87 to start body and paint work, so its perfect timing...I was going to do something different with the lights already. I think I can make this work, and a little metal in the way has never stopped me before. :lala:

redraif

I will have to look on the 82. It has the headlight assemblies gone and the hood we can set it back on and look at actual space issues. Since you would need the hood down to actually see how much space is left. I would assume as much as the hood bumper, but there are recesses in the hood fro the hood bumper. Hence even less room, and more channeling into the metal. Headlight fitment I know I could do...making the door go up and down. I'm not real familier with what is out there actuator wise. But is could be as simple as power on to lights and door actuator holds it down. Lights off, door released to standard position. Its definately doable! Just a bit of research on what device to activate the door...

What size headlights were you wanting to run? Just what would look right?

deadbird

I kind of like that as well. I only have a few issues/'problems' that I could see being a problem.
The slope of the hood in that area isn't all that much to allow for a very large (in height) headlight, if you were to leave the black plastic area and just make the lid tilt down in a fixed hinge manner, the headlight could only be about 1" or so high.
Also with having such a small headlight set so far back, it seems the nose/pocket/recess area would shroud the light intended to hit the road. Cutting the radiator support even further back to get a headlight in there w/o changing the door length would seem to amplify this problem as well. I don't know jack about light diffraction so that's just an assumption on my part.
Cutting the radiator supprt just seems like a bad as well (opinion).
I gave minimal amount of thought (to avoid a headache) about your idea and made a crappy animation (not my cup of tea mind you) of a maybe better working door system while still keeping your (Ken) original idea. (Hope this image works..)

*flash animation no longer hosted*

With this method, you'd be chopping into the impact bar and wouldn't have to touch the radiator support (except for making headlight mounts. The headlight door would have guide pins on it and follow in a track, machined aluminuim or whatever. I figure it might be possible to reuse the original headlight motors but, I'm not an engineer by any means. The only other thing I could think of to push/pull the door in the track would be a power antenna motor or something similar.
Just a thought and probably not of much use or good but, I never claimed it to be If I had the tooling to do something like that I'd give it a try just for the hell of it.

SpeedCat86

'Just a crappy little animation' yeah, whatever.......

I am so building that. Can you imagine what that would look like in operation? That is the coolest thing ever.

Ancel Zero

wow with those headlights it looks even more like a camaro. but it looks really good though, hats off to who ever came up with the idea.

deadbird

It would definatly be something to see.
Another thought (though much more complex to make than most of us have means to make) would be to have the guides toothed like a cd tray and a motor to driv the door along the track with contact switches at the travel ends to trigger the OEM door module to switch polarity/direction. Not like anyone will make it but, it's fun to imagine once in awhile

MdFormula350

looks like a nice mod for the headlights!! good idea.

ChevyKen

iTrader: (1)

deadbird,
That is definitely a slick concept as well!! It would very impressive in operation. The only downside I see with it compared to a "lid" that just goes straight down (hinged in the front) is that there seem to be more moving parts and a more involved construction. But again, it would look slick as hell!!

I also see your point of the limited lighting of small headlights like that, and with their position. That naturally would be a concern, at least for a daily driver. Maybe some could be compensated with a good set of foglights?

Im not sure if Im looking at your animation right, but it seems like nearly half the headlight would be behind the vertical line (just to the right of the opening door) which Im assuming is the black piece next to the turn signal 82-90 birds? Wouldn't that block the light even more? Maybe Im just seeing it all wrong!



Speaking of headlight mods, another thing that would be cool, maybe more so for the Camaros, would be if there were headlights produced where the actual lens glass had the opposit characteristics of the SpeedGlass welding helmets. Ya' know, those that are clear until you start welding, then the light makes it switch to normal dark welding glass.
Think about it, if they had the opposit characteristics, they would be blacked out until you turned your lights on and then would be clear as day......cool huh? Ohhh all those silly ideas!!


'nuff from me!


Ken

redraif

I have seen headlights that have like a thin black honeycomb material in them, so when the light is on it shines through, but during the day when the headlight is seen on an angle it looks blacked out...

HamSpiced

Sorry double post, Major Comp lag.

HamSpiced

hey guys i havent read all of the posts but you are making this sound way too difficult.

how about this idea? Have the headlight door come from the hood?

using the idea of how the motorized hatch works, if somehow we could put slotted guides on the "door" attached to slotted motors this can be done very easily, all you would have to do is keep the positioned base for the light and the headlight thing will appear and disaper through the hood. once i am home i can draw up my idea if your still interested but that seems to be the easies way to do it...

91FIREBIRDGT

anyone wanna photoshop them on a 91-92 firebird?

deadbird

Ken.. I know I didn't do that great of a job on the animation as far a clarity but, the way I tried to show it was the black plastic bezel (part that matches the turn signal when the door is down) moves under the nose with the door. So, when the door goes under, the black bezel/trim part also goes w/it making it all 'flush from the light to the 'pocket' recess. (I hope that made at least a little sence).

JR86-TA

First off, I really like this idea because I am sick of repairing my headlight motor(s) which is now stuck so even the 'manual' open doesn't work... but anywho...
If you wanted it to latch on the front and still have the light shine straight and not be blocked by the 'door', just take of the black piece that says Pontiac and have the housing door touch the bumper like on 4th gen cars... then it would flap down to be perfectly flat... Just a suggestion. I hope one of you can figure out how to make and work... and by the way, take step by step pictures for those of us who want to do it as well.

TransAm12sec

I've always thought of doing something like on the Jaguar XJ220. The lid for the headlights slides forward and under the body. But, not sure how it would work on a third gen.

deadbird

oops

redraif

You would have to retool the door though. If it formed a straight line down to the bumper cover the headlight door would no longer match the lines of the hood. That step up is needed to keep all the bodylines matched up. If you retooled the headlight door to include this step up, I think you would still be stuck with it no recessing enough to no block the headlights beam.

JR86-TA

Well, then how about having the black part that says Pontiac sloped. You would have to do bumper modifications, but I honestly think it is worth it... Or could a person make headlights bright enough that are the same size and shape as the black Pontiac part that would rest under the door... then you would not have to change the hood nor the bumper, just alter the light housing and motor, then you wouldn't have a motor at all... sounds like a good idea to me... sorry if I didn't explain it clear enough.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

Like this?

JR86-TA

Exactly like that... is that a real mod or a PS? And if it is real, do you get good vision at night or is it crappy?

91FIREBIRDGT

I've known two people on these boards to do that. AmorgetRS and Redraif. unfortunately that would only work on 82-90 Firebirds.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

Its real. The headlights in her car are much brighter than the ones in my (stock) 87 TA. Its going to get some kind of headlight converison when I do paint&body (in a couple weeks).

redraif

Aiming the lights was a bit interesting. They are still not quite where I want them, but here is a night shot...

redraif

Close up...